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  1. #121

    Re: Snapper Stocks - Another View

    Quote Originally Posted by Lovey80 View Post
    You took my point the wrong way Chris. I was trying to point out that any one that fishes for Snapper regularly ( other than the same marks day in day out on the gold coast) would never even suggest that " extinction " is on the cards. And certainly not in the next 10-20 years based on our current methods. So being an alarmist and shouting the sky is falling achieves nothing for anyone.
    fair enough ...... I certainly dont think snapper face extinction - I just feel that snapper fishing will go the way of Kingfish in NSW when the floating traps decimated stocks of mature fish - Yes you could go out and catch kingies .... but finding a legal sized fish became difficult and a decent sized fish was rare unless you fished smaller less frequented reefs / headlands & bommies.
    Give a man a fish & he will eat for a day !
    Teach him how to fish
    & he will sit in a boat - & drink beer all day!
    TEAM MOJIKO

  2. #122

    Re: Snapper Stocks - Another View

    I had typed a length response citing some of the facts and the supporting evidence, as well as pointing out the support from the review, but alas it all went when AF crashed just then.

    I can be bothered typing it all up again, its a pointless argument anyway. Even if I did show that this is indeed plausible, seems no one would believe it anyway.


  3. #123

    Re: Snapper Stocks - Another View

    Quote Originally Posted by Big Deez View Post
    Although I don't totally agree with this statement, given the significant decrease in otter trawl effort in the last ten years, the number of snapper caught by trawlers is on the decrease and is decreasing every year. Also, only very small snapper are caught by trawlers working in Moreton Bay and, at this size, there are literally millions of them swimming around and natural mortality is high as well.

    Cost of fuel, lower prices paid due to imports, etc are having a profound effect on trawling so you will get your wish soon and there won't be any trawlers in MB.
    So what can be done to increase the number of these millions of juvenile snapper that grow to breeding size? what do you propose there big deez, it may just fix this snapper stock form slump.

    i would think creating many more artificial reefs in areas which have sand would be a good start.

    as for reduced trawler effort, maybe, but its a short term guess, not management. if thats the argument one could argue there will be less recs fueling there boats so remove all bag limits the snapper will be fine.

  4. #124

    Re: Snapper Stocks - Another View

    Quote Originally Posted by brisbane_boy View Post
    So what can be done to increase the number of these millions of juvenile snapper that grow to breeding size? what do you propose there big deez, it may just fix this snapper stock form slump.

    i would think creating many more artificial reefs in areas which have sand would be a good start.

    as for reduced trawler effort, maybe, but its a short term guess, not management. if thats the argument one could argue there will be less recs fueling there boats so remove all bag limits the snapper will be fine.
    Most juvenile snapper are found inshore on the western side of Moreton Bay, mostly around Peel and in Bramble Bay. There are extensive trawl closures which trawlers can't access. Trawlers use BRDs and TEDs to reduce the amount of juv snapper caught. What else can you do? Stop trawlers catching prawns in MB? Where would rec fishers get their bait then?

  5. #125

    Re: Snapper Stocks - Another View

    Exactly big deez, the word is compromise. if rec anglers miss out on bait from trawlers IMO that would be a far more satisfactory way to deal with the snapper management that locking rec anglers out, hell who needs bait when you cant use it??

    There would be no problem with rec anglers sourcing baits for snapper, I have never relied on a trawler for my bait in my 20 years of fishing the bay, huge numbers now use artificial baits anyway.

  6. #126

    Re: Snapper Stocks - Another View

    Quote Originally Posted by brisbane_boy View Post
    Exactly big deez, the word is compromise. if rec anglers miss out on bait from trawlers IMO that would be a far more satisfactory way to deal with the snapper management that locking rec anglers out, hell who needs bait when you cant use it??

    There would be no problem with rec anglers sourcing baits for snapper, I have never relied on a trawler for my bait in my 20 years of fishing the bay, huge numbers now use artificial baits anyway.
    I'm not talking about snapper bait - where do you think packet prawns come from? You may not use bait but there are 100's of 1000's that do in Queensland. Its funny when rec anglers bag out commercial fisheries when everything in the bait freezers at tackle shops are supplied by a commercial fisher.

  7. #127

    Re: Snapper Stocks - Another View

    So Big Deez,
    you who work for fisheries,

    know that the majority of juvenile snapper are on the western side of moreton bay. Funny, where did they place the green zones? surely the EPA were in discussions with DPI? right??? Two government bodies sharing resources and information..

    Ps I dont remember when peel island was on the western side, and your informaion around where the juviniles are is incorrect, there are just as many juveniles on the eastern side of both moreton and north straddie.

    Thus DPI's arguments - strategy and so called science is rubbish.

    Regards
    Honda.

  8. #128

    Re: Snapper Stocks - Another View

    Quote Originally Posted by honda900 View Post
    So Big Deez,
    you who work for fisheries,

    know that the majority of juvenile snapper are on the western side of moreton bay. Funny, where did they place the green zones? surely the EPA were in discussions with DPI? right??? Two government bodies sharing resources and information..

    Ps I dont remember when peel island was on the western side, and your informaion around where the juviniles are is incorrect, there are just as many juveniles on the eastern side of both moreton and north straddie.

    Thus DPI's arguments - strategy and so called science is rubbish.

