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Thread: Poachers

  1. #136

    Re: Poachers

    Quote Originally Posted by Dignity View Post
    Baitable, I am interested in your view of this statement:

    "Trends in the size and age compositions in landed catches suggest population rebuilding from around 2008 onwards, with continual increases in the average sizes and ages of fish in commercial landings [Wortmann et al. 2018]. This indicates that the stock in New South Wales waters is increasing under existing levels of harvest. This level of fishing mortality is unlikely to cause the biological stock to become recruitment impaired."

    My thoughts are that if recruited fish are increasing in size and age does this means that there could be a depletion in juveniles of the species which seems contrary to the report outcomes.
    Another point is that juveniles can swim out of traps, especially if escape panels are used, so the method is somewhat selective.

  2. #137

    Re: Poachers

    Quote Originally Posted by baitable View Post


    The funny thing is, the spawning
    biomass can only increase in size with younger juveniles coming of sexual maturity age


    Is this accurate?

  3. #138
    Ausfish Gold Member Dirtyfuzz's Avatar
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    Re: Poachers

    Quote Originally Posted by Matthew Campbell View Post


    Is this accurate?
    Iím no sex education teacher but Iím guessing the more sexually mature fish then there will be more bonking and more babies


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  4. #139

    Re: Poachers

    Quote Originally Posted by Dirtyfuzz View Post
    Iím no sex education teacher but Iím guessing the more sexually mature fish then there will be more bonking and more babies


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Well if they are caught at a slower rate due to less fishing effort then the spawning biomass will be larger than it would be with higher fishing effort.

  5. #140

    Re: Poachers

    Quote Originally Posted by baitable View Post


    To be honest, it would help to see the raw data, sample size, duration of samples collected along with the purpose of the study and in what context. What species is the report referring to?
    Without further reading of the report: your assumptions would be correct, if new recruitment was successful (i.e. biomass on the increase) then you should see an increase in juveniles caught which might indicate an increase in biomass to which they are using as an indicator for fish stocks. They do preface most reports however with " our understanding of why recruitment varies in space and time, and of its relative contribution to population changes, is still limited and requires further investigation."

    The funny thing is, the spawning biomass can only increase in size with younger juveniles coming of sexual maturity age, the older fish cannot simply increase in number for obvious reasons but can only spawn to eventually create larvae. Again it appears that that the FRDC can only use limited information given to them by us and commercial catches to draw conclusions. This is why i always like to take one step back and apply simnple reasoning. Data can always be skewed omitted and interpreted in many ways, I could easily pick and choose what article i want to reference to support my argument.

    Here is my simple reasoning: I use to fish offshore in moreton bay, around 15 years ago, catches were far more plentiful, i travelled less to get larger fish in greater numbers and in a shorter period of time in a far smaller boat with simpler electronics. Now, if i replicate my exact same routine in a more capable boat with better electronics and better knowledge, I could not repeat the same catch. I have since shifted my fishing further a field where i travel further, have a larger boat, spend more time on the water to find better fish populations. I am yet to hear reports to the contrary with regards to offshore species within my locale siting a sample size over a 15 year (or plus) period. I would rather be cautious and do everything i can to preserve what we have by whatever means to leave something for the next generation. If we're wrong about about our control of fishery management there are only 2 outcomes. 1-you and I will be restricted to catching less fish maybe even shut out or 2. we decimate what we have and loose it all together.
    I was referring to snapper as quoted in this report, https://www.fish.gov.au/report/230-Snapper-2018
    I don't have access to the raw data but it just appears to me that there is a missing segment of recruitable snapper, in between legal breeding juvenilles and larger adults.

    I also found this report from the mid 1990's https://www.frdc.com.au/Archived-Rep...93-074-DLD.PDF which I found rather interesting in that there is many references to lack of data. Deja Vu.

    I also did find a report quoting similar to "the spawning biomass can only increase in size with younger juveniles coming of sexual maturity age, the older fish cannot simply increase in number for obvious reasons but can only spawn to eventually create larvae." but didn't save the link and I am struggling to get any bandwidth here to look it up (school holidays and the tourists have flocked with crap internet service). This was in relation to snapper but this did not necessarily apply to all other species.

  6. #141

    Re: Poachers

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucky_Phill View Post
    I can't believe I just read 8 pages of a pissing contest.

    he said, she said, he saw, she saw, they did, they did not, they wrote, they did not write.............well, that's 12 minutes I won't get back.

    All put up their opinions and not one opinion has been changed by others arguments.

    With all due respect to all contributors.....seems like a good time to " move along, nothing to see here ". ?

