21st century fishing journalism

[charleville]

I wanted to title this, "In Search of Relevance - 21st Century Fishing Journalism" but the title was too long for the format template.

I am bemused by the thread relating to the possible closure of the fishing pages in the Brisbane Courier Mail.

Whilst there will be fishing journalists who bemoan the loss of such a revenue source, as we enter further into the 21st century, I wonder who else cares any more about that than we care about the plight of unemployed buggy whip manufacturers.

I should confess up front that I ceased subscribing to major daily newspapers several years ago when I discovered the internet. #I should also confess that I read six national and international papers every day in their online form and recognise that only the major dailies really have the resources to accurately report and verify the big stories. #Latter day alternative news sources such as bloggers #cannot sustain the quality in news reporting available through the major dailies. #I must also declare upfront that I am a big fan of the local flavour of the suburban and regional newspapers which do more for building a community than they do for news reporting.

Putting all that aside however, my perspective is that fishing reports and fishing journalism in major daily newspapers is a waste of forest resources on both the grounds of timeliness and validity. #More importantly, they are archaic and rapidly becoming irrelevant in a broadbanded world.

For instance, if you go right now to Brownie’s internet site you will see the same fishing reports that he publishes in the Sunday Mail. #Here is a gem that I have extracted from those fishing reports… “Bream and whiting in the channel between Mosquito and Tabby Tabby Islands, bream in Jacobs Well Channel near the mouth of Behm Creek and mud crabs around the mangrove islands.”

In all honesty, has there ever been a time when that was not the case? #So what is the value of that report? #Useless! #It may as well been written by a geriatric with a good memory and a succinct turn of phrase sitting in a hospice.

Lest I now get #assailed by any fishing journalists who visit this site (which is probably most of them), I hasten to mention that I subscribe to two fishing magazines each month, plus I buy several of the glossy fishing mags from the newsstands each year and also soak in electronic media such at ET’s show, and even Nugget’s radio show when I can wake early enough (Gee I wish that he would podcast those shows.). I also attend most of the fishing expos associated with boat shows and tackle retailers promotions. #Viz, I support the fishing journalism industry bigtime.

But fishing journalists need to move into the 21st century or increasingly they will become irrelevant. #For me, fishing reports in major daily newspapers are untimely and often too abstract to be useful or even probable. #Fishing articles in the major dailies are often too short to be of any use. #Not so of course for the specialist magazines.

For fishing journalists to be relevant, they need to tangibly realize the benefits of 21st century media. #

Commercial TV news editors will understand the nuance of their medium, viz, TV is about movement and action. #A story without moving pictures or live feeds is not worth doing. #A story showing a house fire is another thing!

So my perspective is that fishing journalists in the 21st century need to think like a child of the 21st century and #leverage the benefits and nuances of 21st century media like broadband internet, cable TV, interactive digital TV, digital radio (when it comes), third generation mobile phone downloads, podcasting, etc.

Some are starting to get the picture. #eg Nugget has a few video clips on his website – not a bad start – but heaps of scope to build on this.

You see, when I want to learn how to throw a cast net, I can do that by watching two different methods demonstrated on Nugget’s site; or if I want to get a view about some of the boat ramps in SE Qld, I can see Nugget demonstrating such in his video clips, or if I want to learn how to fillet fish properly, I can find lots of video clips on-line showing me how (I might have to watch walleye being filleted with a Canadian accent #rather than bream but what the heck); or if I want to know how to repack my trailer wheel bearings, I can watch a series of video clips online to show me….and I am sure that there are lots of others.

The essence of what I am saying is that serious fishing journalists should lay to rest their reliance on major daily print media. The first Aussie newspaper was printed in 1803 and nothing much has changed from a reader's perspective except at the margin - eg colour pictures etc. #It is a medium that has served us well but it is no longer relevant for timely boating weather forecasts, timely fishing reports and effective reader education. #Instead, fishing journalists should embrace the new media with more electronic reports and in the fullness of time, be prepared for interactive media.

“What about the costs?”, I hear you say. #Well, Nugget’s site says that he has some sort of video editing equipment which probably cost him a pretty shilling or two whenever he bought it, but in 2006, the costs to do commercial quality video editing are not that great. #For example, if we assume that the journo already owns a computer, all she/he need sis a digital video camera and an appropriate bit of software like FinalCutPro. ($1220). #I reckon that three grand all up will do the job. #Compare that with the comments made in a current monthly fishing mag about how to protect a fishing journalist’s cameras worth $15000!

I have no affiliation or involvement with journalism or media. #I am just an enthusiastic fishing “punter”. #But it rankles me to see attempts to prop up archaic media and practices when so much opportunity is available to leverage the new media by tangibly recognizing the nuances of its dynamics.

What do you think? #What sort of fishing journalism and media would you like to see?

[Jim_Tait]

Agree with most of what you say Charlie re: the ongoing technological revolution and the new media forms that will increasingly become more relevant - but I suppose I'm a bit nostalgic and want to read some good creative writing based on the recreational fishing experience.

So much of the writing these days is largely techno-wank and product placement. Where are the modern day Vic McCrystals producing gems like 'on the sweetwater' or 'the calm before the storm' etc. Vic's articles used to have a Ernest Hemingway feel that put you in the picture (you'd almost get wet as he described walking up a jungle perch creek!) while still providing valuable insights into fishing techniques.

