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  1. #46

    Re: Re-power Cruisemaster 700 with diesel

    Quote Originally Posted by myusernam View Post
    smithy what about a bypass filter then you could be cleaning your oil and extend your interval back out to 250 hrs?
    http://www.kleenoilusa.com/
    does anyone rate these? there are lots of different types available including the old frantz filters that use toilet rolls which are still meant to do a great job. Filtering donwn to 1 or 2 microns has got to be better than the 25 or 30 full flow filters do. If I had an inboard I'd be keen to get one
    Really, marine inboard engines seldom wear out internally. Usually marine age, lack of raw water side maintenence, or poor installation are the culprits to any issues.
    These kind of additional filters offer a placebo fix to people who think improving oil quality will make their engine last longer. Fact is, it won't.

  2. #47

    Re: Re-power Cruisemaster 700 with diesel

    This was their reply to my questions.

    Thank you for your enquiry. The size unit you would be looking for is a KU16 and the cost for them is $350. Replacement cartridges are $55 each, but would only need to be changed out once or twice per year (depending on the hours ran).
    There are a lot of variables involved, but as a quick guideline, if you currently changed your oil at 10,000 KMs, then you would only need to change our cartridge every 20,000 Kms. If you were looking to extend oil changes (based on oil analysis), then you might find that you could get out to 40,000 Kms oil drains and only need to change out our cartridge at the 20,000 Kms mark.

    If you’d like more information or to talk about this further, my details can be found below.

    I look forward to hearing back from you soon.

    Best regards,

  3. #48

    Re: Re-power Cruisemaster 700 with diesel

    from what i can gather these are just as good (the original)
    http://www.frantzfilters.com/
    and use toilet paper rolls (so filter cost low)
    Scott unscented or you can buy frantz brand cheap i'd imagine.
    sounds dodgy but used by trucks before the days of centrifuges.
    A hundered or two for the housing and a dunny roll every hundered hours or so.
    or centrifuges might be worthwhile for thecommercial operator
    http://www.dieselcraft.com/engine-oi...p#.VSWXZ_D4ZbE

    http://www.scintex.com.au/products/c...FdgmvQodS6UAkw

  4. #49
    Ausfish Addict Chimo's Avatar
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    Re: Re-power Cruisemaster 700 with diesel

    Do not use toilet roll filters!!!

    myusernam and all else

    I went down this track years ago and found that the engine wore out amazingly quickly. The filter seemed to strip the oil far too well.

    All the big end bearings were about to collapse when we pulled the engine down so we were just in time.

    Cheers
    Chimo

    Repeat do NOT do this!!!
    Last edited by Chimo; 09-04-2015 at 02:25 PM. Reason: o
    What could go wrong.......................

  5. #50

    Re: Re-power Cruisemaster 700 with diesel

    Quote Originally Posted by Chimo View Post
    Do not use toilet roll filters!!!

    myusernam and all else

    I went down this track years ago and found that the engine wore out amazingly quickly. The filter seemed to strip the oil far to well.

    All the big end bearings were about to collapse when we pulled the engine down so we were just in time.

    Cheers
    Chimo

    Repeat do NOT do this!!!
    chimo what do you think about the centrifuge links I posted up? the small one is $259.
    http://www.scintex.com.au/collection...rifuge-size-20
    Also saw some fairly cheap round the web like ebay etc. I had no idea they were that cheap - If they are that cheap then that would beat any replaceable filter anyway. Dont all trucks, big fishing boatws and expensive plant run centrifuges?
    Looks like you need a pump tho. Dont most run on lectricity? Can u get 12 or 24v ones off trucks?

  6. #51
    Ausfish Addict Chimo's Avatar
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    Re: Re-power Cruisemaster 700 with diesel

    myusernam

    Looks like it could be a useful item especially if its use was linked to pre heated oil.

    Perhaps if you also fitted a sump oil heater such as this http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Engine-Oi...d=811334189310
    it could be good.

    If it were me though i would probably add the heater and the small scintex unit on top of the regular engine oil filter.

    The sump needs to be set up with fittings to allow the scintex to be connected every so often after the oil heater has been on long enough to pre heat the oil and the oil run thu it.

    One could probably share the scintex with a number of other boat people. Perhaps on an inboard trailer boat the oil could be spun after a good run when at home after a bit of extra heat has been applied in the privacy of ones shed?

    No doubt one could also set this system up to be used on moored boats with shore power of even a 240 v generator.

