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Thread: Bass & Barra. Do they mix?

  1. #16

    Re: Bass & Barra. Do they mix?

    Fitzy,
    I like your resourcefulness in utilising another demise for the old goldfish. Barra might help with our carp problem aswell.
    Luke

  2. #17
    WHITTO
    Guest

    Re: Bass & Barra. Do they mix?

    G'Day Gary, Some weeks ago I made mention about a Barra/Saratoga trial in Atkinson, would that concept be possible or is Atkinson to small an impoundment to cater for both species ???. I would be interested in your thoughts or anyone's thoughts on this one , you seemed to be proving the so called experts wrong on the temperature theory and the Barra/Bass combination. I can only live in hope # One day we maybe lucky. #Cheers #Whitto 8)

  3. #18

    Re: Bass & Barra. Do they mix?


    Quote Originally Posted by Whitto
    G'Day Gary, Some weeks ago I made mention about a Barra/Saratoga trial in Atkinson, would that concept be possible or is Atkinson to small an impoundment to cater for both species ???. I would be interested in your thoughts or anyone's thoughts on this one , you seemed to be proving the so called experts wrong on the temperature theory and the Barra/Bass combination. I can only live in hope # One day we maybe lucky. #Cheers #Whitto 8)
    Hi Whitto,
    Somerset seems to be the prefered location for a trial (if any) on stocking southen barra in SE Qld. Personally I think the shallow water of Atkinsons may not be as good for barra as Somerset or Wivenhoe (I have no info on minimum water temps there), but we will certainly consider it if a trial at Somerset proves successful enough & of course get permission from the bean counter to do so (this is the hardest part of all).
    Also good to note that there is no bass/yellas/silvers in Atkinsons Lagoon (never will be any of these) so the issue of one eating the other does not apply there, saratoga are not usually found in the same areas as the perches. 8) Atkinsons does have a good food source in spangled perch & bony bream that at present is only eaten by some BIG eels & the few saratoga we've stocked there to date.
    Spose it wont be long before redclaw find their way there either, usually follow soon after folks start fishing at a place (live bait). But I hope not.
    Cheers,

    Fitzy..
    Australian Lure & Fly Expo - Australia's largest ever gathering of Aussie lures under one roofwww.lureshow.com.au
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  4. #19
    Brett_Finger
    Guest

    Re: Bass & Barra. Do they mix?

    Fitzy,
    mate i know you won't let afew e-mails(no doubt annom) annoy you!
    it's great to have someone like yourelf in there battling for the many!!"
    but it's hard when the core of "GooD Ol Boys" have the upper hand with numbers,cronieism i think it's called >
    but keep the preasure on mate as the stocking groups around are getting sick of these preastoic ideas that keep getting tabled by this mob.
    sooner rather than later the vote will swing towards the thoughts of the many>
    but like GST it won't matter what the people that vote these clowns in think, it'll come down to the usual greaseing of the plams
    Hookin, Brett Finger.

  5. #20
    Alf_Hogan
    Guest

    Re: Bass & Barra. Do they mix?

    Hey Fitzy
    I sympathise with your views. However we are still learning lots about barra in dams, even after 16 years! I'd suggest barra might change your bass fisheries from great to very occasional, which unfortunately seems to have happened to the sooties in Tinaroo. They are still there, and they are still being stocked, but don't appear to swim out in the open like they used to pre barra. The sooty fishing has also dropped off in Koombooloomba, since barra were stocked. Coincidence? It will be interesting to see what happens to the sooties in Peter Faust, Eungella etc once the old big ones thin out. I'd say bass would head for cover too. Time will tell, but the choice is shaping up to be barra and not much else, or reasonable fisheries for bass, yellowbelly, saratoga, sooties, etc. Believe it or not, but barra fishing can get boring, just like marlin fishing - long time between bites! I'd suggest all those who want barra in the southern dams try fishing in the existing barra dams first. You could also push DPI to find out what is happening to the sooty vs barra populations in dams. Make an informed choice then, based on more than wishful thinking.
    My personal opinion is jacks would be a slightly safer bet with bass, if you want a more glamorous species, although we don't know much about them in dams either, apart from good survival and growth after 3 years.
    The other problem you would have down there is the spillways. Any barra over 3kg would be killed.
    Cheers, Alf.

