Why Overheads?

[the_hommi_g_is]

Its just occured to me that most deep water fishing is fished with overheads like the TLD's ... Whats wrong with the normal spinning reels?

I am <hopefully> heading out for some fishing with Sea Sprobe on the 18th Sept and im very curious ...

I have an overhead outfit, but i'd like to take a spinning outfit as well ... I have a nice Ugly Stik <gb1800> that i'd like to put a nice sized reel with 21Lb line on ...

Im sure u guys can tell me if this is a good idea or if im just wasting my time ...

Ta ...

[the_hommi_g_is]

Is it because there is alot more pressure on a spinning reel than an overhead?

Or is it because u feel the fight better on the overhead?

Ta ...

[mackmauler]

most of those charter boats use penn senators, the gears are better than tld single speeds. it comes down to how deep and what weight you are winching, the biggest penn spinfisher in 100m is shit for winching compared to a penn senator, the gear ratio of a spin reel is norm quiet high.

[damons33]

I wouldn't use the spinning reel for the fact of the effort it requires to reel in a lot of line with a heavy weight weight on the end. A #spinning reel has a perpendicular drive system like the diff in a car so there is a loss of power or energy thru that transmission, where the drive gear in an overhead is in line or parallel so there is less energy or power required to turn the spool if all fulcrums and gear ratios where the same as the theadline. The best set up i've used is a tld 30,2spd(the 20,2spd is the same size just narrower!) i have put the tld 50 handle on mine to give greater handle lenght, also i use super braid and i only half fill it so i get an even lower gear ratio(i never use the low gear unless i snag bottom!). the 2spd has a heavier gear set(the gear cogs are twice as thick) then the single speed and has a larger drag diameter. so when i need to turn a large fish from bricking me off on hard reef, i got the power and breaking strain to do so.
# #i spin tuna with a theadline and fish shallow grounds with it as well, but try reeling up from 100m with a 12oz snapper lead with say a 6500 baitrunner and you will understand this the minute you use the larger overhead with gears around 4to1 or less to do that same job, the cheapest larger overhead would be the old diawa sealines like the 9/0 star drag, and dont buy a rod longer then 6ft(penn make some great value sticks for this purpose but i hate penn reels), something fast tapered and preferably graphite so its lite to hold but still could lift an engine block from the sea bed!lol, or give an ambo a few pulled mussels! you know you've gone to hard when you only raise the fishes bottom jaw to the surface!(yes i have done that with a silver trevally of around 3kilos at the peak off sydney, on the hookup- to the amazement to all on board! poor lipless fish!). dont buy a alvey snapper reel unless its the electric reef queen ffs! haha
# #i hope you get some good fish on you charter mate,
# #damon "yo ma nigars! in da westside massive!"

[the_hommi_g_is]

damon ... that makes alot of sense ...

would the spinning reel work well in shallower water ... say 50m?

I really want to use this spinning outfit :P

[bidkev]

Can't be arsed even thinking about the mechanics of it but an egg beater just hasn't got the lift of even the cheapest of overheads IMHO. Yes, they have their place in the "armoury" but the only one of mine that I trust implicitly is my Shimano TSS4.

I've run with abu 7000's for nigh on 25 yrs and despite them being nowadays classed as "entry level" at only 4:1 and star drag, I can fish an 8oz lead comfortably and have landed fish over 40 kilo on 25lb line. I've never gotten into lever drags simply because I've manged with what overheads I've had from "day one" and never found them lacking, whereas I have had to consign many fixed spools to the "learnt the hard way" box. The 7000's suit me because of their versatility........I can chuck a lead over 200 metres from a beach (if need be) and also utilise it in the boat. My favourite all rounder is the Shimano Triton 3GT which also casts well from a beach. Ive never had an overhead lock up or slip drag whereas with fixed spools I've suffered bent bale arms, failure to simply lift a big fish, line failing to come cleanly off spool when casting, and everyone I've bought bar the Shimano has eventually given up the ghost on the anti reverse.

I may have been unlucky in my choices and many guys I know swear by their fixed spools, but they simply ain't for me. If you've already got one though, simply suck it and see..........that's what I did all those years ago :-) I started on the buggers when they came on the market, but once I got an overhead, I never looked back.

cheers

kev

[rusco]

Acouple of points that may help you
Line breaking strains are important on Charters..Different B/strains cause tangles..lines on charters will be same B/Strains 30/50. Maximum amount of line can be put on O/Head reels and skippers will cut line to reduce tangle time.
BOTTOM LINE...You're out there to catch fish in a certain timeframe. You dont have time to stuff around. Also the skipper cannot put you onto fish everytime either..There is alot of traveltime involved...Enjoy your trip...Sea Probe have a good record.

