Moon Phases and Imoundment Barra?

[Dick Pasfield]

Your statistics laid out point to a trend of bright moon success, but how much of this success occurs during the daylight hours,,,,,,, the other half of the day?

G’day Johnny I haven’t converted that data from lunar quarters (7 day periods) into single day periods yet so the answer can only be given that way for the moment, still pretty clear however.

1st Quarter to Full Moon –
21 night sessions – 2 fish per trip average
20 day sessions – .3 fish per trip


Full Moon to Last Quarter
23 night sessions – 3 fish per trip average
19 day sessions – .5 fish per trip

One thing I'd like to see laid over your catch results would be weather conditions and catch techniques.

Made the decision I’d only record a certain amount of data to make interpretation manageable. I’m adding steadily as the capacity to place it within the jigsaw increases.

I

realised we as anglers needed to alter our approach a great deal to continue staying in contact with fisheries where altering conditions closed one door and opened another.

Agreed on that and as I find those other doors the data should reflect that. Data is not a prediction of what will happen, rather what has transpired.

Saturday: 1 bite for a jump off, i.e. a doughnut.

Hi Scott, so much for the plan’s of mice and men. All I got tonight is pictured below.

[Tropicaltrout]

Just to touch on Johnnies bit on the salt fish reacting in the moon phase, We would get better tail cuts in the dark side of the moon then we would in the first and last quaters? why Maybe they come of the chew and what they have eaten is absobed and meat quality goes up, but in saying that they are harder to catch??????????

[A_DIFF_PERSPECTIVE]

Soooo, when we talk about a visitor coming to a lake to try to catch a barra we find a definite split in results when we come to day versus night during a 'bright' moon phase. So, what does one do? For those skilled men that predict when , where, how and what; they come up trumphs when everything aligns, but they, like Scott - (vet) are relying on a strong set of skills to come together with uncontrollable key variables aligned to get those fantastic results that everyone dreams of. Those skilled men know the lake fringes and weed banks almost inside out, and can tell just by a simple cast and retrieve where they are positioned in relation to weed banks or shore lines. Most vistors cannot do that. These men have a swag of luring techniques up their sleeves, one of which (on the night) often catches more than anything else, rather than any lure bringing equal numbers every trip. A novice, or visitor who isn't tuned 100%, or even 50% to the contours of the waterway will struggle in the depths of the dark unless following the mid water troll pattern that may or may not work in their favour at the time. ( A gamble) So, on a bright moon that shines at night, do anglers sleep by day and play golf and fish by dark? A skilled angler could do that and succeed well. A visitor could be wasting hours. If the wind blew cool by night, but daylight offered better conditions, a visitor may find better chances by day; so in saying all of that, I still cannot reccomend a visitor plan a trip to a barra lake under the influence of a full moon (or there abouts) if they do not carry the appropriate base skills required to even have them in the game.
When Scotty says he catches 30 in a night, it is not because anyone can do that, it is because skill A, B, C, D, E, F, G, H, I, J, K, L, M, and N has been utilised to have it all come together. If an angler lacks even just one of those skill sets, it can be just as tame as one key variable like weather, temp, water clarity etc missing from the equation that is required to obtain substantial results. In my job, teaching anglers to fish in the dark hours would be like asking a blind man to count red cars in the parking lot. In my eyes, everday anglers need to work on simple skills, the basic essentials that bring results. (Daylight offers those people more to absorb, by eye.) When they are mastered, or when fish come every trip, or close to it, it may just be time those anglers could advance to night angling in hope of scoring double figure sessions.
Night time angling in lakes was our cuppa tea 9-10 years ago, for a short period, but daylight seemed to offer more learnings. I have experienced what can happen in the dark/night in a lake when it all comes together, but instead, I work/fish lakes by day and fish the salt for barra by night in hope for that special giant that comes along once or twice per year. One or two 30 kg salty barra, to me, is worth the million casts it takes each year.
Two books could be written for day and night barra fishing- contrasting worlds to say no more.
As Scotty says, the last session for him proved a bit tame due to the weather not playing it's part in the equation. Just maybe later in the night may have been better , if, conditions improved, but if is an iffy word.
*Just my view- I still say that anglers visit a lake when they can. If things like weather are in their favour, that can set a great baseline to start off on, but nothing is more important than " How To" when any angler hits the water.
Great conditions and poor techniques will very often catch you nothing, on the other hand, well tuned techniques in average conditions will give you a better chance at success. Averaging ones' self out to be able to catch barra everyday, or every visit, in almost any condition is a major goal in baseline learning.
Lots to think about.
I, like Scott, Dick, and many others, enjoy these types of topics. Ausfish has done a full circle over the last few years from chest pump score cards, whizz bang lures; to now, with full on statistical information presented so the fine detail that makes these fisheries tick is shown to those who are genuinely interested. You won't find better barramundi information on salt or fresh water fisheries than on here, and sweetwater.com.au.
I'm sure many others think the same. I also think it is quite special that the topic can be discussed fairly and passionately for Aussie anglers.
Cheers
Johnny Mitchell

