And that is all we have heard since dec 08.Originally Posted by Nancy_S
Either way, anyone contemplating taking over, investing in, or partnering a business should undertake a due diligence exercise. It might cost, but is a good long term investment.
Having been involved in such a process, it can be taxing and arduous but also enlightening and provides insights into potential for improvement.
Cheers
Wow,
Thanks,
We have a hard road ahead of us but feel up to the challange.
look forward to talking to you all soon
Kind regards
Mick
So Mick,
I'm assuming you have documentation or a paper trail etc to back up these claims?
Tim
Bloody invisable ink...... or is it morse code'?
The above isn't the way I would ever start or change a business let alone invest in one without fully audited accounts and returns. Just don't know what you were getting for your investment ? I take it that you drew no money or goods from the company in your period of involvement with it? I assume a forensic acountant would be recreating the books if any action was going to be taken but then it has all been wound up very fast so no money to fund it???
Interested to hear what you could offer to prospective clients so they are at no risk should they intend to have a boat made as obviously the new company is starting from $ zero or $2
it was there earlier I don't know if it was edited or modded
Stuie
IF IT CAN'T EAT A WHOLE PILLY I DON'T WANT IT
Old saying "never do business with friends or relatives" guess it was the case here. Good to finally here what has gone on. Fisher-Too i hope all goes well for the new company & everyone keeps their jobs.
Adrian
After reading your reply fisher-too I now may reasess weather or not to purchase a new fisher boat.
You have restored much faith by that reply. It would be good though to hear both sides of the story.
Thanks Nanny King,
look forward to talking to you regarding your new fisher, and trust we can help.
kind regards
Mick
Sorry if you feel we are holding back or not answering question because we are trying our best under the circumstances, we do answer our phones and talk to people/ walk them through where we are up to etc. At the end of the day we are the guys on the inside of the cage trying to do what we believe is the right thing with seemingly everyone having a kick at it - and thats ok - just hard to understand with out getting frustrated i guess.
Not sure this is going to satisfy every ones curiosity however hope this sheds some light on the facts, and hay Col, it you want to jump in and correct me, pls do, just log in so we can see who you are.
Try Xmas 2007 when I first knew about you, finding out that you live one house down and telling us what a great product we have or had.
- I first met Col some 2 ½ years ago during my research into upgrading to a 7m walk around plate boat, for me and my 3 boys because we love fishing too, and of cause the responsibilities and mateship that comes with it – yep – our time, after my father passed away in early 07 I realised, life is to short (RIP Mate).
You never signed any contact at all ,in fact you never wanted sign anything ,guess that was part of the ploy.......
- All my endeavours kept leading me back to Fisher Boats. 8 months later I to parted with a deposit and signed up for a Fisher. Col and I ended up built a pretty good friendship during this time – (well so I thought),
The next 11 months you never let up playing Mr nice guy getting inside Col's head believing that you were a trusted friend
- The next 4 months where spent with family interaction, fishing, camping, BBQing and of cause the odd bottle JB & makers thrown in for kicks.
You can't help yourself can you ,you were the one who said hey guy's I'm a great business operator you look like you need a bit of a hand. You offered to come in as a partner a financal one at that and lets grow your business to new heights. Again using all the BS you could come up with.
- Around private X-mas drinks 07 we had a pretty in-depth discussion regarding the wow’s of being a business owner and found some common ground – contracting, uncertainties of the boom faze, growth pains, economies of scale, successes and failures plus all the BS joys associated to being a business owner, O and of cause everyone thinks you’re a darn million air, ha ha ha. – yah – shiny on top but paddling like hell underneath.
How about August 2008 to set up your complicated company structure before everything could be changed over including the accounts.You had JJM financials weeks before you would return them and you were the one who offered to pay x amount for the company not us.
- On the 6th January 08 Col sent me a text saying – help flat out atm. I called back and asked - what’s up – Col explained he couldn’t cope, was just snowed under and needed to get big or get out, possible build some boats from our engineering works – needed to increase efficiencies and production - had more orders then he knew what to do with, liked the way we managed and grew our businesses to be market leaders in our field within 6 years, liked the dynamic between us (and I too enjoyed and trusted our friendship). I said I was quite busy this year and working away at the moment, however, would be back in a few days, we could discuss then.
- BTW do you remember taking Col to the Sundowner Hotel for lunch where you offered to buy half the business without wanting to look at any financials (that were offered to you).
- Well, by March 08, we had incepted a new group of companies (so no trading history to research) called Fisher Boats P/L, Fisher manufacturing P/L and Fisher Designs P/L.
$510,000...Sure
- I injected $510,000 over the cause of a few months, put Jason into fisher manufacturing doing production scheduling, data base and AutoCad work, plus opened the new factory, employed a new receptionist into FB and eventually a fulltime bookkeeper while supporting the fisher group from our engineering company as best possible. Unfortunately by the time the new bookkeeper had started in November, and completed company journals by early December 08, to my amassment the wheels had already fullin off, and the fisher group was destine to hit the wall by February 09 – March at the very latest, what we needed was an urgent and aggressive management turnaround strategy, and a large capital injection, however a capital injection alone would not have fixed the structural problems within the group, these still needed to be addressed as a matter of urgency. You wouldn’t believe it looking at the surface of the business, the company just seemed to be powering ahead with boats going out the door left right and centre.
