Reply With QuoteAnd you never talk about who is catching what and where with other Pro's? What about all the mags that give GPS marks to locations, best you send a letter to the mags and blast them to?
Stu
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And you never talk about who is catching what and where with other Pro's? What about all the mags that give GPS marks to locations, best you send a letter to the mags and blast them to?
Stu
Skip, you were on a hiding to nothing there buddy with that original post.
I understand what your saying, and crowds on your mark, my mark, any ones mark, is a real bitch, but it aint Ausfish thats increasing the SE Qld population by incouraging immigration from interstate and over seas.
X amount of productive spots, X multiplied by 1000 and growing amount of keen fishos, its gunna get ugly.
You only need to look at the flogging that Bris river and Mud Island cop these days with lots of reports of snapper or threadfin being caught to note that many many more people are out there for a share in the reported areas.
I do not throw up reports for this reason, not because it is protecting "my" spots, but rather protecting entire regions from over interest. If anybody asks me personally 1 to 1 where to go for this or that I give them a damn straight answer, but I will not throw up spots online.
I have no beef with pro line fishermen, but i do with trawlers and netters that completely ring reefs like scarby to take the lot. I also have no beef with procrabbers going about their business either, but I have lots of problems about share farmers and pot theives, (not all of them are shamateurs)
The end of the day I like to take friends and family out for a day on the water with a decent chance of bringing home a feed, nothing flash, but honest earned meals. Screw the numbers guys who get a thrill from big kills and screw the guys who don't obey the limits and the sizes.
Jack.
Years ago i use to fish for reds and bigmouths out on the shelf , at that time there where no recs out there fishing those grounds and there still isn't just because there are lots of grounds without having to go that far .
Two of us fished that ground and i can say we thought there was no end to the fish we caught out there or so we thought .
By the end of the first year there where another two pros out there , this was because the same bloke who got me on the spot also told another who told another.We all had small boats around 21ft and could each carry around 500kg.
By the start of the second year all had upgraded to bigger boats with 2000kg min fish box except me . I stuck to me small boat with my 500kg box and could fill this in 3nights and make a good living.
What started out to be a good thing turned into rap and pilage , i noticed from the end of the second year it was getting hard to fill the box , in the second year i caught around 6000kg of reds and bigmouth(my average) , these other blokes who upgraded there boats caught around 15000kg of reds and bigmouths each. By the third year it was over . All the stock was well and truely fkd , no more big fish , breeding stock gone .
If only that bloke who got me out there kept his big mouth shut he could of fish that ground in a substainable manner for years to come.
Good news is that i have been back to that same ground last year and i can say the fish are back and this is great news for everyone. It took over 10 years for the big fish to make a come back.
I can speak from exsperiance and i can say some things are best kept in secrecy, i don't want to come off as a mongrel over this and please don't bag me but what happend out there was a disaster to the fish stocks and it only took 4 boats to do it .
Those stocks are back and i personaly want it to stay that way , no i don't own the area , no i don't want it all to myself.
I just want it to stay the way it is and for all the right reasons.
There is nothing wrong with secrecy when it comes to great fishing spots , i have seen first hand what can happen when letting the cat out of the bag.
If you are going to let go of your spot then do it , there is no one stopping anyone from doing so , just have a little thought for the fish your catching , think about what could happen, just remember a good thing never lasts long.
A good fishing spot is like being on a Honeymoon , do eveything you can to keep it that way or it can soon turn to shit no matter how good your intentions.
Prevention through secrecy is better than cure
Cheers
Smashed Crabs
Hi Smashed Crab...
Thanks for the honest response...
There is a difference between a general area and a specific spot....in your case was it more of a specific area? 50,000 kilos from four boats in a season...your story adds up.
The story I am about to tell was a long time ago, but it does emphasises what smashed crabs was saying.....For those who know the story below, hello.
The old man went double boating with his brothers......one of the boats was a 30ft hydra foil, the other was a formula 23.......the small boat broke down and called for a tow from the larger boat. The larger boat was a fair distance away, so the smaller boat anchored up to wait for the tow.....As my dad arrived in the larger boat, they saw these massive red things being hauled into the boat...the size of which I have never seen again.