These days its all about wearing columbia shirts, and marketing the latest rods, reels, soft plastics, fishing resort etc..The 200 hp bass boats on fibre glass rockets that look straight out of a yank show room are just too much for me - they're almost immoral in these days of diminishing world resources and climate change etc.. Consider how far removed thay are from the original river bass fisho - a relatively fit person who used to walk or canoe up wild rivers using their own energy - interacting with and understanding the glory of nature exemplified by a beautiful bronze battler smashing his lure in some forest shaded hole in the depths of the bush.

Infomercials have their place for those who are new to the sport or are in the market for some new gear - but what about if you already know how to fish SPs (They've been around since the 70's!) or don't care how smooth the latest $1000 baitcaster is...I enjoy using my 30 yr old Abu 2500c and it will catch just as many fish - but I'd rekon it would be difficult to get its photo published in a fishing mag.

Am I just past my use by date? Turned into a grumpy old man? or would others also like to see the re-emergence of creative fishing writing?? Fishing has always verged on being a religion for me - lately it seems to have lost (the published version at least) its spirituality!


Regards and tight lines - Jim

[blaze]

maybe i'm to old, I like to read it, feel it, crinkle the pages. Its just not the same running the mouse over the screen and scolling down the page. Give it to me in print any day
cheers
blaze

[Lone_Wolf]

Charlie,

Firstly, that was a great piece of journalism in itself. Seriously stimulating reading.

Mate, I guess we have to look at a newspaper for what it is, a tabloid designed to give a general overview on a broad spectrum of topics. I guess that's why there has not been much change in the format over the years.

Does a serious fisho buy the Courier Mail for the latest fishing report? Well, yes as a kid, I did. Could I afford to pay more than a dollar or so for that information? Well, probably not.

I guess that's where more money spent on a glossy subscription will offer the detailed, more advanced information you are after as a fisho.

So I guess the answer is that today, there are a variety of medians in which to gain information. The more you spend, the more you get.... Oh, unless you are just a passionate fisho like Nugget who shares the information without the motivation to make a million bucks from it!

[finga64]

Crikey, I must be older then you Blaze because I miss stinky on the AM band on the radio on Sunday mornings on 2LM on the NSW northern rivers area.
Have a laugh, get some info etc etc it was great (just like Ausfish only by voice)
I like paper reports too. Easy to explain and show the cook why it's imperative to go fishing tomorrow. Like life and death.
Ooh, I can't take the computer into the little boys room either for a think and contemplation. But I can take a BtoB (that's beacon to beacon OR bush to beach...Ok it's not bush to beach but close enough) and a paper #;)
:)
P.S. I still use a 4" Alvey with mono in the river #:)

[fish2eat]

I commend Charlie on his journalistic efforts, top class. His logic is also good, but fails only to mention that most human beings are collectors, hoarders.....

What does that mean?? well, when we get someting new, like the internet and all its abilty to provide fantastic info, we absorb it into our world but don't want to let go of the old technology. It's just the same as when we get a new rod......throw the old one into a corner and probably don't use it again but NOT throw it out. We just keep accumulating.

I totally agree that the relevance of the newspaper reports is very limited, but its about the only reason I buy the Courier Mail on Fridays. I open it up, read and think mmmmm.....sounds like the same report I read last week and the week before, but habit forces me to buy it every week, even though I now go here and do a host of other electronic data gathering.

Some wise person said, " the paperless office is totally technologically feasible, but is as humanly acceptable as the paperless toilet, which is also feasible" ie it's what you are comfortable with

[Nugget]

Excellent words Charlie and some great responses.
I agree with just about everything you say and have every intention of making video the major part of my site. 'Watch this space'

I think you are a visionary - seeing five years ahead of today.

Some figures that might interest you:
Nielsen's Media Research survey results, Feb 2006.
64% of 4BC listeners have never accessed the Internet.
85% have read a newspaper in the past 7 days.
I expect that Internet access figure to drop significantly over the next few years.

I do have major concerns about the future of fishing though.
Gazing into my crystal ball it would appear that our sport is becoming unsociable.
Like hunting, smoking and boxing, fishing is loosing public acceptability.
Considered a family activity when I was growing up, fishing is now considered a blood sport by many of this generation.
This is no bombshell; the writing has been on the wall for some time.
I have not been able to use a photo in print or on TV that shows a gaff in a fish, blood or any injured fish for more than five years.

Have you thought lately that the authorities that manage our waterways have had a conspiracy against anglers? They close areas to fishing and increase bag and size limits without scientific evidence to support their actions.
Those that manage our waterways appear to have an agenda of depopulating the sport.

When I was growing up a vegetarian was a weirdo, now they are accepted as health enthusiasts. Only Olympic athletes had personal trainers and gyms were for muscle bound weight lifters, now they are the ‘norm’.
It would appear that the evolution of social acceptability is changing and leaving fishing behind.

Did you notice that Brownie on Channel 7 was not replaced and Channel 9 axed Andy Phipps? Dedicated fishing shows on commercial TV are no more… Yibbida Yibbida.
Instead we have lifestyle programs that incorporate fishing… less and less.

