ipad 1 as a chartplotter

[strobe1970]

Hi!,

I am being given a second iPad 1 and also need a chart plotter for the boat. So I'm thinking that the iPad may be a solution utilising the Navionics HD application and an appropriate water proof case and a mount suitable for the boat. Potentially much cheaper than buying a hds 10.

Just wondering whether anybody has had some experience of this solution and whether it works in sunlight etc. And any recommendations on water proofing and mounts etc.


Regards,

Paul

[Crunchy]

Does the navionics app work (fully functional) without an Internet connection? I have a feeling it may not....this is what put me off this idea but check it out as I may be wrong.

[Crunchy]

It's not clear but I don't think it will function as a real Marine (chart plotter) GPS, some comments from their FAQ's

A. An internet connection is only needed to download Navionics Mobile to your iPad. Once downloaded, the map resides on the iPad allowing you to view Navionics Mobile Charts with the smartphones' internal GPS.

A. With the iPad 3G, location technology is built into the device. Your approximate location is determined using available information from cellular network data, local Wi-Fi networks (if you have Wi-Fi turned on), and GPS (if you have an iPad 3G; GPS not

A. Navionics Mobile Charts are not intended to replace fully functional chartplotters; however they are an excellent reference tool or compliment to your onboard electronics. You can find your position, seamlessly pan and zoom on the map, query chart obje

[Andy56]

If it has a gps chip, you have got a damn fine unit. I have two apps on my iphone, isailor and navionics. Both should work fine on an ipad.
Not so sure without the gps chip though, especially if you have no reception.

[wirlybird]

the navionics works on the phone signal and gps so it should work no matter what your reception is i tested this in the Whitsundays with my iphone

[FishHunter]

Does the navionics app work (fully functional) without an Internet connection? I have a feeling it may not....this is what put me off this idea but check it out as I may be wrong.

No internet required once you have downloaded the maps

[FishHunter]

If the scrapple version is anything like the Android version it is pretty much exactly the same charts as your chartplotter, it has 3 day wind forcasts (internet required) moon rise and set times, sun rise and set times, Tides and currents which is more than most chart plotters. it also saves tracks and routes and has a few other features which require internet access. mYou can aslo overlay satellite imagery (internet required)

However its not as quick and easy to save waypoints and if you have the wrong settings you will share your waypoints with the world. Using the touch screen in a bouncing boat is also a exercise in frustration

[strobe1970]

I've played with the android iPhone version and you can indeed download maps and use them offline. Also it uses the internal GPS. It seems functional standalone ie not connected to the Internet. Pushing a touch screen in a bouncing boat I imagine would be a challenge. Any advice around mounts and water proofing and where to get them?

Regards,

Paul

[FishHunter]

I've played with the android iPhone version and you can indeed download maps and use them offline. Also it uses the internal GPS. It seems functional standalone ie not connected to the Internet. Pushing a touch screen in a bouncing boat I imagine would be a challenge. Any advice around mounts and water proofing and where to get them?

Regards,

Paul

Ram and Talon make Ipad mounts and various suppliers make waterproof bags. Let google be your friend, ebay is also a good place to find them

[gpz1991]

No internet required once you have downloaded the maps

Have iPad ll with navionics, detail is great and the download is cheap at around $50. Have not used the mapping on my combo unit since except asa referance to transfer my marks, as fishunter said you do not need Internet conection once you download maps.

Only suggestion is buy a good quality mount, I tried a cheaper mount and nearly lost a $ 800 iPad over board when it broke.

[Crunchy]

I wonder why they say it's not Replacement for chart plotter?

[FishHunter]

I wonder why they say it's not Replacement for chart plotter?
Maybe it keeps people paying $400 for chartplotter software instead of $15 for a android version? It has more features than my Gold version but it doesn't have the ease of creating, storing and finding waypoints, and for me working the touchscreen while underway is a big issue.

As always you pays your money and you makes your choices


Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2

[Crunchy]

CheersFH, OK so my $1500 spent on the a chart plotter may not have been a total waste then!

[Jakers 69]

Have iPad ll with navionics, detail is great and the download is cheap at around $50. Have not used the mapping on my combo unit since except asa referance to transfer my marks, as fishunter said you do not need Internet conection once you download maps.

Only suggestion is buy a good quality mount, I tried a cheaper mount and nearly lost a $ 800 iPad over board when it broke.