Whilst they were waiting for a tow, they decided to drop in a line and started hauling reds. As luck would have it, the small boat happened to anchor over an old war plane, home to many big red things.
They went back to this spot and caught many good feeds.....the idea of conservation wasn’t really in play back in that era....
Anyhow, long story short, one of my cousins got pissed at a bar and gave away the long and the lats.....next day a bunch of boats were sitting on top of the plane, and that was the end of that..........loose lips sink ships...
If that is what this post is trying to say then fine...but the original thread really pi$$ed me off because of the comments made about amateur’s attitude etc, and the fact that it came across as very much NIMBY and that he was having a shot at specific people who didn’t give away specific spots. My experiences with pros have been just as bad as any weekend cowboy with no clue.
As a self confessed "Mug" fisherman, I can't stand up & beat my chest about big takes on any particular marks, but I can say this.
All the marks I have, were obtained by searching through Books & Mags, searching sites, or being given info by fellow fishos. Research.
I've been taken to marks by fellow Ausfishers at M&G's
I've shared the marks with anyone who wants them.
My choice......
I've been out to a good few of them, & , over the last 12 months, haven't done well at all. In areas nearby however, others were doing well.
Were there other boats there?
Sure... some did well. .........Some very well........... Some not.
There were Commercial boats out there too......more than 4.........a small distance away .....but there.
In calling into the wharf on occaisions, I've never heard the Commercial Fisherman boys hadn't caught a thing.
I go out to try & get a feed, if I don't, well, that's just part of the game.
I pay a small fortune on all things fishing related attempting to increase the pleasure by catching a feed...........so do the commercial boys.
More miss with me, but what the hell........I'll be back.
Maybe it's the bait, or the way I hold my tongue, or the Solunar Peak, or the Tide, the current, the other boats, the Oxygen in the water, or lack thereof, maybe it's the fish didn't turn up on the day, maybe overfishing... I'll be back.
Someone said "averaging about $450 per fish" earlier on.
(I think I've got you covered!)
Then there's the invasion of places North.
As far as travelling bulk Km's to get wherever, great.......surely that's a choice you make, ...........but would whatever funds you then contribute to the local economy of the area be a boost ?
I'll bet the local retail businesses like the money.
And if you then choose to travel a further 300km by boat, just for a day...... or 2........or a week........... again, that's the choice of the individuals, who probably don't want to compete with the throng of the City or Gold Coast every time.
If they can catch a few good Reds ( or whatever ) good luck to 'em.
I'm jealous. It makes me want to go there too.
My choice. Then I contribute to the local economy...........
If I don't want to holiday in Noosa ... I go somewhere else...that's my choice too.
Don.
"Magpie Navy." VHF 73.
It was a Woman who drove me to Drink......
....and I never gave her money for the Petrol......
i think you spot on. nothing to do with bragging or giving away marks/positions. It's simply more and more people getting into boats and increase in general population.Originally Posted by Jurkyjj
I am sure if i started bragging about all the HUGE numbers if fish & crabs i catch at banana banks i won't expect to see an increase in the parking lot out there.
same myth with the big sink hole out near mud island that people don't want to give away the marks for.
but yes courtesy on the water is a thing of the past
russ
[quote=lampuki;1167825]Hi Smashed Crab...
Thanks for the honest response...
There is a difference between a generally area and a specific spot....in your case was it more of a specific area? 50,000 kilos from four boats in a season...your story adds up.
quote]
Hi Lampuki
Yes specific spots with a type of soft red fern coral (i think it's coral ?).
Too all
Does anyone remember when the scallop boats used to hammer the grounds of townsville? At anyone time there was atleast 10 trawlers working that ground , started of with one one boat then before you knew it the grounds were over run.
Large trawlers from down south were there over night , 6months later it was all fkd and it was bigger better and loose lips from our buyers that caused the influx of boats , all they could care about was getting as much product as they could through their doors and the quicker the better as the price and demand was incredible.
We up here always knew the grounds where loaded with product and use to go catch a few when prawns were on the skinny side , so in many ways it was substanable fishing for us and back in a time when substainability was not even a thought and to most a complete joke ie as if stocks would ever run out !