For these reasons, we need to keep fishing articles, reports and shows in the media, for as long as we can.
Every fishing column dropped, show cut or event cancelled is another step in the wrong direction, even though they may be a dinosaur.

Dave ><>

[Fafnir]

Ooh, I can't take the computer into the little boys room either for a think and contemplation

Further to this, you also can't sleep under a computer on a park bench if you're down on your luck. Computers don't burn as well as paper when you need to start a fire, and perish the thought of trying to clean yoursef with your mouse pad on a camping trip after doing #2's behind a tree.

I agree that for up to date information on what is biting where etc, nothing compares to the internet for price and speed of delivery, but I can only hope that physical newspapers are still around when I am an old man living in a park somewhere. Might pay to start stocking up on a few just in case.

[fish2eat]

Dave Speaks......the crowd applauds. Spooky words, sobering thoughts.

I only hope that fishing is not outlawed in my lifetime.

[charleville]

Some figures that might interest you:
Nielsen's Media Research survey results, Feb 2006.
64% of 4BC listeners have never accessed the Internet.
85% have read a newspaper in the past 7 days.


Thanks Dave and others for your perspectives. #:) #I think that I am starting to come around in relation to your concerns regarding the safety of the amateur fishing regulations as we know them. :(

However, the Neilsen’s data that you show tells only part of the story. #:-/ #The numbers about internet literacy and newspaper readership for 4BC listeners needs to be considered in the context of the demographics of the 4BC audience as shown in the attachment below. #

4BC attracts the largest audience of 55+ listeners and it is only to be expected that the oldies will hang on to the old media and resist the new media #:-/ #– although to be fair seeing that 40% of that age group is already internet literate only goes to support my argument that fishing journalists should expend their efforts in embracing the new media. #;)

But there’s more, 4BC only attracts 10% of the listening population – so its value as a lobbying force for amateur fishing interests is highly suspect. # :-/ (You have to wonder about what is wrong with the 0.5% of 18 – 24 year olds who choose to listen to 4BC as well – well that is, apart from those who listen to the fishing show, of course. #;D ;D)

Another 10% of the population listens to 4BC’s sister station 4BH, which I used to listen to when fishing because of the soothing music, but I gave it away because I tired of hearing advertisements for funeral directors. #>:( #[If I hear one more advertisement about Kate Mary Smith, I’ll… #(you have to listen to 4BH to know what I am saying about the sheer frequency of KM Smith Funeral Director advertisements.)]

So that means that 80% of the population which is mostly young or young at heart is going elsewhere – and I’ll bet that a very large % of those are deeply into new media. #:-/ #The Courier-Mail might be cheering itself on about how their new compact format is easier to read on a train but give me my Ipod to listen to with my eyes closed any day – and it is usually not music that I am listening to but podcasts from various radio programs, lectures from Stanford University, financial advice, audio books etc etc etc. #Of course the new Ipods are now video – need I say more about the journalistic opportunities. #;) #I have searched for fishing podcasts but there is no quality in what is available.

Back on topic - I reckon that the numbers speak for themselves. #A significant of a small part of the population wants old media. But even almost half of that ever diminishing group is already switched on to the new media and I suspect that many of the under 55’s use new media frequently and increasingly want to be stimulated by journalism that knows how to make best use of that media, especially broadband which is rapidly becoming as ubiquitous as the mobile phone. #:)

It is said that we all think of ourselves as being 15 years younger than what we are. If that is the case, I am 40 years old ;D #and I know that it is the new media that is attracting my interest – I will even go out of my way to buy a magazine that gives away free advertorial DVDs such as the sort of stuff that Paul Burt does. :) These often lack the polish of big budget productions but I suspect that the first personal computers were probably a bit rough also and look were that industry went. #;)

So as a mug amateur fishing punter who consumes everything that I can about fishing I reiterate my point that the energy expended in trying to revive dying media is not worth the effort and that the majority of fishing journalists ought to lift their game to give the public fishing stories married to the media that we are growingly coming to expect.

:) :) :)

[Girella]

Charleville, I fear that you will soon be assassinated as eventually happens to
all bright young upstarts like yourself who know too much.

So I will make this quick.

Gotta agree with your statements about tired old fishing reports that don't change from week to week.

This though, is the strength of Dave's CM reports. They are obviously written with a genuine intent to give the average fisho a helping hand. As such they are worth preserving.

I don't agree though that fishing is under siege from those wishing to destroy it. One only has to look at the exponential increase in businesses attempting to trade off the sport in the last couple of years. BCF, Camp Mart, Anaconda, BIAS to name a few.

I doubt this degree of investment would exist for a dying pastime.

I hold a more optimistic view and believe that demand will drive the kind of improvements that you foresee.

PK

[imported_admin]

Charleville

A very good read.


Interesting you mention the podcasts.

I am currently working on some Hints & Tips for viewing on the new Ipods.

Things like -
How to Cast an Alvey
How to cast a Baitcaster
How to use a Yabby Pump
Etc.
Etc.

Bit hard to take the TV and DVD player down to the beach or creek and watch the video, but you can take the Ipod.


All I have to do now is find some time to get it all done.

[Nic]

[/quote]

4BC only attracts 10% of the listening population – so its value as a lobbying force for amateur fishing interests is highly suspect. Another 10% of the population listens to 4BC’s sister station 4BH.