    What do you think?

    Cheers
    Chimo
    What could go wrong.......................

  7. #52

    Re: Re-power Cruisemaster 700 with diesel

    im no mechanic, just know all the big rigs have them, not only on engine oil but fuel in. Looks like engine oil pressure alone spins.
    (whereas for bigger boats have 3phase 240volt models)
    but trucks have them so I guess they use this style.
    http://www.xtremediesel.com/ppeoilce...rationkit.aspx
    for someone doing big hours it's a cheap solution - but I thought you just hooked them up and it cleaned your oil perpetually (just leave in cct). Then you can opt to get your oil tested and extend your interval or smithy could just stick to his 250 hours and it would probably pay for itself in the long run. Some synthetic oil places (purple pig I think) do free oil testing if you use their oil and you only change when the results show u need. I would personally probably just stick to the 250 hours but for $259 and having your oil filtered to .5 micron sounds pretty good. Am I missing something?

  8. #53

    Re: Re-power Cruisemaster 700 with diesel

    None of our tugs bother with them for the engine oil. Depending on manufacturer requirements, oil changes at 250 or 500 hours with analysis typically every 500. We do have purifiers/centrifuges on some of the bigger boats that do international tows for fuel oil (diesel) - they are not a real lot of fun to clean/service but they are fairly large units. You can invest a little or a lot in some of this stuff but IMO the best option is leave it as the manufacturer intended and follow their maintenance plan as a minimum - keeps the arguments to a minimum if anything goes wrong. More regular oil changes won't hurt but adding extra hardware can simply give the manufacturer an out in the event of a failure.
    "I soak the worms in rum. The fish love em and the worms die happy"
    "Alcohol is not the solution to your problems...................but then again, neither is milk"

  9. #54
    Ausfish Silver Member brett62's Avatar
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    Re: Re-power Cruisemaster 700 with diesel

    Agree.

    I am going for extra oil changes as the cost of some oil and a filter on the size diesel we are playing with is FA. I have a oil rep living across the road and I will bend his ear as he deals with oils for the marine and mining people. Will be interesting to get his ideas.

    Quote Originally Posted by scottar View Post
    None of our tugs bother with them for the engine oil. Depending on manufacturer requirements, oil changes at 250 or 500 hours with analysis typically every 500. We do have purifiers/centrifuges on some of the bigger boats that do international tows for fuel oil (diesel) - they are not a real lot of fun to clean/service but they are fairly large units. You can invest a little or a lot in some of this stuff but IMO the best option is leave it as the manufacturer intended and follow their maintenance plan as a minimum - keeps the arguments to a minimum if anything goes wrong. More regular oil changes won't hurt but adding extra hardware can simply give the manufacturer an out in the event of a failure.

  10. #55

    Re: Re-power Cruisemaster 700 with diesel

    You'd be far better off investing in decent fuel filtering. Most diesel trailerboats and smaller engined moored boats are usually fitted with the bare minimum of filtering, usually a shitty CAV filter/water seperator or an archaic Racor. There are much better options available to the thinking boat owner these days.
    A dual filter head using cheap spin on Fleetguard filters with water check drains is the ultimate. Featuring a primary filter of 30 micron, and a secondary filter at 10 micron, optioned with vacuum gauges for each, you will never again change a filter without knowing how blocked it is, and as a bonus you'll probably never have to change the "last chance" engine mounted filter...... Because the pre filtering is just so good.

    If you have spare money to throw at it, and the means to keep it powered up when stored, add an engine oil pan heater glued to the sump. It keeps the oil and engine warm, meaning your warm up time leaving the ramp is significantly shorter, and the added benefit is the heat keeps the engine bay dry and free of moisture/condensation.

  11. #56
    Ausfish Addict Chimo's Avatar
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    Re: Re-power Cruisemaster 700 with diesel

    What could go wrong.......................

  12. #57
    Ausfish Silver Member brett62's Avatar
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    Re: Re-power Cruisemaster 700 with diesel

    I have received the results from rednuts on a re-power he has completed. The rig is much the same style as the cruisemaster and weight. It also had the same mercruiser that I have at present so was waiting for the results to establish what HP rednuts would recommend for my re-power. Now rednuts has not confirmed if this is the one he will install as yet and I will catch up with him when I get home in a couple of days to discuss but I think this is what he will be steering me towards.

