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  1. #46

    Re: Converting barra taps , nips & bites to hookups

    Quote Originally Posted by 2manylures View Post
    The rod angle relative to the retrieve direction is what allows the rod to hook the fish, the rod needs to be perpendicular to the lure or thereabouts to take the shock and do its job.

    Pointing the rod directly at the lure/fish merely puts a solid pressure at point of impact on the lure especially when using tightly set drags, something has to give, i.e. hooks pull or straighten, line or rod snaps.

    As a kid some 40 plus years ago using fiberglass rods we used to have to alternate rod angles perpendicular to our lures otherwise the glass blanks would take on a bent shape.

    A soft plastic with single hook will have a miniscule hook up rate from a fish face smacking it as opposed to a lure running trebles, basic physics dictates what will happen which is why what Johnny Mitchell stated should have been logical from a common sense point of view without experimenting. A solid non twisting link to a hook forces twist by turning the handle. On the other hand when the line is the handle it is not solid hence will never force the lure to twist.

    Why some people make simplicity more difficult than complexity is something Iíll never understand, then again I donít chase barra so being a basic southern native and trout angler Iíd really have no idea.

    I'm still thinking about where the rod tip is pointed during a retrieve when fishing placcys- Over the last 3 years I haven't strayed from pointing the tip straight at the lure (I've had reasonable success)
    I can see benefits of putting a bit of rod angle in there - Primarily to allow some give in a pretty rigid system of braided line , short heavy leader & no rod to absorb any movement of the lure during inhalation. Dunno

    Chris
    Give a man a fish & he will eat for a day !
    Teach him how to fish
    & he will sit in a boat - & drink beer all day!
    TEAM MOJIKO

  2. #47

    Re: Converting barra taps , nips & bites to hookups

    Quote Originally Posted by NAGG View Post
    I'm still thinking about where the rod tip is pointed during a retrieve when fishing placcys- Over the last 3 years I haven't strayed from pointing the tip straight at the lure (I've had reasonable success)
    I can see benefits of putting a bit of rod angle in there - Primarily to allow some give in a pretty rigid system of braided line , short heavy leader & no rod to absorb any movement of the lure during inhalation. Dunno

    Chris
    Hi Chris mate im sure JM and Harro have talked about the rod tip, striking theme on here before. Old threads will have info on these already covered topics. Have a look for em and enjoy some great reading.

    You seem to be looking at your whole fishing game which is a great way to improve. Although i'm sure you are playing dumb to sift more info at times, a good strategy to manipulate people into giving you more info ha. I say this because you ask questions you have already gone over and that have already been answered in older posts. The timing of all this comes just before the competition season.

    What's your goal, long term and short? e.g. how are you going to use all this barra info provided by Ausfish members, ex guides, current guides, social fisho's and the like?

    What will be happing in a couple of years with your barra fishing?
    e.g. where will you be and what will you be doing in the barra scene in the future, what's the goal?

    What's your dream result from all this info in a perfect barra year?

    Future Plans
    When looking at improving the end result is needed for clarity of mind and future planning, if you haven't done that already with your Ausfish threads...

    I ask this question as i'm not clear where you are going or coming from. When clear it's easier for everyone to help each other out mate. Does that make sense?

    Cheers Lyndon.
    ps if you are genuinely looking at your whole game and will take on changes suggested in areas that can be improved maybe have a look at the start of the entire equation and go from there. This has also been covered on here somewhere that would take me too long to find for you right now mate.

  3. #48

    Re: Converting barra taps , nips & bites to hookups

    Quote Originally Posted by SeekingBarradise View Post
    Hi Chris mate im sure JM and Harro have talked about the rod tip, striking theme on here before. Old threads will have info on these already covered topics. Have a look for em and enjoy some great reading.

    You seem to be looking at your whole fishing game which is a great way to improve. Although i'm sure you are playing dumb to sift more info at times, a good strategy to manipulate people into giving you more info ha. I say this because you ask questions you have already gone over and that have already been answered in older posts. The timing of all this comes just before the competition season.

    What's your goal, long term and short? e.g. how are you going to use all this barra info provided by Ausfish members, ex guides, current guides, social fisho's and the like?

    What will be happing in a couple of years with your barra fishing?
    e.g. where will you be and what will you be doing in the barra scene in the future, what's the goal?

    What's your dream result from all this info in a perfect barra year?

    Future Plans
    When looking at improving the end result is needed for clarity of mind and future planning, if you haven't done that already with your Ausfish threads...