  6. #21

    Re: Bass & Barra. Do they mix?

    Hi Alf,
    Mate its great to get some input from you on this topic, your oppinion holds great sway amoung the fish stocking fraternity.
    Mate can I quote you on the "The other problem you would have down there is the spillways. Any barra over 3kg would be killed."

    That's the sort of thing we would like to see happen to any escapees, will make our task of getting southern barra in southen lakes easier.
    Alf the only trial of barra & bass together in decent sized lakes is at Monduran & Lenthalls (not really a big lake), both lakes are still dominated by bass captures even after several years of barra stocking. ??? I fully understand what you are saying re barra Vs sooties, but having fished extensively for both bass & sooties both in wild & lake situations I can say they are not very similar in habit & are generally found in differing locations in general terms alot of the time. For example, Somerset is a prime fishery for open, mid-water schools of bass, often 30-50 feet down &/or 30 - 50 feet off the bottom at any time. I'm yet to see many lake sooties or barra in these locations.
    You are right Alf, we are learning more about barra (& all our other stocked fish for that matter) all the time, as part of that learning I/we feel a limited trial is needed to see what will happen. The precautionary principle need not be applied to everything, "suck it and see" has done the job at times too. The benefit to the community should also be considered as well.
    Nobody has considered the fact that any particular stocking group may not want to stock bass any longer if barra are available, if they don't co-exist. Surely it should be their decision on whether to do this or not. Take the autonomy away from stocking groups & they'll fold quicker that Bible at a KKK meeting.
    Barra survivability is not an issue as the historical water temps have shown, now the argument of one fish eating another is mooted. Fair enough too, but if this is applied to all other fisheries would we not have monoculture lakes? All fish we stock are predators & they will all eat anything that is available & catchable & in the right place.
    Cod eat everything & anything, but no outcry against them, hmmmmm, I'll get back to that later.....
    I can tell you that SWFSA (Somerset/Wivenhoe group) are compiling a submission for a TRIAL stocking of 10 000 barra/year for 3-5 years & then stop stocking for the same period to evaluate. Monitor catches, stomach content ananlysis etc to see what impact if any the barra have. It is SWFSA's hard earned $$$ that has created the fishery & no SIP money will be utilised for barra fingerling purchase.
    "Try fishing in a barra dam first"? Been there done that mate. Done Awoonga, Monduran, Lenthalls, Callide & Faust & got barra in all of em, that enough of a lake barra apprenticeship? Also fished scores of bass, cod, sara, sooty, golden, redfin, trout lakes too & for mine, barra are the best fun.
    There's also the little thing about opposition to barra in the SE for the simple reason that the Barra Buck is a jealously guarded thing & "those bloody southerners want a slice if it". To those with this poor view I would say, "afraid if a little competition?"
    Could rattle on for yonks with pros & cons Alf. I'm told you've been given a copy of the points that we've raised on the issue. You support for a limited trial in Somerset or Wivenhoe would be very much appreciated.

    Cheers,

    Garry Fitzgerald




    Australian Lure & Fly Expo - Australia's largest ever gathering of Aussie lures under one roofwww.lureshow.com.au
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  7. #22
    Brett_Finger
    Guest

    Re: Bass & Barra. Do they mix?