    The re-power was in a Chapperal 25ft sportscruiser having a draft of 74cm and weighing in at 3356kg. Engine installed is a Yanmar 4LHA driving a Bravo III leg swinging 24" props.

    Top speed 30 knots
    Cruise speed 25 Knots burning 18 lph
    Cruise speed 22 knots burning 13 lph

    Owner said he had far better performance getting out of the hole. Figures are with boat fully loaded.

    The cruisemaster has much the same draft, is 2 feet shorter and estimate the weight at about 3000kg. I burn 37 L at 20kn with the petrol and hold 320 L in the tank which gives me 320km range if I empty the tank. Now if I can get around the same results as the above (I can't see any reason why I shouldn't) my range is 910km.

    I hope to do 150 hours per year give or take so I did the maths on the cost difference between the price of the diesel and petrol engines and it comes out that after 2 years I have covered the difference. Any last doubt I had with installing the diesel are certainly put to bed. The other added bonus is that the 4LHA will more than likely fit my engine compartment with out having to do some major changes(will confirm with Jim). The weight of the 4HLA works out to be much the same as the mercruiser so not changing the dynamics of the hull.

    Every box has been ticked. Now I just need to get the other jobs on the boat finished and part with the money. I am still looking at towards the end of the year to completed but that's coming up quick.

  13. #58

    Re: Re-power Cruisemaster 700 with diesel

    Hi Brett as smithy can confirm the 4LHA is a great well proven engine and well over 10,000 hrs and still going strong, i agree with woo that fuel filtration is critical and oil testing be done to determine your oil life span which is different for every boat and how its used.
    I don't beleive in adding extra oil filtration when they are so so cheap to change regularly.
    JIMMY

  14. #59
    Ausfish Silver Member brett62's Avatar
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    Re: Re-power Cruisemaster 700 with diesel

    Quote Originally Posted by captain rednut View Post
    Hi Brett as smithy can confirm the 4LHA is a great well proven engine and well over 10,000 hrs and still going strong, i agree with woo that fuel filtration is critical and oil testing be done to determine your oil life span which is different for every boat and how its used.
    I don't beleive in adding extra oil filtration when they are so so cheap to change regularly.
    JIMMY
    Well all I can say Jim is that you are in charge of the re-power and you will have to answer to the wife if we get it wrong.LOL

    Mate I will give you a call when I get home to sort out a time to see you. I am happy to do extra oil changes Jim and also install a good fuel filtration system. I really don't want to cut corners as I am spending a lot of time and money getting the boat how I want. As you know I have been out of the water for sometime now but it will be worth the wait.

  15. #60

    Re: Re-power Cruisemaster 700 with diesel

    Quote Originally Posted by brett62 View Post
    ... The re-power was in a Chapperal 25ft sportscruiser having a draft of 74cm and weighing in at 3356kg. Engine installed is a Yanmar 4LHA driving a Bravo III leg swinging 24" props.

    Top speed 30 knots
    Cruise speed 25 Knots burning 18 lph
    Cruise speed 22 knots burning 13 lph

    The cruisemaster has much the same draft, is 2 feet shorter and estimate the weight at about 3000kg. I burn 37 L at 20kn with the petrol ...
    I reckon 37L/h @20kn is actually pretty good from a V8 petrol in a big heavy boat Brett! But, you won't look back going to the diesel I'm sure Jimmy will sort you out. Just don't make him too busy in August.

    Those diesel fuel consumption figures quoted above are fantastic. It's amazing how far the oilers have come in 30yrs. Used to install Volvo's in the 80's, mostly the 40 series but also the 30's

    Although a little vague on the stats now, think a typical 24' or 25' with a 165 duoprop would cruise around 20kn using 20L/h, maybe a tad more.

    In a 25 Nova f/bridge (copy of a Berty), going form 2 x 170hp 6cyl petrols to a 165 diesel d/prop gave approx same cruise for a ~40% drop in fuel consumption. Obviously a big drop in top end and zip on to the plane etc.

    These donks, and the later 200hp 41's were only ~40-50 HP/L of cubic capacity, so pretty much clunkers in comparison to today's light oilers, and the one you are looking at.

    Some might argue that today's high performance oilers won't/can't provide the longevity of the old style donks, but really, from the hours being run up by us recreational boaters, are we even going to get close to testing this?

    Not sure what 4HLA stats are, but I assume 60HP/L or more? Will certainly be watching the progress with interest .
    Cheers
    Brendon


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