    I ask this question as i'm not clear where you are going or coming from. When clear it's easier for everyone to help each other out mate. Does that make sense?

    Cheers Lyndon.
    ps if you are genuinely looking at your whole game and will take on changes suggested in areas that can be improved maybe have a look at the start of the entire equation and go from there. This has also been covered on here somewhere that would take me too long to find for you right now mate.
    Its easy for me to play dumb but - Not that easy to find that sort of info using a search Lyndon ........ I tried but got no where

    Chris
    Give a man a fish & he will eat for a day !
    Teach him how to fish
    & he will sit in a boat - & drink beer all day!
    TEAM MOJIKO

  4. #49

    Re: Converting barra taps , nips & bites to hookups

    I did have a brief go on this before but realy just more of a passing thought. What I tend to do on barra, trout, Jacks is throw a lure out wind pause what ever you do but on the initial hit, I do strike and wind a turn fairly direct up and down motion but as the fish runs off, a split second back oof followed by a small strike again, the theroy behind this is that the fishes momentum pushed the lure backward so inabeling the un set hooks to maybe have a chance in fouling up.. Tried and tested many time now I do seem to have a little more faith in this method mind you still seem to loose a few, but never have pulled the hooks on that second strike as yet no dobt now it will happen so onward and up ward....

    Next theroy...LOL Love it barra will have us scratching our heads a while yet mongreals

  5. #50

    Re: Converting barra taps , nips & bites to hookups

    Quote Originally Posted by Tropicaltrout View Post
    I did have a brief go on this before but realy just more of a passing thought. What I tend to do on barra, trout, Jacks is throw a lure out wind pause what ever you do but on the initial hit, I do strike and wind a turn fairly direct up and down motion but as the fish runs off, a split second back oof followed by a small strike again, the theroy behind this is that the fishes momentum pushed the lure backward so inabeling the un set hooks to maybe have a chance in fouling up.. Tried and tested many time now I do seem to have a little more faith in this method mind you still seem to loose a few, but never have pulled the hooks on that second strike as yet no dobt now it will happen so onward and up ward....

    Next theroy...LOL Love it barra will have us scratching our heads a while yet mongreals
    So what about plastics ........ totally different scenario - lure is constantly moving & the hit is often over in a fraction of a second - WHOOOF & gone

    Chris
    Give a man a fish & he will eat for a day !
    Teach him how to fish
    & he will sit in a boat - & drink beer all day!
    TEAM MOJIKO

  6. #51

    Re: Converting barra taps , nips & bites to hookups

    Quote Originally Posted by NAGG View Post
    So what about plastics ........ totally different scenario - lure is constantly moving & the hit is often over in a fraction of a second - WHOOOF & gone

    Chris
    Yep it is a different scenario and one that has probably hundreds of small different styles and ways around it but, as you know I am not a plastics bloke so can only comment on what I use, I feel conferdent now in my HB presentations and hookset styles and lets face it's not something that happens in a couple of trips so a few years would probably sum it up but still never be complete but at the end of the day in fishing nothing is certain or ever fool proof .

    This year in I am going to use SP's and hope to learn what you guys already have and hope to nail a few doing so. In saying that a thought of a very small stinger set up rigged via a piece of braid by a needle so that the small stinger sits in the tail itself may be a chance.... Pre set the stinger to the jig head according to the lenght of the Sp Insert the braid useing a needle so the braid tracks direct to the tail so theres less friction attach a small hook in the top of the tail pull it tight insert the jig head and a small extra chance maybe other then that I got nothin

  7. #52

    Re: Converting barra taps , nips & bites to hookups

    G'day all.

    Just got back from what has to be one of the most memorable weekends on Tinaroo. Some cracker fish caught.

    Had a funny session on the Saturday afternoon... very relative to this topic. In a 4 hour period, I personally had over a dozen bites from fish of all sizes. All on the one particular plastic (FWIW, Storm Intense Kicking Shad). My first cast in the spot got absolutely nailed by a fish just on a metre and it took the lure just like most here, on the drop. Fought the fish for a good 2 minutes and got stuck right into it with my light spin outfit. 2m out from the boat the fish took a great leap and managed to shake the plastic free. Hook was in the corner of the mouth, though must have only just been 'skinned'. The amount of pressure I put on this fish was immense. My fishing partner was suprised at home much I had on the fish. No chaff on leader, although after a further 3 or 4 bites I had to change leader and these big fish were taking it down deep.