AS MENTIONED BY Fishhunter, Talon and ram make quality mounts.

[Kondo 1]

Ram have a good waterproof mount, I have the non-waterproof mount in my landcruiser - works well.

Though I have found the gps is rubbish - you need a Dual XGPS Bluetooth device, then it works very very well.

[goat boy]

Navionics ap requires no internet connection to work, only to download the program, maps etc. There are some good ram mounts around, brands already mentioned. You can get a waterproof dive bag for it but that sorta negates the ram mount and so on. A good case like the heavy duty shock ones from gumdrop isn't waterproof but depending on where it's mounted you may not need full waterproof (the rubber case and screen protector are good splash protection though...
There is an issue with viewing the tablets in daylight for some, you can use a product such as nushields dayvue to help with this

I have a tablet on a ram mount, with gumdrop case and glare reduction on it. works fine, have used it solid for over a year, love the big, touch screen capability. I do have several backup gps/chartplotter options but have never used them since this setup and would hate to have to go back.

[Splash]

... some juicy links to read....

http://gpscradle.dualav.com/

http://www.thehulltruth.com/marine-electronics-forum/433095-ipad-chatplotter.html


Splash

[odes20]

Ram have a good waterproof mount, I have the non-waterproof mount in my landcruiser - works well.

Though I have found the gps is rubbish - you need a Dual XGPS Bluetooth device, then it works very very well.
How many of you have actually tried using the gps capability of your IPad or phone?
I'm with you on this Kondo. They do have Gps but it's not an efficient update rate for real time Gps function on the water. Especially when in marginal country. Like you I bought a Dual xgps GPS Bluetooth, and it is brilliant. They are hard to find in Aussie, got mine from USA $120 delivered, and give my IPad 2 proper Gps reception.

[WalrusLike]

How many of you have actually tried using the gps capability of your IPad or phone?
I'm with you on this Kondo. They do have Gps but it's not an efficient update rate for real time Gps function on the water. Especially when in marginal country. Like you I bought a Dual xgps GPS Bluetooth, and it is brilliant. They are hard to find in Aussie, got mine from USA $120 delivered, and give my IPad 2 proper Gps reception.

I found the opposite.... Twice my Navionics has been more accurate than my Garmin 551S. [EDIT: Using iPad 3 ]

My iPad seems to be fairly accurate down to about 2-3 metres every time I use it. Updates fine. The same for my Garmin. However the Garmin failed miserably in the Brisbane river west of the Regatta (roughly around there somewhere) and had me on land mostly. Basically where the chart soundings run out so does the chart accuracy. Not a "gps fix" issue since it was bang on as soon as the soundings started. It also had me on land in Couran cove. The Navionics had soundings right up to Jindalee (at least.. Maybe more)

The iPad is useless in strong daylight and is very difficult to use on a rough sea. But it is great for looking around and finding distances, and gives you a better situational awareness than the small Garmin screen. I use it often as a Gods Eye View if I am in small channels to get a bigger picture than the Garmin. It's also superb for tides..... Let's you easily see how much more water will disappear after you anchor. (I notice a few of us Ausfishers have been stranded lately). :) A iPad would have saved them....

So I bung it in a Glad Ziplock (touches work through the plastic) and always have it handy. I bung my head in the cabin if it's hard to see. I consider it a valuable aid and would choose it over the Garmin if only choosing one Plotter device. However the Garmin does many other things like Fuel usage and Trip etc and so is the essential device.

[Tim Hutchison]

I didn't think iPad 1 had a built in GPS

[strobe1970]

iPad 1s with the 3G data capability have GPS as well. The straight wifi ones don't have the gps capability.

I also have a 16 channel Bluetooth gps module that I can test as well sand see if that improves performance.

Paul

[Kondo 1]

I found my GPS on the IPAD 2 3G works ok in town, but certainly as soon as I lose network coverage it is gone. Hence the XGPS. I predominantly use my Ipad for off road mapping and it certainly isn't very good at all once cvoerage becomes patchy, though I suspect that if you are in the Bay or close to land then most times you will have network coverage anyway.