You might also recall when we had a meeting on the 4Th of August 08 at 28 Piper Street to ask you how the hell we are going to cope with all the added expenses that you were incurring ie your man Jason Davis putting himself on $72,800 a year as he looked after accounts and payroll when he took over in May 2008.
Which I might add we didn't get paid till July 08 and Jason set those wages for us and as I recall under your instructions.Not to forget the added expense of setting up the new shed going from 9 employees to 18 and you offering them all extra money, then deciding we would have brand new forklifts x2 instead of second hand ones or leasing them as we requested.
There are two sides to a partnership Mick it's about time you recognized it!!!!!!
What a selective memory you have, one of the meetings I recall.... you frothing at the mouth eyes glazed pointing the finger yelling like a manic telling me I was too take a 3 months holiday and making huge allegations (which I might add I wanted you to prove)and me telling you where to shove it and walking out. Col went to Tassie over a long week-end to use up existing air tickets from the year before as he told you at the time. Buying real estate in Tassie what a joke you must be paranoid. Bit like the extra home loan payments hey.
- During the cause of December 08 some very serious questions asked, allegations raised and meetings called. One meeting was delayed by 6 days due to Col being in Tasmania (yep- the cheapest place in Australia to buy a house), Col’s reply to most of this was “she’ll be right mate – don’t stress the small things - we’ve got money coming in, we’ll be ok, Nancy hit the roof – quit and overnight cleared out her desk and took some pretty important doc’s with her.
We actually saw each other on Boxing day night did you forget that too Mick. Well I don't, you and your wife came up bearing gifts and then socialized with my family and relatives leaving us and telling us to have a great holiday and enjoy yourselves. Found more lies well it's either Mick Sanderson's way or no way. Some one you know said to me what Mick Sanderson wants Mick Sanderson always get's at any expense. Truer words as I was to find out ever spoken.
- We all last saw each other as the fisher group on the 24th December 08, at the x-mas party. By this stage I had a high level of concern but just couldn’t join the dots or work out what went wrong – it almost felt like every corner I turned I found more lies.
1770 actually Mick and again you stuffed that holiday, at least we tried to get away not like you lying and telling us you were away with the family when all the time you were plotting to take over the business.
- Col and his family then departed on holidays for a couple of weeks to the Whitsunday’s or 1770 ???
Again what a lot of BS this is.... it would take me too long to tell the correct version
- Between X-mas and NY I drove passed the factory in Piper st, to my surprise it was open. I called Col and reached him, I asked 2 things, are you aware the factory is open and there has been a chq bounce? – thinking it may have been a boat payment?, Cols reply was sorry mate- that was me, we’ve got some money coming in today that should have landed a couple of days ago, and I’ll sort it out. Mick is just doing some work on his own boat, is that ok – sure I just would have appreciated knowing before hand.
Ash and Payne were just on here whinging yet helped themselves to the workshop whenever they wanted as you found out over the break.You can't help yourself can you it just comes so naturally to you..... I recall you said, that I said you were bipolar No Mick I didn't say that but it wouldn't surprise me what you were.
- I called in and said G-day to Mick, had a quick chat and left, he did mentioned him and ash where in tomorrow. Yep – I’m still scratching my head trying to join the dots.
Doing what comes naturally conning people and telling heaps of BS I will give you credit for that you conned us well and truly.Why run up accounts in December with a break coming up and already bigger then normal accounts.
- I took a 6pack around the next day about lunchtime and had a beer with the boys in the back of Mick’s boat – once we broke the ice I was quite blown away with the information coming at me regarding production, questions and stock levels, plus the direction and openness the conversation, Mick and ash were also blown away with some of the things I had to say about the books, none of us could work it out but it all started to fit and add up
Col and Nancy told employees late November/ December – Mick Sanderson has bipolar so don’t worry about him too much, just watch Mick because he’s been playing up a bit lately, asking weird questions? .
Again full of BS
Problems ???
1. lack of material stock See above
2. lack of consumable stock See above
3. lack of core gas stock See above
4. no boat kits ordered for January production schedules Why didn't your man order them
5. uncontrolled leakage within the group BS
6. no working capital left You never supported it as you said you would
7. large creditors bill yeh higher then normal that's why we didn't want too much in December
8. 1st & 2nd boat payments received on boat kits not even ordered let alone started Bull shit
9. monies taken for motors not even ordered They were ordered before price rise
10. company name expired please expain
11. lease agreement on boat yard lapsed by 2 months Too busy before xmas thank god with what you did.
12. Cash payment ??????? In the bank as we told you when you came around home harrassing me. Look at the records.
13. boats built by FM but sold through other companies – not FB All under one roof
14. Col & N tried to trademark register the name FB and logo into their own personal names while being in a partnership ???? More paranoia check the records since you have them all in your possession.