That ground was hammered and in came the sea eggs (small sea urchins) from to many trawlers ploughing the bottom , if you knock out one specie another can thrive. To much damage in such short time and an utter discrace , only more bad rep and another nail in the coffin for industry caused by loose lips and greed for the big bucks, honestly how much fkn money does a bloke actually need and at what cost , back then we could see it was going to be fkd in no time at the rate is was being fished , this one event caused great harm and sealed the fate of some local trawlers at Lucinda, no longer could they jump to scallop when the prawns were skinny then back again , we where the last of the ice box trawlers fisherman which is too me and in my opinion the only form of substainable trawling if we need to have them at all but thats another thread.
Too add further to this most of these trawlers , us included off loaded our product at fith ave in townsville, there was a big trawler one night tied of at the very end of the warf with the deck lights on , they had only just unloaded that day and washed down , you could smell the juice of the scallop on this boat and so could the fish , just in and around the lights of the trawler where big barra , all sitting head down tail up , then small barra would race through the pack (breeding ? right time of the year or very close to it)
I took of and grabbed a line , all i could dig out was a hand line with a 7/0 hook and bacon for bait(funny i know ) . I chucked it in and just pulled it through the barra and bang up she come , my very first barra 107cm , i manage to catch four which was plenty for a feed and popped em on ice on the trawler i was on .
Next morning i showed the Skipper i was working for and he went and got me some lures , i don't have to say how excited i was , we went to the pub for dinner early that night , chucked down a feed and raced back of to the warf with the new gear , got to the end of the warf and what the fk you wouldn't beleive it fkn net every where , nearly 2000kg of barra was pulled from that spot in record time.
I could have shot the bastard i was that wild , then i had to ask the question how did this bloke know? That was easy my skipper told the bloke at the tackle shop which was right next door to a seafood shop . I was was around 16teen at the time and i can tell you i thought about walking away from pro fishing then and there , most of those barra where very large females . Again another case of letting the cat from the bag.
I can be honest here to say i don't have faith in anyone knowing a good thing , i have seen to much of the bullshit that can happen just from my end as a pro just with other pro's.
Im still a pro and still have my masters , im very protective of my knowledge towards alot of specific areas and i have not fished for 5years , i do however pass on where the barra nusery's are and when and where to steer clear of breeders and the netters here respect that ( thank fk ) and steer clear.
We do get the out of towner pro's and we watch them intensley and to the stage if a net is dropped on specific ground we approached them talk about what they are doing and try to move them on, some things you just have to fight for , again another thread
My father in law is great at catching grunter and he has his magic spots and the old fella always gets his fish , many times i have tried to get it out of him but he won't tell a soul , this really pisses me off big time and he knows it , i have tried every trick in the book to get him to spill.
The father in law reminds me in many ways of elders i lived with in the desert , tell no one anything and everything is a secret , the elders do this because they want to protect somthing from what they call Silly People , if an elder is on his death bed he wont even pass on knowlege to a son if he beleives he is silly.
I have gone to some trouble with this to try and exsplain a veiw but i really need not to exaplain a single thing , The elders would say some things don't need to be exspained , hold onto what you have got while you still have it , hold on for a purpose greater then your self , hold onto that good for the benifit of everyone else , those who can be trusted can change their mind.
Do what you have to do people it's your journey , no one can force you in any direction , it's your choice
Cheers
SC
SC,
I am happy to share many of my regular spots, or at least give a general starter mark, you still have to get there, and there is NO guarrantee that the fish will be there at the same time....
I have told this story a couple of times, but will happily tell again...
I like to fish deep water,
I NEVER fish inside 60 mtrs, I would rather fish 100mtrs,
and when I can get out there, I LOVE to fish 250 mtrs or so , with rod and reel, for Bar cod.
There was a day a few years back when we made the journey out to the shelf to try for a cod,
23 miles might not be that far for you guys north of the border to be offshore,
but Ballina does not have the protection of the reef that you guys enjoy,
so days that we can do this are limited.
I was only a few miles from my mark when I passed a local Pro fisher, who was known to me, and i thought a mate.......he was also fishing for cod.
Hmmmmm, I chose to pull up short of my mark by a mile or so and waited until I saw this guy leave the area and disappear over the horizon......please note, I did not pull up for a chat and ping HIS mark.