    Fitzy,
    mate i agree it's great to have people with the credits of Mr hogan on this board,also i will have to say the remark that you have made about the "Barra Dollar" kept out the south seems to make sence!!
    it has to change soon as the preasure of the general public is getting to Strong and loud to ignore >
    so as with the many others watching these posts with great intrest i say now i totally support the trial stocking of barra in the southen impoundments!!
    for those people wishing to target barra, no need to go all the way to the Northen impoundments just head to Monduran Dam just 3 1/2 hours north of Brissy or go another hour up the road to Awonga Dam just outside of Gladstone!! bouth these impoundments are well worth a look as thay hold good Barra,!!!
    Hookin, Brett.

  8. #23

    Re: Bass & Barra. Do they mix?

    Hi Brett,
    Now that the "cone of silence" on this barra buck has been shattered (yes we've been aware of it for yonks), the opponents may well be more open with the hidden agendas.
    I am perplexed on one thing though....................
    If barra are such a threat to all other fish species, why stock em at all??? The answer is that they are a great fish for sport & on the table. Their growth rates and survivability are exceptional, fingerlings are cheeper in comparison to bass, cod (if any ever become available ) & saratoga and will undoubtedly be cheeper than jacks, big eye trevs or Junglies ever will be. Also more consistent supply from hatcheries than bass.
    Wh not try to get the best value from your limited $$$?
    On average Somerset & Wivenhoe recieve a major flood event every 7 years, bass etc haven't reached their potential size in this time and many may well go AWOL, but barra would certainly be a good size in this time frame. Some of these 12 year old bass are only just now getting around the 60 cm mark. Barra can approach this size in a fraction of that time.
    It is also worth considering that as there are NO Mary River Cod available for stocking groups to purchase, there is no fish (in SEQ) that fills the role of trophy fish &/or apex predator.
    We've got tilapia by the million and bass, yellas & silvers have got Buckleys of knocking off a couple of kilos of Cichlid, not to mention doble figure forkies.

    There's tons more to rattle on about but I gotta get off the soap box every now & then.

    Fitzy..
    Australian Lure & Fly Expo - Australia's largest ever gathering of Aussie lures under one roofwww.lureshow.com.au
    Australian Lure Shop - Get aussie made lures direct from the lure makers at www.australianlureshop.com.au

  9. #24
    Brett_Finger
    Guest

    Re: Bass & Barra. Do they mix?

    Fitzy,
    a mate of mine caught a 98cm barra in peter faust dam and had the Northen Fisheries recearch team age this fish, and from memory it was around two and a half years old!!!
    so in seven years in a talipa rich envoriment the grouth rates would be incredable!!!
    Hookin, Brett

  10. #25

    Re: Bass & Barra. Do they mix?

    Fitzy,
    been fishing for years but I would love the chance at barra.Suppose when I hear you guys talking makes me feel stupid almost like I've never fished but that'sthe joy.If I can't learnn something new everyday I may aswell not fish.Facts/Opinions doesn't matter more the better.Bring it on boys

  11. #26
    Cremated_Reddog
    Guest

    Re: Bass & Barra. Do they mix?

    to right there Luke. I been fishing most of my life just not the same as you guys do and I'd cut my left ear off to get a barra closer to home like SE QLD would be just grand and I'd say you'd prob have about umpteen million southerners headin there aswell.Well I know of atleast 40ppl that would trek that far for a week end of fishing from Lake Macquarie where I'm from. So to right there should be a trial.
    Reddog

  12. #27

    Re: Bass & Barra. Do they mix?


    Quote Originally Posted by Reddog
    to right there Luke. I been fishing most of my life just not the same as you guys do and I'd cut my left ear off to get a barra closer to home like SE QLD would be just grand and I'd say you'd prob have about umpteen million southerners headin there aswell.Well I know of atleast 40ppl that would trek that far for a week end of fishing from Lake Macquarie where I'm from. So to right there should be a trial.
    # # # # # # # # # # # # # # Reddog
    Hi Reddog,
    You indicate that you would freely travel to SE Qld if barra were on offer. A couple of Qs.
    1- Would you travel to SE Qld to come bass fishing?
    2- Would you travel the extra distance past Brisbane to fish at say Lenthalls Dam (3.5 hours), Monduran (4.5 hours) or Awoonga (6 hours), or is this too far?
    I've had it suggested to me that if any longer than a 3-4 hour drive to get to barra country, folks would not bother for a weekend trip & thus save thier time & $$$ to do a week in the Territory.