15. This all meant this was going to hell in a hand basket at a 100mph you should know you created this mess!!!!!!
At the end of the day and after 10 months of trade.
$500k shareholder money missing Again more lies
$650k creditors in a business that should trade cash flow positive Well if we had left your man Jason in control I dare say it would have been worse and it was funny when you got rid of me at the end of October and bought in your bookkeeper, and yes was paid by Inseam the conversation I had with her was she could see what was going on and told me to seek legal advice in the new year. I'm just sorry I didn't act earlier but at that same time I was talking to my accountants about you.
When you run a company down this hard, it shouldn’t matter wether it’s Christmas, Easter or any given Wednesday – it shouldn’t come as a shock that the company goes into a partnership meltdown, administration or liquidation, it’s called being accountable for your own actions.
We had that business for 7 years before you. Mick you were in it for less than a year now you have our business ?????you do the maths. You used our good credit rating because you didn't have one.
In the throughs of all this, C and N where paid $200k salaries to run the company, meanwhile they renovated their house with new on sweats, floor coverings, kitchen, patios and covered areas, and of cause that haugh shed down the back yard, this is what I mean, everything on the surface look fine, so where did all the money go, what was the next move.
Yes Mick as I said you instigated that one the wages BTW we only got paid half of that.
First mistake brought house in same street as you and I might add after years of renting. Yes the house wasn't flash and we did pay for all renovations out of our own money not like you wanted, telling Col to put it through the company.
The short of the long
Just to let everyone know that all these figures that Mick Sanderson is quoting are all from his bookkeepers and when we tried to get him to put it on the table with our Lawyers he declined. Which left us no other option but to push him into administration.
- never go into a partnership where the husband runs the business and the wife does the books
- All I can say is the cogs of justice grind slowly – but they do grind
- There are probably a couple of things missing but I’m sure they will come out in the wash
We have never burnt anyone before in business I have been married to Col over 20 years and what I'm reading is not true, we loved the business and put a lot of time and effort into it. This has destroyed our lives we have children and to see their father effected by this I wouldn't wish it on any one. This was our life .
What are we trying to do
BTW Mick what sort of people are you...... your wife and you going up to my daughters school and getting them involved in this mess well guess what she will be staying at that school til the end of 2009. Thanks but no thanks for all the roof rocking and intimadating acts
- Pick up the pieces
- Rebuild the business in the interest of all
- Keep 2 apprentices employed while maintaining 5 world class tradies
that you have choosen to do over this time.
Mick and Ash are top blokes, straight shooters and perfectionist in their own wrights.
Well you have to say that. But having said that I would like to see the clients get their boats finished if we had been allowed to stay as we were they would have had them by now. Or better still if you hadn't come into our lives.
Not sure how this sits or how it makes you feel but they are the facts.
It is very interesting that although there were 50% partners and directors in the business that one continually sleges and blames the other and he never does anything wrong. At no time did he offer any assistants only wanting Col to go fishing and on road trips to Moura which is interesting in it's self when that business ceased operations a very long time ago.Col will probably say something one day but he isn't into urgueing on the internet like some.
Thought for the day
My mission in life is to be the person my dog thinks I am
Since your into quotes
Every dog has it's day .
Nancy (Col's wife)
Have a great day everyone [/quote]
All the best sorting that out
Nancy, I really feel for you and Col. I haven't commented on this thread until now, But what you just said confirms my suspicions that Mick is a bit of a snake in the grass and I believe that some of your ex staff have had the wool pulled over their eyes too.
Ron
Make something Idiot proof and they make better Idiots
Well I don't know about the two statements made by Mrs Col and Mick Sanderson.
The truth would be somewhere between the two I reckon.
Frankly 98% of people could not care less who paid who and what was what and who visited who and gave a toaster for X-mas.
What 98% of people would like to know is (and these can be answered in simplistic yes or no statements...not politician talk answers) are listed below.
These questions refer to Fisher Boats MkI, II and every other way Fisher boats and it's subsidiaries can be described as in it's many company forms etc etc if you get my drift.
(1) will people with Fisher boat already be able to make warranty claims if needed on their boats?
(2) will all the people who have money invested in boats in the construction stage receive their boats with full warantee or receive refunds of money given to Fisher?
(3) will Dan get his motor as well as other people who have ordered and paid for merchandise and have not taken delivery of said merchandise?
(4) will the all the suppliers be paid?
If the answer to all these is yes then I'll be the first to wish you all the best.
If all the answers are not all yes....
I intend on living for-ever....so far so good
There are 3 sides to every story............... Yours, Mine and the Truth
Have not posted on this subject yet but I really feel for Col, Fisher boats is Col and if the new guys are serious they will call their business something else and build there own reputation not trade on Col's. This is not the first time this has happened as it happened when John Haines got kicked out of Haines Hunter a company he built from nothing after taking an equity partner in the early 80's. John came back with Haines Signature and I hope Col does the same.
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