    LP
    Why such apathy when marine parks are one of the biggest issues facing us? And given much of the philosophy behind them is anti use - no matter how well the fishery is managed.

  7. #142

    Re: Poachers

    Quote Originally Posted by billfisher View Post
    Why such apathy when marine parks are one of the biggest issues facing us? And given much of the philosophy behind them is anti use - no matter how well the fishery is managed.
    Like a little energiser bunny......poking....stirring....(Note to self......Christ this blokes arsehole must be jealous of the amount of shit his mouth passes).

  8. #143

    Re: Poachers

    Quote Originally Posted by banshee View Post
    Like a little energiser bunny......poking....stirring....(Note to self......Christ this blokes arsehole must be jealous of the amount of shit his mouth passes).
    You're on a roll - another obnoxious no content post.

  9. #144

    Re: Poachers

    Dropped my popcorn.

    Nope, marine parks are not one the biggest issues, the sustainability of the fishery is. Compliance is another. Loss of Habitat. Over Fishing and so much more. Marine Parks are a management tool, one of many.

    There is no apathy from me. All I see here are opinions tentatively supported by various reports, papers, studies and that depends on who reads what and how it is interpreted.

    The topic was about Poachers..... now it is about who can post the most " evidence " in relation to Marine Parks and their affects or otherwise.

    We all know a couple of things.

    1... Marine Parks ( Green Zones ) are good for the fishery contained within them.

    2.. There is some evidence of the " spill-over " effect.

    3.. Certain Marine Parks were legislated to appease a certain group of voters

    4.. Butter on popcorn is good

    LP
    Kingfisher Painting Solutions:- Domestic and Commercial.

    For further information, contact details, quotes or advice - Click Here




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  10. #145

    Re: Poachers

    Quote Originally Posted by billfisher View Post
    You're on a roll - another obnoxious no content post.
    Dude is totally trolling

    tenor.jpg

  11. #146

    Re: Poachers

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucky_Phill View Post
    Dropped my popcorn.

    Nope, marine parks are not one the biggest issues, the sustainability of the fishery is. Compliance is another. Loss of Habitat. Over Fishing and so much more. Marine Parks are a management tool, one of many.

    There is no apathy from me. All I see here are opinions tentatively supported by various reports, papers, studies and that depends on who reads what and how it is interpreted.

    The topic was about Poachers..... now it is about who can post the most " evidence " in relation to Marine Parks and their affects or otherwise.

    We all know a couple of things.

    1... Marine Parks ( Green Zones ) are good for the fishery contained within them.

    2.. There is some evidence of the " spill-over " effect.

    3.. Certain Marine Parks were legislated to appease a certain group of voters

    4.. Butter on popcorn is good

    LP
    I didn't say marine parks were the only issue. As to sustainability just about all the problems have been addressed or are being addressed. Especially on the GBR. And you can't really say that marine parks are a fisheries management tool. Fisheries managers already have the power for spatial closures. Eg some states have area bans on trawling larger than any of the marine parks they host. And marine parks weren't initiated by any fisheries departments.

    As to your other points. Yes my posts are slightly off topic - so what? It is still a topic worthy of discussion.

    "1... Marine Parks ( Green Zones ) are good for the fishery contained within them".

    Irrelevant from a fisheries management perspective as those grounds are lost to fishermen. It's only relevant if they increase the yield in a cost effective way. Even from an ecological perspective there are better ways - see my link 'how ecosystems can keep their fish and we can eat them to'.

    "2.. There is some evidence of the " spill-over " effect".

    Well there is very little evidence where effective fisheries management is in place - see my other references.

    "3.. Certain Marine Parks were legislated to appease a certain group of voters".

    The GBR one was part of a deal with the Democrats to get the GST passed. This also rather contradicts your point about them being about fisheries management.


  12. #147

    Re: Poachers

    Quote Originally Posted by billfisher View Post
    You're on a roll - another obnoxious no content post.
    Only a narcissist could miss the content......

  13. #148

    Re: Poachers

    Quote Originally Posted by banshee View Post
    Only a narcissist could miss the content......
    I don't call personal insults 'content'. Especially given that the only thing I have done is to post something you disagree with.

    What passes for moderation on this site?

  14. #149

    Re: Poachers

    Ok, I having a Cider chaser with my popcorn now.... Noel, want to join me ?

    LP
    Kingfisher Painting Solutions:- Domestic and Commercial.

    For further information, contact details, quotes or advice - Click Here




    Seller's Items


  15. #150

    Re: Poachers

    Yep, be there shortly with esky in hand!

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