Walruslike - I am wondering if it is a mapping data issue, generally I dont think that sort of issue would be GPS fix related but more likely to be mapping that it is not quite right. I know I have experienced "driving" over land plenty of times with my HDS and Navionics card as well, I have cross referenced up to 3 devices at once to check on the fix accuracy and they are all very very close if not identical - I would say there has to be some room for error in the mapping, they could not possibly get everything spot on, especially where you are talking about close quarters manouevering IE less than 10-15M from the bank - as such I would say the Garmin mapping probably had some slightly different mapping data to the Navionics data on the Ipad. I reckon this would be particularly likely the further upriver you go on any given river depending on how far of the survey they have put into their mapping cards.

I would say the reasoning behind the disclaimer on the Ipad Navionics app is just an a$$ covering exercise, one they know the GPS and position fix data can be erroneous where network coverage is marginal or non-existent and the other probably the same as the warning I get on my HDS when it powers up saying not for navigation. It is just to stop the manufacturer being sued if some goose runs into some rocks becasue he believed totally what his plotter was showing. Hard for them to guarantee the data integrity/position fix info when it is at the mercy of the US Military and whatever error they decide to program for any given day.

[WalrusLike]

Yeah Kondo it is not the Garmin not knowing where it is... But rather the map of the river is wrong.

That's what I meant when I said its not a "gps fix" issue since it was bang on when it got to the part it had soundings for.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

[Kondo 1]

Yeah Kondo it is not the Garmin not knowing where it is... But rather the map of the river is wrong.

That's what I meant when I said its not a "gps fix" issue since it was bang on when it got to the part it had soundings for.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

After I re-read your initial post I thought that may have been the case :) too many cold and flu drugs here lately.

[FishHunter]

I found my GPS on the IPAD 2 3G works ok in town, but certainly as soon as I lose network coverage it is gone. Hence the XGPS. I predominantly use my Ipad for off road mapping and it certainly isn't very good at all once cvoerage becomes patchy, though I suspect that if you are in the Bay or close to land then most times you will have network coverage anyway.

Walruslike - I am wondering if it is a mapping data issue, generally I dont think that sort of issue would be GPS fix related but more likely to be mapping that it is not quite right. I know I have experienced "driving" over land plenty of times with my HDS and Navionics card as well, I have cross referenced up to 3 devices at once to check on the fix accuracy and they are all very very close if not identical - I would say there has to be some room for error in the mapping, they could not possibly get everything spot on, especially where you are talking about close quarters manouevering IE less than 10-15M from the bank - as such I would say the Garmin mapping probably had some slightly different mapping data to the Navionics data on the Ipad. I reckon this would be particularly likely the further upriver you go on any given river depending on how far of the survey they have put into their mapping cards.

I would say the reasoning behind the disclaimer on the Ipad Navionics app is just an a$$ covering exercise, one they know the GPS and position fix data can be erroneous where network coverage is marginal or non-existent and the other probably the same as the warning I get on my HDS when it powers up saying not for navigation. It is just to stop the manufacturer being sued if some goose runs into some rocks becasue he believed totally what his plotter was showing. Hard for them to guarantee the data integrity/position fix info when it is at the mercy of the US Military and whatever error they decide to program for any given day.


Must be an apple issue as the gps in my old Sony Ericson and 2 samsung tablets and a Samsung phone all work perfectly very far from a cell phone signal.

[strobe1970]

I can also confirm that the iPad 1 3G that I have, without a sim card inserted and wifi turned off, does gps location fine. Just used it today to navigate from Townsville to Cairns albeit using google maps.

Paul

[Andy56]

As I said, gps chip is a must. You guys that say that once the maps are downloaded its fine, check to see if your ipad has the gps chip. Without the chip and no mobile reception, it will be just a static map, ie, how does it know where you are? get the point?

[ozscott]

My Iconia on a ram mount with ram tough tray II works very well as a GPS without a 3G card inserted. Cheers

[stevemid]

I have an iPad 1 and cannot read it in outside daylight however, it works great inside the car, as someone else commented.

[WalrusLike]

As I said, gps chip is a must. You guys that say that once the maps are downloaded its fine, check to see if your ipad has the gps chip. Without the chip and no mobile reception, it will be just a static map, ie, how does it know where you are? get the point?

I thought the iPad 2 and 3 had gps in every model... Not sure about ipad1 though.

[jtpython]

if you have service it works soon as no service bye bye gps

[myusernam]

my windows phone gps works without reception.