So that means that 80% of the population which is mostly young or young at heart is going elsewhere – and I’ll bet that a very large % of those are deeply into new media.

[/quote]

That means there's yet another reason to focus on new media for broadcasting fishing information: if young people prefer new media, that could be a better way to interest them in the sport. Surveys indicate that most anglers are men aged 40+, so in 15 years' time participation rates will decline -- that's unless more young anglers develop an interest in fishing.

[Fafnir]

Great topic this one, and it has got me wondering. Assuming that some (many? most?) fishing journalists get paid something for their efforts by the various mediums they write for, how many members would 'pay' to subscribe to a fishing podcast? Assuming it was a nominal amount.

I don't think it's unreasonable that people who go to the time and effort to share their skills and knowledge make 'something' out of it. I know that the 'free' DVD's are paid for by the companies that the DVD promotes. So the people making and presenting in the DVD's make a dollar out of it that way.

I had this conversation with a collegue recently who is a podcast guru and has been doing online audio for many, many years. I asked him the question 'How do you turn a podcast into profits?'. For him the answer was simple, he runs a marketing tips podcast and as a result of its popularity he signs up new clients.

Advertising is not the answer for the majority of podcasts, as companies have limited budgets and get approached by every man and their dog. Subscription is an answer but how many of you who are reading this would pay a small amount to subscribe to a fishing podcast?

[PinHead]

some intersting points in this discussion...as for an ipod..the missus won one..it is in a drawer and will probably never be used. Not all new technology is necessarily better than that before it....take a laser disc and a dvd and compare...I doubt there is a movie on dvd that can match the quality of a laser disc...only advantage is in the storage space required. Another example is plasma TV's,,why doesn't Sony make them any more...they are unreliable and cannot be repaired. The same applies with the media...as in the case of fishing...the demographics do show one thing...that 10% in the 40-55 age group is not a bad place for a fishing show...most of those under that age do not have as much disposable income for leisure pursuits as in this age group. Numbers listening to a certain station do not show a lot except to the station and as to what advertisers to target for the age group they have predominantly as listeners.

[BAIT_MAN]

I don't agree though that fishing is under siege from those wishing to destroy it. One only has to look at the exponential increase in businesses attempting to trade off the sport in the last couple of years. BCF, Camp Mart, Anaconda, BIAS to name a few.

I doubt this degree of investment would exist for a dying pastime.

PK


Girella
Mate have to disagree with you on this matter. I ask you to visit these sites and then ask that you give me your opinion on the fact that fishing is not under siege from those wishing to destroy it.

1. http://www.amcs.org.au/campaigns/marine_protected_areas/moreton_bay_mp.html

2. http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5478,18271637%255E2862,00.html

3. http://www.fishinghurts.com/pdfs/DaddyKillsAnimals.pdf

4. http://parlinfoweb.aph.gov.au/parlinfo/Repository/Legis/Bills/Linked/20060507.pdf

5. http://www.fishingparty.com.au/forums/viewtopic.php?t=34

Then there is this.

Push to end 'cruel' fishing

By MATTHEW SCHULZ
26feb06
ANIMAL liberationists have focused on Victoria's 600,000 anglers in a new campaign against sports they claim are cruel.
Victorian fishermen say the campaign is ridiculous. #
Animal Liberation spokesman Mark Pearson said recreational fishing was a "barbaric sport" and the group had planned first strikes against game fishing. #
Other action in its bid to wipe out angling would follow if authorities did not act, he said. #
While Mr Pearson would not reveal the group's strategy to wipe out one of Australia's favourite pastimes, US activists have paraded in the streets with stuffed dogs hanging from fishing poles and erected billboards on the same theme. #
People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals (PETA) spokeswoman Karin Robertson said: "If you wouldn't hook the family dog and drag her behind your car, you shouldn't impale a fish and drag her into your boat. #
"Fish are smart, have complex lives and deserve to live free from suffering." #
Animal Liberation has hired barristers and bought boats to prove marlin and shark hunters are breaking animal cruelty laws. #
Mr Pearson said fishing tournaments were "nothing but a glorified abuse of these animals". #
"If these wild animals could scream, maybe someone would listen," he said. #
"If this torture was being inflicted on dolphins, there would be public outrage." #
Mr Pearson vowed the attack on game fishing was the first step. #
"Once we've opened the door to this debate, it raises further questions, such as the fellow down on the wharf who chucks the fish back without eating it," he said. #
But the state peak recreational fishing body, VRFish, said the animal liberationists' campaign was "absolutely ridiculous". #
"It's probably one of the last areas where people can get their own feed from the wild," executive director David Kramer said. #
Anglers were educated about handling fish with care, he said. #
"A group of animal libbers aren't going to stop us. It's like saying we should stop killing cows for beef." #

PETA has a budget $29 Million per year

Do some research on GBRMPA and you will find that there is a 42% downturn in rec fishing in the north not to mention all the businesses that went belly up because of the closures and it is all so happened in the great sandy straights and is about to happen in Moreton Bay.

Latest press release
From: # Opposition Media #
Sent: # Tuesday, March 28, 2006 12:18 PM
Subject: # # # #MEDIA RELEASE - Moreton Bay recreational fishing ban part of Gaven green deal




28 March 2006

Moreton Bay recreational fishing ban part of Gaven green deal

The Queensland Coalition fear recreational fishing will be banned in half of Moreton Bay under a secret pre-election preference deal between the Beattie Labor Government and the extreme greens.