    Nobody is suggesting open slather (seems to be what some are worried about) stocking of barra in any SE Qld lake. A trial is suggested with limited numbers for 3-5 years with continued monitoring & then evaluate fishery. If successful, continue, if not successful, stop.

    Hope to see you getting onto a few barra at Somerset sometime soon.

    Fitzy..
    Australian Lure & Fly Expo - Australia's largest ever gathering of Aussie lures under one roofwww.lureshow.com.au
    Australian Lure Shop - Get aussie made lures direct from the lure makers at www.australianlureshop.com.au

  13. #28
    Cremated_Reddog
    Guest

    Re: Bass & Barra. Do they mix?

    Hiya Fitzy, mate I would freely travel up there to help put the things in the water even if it meant I couldn't fish for em for yrs. I have never been freshwater fishing b4 but am very keen to try it and if it means waiting to get barra then so it be then.I would prob go that far to get bass but would prefer barra.
    1.Q. as to weather I waould travel that far for bass.
    .A. I would travell any distance to do any fishing but would prefer to have barra in a more accessable location rather than going to the territory. yes I would travell the 41/2 to 5hrs past bris to catch em. hell it is only 81/2hrs to bris from my house so another couple is not a prob. Awoonga dam would prob be the furthest we would go to without taking a week or. these places are what we would call nice weekend trips away from the hell hole down here...



    ps. fitzy. if you want a deckie I'll gladly pack my shit and move on up..

  14. #29
    Alf_Hogan
    Guest

    Re: Bass & Barra. Do they mix?

    Hi Fitzy
    As I said before, I'm sympathetic to your desire for a barra fishery down there, but I'd be looking at other options, eg jacks and/or trevally. I certainly wouldn't be worried about competition between dams for the "barra dollar", as I'm sure each dam would have something unique to offer (Tinaroo the biggest, Awoonga the most, Faust the most reliable, and so on). My concern would be for your great bass fisheries.
    As far as a "trial" goes, all a stocking of 10,000 in Somerset/Wivenhoe will tell you is a need for a lot of patience to go barra fishing. You would have to resort to nets to find them! I'd recommend a minimum of 100/ha/year (420,000 into Somerset in one hit), and I'd stock every second year, so year classes can be clearly identified. We are also developing the suspicion that barra are their own worst predators, so a wider gap between year classes may be the way to go. If you are successful in starting up a barra trial, perhaps you could test the 2 year strategy as well. The trial needs to be for 10 years.
    Just for your info, we have netted and fished barra from 30m deep (on rattling spots, just like hooking a submarine!) The Mt Isa guys were also fishing for sooties in the open deep water along the old river channels in Lake Julius before the first bass was ever stocked into a dam in Qld. It may take 10 years, but I'd predict barra will change bass behaviour in impoundments. Nothing wrong with that, if that is indeed what you want.
    Cheers, Alf.

  15. #30

    Re: Bass & Barra. Do they mix?

    Hi Alf,
    Thanks again for your input. Some good ideas there to mull over.
    Yes, Jacks & Trevs would be great, however I can't see jacks ever being available in enough numbers, nor cheep enough for widescale stocking anytime soon. Any updates on how things with them are progressing up there? The Gladstone fellas are hopefull for a better season on them this year.
    Trevs? Well we gotta get some $$$ into some serious research on them, still a long time off.

    Cheers,

    GF
    Australian Lure & Fly Expo - Australia's largest ever gathering of Aussie lures under one roofwww.lureshow.com.au
    Australian Lure Shop - Get aussie made lures direct from the lure makers at www.australianlureshop.com.au

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