Minn Kota and Lithium Ion batteries

[bobfromblacky]

I have something to ad to the original topic, having experience With watersnake and mk using lithium, some good and bad, just can’t be arsed because someone decides to use this forum to champion the cause of a known f***wit, bro there’s woke forum’s out there that will accommodate you.

[gazza2006au]

Dis off topic.. but no one wanted to see you fail with your build/import some guys knew what u were getting before that hull was built you your self later confirmed the shit work done by the chinese with the hull bending and the builder leaving out bulkheads etc.. i dont think anyone rear ended u for it and no one said i told you so all there were a bunch of blokes in disbelief that u got ripped off but you still didnt feel like u were sworded and everything panned out

It was the way u attacked people in your replies as a respond to people telling not to build in china

For me personally where it began what pissed me off was the original boat designer/builder is still building your boat in small numbers but you took your business to china for a cheap copy than when i had something to say about it u went bolistic and here we are today

[Paul071978]

Getting waaaay off topic guys not a good look for this forum....

[shakey55]

Dis off topic.. but no one wanted to see you fail with your build/import some guys knew what u were getting before that hull was built you your self later confirmed the shit work done by the chinese with the hull bending and the builder leaving out bulkheads etc.. i dont think anyone rear ended u for it and no one said i told you so all there were a bunch of blokes in disbelief that u got ripped off but you still didnt feel like u were sworded and everything panned out

It was the way u attacked people in your replies as a respond to people telling not to build in china

For me personally where it began what pissed me off was the original boat designer/builder is still building your boat in small numbers but you took your business to china for a cheap copy than when i had something to say about it u went bolistic and here we are today

F..K the off topic shite. I have no qualms with any of you but this bullying has been what has caused some young people to take their own lives and you think it’s alright to to do it as an adult. I know one thing if it was your children copping this you’d be doing everything to stop it.

I enjoy reading/learning from some things you both have to say but really leave it alone.

Both need a chill pill, take three steps back and really have a good think about what you are doing here.

And don’t say it’s his fault, just accept it’s over and get on with life.


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[NAGG]

Take it elsewhere boys - it's not needed here ....... All cool to have a robust debate but don't make it personal & get back to battery / leccy talk .

Chris

[blacklab]

ppppppppppppppp

[bluefin59]

Sorry I’m going fishing

[Barry Ehsman]

Why don't you bloke's just shut the f@@k up i was interested in this topic but your bullying has pissed me off. Why can't you send each other a PM so we don't have to put up with your chest beating.

[Noelm]

Jesus...I just had a look at this thread for the first time, it's turned out nice hasn't it? I saw the weather report and there was no mention of a shit storm! It's time to put it all to bed, apologise if you think you have done wrong, accept it if you think you have been done wrong and just move on.

[fishtragic]

Apologies if this post goes over old news in the above pages, I couldn't be bothered reading through the ##### measuring contest going on. I installed lithiums to run my 112lb MK September '19 after checking directly with Minn Kota at the boat show to ask if they will cover warranty if I do so. I was told definitely no problem with warranty but they advise against it. No issues for 6 mths then major malfunction of all electrics, motors, board, wiring. All due to 3 x 12v Lithiums in series producing 41V and too high a current draw for too prolonged a period. BLA repaired the MK under warranty without question. They did, however, say that after warranty period I'm on my own, fair enough. I have been running it since with the same setup without a problem. I was told by their service people to keep the power meter on the remote under 7 and I 'should' be OK, also to assist the self deploy manually to reduce load and to trim up before hitting stow.I have asked many companies, electronic gurus and anyone I thought may have a solution to this issue with no success. I also asked how lots of USA boats are using lithiums without damaging their motors and the reply was "they're damaging their motors". I rarely troll with it, mainly used for spot lock but now I'm just careful what conditions I use it, if too much current or wind it's back to anchoring but lets face it if your MK needs to be pulling 9 or 10 it's probably out of control for anchor fishing anyway.

[fishing111]

Apologies if this post goes over old news in the above pages, I couldn't be bothered reading through the ##### measuring contest going on. I installed lithiums to run my 112lb MK September '19 after checking directly with Minn Kota at the boat show to ask if they will cover warranty if I do so. I was told definitely no problem with warranty but they advise against it. No issues for 6 mths then major malfunction of all electrics, motors, board, wiring. All due to 3 x 12v Lithiums in series producing 41V and too high a current draw for too prolonged a period. BLA repaired the MK under warranty without question. They did, however, say that after warranty period I'm on my own, fair enough. I have been running it since with the same setup without a problem. I was told by their service people to keep the power meter on the remote under 7 and I 'should' be OK, also to assist the self deploy manually to reduce load and to trim up before hitting stow.I have asked many companies, electronic gurus and anyone I thought may have a solution to this issue with no success. I also asked how lots of USA boats are using lithiums without damaging their motors and the reply was "they're damaging their motors". I rarely troll with it, mainly used for spot lock but now I'm just careful what conditions I use it, if too much current or wind it's back to anchoring but lets face it if your MK needs to be pulling 9 or 10 it's probably out of control for anchor fishing anyway.