[damons33]

yo hommie'
# i have plenty of theadlines(stella 10,000 and sustain in the smaller sizes) and love em' but the charter you're going on aint the place for it, under 30 meters yes! as the weight required to get into the strike zone is a lot less- i know that a mitchell 499 would strip the gears out of abu 7000! and dropping a 12oz lead from a 7000 would be a nightmare! but cold water fish tend to be a lot more dosile then in the tropics!(i got 2 7000c's lying in the shed broken n' f@#$ed from encounters with real fish!) and i remember lifting a massive ray with a 499 rock fishing- rotten pests they are skates n' rays!, i hate the fact they are an eligible species under ansa!
who-ed bother with em'? #like really?
# #the best thing about theadlines is their ablity to cast light weights good distances and their high retrieve ratios are great for spinning tunas or pitching liveys at teased up billies, sails or dolphin fish, when i'm at anchor fishing baits i always have a threadline at the ready with a pilchard on a set of gangs with a heavy mono leader( if a see a mackerel! i set the hook as soon as it picks it up!) for the unexpected pelargics that sometimes show up at the transom sniffing my berley pot. damon olsen and the boys on nomad charters use stella 16000's with 12o lbs braid to pop giant trevally and turrum over 60kg- no shit, thats awesome stuff! and awesome gear at an awesome price!
# even then my favorite bottom outfit for light line, shallow water snapper fishing is a calcutta ct400 on a glx loomis 4kg rod and i dont use lead or leader i just go mainline straight to the hook and get plenty of squire out to 4kg(in my mind i reckon snapper 2 to 4kg are the best to eat! baked whole).
# ie - i was looking at getting a $4oo dollar fly rod for tuna and my mates in the know said "look dont muck around and end up owning 3 rods(2 of which i would shelve) get the $1000 jobby straight up and save money(glx loomis!)". depends on how serious you are about fishing and how much you want success(how much money you got too i guess!) in this "the greatest sport in the world!"
::)
damon-hell i should get into sales!
#

[banshee]

Stella 16000? How old are they? Correct me if I'm wrong but no such animal exists.

[agnes_jack]

Banshee
Yeah they now come in--10000, 20000 sizes.

Regards, Tony

Ps Damon, I'll give you a yell when I need new sales staff! ;D ;D ;D

[banshee]

The 10000 and 20000 have been around for a while,but if there is a 16000 it must be a discontinued line because the only new stuff I saw from Shimano last week was the new Trinidad 16 and 40 jigging reels,the Calcutta 200,the little Chronarch and the new Corsair replacments the Corvalis.

[agnes_jack]

Banshee
There is a 6000, if there was a 16000, it has been discontinued for at least a few years now. Did you go to the tackle show?

Regards, Tony

[Tony_N]

October FishingWorld mag comes with a bonus 48 page Shimano catalogue. Its good to have that little wish book to put under my pillow at night!

[banshee]

G'day Agnes,I went up on the Saturday,the highlight for me was having the Okuma boys let me try and break a couple of their Crystal Blue jigging rods,I had the rep on both knees with both hands locked on to the tip while I gave it everything,I didn't use a double grip but weighing in at 90kg I certainly gave those two rods a good going over for about 30 seconds each,my bossman went the colour of bad shit when he saw what was going on,I can still hear him declaring that he wasn't paying for any breakages.

G'day Tony,as Agnes Jack has said before,those toys should come in a bit cheaper this year.

[agnes_jack]

Banshee
Classic!! I had a similar thing with one of the other "cheaper brand" reps, he insisted that I wouldn't break his rod no matter how hard I lifted. He kept saying harder harder
The missus and I were cracking up laughing at eachother as we could hear the rod cracking under the foregrip, felt it going bigtime ;D ;D ;D ;D

Regards, Tony ;D

[the_hommi_g_is]

I had a very similar situation a few years ago at the boat show ... There was a custom rod builder there and he showed us a nice surf rod he had there ... dad and i commented on how the tip was a little too senstive and the rod wouldnt hold up with 25Lb-30Lb line ...

The guy handed dad the rod and said hold on ... this 90Kg guy hung off the tip and dad gave it everything ... it was an amazing rod ... went bak to his shop the next weekend and bought the rod ... It also came with a little 3rd piece which is just the butt of a rod, u take the top piece of the surf rod and put it on the butt so u can use it for ur smaller species in estuary etc ...

Lovely rod ... Never thought a rod could ever be soo strong ...

Ta :)

Hamza