[NAGG]

Well written Johnny

I will say though ..... while night fishing is no place for a beginner & certainly not a place to start .
Having said that ...... there is no reason why after a bit of exposure & familiarisation that a newcomer cannot fish a sunset period through to early evening! particularly at a place like Awoonga
More often than not , I see anglers pulling their boats out of the water at the time when they should be fishing !
For me one thing serves true ...... that there is a barra o clock - & certainly from Spring time through to late Autumn ......... If I am at at barra dam - you'll see me fishing that sunset period ........ Barra O clock
If this is followed by a moon rise ........

Chris

[vet]

Well written again Johnny, night fishing is a totally different ball game. It is hard enough for people to pick up on the little changes that signal a bite period in the day let alone in the dark. Night time is definitely not the time to be learning. That is what daytime is for. Instead of playing golf in the day, people should be driving around the dam studying their sounders intently, learning all the contours, holes and gutters, logs, weed balls etc. Go when it's glassy calm and then go into the weed beds and look at what is there to confirm what your sounder tells you, study the lay of a log, an alley way in a weed bed that shows the presence of a gulley which barra may travel along, even the type of weed that is growing and the type of bait fish that is present. Put on goggles and have a closer look if necessary. Mark points of interest on your gps, go back and do a normal cast with a lure you expect to use at that point and mark this point so you can position your boat and know you'll be landing the lure in the right place. Once you know what's there in detail, than you can go fishing at night. The big problem is that it will change in a short time so you have to start all over again.
I agree with you Johnny, for a newcomer to a lake daytime offers them the best chance to learn something and with that hopefully catch a barra and daytime angling definitely doesn't require a full moon. The trouble is people come with high expectations of catching lots of barra and they go away disappointed. We need to reset the bar and get people catching 1-2 barra a day consistently before they try the dark side.
An example of learning in the day: I caught a couple of fish at a spot I haven't fished for a long time, so the next day I went out in the morning and mooched around under electric power where the fish had been hooked the night before. I noticed an absence of boney bream in the area and an abundance of a smaller constantly moving baitfish in the area( rainbows), I also noted the way the logs were laying in the water and where the weed balls were and the depth was 2 foot or less. From this I went to the tackle shop and bought lighter jig heads and plastics that were more boyant but were 8-9 cm long and thin profile and dark like rainbows. Then I went back at night and caught more fish than previously.
So learning in the day is the way to go, therefore newcomers and travellers would be best to spend a fair bit of time on the water in the day, and therefore you don't need full moon.
Walk before you run,
scott.

[SeekingBarradise]

Moon Phases & Anglers

So far this thread has backed up the Spin Gear for Barra Thread from a month ago and will be one to copy and paste to help old timers or new comers asking questions regarding Impoundment barra and moon phases. Well done to all who have contributed.

I agree I reckon 3 years ago this thread would have ended up in a full on argument. People thought we would miss the people that don’t contribute anymore, but just like Sonny Bill when he left Cantebury it only took the next season for the team to still go well in the absence.