Once he was out of sight I proceeded to my spot,
it's worth mentioning that my cod marks are snag marks for prawn trawlers,
so are in the middle of what most people think is just a desert of sandy bottom.
When I next saw my "friend", he was very keen to chat,
he quizzed me on depths , longs and lats of where he had seen me heading, but I tried to play dumb and said that I just worked of my GPS square....
The VERY NEXT TIME I arrived at this spot, he had 4 strings of 90 hooks all over my mark, I couldnt even fish it myself.........the mongerel had pinged me on the radar.
I was later told that he had pulled over a ton of cod off this one mark in one week..............................
I have never caught a cod on this mark since.
I'm sure you get the picture, if I see ANYONE out there now, I just come back in rather than loose more marks to greedy people.
Muzz
Muzz
I know exactly what you mean about pros. Last time I went out at night we were hooked up in a spot and a bloody charter/pro lined us up in the dark and started heading for us. We switched all the lights off and he took the hint and headed in a different direction, but I have no doubts he would have picked the mark up on the radar.
I was out off innisfail during the day and we ran over a bommie about 2-3 mile from the main reef and a bloke seen us and drove straight over to us and was about 50 feet away and I could hear him say "jesus it comes right up here doesn't it". He did a full loop right around us while we were anchored (marking the spot). I gave him a mouthful but he didn't care then drove off back to the main reef. In the end he can have the mark, it's crap, but you just don't do that.
All this technology gives me the sh*ts sometimes. All these people that have no idea about common curtiousy just mark your spots and go back and flog them to death.
I don't like to give away our spots because what happens is they get passed on to every tom, d*ck and harry who say, we've got a new mark, lets try it out. If they catch some on it, then they don't go looking for another spot they just keep going back and back to the same spot until there is nothing left.
My 2 cents worth.
Pazz
I have always had the highest respect for any guy who has to deal with the ocean on a daily basis to make a living, and its only getin harder, but as a rec fisho who has been on the sunny coast for 20 yrs i have shared all my spots with who ever has ask and had some to share back. in this time i have seen the fish stokes rise and fall and hot summers bring awesome mackeral seasons or cold winters bring unreal snapper seasons. i dont doubt that over fishing is a problem especially with the technology improvments now.Years ago i use to fish for reds and bigmouths out on the shelf , at that time there where no recs out there fishing those grounds and there still isn't just because there are lots of grounds without having to go that far .
Two of us fished that ground and i can say we thought there was no end to the fish we caught out there or so we thought .
By the end of the first year there where another two pros out there , this was because the same bloke who got me on the spot also told another who told another.We all had small boats around 21ft and could each carry around 500kg.
By the start of the second year all had upgraded to bigger boats with 2000kg min fish box except me . I stuck to me small boat with my 500kg box and could fill this in 3nights and make a good living.
What started out to be a good thing turned into rap and pilage , i noticed from the end of the second year it was getting hard to fill the box , in the second year i caught around 6000kg of reds and bigmouth(my average) , these other blokes who upgraded there boats caught around 15000kg of reds and bigmouths each. By the third year it was over . All the stock was well and truely fkd , no more big fish , breeding stock gone .
If only that bloke who got me out there kept his big mouth shut he could of fish that ground in a substainable manner for years to come.
Good news is that i have been back to that same ground last year and i can say the fish are back and this is great news for everyone. It took over 10 years for the big fish to make a come back.
I can speak from exsperiance and i can say some things are best kept in secrecy, i don't want to come off as a mongrel over this and please don't bag me but what happend out there was a disaster to the fish stocks and it only took 4 boats to do it .
Those stocks are back and i personaly want it to stay that way , no i don't own the area , no i don't want it all to myself.
I just want it to stay the way it is and for all the right reasons.
There is nothing wrong with secrecy when it comes to great fishing spots , i have seen first hand what can happen when letting the cat out of the bag.
If you are going to let go of your spot then do it , there is no one stopping anyone from doing so , just have a little thought for the fish your catching , think about what could happen, just remember a good thing never lasts long.
A good fishing spot is like being on a Honeymoon , do eveything you can to keep it that way or it can soon turn to shit no matter how good your intentions.