[goat boy]

Phone service covereage and gps coverage are not linked. They are only linked if you are using an application that utilises both at once (ie some of the navionics features or google nav features). Your ap (whatever that may be) may experience issues if network coverage is lost and it is continually searching for something not there (switch auto roaming off). Or you are trying to use a linked internet feature (facebook etc).
Save yourself the battery life and the hassles, if you have a device (phone or tablet) switch off wi-fi and anything else related to 'mobile network' coverage before you try and use any nav features, most of your issues will disappear.
Some nav programs do link in with both at once constantly so are useless without mobile network coverage. Navionics does not need mobile network coverage to work, only for some extra features that have no bearing on the actual navigation at all.

[FishHunter]

if you have service it works soon as no service bye bye gps

Really? Must be something wrong with my phones and tablets then as the gps works just fine 80km offshore

[WalrusLike]

Guys the Wifi only cheaper version of the iPads does not have GPS but when connected to wifi it works out its location via triangulation of known wifi hotspots.

Some say you can tether to a iPhone and locate that way but i don't know if that works.

The cellular versions ((3G and 4G) do have a GPS chip. The iPad 3 also has access to the Russion GPS system Glonass.

iPads with GPS have what is called assisted GPS which means that they use wifi and cell tower info to quickly get first fix and to improve accuracy after gps fix.

To display your location on a map needs two things.... The location, and the map. The map is digital data so must be downloaded. You've seen that happen in Maps app when the rectangular 'tiles' are gradually going from grey to map pictures. So if you are somewhere without a data signal but you have previously 'browsed' that location you can see a perfectly good map and location icon because it has it's two needs met... Map data, and a GPS 'fix'.

If you've just turned it on in a data black-spot location it won't get a location as quickly as normal but it will eventually. So if your going somewhere that has no coverage browse the area before going there.... All will work fine then.

Some apps like Navionics have the ability to specify a download map and then it stores it... So it works out of coverage area if you have the gps enabled iPad.

By the way.... Einstein said that time slows down when you go fast and that it also slows down when in a gravity field. Sounds like nonsense, but if you don't allow for the slow down on the satellite because it's going fast, and also the slowdown on your ipad because it's in a gravity field, the gps location would be out by a couple of kilometers!!

Sorry to bore you.... If you read this far you have too much time on your hands.... :)

[thelump]

http://www.thehulltruth.com/marine-electronics-forum/433095-ipad-chatplotter.html (http://www.thehulltruth.com/marine-electronics-forum/433095-ipad-chatplotter.html) and http://www.lifedge.co.uk/ (http://www.lifedge.co.uk/)

[lethal098]

I use My Ipad 2 (3g and Wifi, but with no sim card fitted)as a Chartplotter as i can take it with me not only on my boat but on other trips that i do, I use it onboard our Coastguard rescue vessels also and have never had an issue with no reception.

Biggest downfall is the Power, I would reccomend having power available for it, The other is Temperature, All good during Winter but come summer and it gets too hot on the Dash and Disables itself.

Other than that its fantastic.

Cheers Lee

[gpz1991]

Had no problems with my iPad 2, ran it side by side with my chart plotter for the first few trips, both appear to have the same accuracy, have used it with no mobile signal and have no complaints, I do tend to use it as a secondary plotter like when sounding for fish, in a perfect world we would all have the best electronics that would fit in our boats, if you are getting it for free why not use it, good luck

[strobe1970]

Still working on this and I have almost a solution ready to install. I have decided to have a backup chartplotter (in the form of a HDS5) but use the IPAD as the main device. Solution so far:

IPAD - IPAD 1 64Gb with inbuilt GPS
Apps - iSailor (useful for navigation and has good covereage of rivers, lakes etc) and Navionics HD AUS/NZ for fishing marks etc
Case - Overboard Waterproof case (6Metres)
Cradle - Overboard Marine Pod
Mount - RAM Marine grade

I'm still working on remote power as the IPAD is only rated at 10hours continual use. I have found a flat ipad power cable which will fit into the case and I can run the cable out of the waterproof case (which will make it water-resistant rather than water-proof).

I'll post some photos once its all installed.

[ozscott]

Acer Iconia - Ram marine grade mount and Ram Tuff Tray II - inbuilt GPS, no 3G card installed - very fast to fine sats and very good plotting and tracks etc. Gotta love the sense of proportion with an 11 inch screen...

Cheers

PS. Power on the dash and a zip bag to seal, which allows it to still get gripped hard by the tuff tray.

[jtpython]

Yep i stuff up sorry guys
JT