    During this session I had this exact ausfish thread in my mind the whole time. I didn't fall back into the resort of adding a stinger, instead worked on positioning myself in the boat as well as working different rod angles. Found gold when we decided to re-anchor over a few M's to our right in hope of fishing a tad deeper allowing for more pausing of the plastic. Mate landed an absolute stonker 5mins later. My technique didn't change too much, slow to medium roll of the plastic though after each subtle pause I would give a small 'jink' of the rod to further prepare myself for the strike. These jinks were very minute, and the next fish that came along was hooked - corner of the mouth yet again. Fish, just like most, hit the lure about 1/100th of a second into the roll after a good 3 second pause. Had I not been in position and jinked the lure to a) develop further tightness in the line b) have rod angle set and c) jinked the lure into a good striking position (with the head raised and the tail/hook down) then this fish was going to be yet another miss.

    Something else for a few out there to think about. Feel free to 'sponge' it if you will, but recognise the fact that its pretty simple thinking. I could go on further. Reason I won't is that I question the reasoning for some of those involved in this thread and their objectives, not just on this forum, but in the whole scheme of things. You know what paddock I'm in, thus making myself along way from the fence.

    cheers

    Theo
    TT

  8. #53

    Re: Converting barra taps , nips & bites to hookups

    i hardly bother posting anymore, but for some reason this thread has me interested enough to post my 2c...

    i'd like to think i get a good conversion ratio when it comes to fishing plastics. i feel rod position during retrieve pays a critical role,as scott alluded to earlier. i never point my rod directly at the lure when rolling plastics for a number of reasons that i'm not sure i could put on paper in such a way that would be understood without being rather long winded but i'll try...i hold the rod at a 30 to 45deg angle to line. this not only allows some give in the equation so the barra can inhale the lure easier but also the response of the rod aids in hookset plus the important bit that i'm not sure many people consider... anglers hookset action is maximised as the rod tip movement away from the lure exponentially increases from 0-90deg

    ie if the rod is pointed straight at the lure and the angler 'strikes' from 0-45deg the rod tip will actually only move a minimal amount away from the lure. if the rod is held at 45deg to the lure, when the angler strikes again in a 45deg arc the rod tip will move about 2.5 times further from the lure, maximising hookset

    also being a rod builder my blanks are selected for technique specific actions, even down to different rods for different plastics that i feel benefit from having a rod to suit them and the retrieves

  9. #54

    Re: Converting barra taps , nips & bites to hookups

    Quote Originally Posted by wheezer View Post
    i hardly bother posting anymore, but for some reason this thread has me interested enough to post my 2c...

    i'd like to think i get a good conversion ratio when it comes to fishing plastics. i feel rod position during retrieve pays a critical role,as scott alluded to earlier. i never point my rod directly at the lure when rolling plastics for a number of reasons that i'm not sure i could put on paper in such a way that would be understood without being rather long winded but i'll try...i hold the rod at a 30 to 45deg angle to line. this not only allows some give in the equation so the barra can inhale the lure easier but also the response of the rod aids in hookset plus the important bit that i'm not sure many people consider... anglers hookset action is maximised as the rod tip movement away from the lure exponentially increases from 0-90deg

    ie if the rod is pointed straight at the lure and the angler 'strikes' from 0-45deg the rod tip will actually only move a minimal amount away from the lure. if the rod is held at 45deg to the lure, when the angler strikes again in a 45deg arc the rod tip will move about 2.5 times further from the lure, maximising hookset

    also being a rod builder my blanks are selected for technique specific actions, even down to different rods for different plastics that i feel benefit from having a rod to suit them and the retrieves
    Thank - you - very - much - Andrew

    Yours is the type of response I was looking for - logical & simple

    I'm a bream fisherman ....... & I never point the rod tip directly at the lure (the rod does the work on hookset)

    as for barra ..... & plastics I felt that there was something basically flawed with my technique of pointing the rod tip at the lure in a rigid system ( maybe if I was fishing mono rather than braid ...... it could be different).