In some respects it's like having a dog and barking too with the operation of the unit. I almost pulled the pin on a trolling motor but really wanted the auto stow/deploy but couldn't justify the price tag with all of the complaints. Then looked at the MG and they had problems too. They are a lot of coin and to be f%^*&^ around taking it back to be repaired all the time. Hope someone can make a reliable unit in the near future, till then i'll stick with the pick. Hope yours keeps on keeping on forya. Cheers

[shakey55]

Interesting. When I was getting new battery for car the other day I asked the battery bloke what he thought of Lithium Batteries for the marine world. He replied, they will be good, but not at the moment. I asked what he meant and he said, very bloody expensive, and in his opinion the technology is not quite their yet. His opinion and his words.

Don’t think I’m knocking them, I’m not, but I was interested in a battery professionals opinion.

Fishtragic lucky they honoured the warranty. It really looks like the lithium setup just produces to much power constantly.


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[disorderly]

Apologies if this post goes over old news in the above pages, I couldn't be bothered reading through the ##### measuring contest going on. I installed lithiums to run my 112lb MK September '19 after checking directly with Minn Kota at the boat show to ask if they will cover warranty if I do so. I was told definitely no problem with warranty but they advise against it. No issues for 6 mths then major malfunction of all electrics, motors, board, wiring. All due to 3 x 12v Lithiums in series producing 41V and too high a current draw for too prolonged a period. BLA repaired the MK under warranty without question. They did, however, say that after warranty period I'm on my own, fair enough. I have been running it since with the same setup without a problem. I was told by their service people to keep the power meter on the remote under 7 and I 'should' be OK, also to assist the self deploy manually to reduce load and to trim up before hitting stow.I have asked many companies, electronic gurus and anyone I thought may have a solution to this issue with no success. I also asked how lots of USA boats are using lithiums without damaging their motors and the reply was "they're damaging their motors". I rarely troll with it, mainly used for spot lock but now I'm just careful what conditions I use it, if too much current or wind it's back to anchoring but lets face it if your MK needs to be pulling 9 or 10 it's probably out of control for anchor fishing anyway.

Thankyou for getting it back on track..

I think your experience/analysis hits the nail on the head..

and the main issue seems to be that as you mention "too high a current draw for too prolonged a period"..and then when its working too hard its just all too much ...

I guess we have to remember that its a bit like using a whippersnipper to hold a 2 tonne boat in place in current and wind ,often for hours at a time so we really are asking quite a lot of it...

I also notice that people are putting the 36v motor on 7-8m boats now and you sometimes see 80lb 24v motors on a boat that could well do with a 36v motor...so they will be expected to work very hard at times..maybe too hard..

That said though do you know if any of the brands are doing any development so their motor and circuitry can tolerate the higher voltage...I do hope so..

Interestingly I see that with my 12v Travelbuddy oven/pie warmer that their is available a step up/step down voltage converter that can be used to make the oven run hotter....Surely if these things are available MK and MG could do something to solve the issue of regulating voltage to a sustainable level ......

https://somervillemetalworks.com.au/...-up-converter/

You also mentioned your wiring was damaged..did you have some meltage of plugs and cable as well as the unit itself...?

[disorderly]

Interesting. When I was getting new battery for car the other day I asked the battery bloke what he thought of Lithium Batteries for the marine world. He replied, they will be good, but not at the moment. I asked what he meant and he said, very bloody expensive, and in his opinion the technology is not quite their yet. His opinion and his words.

Don’t think I’m knocking them, I’m not, but I was interested in a battery professionals opinion.

Fishtragic lucky they honoured the warranty. It really looks like the lithium setup just produces to much power constantly.


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Its a bit of a quandary Shakey..

In the end my choice to use them was based mostly on weight..

So with a Lead acid type battery that should only be drawn down to a max of 50% you need a battery twice the size of LiFePO4 ( mine state 2000 cycles at 100% depth of discharge)..

100Ah LiFePO4 =12-13kgs
200Ah Lead acid = 42-45 kg

with a 36v system times that by 3 and you start to get the picture that i would be carrying an extra 90 kgs in the mid to front area of the boat every trip....its rather significant...carrying 130-145kgs of batteries for the trolling motor is just nuts...

Your battery guy obviously knows a lot more then me but I havent heard of any issues to any other boat components or accessories caused by the higher voltage of LiFePO4 batteries other then Trolling motors...has anybody got any experience with issues here..?

If you also carry the same thinking of 2 to 1 real usable capacity over from good quality Lead acid to lithium then by using Calbs cells or similar to "make your own" the actual "real cost" of storage is not a hell of a lot more...it is however if compared to something like an Enerdrive purpose built 36v battery which really is a lot of money....

I hope I've explained that in an understandable manner...

Also I wonder if its the Trolling motor technology that isnt up to speed with the LiFePO4 batteries rather then the other way around...just a theory and happy to be proven wrong if thats the case...

which ever is the case there are definite issues there and as mentioned by fishtragic its us that will be paying for it once out of warranty...

[Paul071978]

For me it’s pushing the current tech envelope too much and thus have premature early failure after a sizable investment. Going the lead acid path adds around 200kg to a 6m boat which is a recipe for disaster