At the moment I see the answer to the Question: “Should I post-pone or plan a trip for a better moon phase or a particular moon on a Barra Lake?”

I still see this answer as “No, just go when you can but look for a good weather window.

With JM’s thoughts on skill level I’ve added. “Try to study up and improve your knowledge/skill regarding Barra as much as possible to take advantage of the playing field you are dished up by the weather gods on your trip”.


Skill level

It was perfect timing to mention skill level of the angler JM. Lets face it the vast majority won’t have spent a lot of time or study effort on barra. If it’s not your favourite fish then the amount of hours fishing, observing, talking and thinking about the species will be low which doesn’t help.


Many people’s favourite fishing species will usually be close to where they live. With 99% of people fishing these dams being visiting anglers, it’s not rocket science to say that their barra base would be low to start with, just like if we fished for a new species in unfamiliar locations, we would be behind the 8’ball to start with. Nothing wrong with this we all have species and locations we know nothing about. But we can help people out which is the Aussie way, like this gem of a thread etc.

So in simple form, what most people are trying to do is to find the easiest fishing available.
That’s why many use spin gear, especially at entry level. That’s why people ask what lures are best for barra and what moons etc. We are really searching for better fishing times. When’s the last time you heard or saw a thread with someone wanting to be pointed towards the worst lures, gear and moons to go fishing in?

Cheers Lyndon

[SeekingBarradise]

The Million Dollar Question

Impoundment Barra would never be the first form of fishing recommended to a mate when the topic of easy fishing rose around the campfire. So the real question is
“When is the easier fishing on a barra dam within a monthly cycle so I can plan a trip mate? Is it linked to a moon phase?”

On hard fished dams where fish have been pressured the glory days are over. Little windows are there for good fisho’s as Mitchell and Scotty have listed in their replies. However the first timer or travelling angler will have trouble cashing in on these events, if they are even noted in the first place. The first thing I’d do is send them to the easiest barra dam in the state and go from there. In the months of September to November if possible. But this is really like patching up old tyres, there is a risk of it blowing up and deflating at the worst possible time. When you really just needed a better tyre to start with, but you put it off as long as possible for one reason or another. Starting with a better tyre will get rid of the worry and let you know you are on the right track.


Solution: Tapping into knowledge

I would straight up say to anyone going to a Barra Impoundment that getting a guide on your first day would be the best thing you could ever do on a trip. Secondly I’d go out with a local that fishes like a guide.

Everything else you do will be a million % behind what you could learn by yourself in a short 2-3 day window fishing a lake you are not familiar with and a species you are not familiar with. If you are prepared to spend your cash on your own trip and you are ok with getting expensive donuts then that is ok, but you could look at things another way.

How much will I spend on lures this year? Then add up how much I’ll spend on rods and reels this year? Then add expenditure on all other fishing gear over a year, including mags? Now if some of this money went towards a guide do you think we could find a bit of extra dough?

Food For Thought Anyway. Keep this great thread rolling guys, awesome stuff.
Cheers Lyndon.

[NAGG]

Gee I can't let this be a regular thing - but here goes

I have to agree 100% with Lyndon on the guide thing ...... It would be money well spent & worth while if you plan to do a few days & have your own boat at a location

fishing with a knowledgeable local ..... also is good - I certainly owe a lot to Trev on our first trip to Awoonga

These guided times give you the opportunity to pick up on what is working then & there! - plus techniques ( & a bucket load of other stuff)

& finally

Agree with Lyndon about earlier in the season rather than later (favourable weather pattens are gold) last Sept / Oct were crackers at both Mondy & Awoonga........