The Australian Marine Conservation Society has launched a campaign to have “at least 30 – 50% of Moreton Bay within reserves (protected areas closed to all extractive activities)” as part of the 10 year review of the marine park.

In State Parliament today, Shadow Fisheries Minister Mike Horan revealed recreational fishers feared the preference deal between Labor and the Greens in the Gaven by-election was based on the delivery of the Moreton Bay lock out.

“I have spoken to a number of recreational fishers and their representative groups who are gravely concerned about the possible rezoning of Moreton Bay,” Mr Horan said. #

“The message I received is they support conservation measures in Moreton Bay but they are afraid the Beattie Labor Government will ban recreational fishing in half the bay, which will only increase pressure on the fishery in the areas that remain open.

“Locking up half of Moreton Bay would anger a lot of people, with a 2001 State Government recreational fishing survey finding there were 471,000 south east Queenslanders, including 77,400 on the Gold Coast, who went fishing at least once a year.

“But the Beattie Labor Government has a track record in shutting down fishing in Moreton Bay, as demonstrated by bans introduced in four key areas in 2003, allegedly to protect grey nurse sharks.

“Fishers were prepared to accept additional restrictions on bottom fishing and night fishing to protect grey nurse sharks when and where they were most active, but the Beattie Labor Government decided to introduce a total ban, which was what the extreme greens wanted.”

Mr Horan said the Beattie Labor Government was not interested in common sense conservation and was only interested in attracting Greens preferences at elections to ensure Labor won marginal seats.

“Farmers and timber workers have borne the brunt of Labor’s environmental extremism in the past but now it’s the Mums, Dads and kids who just want to go fishing or ride a horse who are getting hurt,” he said.

“The Coalition is committed to common sense conservation while Labor is only interested in pandering to the extreme greens.”

I look forward to your comments.

Regards Shane

[PinHead]

Shane...does anyone really take notice of PETA here..they may have had some success elsewhere but I don't think they will have much success in Aust.

As for the comments of the Shadow Minister..they are exactly that..a shadow. A member in opposition has to make some noise at some time to try and let the electorate know they are there...could be whole new ball game if they won Govt and he became Minisiter. As for Labor making deals with the Greens...that is nothing new. The Labor Party is just a group of factions..one of these factions is the Socialist Left..once the domain of Senator George Georges..they have a very left and green leaning...they have done long before the Greens were heard of. The Labor Party makes the preference deals with the Greens to appease the Socialist Left faction...if anyone thinks Mr Beattie runs Qld they are mistaken...until recently Qld has been ruled by Bill Ludwig and Terry Mackenroth...they are/were the powerbrokers in the Labor movement in this State.

As for the journalism....Opposition members do not often get into print unless it is a slow news day.

As for the forced demise of fishing as a pastime...the average worker has far more serious (in his view) things to concentrate on..work, mortgage, kids etc etc etc...fishing does not rate highly on their agenda. Therein lies a large problem in instigating numbers to try and approach Govt....or else the few have to make a lot of noise and be well armed with the facts...not an easy thing to do.

[webby]

Excuse my age and not into all these electronic thing-a-mig-gigs but whats a ipod :-[
regards

[PinHead]

Excuse my age and not into all these electronic thing-a-mig-gigs but whats a ipod :-[regards


Okay old fella..an ipod is something that holds a lot of music on it ( I think)..and ya stick the earpugs in ya ears and ya walk around bopping along to the music...I know..must be hard for someone of your age to understand when you are just coming to grips with 45rpm records..I told ya those 78's are dated

[charleville]

Excuse my age and not into all these electronic thing-a-mig-gigs but whats a ipod :-[regards


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IPod

That is the hardware. #They are like walkmans in that they play music or other stuff such as audio books (www.audible.com) but are computer related and can do other stuff like play podcasts. #Podcasts are regular downloads of audio material - eg a radio broadcast or an interest like military history that someone has turned into a series of audio or video presentations. #Podcasts use a protocol called RSS (Really simple syndication) which means that when you turn on your computer every day it downloads the latest podcasts that you have registered and when you plug your ipod into the computer it deletes the podcasts that you have listened to and #transfers the ones that you have not yet listened to on to the ipod (or other MP3 device)

I think that Apple Computer Company sold 43million ipods last year, up from 10 million the previous year.

Regards...

[imported_admin]

Don't worry Webby, Ill bring mine along on Sunday and you can have a look

http://images.apple.com/au/itunes/home/images/2005/10/promoipodvideo20051013.jpg


Interesting if people would pay to subscribe to a fishing podcast. I remember quite a few tyears back someone had a site with all Mal Florences videos on it and people could subscribe to watch them. Maybe a bit before its time or people just didn't want to pay. People more and more these days seems to expect it for free if it has anything to do with the internet. The biggest problem with podcasting or any internet video is bandwidth and the cost to the server owner.Maybe people would pay a small fee and then teh bulk of the cost would be paid by advertisiers. But then people might would get sick of the ads.
I was just going to do the first few as a trial and see where it goes from there.

Anyway, see what people think.