    Regards
    Honda.
    Trust me honda, if you had been near DPI offices during the whole green zone issue you would know there was no love lost between Fisheries and EPA.


  9. #129

    Re: Snapper Stocks - Another View

    ..........

  10. #130

    Re: Snapper Stocks - Another View

    Quote Originally Posted by honda900 View Post
    So Big Deez,
    you who work for fisheries,

    know that the majority of juvenile snapper are on the western side of moreton bay. Funny, where did they place the green zones? surely the EPA were in discussions with DPI? right??? Two government bodies sharing resources and information..

    Ps I dont remember when peel island was on the western side, and your informaion around where the juviniles are is incorrect, there are just as many juveniles on the eastern side of both moreton and north straddie.

    Thus DPI's arguments - strategy and so called science is rubbish.

    Regards
    Honda.
    Honda
    By juvenile snapper I am talking about fish <10cm.

  11. #131

    Re: Snapper Stocks - Another View

    Quote Originally Posted by TheRealAndy View Post
    Trust me honda, if you had been near DPI offices during the whole green zone issue you would know there was no love lost between Fisheries and EPA.

    We are all well aware that the 2 departments are not working together, the fact is that there is a political powerplay by the EPA to get a bigger slice of the annual funding, while DPI rested on its laurels.

    So whats the end result for the taxpayer?? EPA and DPI come up with unfounded statistics and put in place mechanisms that will not assist in any way shape or form and have no scientific basis.

    Put simply they have no mechanism to calculate the current state of the biomass, both have used phone polls to predict the rec's annual take as the basis of their argument, all agree these are rubbish and they were conducted by a third party supplier who was likely paid on a per result basis (assumed).

    At the end of the day the EPA green zones have not been accounted for by DPI as they do not share information, nor do they have the ability to assess the current or future status of the fishery.

    So at the end of the 6 week closure what can we expect from DPI - a big fat nothing as they have no way of assessing the change in the biomass, let alone any viable information from EPA.

    Burn taxpayer dollar burn.. The government of the day needs to go... Publicity is the only answer to this problem..


    Regards
    Honda.

  12. #132

    Re: Snapper Stocks - Another View

    Quote Originally Posted by Big Deez View Post
    Honda
    By juvenile snapper I am talking about fish <10cm.
    Then you need to do more research, as I was talking all fish under the legal size limit, there are litterally thousands of <10cm fish outside the bay, and are frequently trawled.

    Regards
    Honda.

  13. #133

    Re: Snapper Stocks - Another View

    can anyone tell me whats the reasoning behind having the closure on the dates they have specified. Normally a short closure such as the one implemented is put in place to protect the stocks at a vunerable or important time such as breeding or migration.

  14. #134

    Re: Snapper Stocks - Another View

    Quote Originally Posted by seriola ilandi View Post
    can anyone tell me whats the reasoning behind having the closure on the dates they have specified. Normally a short closure such as the one implemented is put in place to protect the stocks at a vunerable or important time such as breeding or migration.
    IMHO it is because Fisheries needed to be seen doing something. An immediate (pre 2011) ban would have indicated a degree of panic, whilst a ban later in the year would have demonstrated a level of complacency about a VERY SERIOUS PROBLEM (in the eyes of DPI that is).
    So Feb/Mar it is. Outside the spawning period & a lot of fish are moving out to deeper water as inshore temps rise.
    No science here.
    ROLL TIDE, ROLL.................

    Regards,
    Peter


    http://www.superiorterminals.com.au

  15. #135

    Re: Snapper Stocks - Another View

    Quote Originally Posted by honda900 View Post
    We are all well aware that the 2 departments are not working together, the fact is that there is a political powerplay by the EPA to get a bigger slice of the annual funding, while DPI rested on its laurels.

    So whats the end result for the taxpayer?? EPA and DPI come up with unfounded statistics and put in place mechanisms that will not assist in any way shape or form and have no scientific basis.

    Put simply they have no mechanism to calculate the current state of the biomass, both have used phone polls to predict the rec's annual take as the basis of their argument, all agree these are rubbish and they were conducted by a third party supplier who was likely paid on a per result basis (assumed).

    At the end of the day the EPA green zones have not been accounted for by DPI as they do not share information, nor do they have the ability to assess the current or future status of the fishery.

    So at the end of the 6 week closure what can we expect from DPI - a big fat nothing as they have no way of assessing the change in the biomass, let alone any viable information from EPA.

    Burn taxpayer dollar burn.. The government of the day needs to go... Publicity is the only answer to this problem..


    Regards
    Honda.
    You are just plain wrong, there is nothing more I can say.

    Have you actually looked at the assement and review? They have done some excellent modeling on the figures, and even using least catch effort by rec anglers the biomass still shows a decline. This is not just some crap a DPI scientist made up, its time tested statistics.


    I suspect very few here have actually read the assesment and review.

    Quote Originally Posted by seriola ilandi View Post
    can anyone tell me whats the reasoning behind having the closure on the dates they have specified. Normally a short closure such as the one implemented is put in place to protect the stocks at a vunerable or important time such as breeding or migration.
    The reason is to reduce the actual catch effort. There is data on numbers of fish caught around the year, and by having a closed season you reduce the catch effort by a sufficient amount for the fishery to remain sustainable. Of course if the catch rates doubled in the proceding weeks after the closure, the desired result is not obtained. The total catch effort has to be reduced for the closure to be successful.


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