Cheers

chris

[vet]

Good advice Lyndon and Chris, hiring a guide would be much easier than my method of fishing a new dam. When I arrive at a new dam I take plenty of food and look around all day and then stay out all night and fish for as long as it takes to find when the bite windows occur. Once I have found this out then I go back at similar times the following days of the trip. It would definitely be easier to hire a guide and be given up to date advice about where and when to go. The only down side of this is that it is hard to find a guide that works at night.
cheers, scott

[Big_Ren]

Good advice Lyndon and Chris, hiring a guide would be much easier than my method of fishing a new dam. When I arrive at a new dam I take plenty of food and look around all day and then stay out all night and fish for as long as it takes to find when the bite windows occur. Once I have found this out then I go back at similar times the following days of the trip. It would definitely be easier to hire a guide and be given up to date advice about where and when to go. The only down side of this is that it is hard to find a guide that works at night.
cheers, scott

A guide is nothing short of money well spent indeed Scott, but I would think you're getting even better bang for your buck with a daylight guiding session.

You can see what he is showing you, you can see the lay of the land so to speak, you can see and hear (or listen) why he has chosen a particular target zone based on all the available variables at play.

With a night guiding session, you are missing out on those essential learnings. The info imparted is priceless.

On the subject of moons, I certainly do fish around the moon phases, but not for the reasons you may be thinking. I try to avoid fishing the full moon because it is like the Pied Piper for all the freezer brigade mice and every other Tom Dick and Harry.

We go when we can, as often as we can, but more often than not I try to avoid the big globe in the sky like the plague for that reason alone.

Cheers
Paul

[Awoonga]

So lets see... And take last night as a example..Wind blowing . At least 10 to 15 Knots Water temp 19.5 .The air temp was cold {jumper time and coat time} Now the location was somewhere that l have not been for at least two years ..Why ? because someone was in my spot .Or should that read there was a boat where l had been fishing latley ! I was looking for a wind blown bay . This bay had the waves rolling in from the main basin {quite rough }At the entrance to the bay on the sounder there where the ladies... At least twenty .They seemed to be in this holding pattern . Like not ready to feed or go into the bay. Now this was before the sun had set and the moon had risen l moved into the bay anchor deployed and waited...Nothing untill the moon rose and the sun had set then slowly it started to happen first the nips and bumps then two bites then the hookups it all lasted about forty minutes then nothing.. Was it the moons influence ? or a new location ? The night before l fished with Scotty in the location that was occupied last night water temp was 20c the wind had stopped and only one fish was hooked. To me the conditions on that night where better than last night . Tonight l shall go back to that bay and see what happens !

[Pete62]

A quick thank - you to those kind enough to share their knowledge and experiences on this topic, I am finding it riveting and informative reading.

Pete - A traveling Angler -

[vet]

Hi Big Ren, I see your point but don't understand why you can't see or hear what the guide is saying because it is night. I find that I can hear, see and feel what's going on better at night because it is often calmer, every ripple roll and splash is easier to see and hear because of the stillness. As I said before, for newcomers it is easier to learn in the day and this is why guides work in daylignt.
cheers scott.

[fishel]

SeekingBarradise, Interesting what you say about barra being caught in temps considered low enough to kill barra, because a neighbour of a friend who lives at Dalby put 20 barra in his dam a few years ago, and not a very big dam at that, as they only have half an acre of land, and he put his boat in the dam and checked his sounder and found 18 of them still alive. Some have been caught and were a good size.

Now, if you don't know Dalby, it is COLD. Lots of frosts with a layer of ice on top of any water containers, etc left outside in the winter. I was very surprised as I thought they didn't live south of Gympie because of the cold.

Cheers Eleanor

[Big_Ren]

Hi Big Ren, I see your point but don't understand why you can't see or hear what the guide is saying because it is night. I find that I can hear, see and feel what's going on better at night because it is often calmer, every ripple roll and splash is easier to see and hear because of the stillness. As I said before, for newcomers it is easier to learn in the day and this is why guides work in daylignt.
cheers scott.

I actually love fishing at night Scott, particularly Awoonga. But if people have particular learning styles that are more attuned to seeing (as distinctly opposed to sensing or feeling) what they are hearing, and with that comes acceptance and belief, then day time is the go for a higher percentage of beginners and experienced anglers alike. Monkey see, monkey do.

Me......it doesn't worry me if it's the a.m. or the p.m......beats the heck out of work don't ya think.

Cheers
Paul