[charleville]

Charleville, I fear that you will soon be assassinated as eventually happens to
all bright young upstarts like yourself who know too much.


Nah! # It won’t happen because:-

1. every journalist reading this thread knows that I am right #;) – well except that I might have to watch out for Nugget because he may get cranky that this thread may awaken some giants who might not want him to corner the market with the new media ideas that he is working on. ;D ;D

2. I am on the side of the angels. #Mr Ausfish virtually says so in his response here and he is the Almighty on this site by definition. (Well ok - #perhaps I am applying a liberal interpretation to his response.) #;D ;D



I am currently working on some Hints & Tips for viewing on the new Ipods.

Things like -
How to Cast an Alvey
How to cast a Baitcaster
How to use a Yabby Pump
Etc.
Etc.

Bit hard to take the TV and DVD #player down to the beach or creek and watch the video, but you can take the Ipod. #

Very reassuring Steve #:) - ..and maybe some topics like boat maintenance, replacing wheel bearings, crossing ocean bars, how to catch a mud crab, how to cook a mud crab, how to eat a mud crab (only joking!) ;D ;D, what to look for in collecting bait for luderick, boat/trailer security devices, interviews with the fisheries minister etc etc etc.



Assuming that some (many? most?) fishing journalists get paid something for their efforts by the various mediums they write for, how many members would 'pay' to subscribe to a fishing podcast?

Undoubtedly, the business proposition for any new media takes a little time to sort out. #I doubt if any “punter” will pay for podcasts but sponsors might pay for some advertising in each message or perhaps it will be the virility of the website from which they come that will attract new advertisers. Maybe it is just the fame that the podcasts bring to the speaker that will grow into a bigger media offer.



I had this conversation with a collegue recently who is a podcast guru and has been doing online audio for many, many years. I asked him the question 'How do you turn a podcast into profits?'. For him the answer was simple, he runs a marketing tips podcast and as a result of its popularity he signs up new clients. #


Yep – I have no doubt about that. #I listen to a couple of USA financial advisors who run a regular podcast and because of what I hear them say and the genuineness in their voices, I reckon that if I were a yank, I would look them up. #



Advertising is not the answer for the majority of podcasts, as companies have limited budgets and get approached by every man and their dog. Subscription is an answer but how many of you who are reading this would pay a small amount to subscribe to a fishing podcast?

I will never have the fishing talent to be a fishing journalist #:-[ but I suspect that there would not be a lot of money in fishing journalism for most of them anyway. #I have long suspected that it just helps pay for their hobby at best and is just an extension of their hobby at worst. #:-/ #Those who do innovate are the ones who hit the big time with regular TV gigs. #Happy to be told that I am wrong, of course. #:) :)

So podcasting just one of the new media. #I would love to think that the members on this site can actually voice what it is that fishing journalists could do with the new media to excite them. # :) :) :)

[charleville]

By the way, if print newspapers are important for people for their weekly dose of fishing journalism, they really ought to be getting material published in the suburban freebie newspapers - #eg those owned mostly by Quest Newspapers in Brisbane.

A couple of years ago, an intelligent person told me that 6 million people in Australia read newspapers but that 4 million of that 6 million only ever read their free suburban newspaper.

At the time, I researched the validity of that and could not disprove it. #I was also told that similar comments had been made by the boss of Cumberland Press which runs most of Sydney's free suburban papers.

Lots of self-interests suggested to me at the time that the numbers were erroneous with arguments about circulation versus readership but no one but no one was able to convince me that the numbers were not right - and as a person well connected to large corporate marketers and media relations people who measure all sorts of things about media effectiveness in relation to corporate messages and therefore should understand the numbers, not one of them ever proved those numbers wrong to me.

So the bottom line for those people on this site who do want to wage campaigns about things like preserving our amateur fishing rights, you might want to target the suburbans rather than the major dailies - but you will need to do it in a way that illustrates a local relevance.

:) :) :)

[imnotoriginal]

Charlie,
great read mate, plenty of good points in there that you've obviously thought about extensively. #As a journalism student myself I've read about plenty of these issues, although more in terms of political journalism than for fishing. #I think there is evidence of some fishing websites and writers (they will remain unnamed as competitors of this site) that have started to use this medium and I, as a consumer of a wide variety of these sites, have enjoyed many articles written both on Ausfish by nugget and by other writers on some of ausfish's competitors. #I think we will see a growth in the use of the internet for fishing information, just look at how the use of sites like ausfish are growing. #It would be interesting to see steve's figures on the usage of this site over time. #I think sites such as this are the future of fishing journalism. #Fishing magazines still hold quite a place in the field, but frankly, I don't think fishing is a section of priority for newspapers that are struggling with their coverage of political issues and continual public dissatisfaction.

As for the uselessness of Brownies reports, there I do disagree. #It's not always great for the fishing regulars or people who live locally, but for people who are trying new spots without any prior knowledge it can be quite helpful. #It may not be the most informative of reports, but it is at least a starting point and I still look to it either online or in the sunday mail for a general idea of how the fishing is going.

Anyways, I really enjoyed reading your comments. #Here's hoping ausfish just keeps growing.
Joel
P.S. I'm pretty sure quest newspapers, who do the local rags, are owned by newslimited, who own the courier mail and the australian.