Prevention through secrecy is better than cure
Cheers
Smashed Crabs
BUT within your thread is the the main reason rec fishos have a less than favourable view of pros.one boat caught 6 tonne and the other 15 tonne in a year, now call me stupid but that a bullshit amount of fish for 2 boats in a year. i find it hard to understand how this is done without any thought to the sustainability of the fish stocks. i dont begrudge anyone doing what it takes to earn a living but it would take me 20yrs to even get a quarter of that amount of fish let alone one species.
I am willing to share any spots with people because in general fishing it takes more than just pulling up on a spot to catch fishit takes time on the water to know what the fish is done and when they feed.
not having a go at you mate just my thoughts and ideas
Supa.....
This is the kind of fishing which completely devistates an ecosystem. I am very aware of how many fish I pull from anyone patch of reef (as i mentioned in a previous post usually no more than 6 or 7 of one species before moving), especially when it is a small area. I have heard first hand of Pro's pulling 30+ 70cm+ cod of one small patch of rock, once again completely wiping out that area. This is not sustainable fishing and this is what really does the damage to fish stocks, not the average recreational fisherman.Years ago i use to fish for reds and bigmouths out on the shelf , at that time there where no recs out there fishing those grounds and there still isn't just because there are lots of grounds without having to go that far .
Two of us fished that ground and i can say we thought there was no end to the fish we caught out there or so we thought .
By the end of the first year there where another two pros out there , this was because the same bloke who got me on the spot also told another who told another.We all had small boats around 21ft and could each carry around 500kg.
By the start of the second year all had upgraded to bigger boats with 2000kg min fish box except me . I stuck to me small boat with my 500kg box and could fill this in 3nights and make a good living.
What started out to be a good thing turned into rap and pilage , i noticed from the end of the second year it was getting hard to fill the box , in the second year i caught around 6000kg of reds and bigmouth(my average) , these other blokes who upgraded there boats caught around 15000kg of reds and bigmouths each. By the third year it was over . All the stock was well and truely fkd , no more big fish , breeding stock gone .
If only that bloke who got me out there kept his big mouth shut he could of fish that ground in a substainable manner for years to come.
Good news is that i have been back to that same ground last year and i can say the fish are back and this is great news for everyone. It took over 10 years for the big fish to make a come back.
I can speak from exsperiance and i can say some things are best kept in secrecy, i don't want to come off as a mongrel over this and please don't bag me but what happend out there was a disaster to the fish stocks and it only took 4 boats to do it .
Those stocks are back and i personaly want it to stay that way , no i don't own the area , no i don't want it all to myself.
I just want it to stay the way it is and for all the right reasons.
There is nothing wrong with secrecy when it comes to great fishing spots , i have seen first hand what can happen when letting the cat out of the bag.
If you are going to let go of your spot then do it , there is no one stopping anyone from doing so , just have a little thought for the fish your catching , think about what could happen, just remember a good thing never lasts long.
A good fishing spot is like being on a Honeymoon , do eveything you can to keep it that way or it can soon turn to shit no matter how good your intentions.
Prevention through secrecy is better than cure
Cheers
Smashed Crabs
If there are any boats around I won't fish quite a few of my well guarded spots, because of fear of this type of thing happening. On the other hand there is plenty of spots I fish which every man and his dog has the marks for, but often don't know how and when to fish them.
Policy makers need to take a more proactive approach to managing our fish stocks, rather than a reactive one. As I said, the more artificial reefs the better, especially south of the Barrier Reef. Why greenies are so against them I don't know?? The benefit far outweighs the negative impacts if any.
Anthony
Hey Skipper;
As one of the 'old guys' I can relate to having a good day out on the water with a caring skipper and crew who work hard to get all their clients to enjoy themselves. It isn't really about the size of the catch at the end of the day, but whether everyone on your charter had a good time. I fish a charter at least once a week now I am semi-retired and if I enjoy my day out then I book with the same team again.
Many of your words are true and its only going to get harder for the charters who have historically looked after their areas taking a bit here and a bit there, you only have to look at some of the GPS marks found on the web for the Gold Coast to see how fished out an area can quickly become.
If you have some good marks then keep them quiet and if you have anyone on board with a GPS then put him in the burley trail.
Cheers
Plato
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