    I will be curious to see some other responses now

    Thanks again

    Chris
    Give a man a fish & he will eat for a day !
    Teach him how to fish
    & he will sit in a boat - & drink beer all day!
    TEAM MOJIKO

  10. #55

    Re: Converting barra taps , nips & bites to hookups

    Andrew (wheezer),

    I spent an hour and a half on the phone last night talking to one of Australias best rod builders....and we talked exactly about what you stated regarding rod angles, striking and hooking fish....it was very interesting...but your on the same track

    cheers Steve

  11. #56

    Re: Converting barra taps , nips & bites to hookups

    Quote Originally Posted by Tropicaltrout View Post
    In saying that a thought of a very small stinger set up rigged via a piece of braid by a needle so that the small stinger sits in the tail itself may be a chance.... Pre set the stinger to the jig head according to the lenght of the Sp Insert the braid useing a needle so the braid tracks direct to the tail so theres less friction attach a small hook in the top of the tail pull it tight insert the jig head and a small extra chance maybe other then that I got nothin
    Iíve been doing similar for 20 years surface/sub surface trolling live minnow for trout behind a dodger {reason for dodger is at a little speed it will skip across the surface flapping instead of sinking and darting} . By utilizing a snelled front single hook {hooking minnow through lip/s from the underside} leaving the tag long enough to tie a free floating treble that will come up with motion/speed and sit just behind the tail of the minnow thus not disturbing the action. Works extremely well!
    I canít see why the same {with/without doger depending} wouldnít work with soft plastics.
    An Arkansas lure making company {defunct now I think}, made jigheads with a fluttering willow leaf blade attached to the bottom of the jig head. These would be perfect for what you want to test drive, simply remove the blade and tie a stinger of choice to the underside eye on the jighead allowing it to free swim behind the plastic. It may not come into play whilst allowing your lure to sink/flutter yet whilst in a forward/retrieve motion it would be the 1st point of impact.

  12. #57

    Re: Converting barra taps , nips & bites to hookups

    Quote Originally Posted by NAGG View Post
    I'm still thinking about where the rod tip is pointed during a retrieve when fishing placcys- Over the last 3 years I haven't strayed from pointing the tip straight at the lure (I've had reasonable success)
    I can see benefits of putting a bit of rod angle in there - Primarily to allow some give in a pretty rigid system of braided line , short heavy leader & no rod to absorb any movement of the lure during inhalation. Dunno

    Chris

    Quote Originally Posted by NAGG View Post

    I'm a bream fisherman ....... & I never point the rod tip directly at the lure (the rod does the work on hookset)

    as for barra ..... & plastics I felt that there was something basically flawed with my technique of pointing the rod tip at the lure in a rigid system ( maybe if I was fishing mono rather than braid ...... it could be different).

    I will be curious to see some other responses now

    Thanks again

    Chris
    I wish you'd make up your mind as it would be much easier to throw some simple logical ideas your way.

    Call me petty but you really don't make any sense very often.

  13. #58

    Re: Converting barra taps , nips & bites to hookups

    i would like to see a stronge jighead that would stand up to barra with a bib...that would help it to swim on the sink.... I have seen them in small bream bass style many years ago but i havent seen anything heavy duty yet, anyone else seen them?

  14. #59

    Re: Converting barra taps , nips & bites to hookups

    Quote Originally Posted by 2manylures View Post
    I wish you'd make up your mind as it would be much easier to throw some simple logical ideas your way.

    Call me petty but you really don't make any sense very often.

    I .. Will .. spell .. it .. out .. for .. you .. in .. simple .. terms .. if .. you .. like .. 2 Many

    Now ...... When bream fishing & working a plastic - I fish the rod to the side & down (this is how I work the lure plastic) - The strike is a little flick of the wrist ( little lure & little sharp hooks) Bream will hit often - we also usually get the fish within 10M of the boat

    When fishing plastics for barra ....... Its basically a slow roll with a much bigger & heavier lure (a little twitch occasionally) - I point the rod tip at the lure to keep contact with the continually moving lure as most barra hits on a plastic are single rapid inhale / exhale (10ths of a second) ....... rapid striking is required unless the fish hooks itself - The strike needs to be fairly firm to get the hook in - specially on a single hook the size of a nail . Often the placcy is over 30-40 M away

    So thats why there is a difference in technique ....... different for so many reasons.

    However ...... I feel a alteration is required

    Chris
    Give a man a fish & he will eat for a day !
    Teach him how to fish
    & he will sit in a boat - & drink beer all day!
    TEAM MOJIKO

  15. #60

    Re: Converting barra taps , nips & bites to hookups

    Quote Originally Posted by setthehook View Post
    i would like to see a stronge jighead that would stand up to barra with a bib...that would help it to swim on the sink.... I have seen them in small bream bass style many years ago but i havent seen anything heavy duty yet, anyone else seen them?
    Hey Rob ...... forget it - I saw Steves other post

    chris
    Give a man a fish & he will eat for a day !
    Teach him how to fish
    & he will sit in a boat - & drink beer all day!
    TEAM MOJIKO

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