[imported_admin]

Very valid point on the local papers. I can't remember the last time I bought a newspapper but I read the local free one every week. Well at least I look at the pictures and read the article if the attached if the title catches my interest.

Maybe Sunfish or the Fishing paper could get a range of articles written that have a lot of info in them as well as a good underpinning message about fishing. Then just send them out and about for the newspapers to print without a fee. They may be surprised at how many people read it.

I know one of the many papers Nugget writes for missed his weekly article once and were amazed at the amount of complaints they received. Thing is if they hadn't of missed it they would have never received any feedback of how many people read it and would have never valued it as I am sure they do now.

[rick_k]

We are all on line. A big chunk of the population is not. Should we leave them behind or abandon them?

Politics is a dirty business of compromises and back room deals. I'll lay my cards on the table and say I voted for the Coalition because I fish, drive, camp and hunt, and with the exception of shooting, thought I got a better deal under the Coalition on those things than under Labor. And I thought that the Labor party was so far Right as to be the same as the Coalition on work matters. OOOOooooppsss. Sorry.

But, the 5% of voters have the whip hand. If I am going to be done over at work (and we did worse under the Eyebrow and the Gay Clock Collector (I'm a straight clock collector) on wages than we have done under Flack Jacket Johnie, then I'm voting for the b@st@rds who'll let me do what I need to do on my time off (I was going to type weekends, but they may be a thing of the past)

Rick k

[finga64]

I still want to know how do you go online when your on the throne?? :'(
It's the only room with peace and quite long enough for me to read an article. And people can't laugh at me when my lips move when I read. :-/

Good point about the fee Quest type papers. They're about the only papers we read.

[charleville]

I still want to know how do you go online when your on the throne?? #:'(


Too easy. #:) #Ipods will do that for you either as a video device or just to listen to a podcast. #I do it all the time because as I am on a long long service leave, I find myself doing lots of jobs around the house very contently listening to various Podcasts, especially Radio National. So as I move from room to room no matter which room #;), the ipod stays in my top pocket and the ear buds stay in my ears.

By the way, when I do find the energy to take a daily walk (haven't taken one for about 8 months now #:() I always walk listening to audiobooks on my Ipod. #In this way, I got to hear Bill Clinton narrate his own book (6 hours 10 minutes) at a cost of about $12. #It was panned by the critics as being too long and boring when it was first published in print form but it was pretty good with him narrating it. ( ie I downloaded the book from audible.com - but you can also get audio books on CD from your local library and download them for free via your computer. #I also listened to "War & Peace #by Leo Tolstoy - it takes about 60 - 70 hours and is the most boring book ever written - I would never have sustained reading the thing but at an hour at a time on my then daily walk, I listened to the lot.)

My ipod listening habits tend to annoy my wife a bit though as when she talks to me I cannot hear her. #;D ;D ;D ;D # This reminds me of the joke from the jokes thread on this site... # ;D ;D ;D ;D

[charleville]

I'm pretty sure quest newspapers, who do the local rags, are owned by newslimited, who own the courier mail and the australian.



Yep - I vaguely recall that you may be right on that but they are a separately managed business with their own centre of gravity. #I once read that Frank Packer and the Fairfaxes used to ridicule the young Rupert Murdoch because he was running a minor paper in Adelaide in his early days. #;D ;D ;D

I also know that there are journos who work on the suburbans have been known to migrate to the big dailies in their careers. #So plant whatever seeds you want to there and you never know what blooms a little later on. #I mean this either in a career sense as you have said that you are a journalism student or to those people on this site who seek to use print media for lobbying purposes.

[blaze]

Like I said earlier, I must be getting toooooooooo ooooolld .
I dont fear modern technology
Purchased the first 2 digital cameras in tassie
Used internet before it was the internet.

But I buy my area newspaper on most days
buy the local one once a week (should be free for all the info in it)

Would wonder why any one would want to spend all there spare time walking around with something jammed in their ear.
What ever happened to good quality think time, time to dream, time to be just brain dead so it dont go into over drive and burn you out. relaxation
Maybe thats why small country towns like my own are full of relaxed people who generate the wealth for the mind boggled city city folk who live off the wealth we generate because at the end of the day the wealth of a nation is from "PRIMARY" production (got a bit off topic there)

I move foward kicking and screaming, still love all the old
cheers
blaze

[charleville]

Would wonder why any one would want to spend all there spare time walking around with something jammed in their ear.
What ever happened to good quality think time, time to dream, time to be just brain dead so it dont go into over drive and burn you out. relaxation


No one agrees more with you than I do Blaze. #One of my greatest thrills is to sit in the back yard without ipod or anything else (well maybe a hose when we were allowed to do such things #:( ) just looking at the stars and contemplating - one of the reasons that I like going night fishing on my own and indeed one of the joys of going fishing on my own 99% of the time.

But I have to admit that I hate doing exercise as I find it so boring - likewise doing dishes (not that I do them very often but I sometimes like to win some brownie points #;D #and we threw out that noisy, unreliable, cockroach-breeding, albeit Prince Phillip Design Award winning, dishwasher many many years ago ;D) - so when I have an intelligent program in my ear, I am perfect happy to do the mundane things with no sign of impatience. :)

In a similar vein to your comment, I find TV to be worse in that you have your brain pounded by both vision and sound so there is no hope of true relaxation. >:( #Since I have been on my 13 months long service leave, I have hardly watched any TV but when I was at work, I would regularly come home buggered and just slump in front of it and not move all night. :-/

[Fafnir]

In years gone by I worked for a daily newspaper, that also had a free weekly paper. Interesting point about circulation vs readership. Pretty fair bet if you 'buy' a paper you will read it. Hard to know what happens with all the free ones. But certainly at the paper I worked at, they operated out of the same building, but were in the main seperate entities, often with sales reps fighting over the same advertising dollar. But most importantly, run by different editors who each decided on their own content. I would imagine Quest would be the same.

[charleville]

I Pretty fair bet if you 'buy' a paper you will read it.


Nah - I don't buy that. That was the usual argument mounted by the major dailies when I was trying to test the numbers but it has flaws.

I subscribed to delivered papers for years and many times they went unread because I was just so busy (and anyway some of the midweek papers did not have much in them anyway) or because I was out of town which I was for a lot of time in my job - like every week. I recall often throwing out several unopened rolled-up papers every week or so. >:(

By comparison, everyone in my household reads the freebie because it is friendly folksy local news. :) I don't give much of a toss about what is happening on the Gaza strip or what Tony Blair said yesterday such as gets reported every week in the major dailies and neither does anyone else in my home but the rest of the family will want to look at the pictures of the local school kids or see what entertainment is coming to the local shopping centre.

So the circulation figures of the major dailies may mean that each paper is read by just one person and maybe some days, it might be a cursory flick through at best whereas each suburban paper may be read by maybe four people in some households soaking up each and every page.

[Fafnir]

Ah, takes me back to my days as a sales rep, when all of these arguements were used for and against (depending on which publication I was selling for at the time).


I subscribed to delivered papers for years

You have a point here. I was talking more about a paper that you physically went out and purchased on that day. Subscription stats were always dubious for the points you have stated.

Having done some research in this area myself, I was surprised at the time (we are talking more than a decade ago), at how many households did NOT read their free weekly paper. But I suspect that it varies from market to market.

[Fafnir]

But going back to another point ...


I will even go out of my way to buy a magazine that gives away free advertorial DVDs such as the sort of stuff that Paul Burt does. These often lack the polish of big budget productions


I doubt if any “punter” will pay for podcasts

Herein lies the problem. It’s hard to fund anything of ‘quality’ without $. I am friends with a number of people who produce fishing media and I know the challenge they find in getting advertising dollars.

Paying a small fee, enables the person producing it to create a quality publication, complete with interviews with identities that would not feature without being paid for their time.

I personally would pay a small subscription fee for a quality podcast. Still curious as to whether others would. Maybe Steve could start a polll???

[Gutsy]

Very interesting topic. And very popular considering the amount of replies in such a short time. Well Done Charlie.

I myself suscribe to several fishing mags and flick thru these to read the articles that attract my attention. In saying that I must admit that I am always keen to read Nugget's article in the free local rag.

I think with technology growing and companies trying to grasp more market share podcasts and the like are the future. I mean, just look we are all on the web debating this topic on a great, free forum (Thanks Steve). A forum site that I'm sure Steve can allaborate further, but has more and more people joining each day. The same can be said about other popular fishing websites.

I myself would download podcasts on fishing related topics, and infact think it would be great to listen to Dave's show throughout the day at my own leisure. Ensuring I don't miss a beat.

Looking forward to reading further replies.

Cheers.

Marcel.

[Fafnir]

So Marcel, would you consider paying a dollar or two per month if Dave or Steve had a podcast that was subscription based?

[Gutsy]

I would consider it, yes. Compared to the price of Monthly Fishing Mags I think a dollar or two is fair.

Would you consider it?

[Gutsy]

Sorry, just re-read you previous post and you would. ;) Fafnir.

PS, What is your real name....?

Cheers,

Marcel.

[Fafnir]

Podcasts, decent ones anyway, can be time consuming. So I like the thought that if someone were to put in the time and effort to do a decent one, that they would be able to get paid for their time. I think that a couple of dollars a month would be fair and reasonable, particularly if a lot of people subscribed.

I have no problem with other people making money. I like to think that if Steve, or Dave or anyone else for that matter started a $2 a month podcast that they could get thousands of subscribers world wide and make millions out of it. The site already offers heaps of top class free advice. But I would have no problem with paying a small amount for something along those lines. I just like to see people getting paid for their efforts.

PS Trevor

[tincanpeter]

As an oldie I can remember when newspaper journalists were also writers and able to entertain. Now as admitted by professors of journalistism due to the large supply of news materials , they are now becoming receivers and publishers of articals written by outside sources. You only have to read some of the political stories to see the results. Newspaper journalists have become BORING.
You can always pick when an audit on newspaper sales is due, free or subsidised
newspapers or some other give away gimmick

[coxy]

In my day, in my day....

I TOTALLY agree but unfortunately I'm not "In my day" anymore.


In your day did you get on the internet to talk fishing to people you've never met??

When I went to school there were no such things as mobile phones. Now most of my mates are employed by mobile phones.

It's no reason to be scared or angry but just to know that things change whether we like it or not. I can't do anything about it & neither can any of us.