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View Full Version : Yamaha Owners BEWARE!!!



Heath
02-08-2002, 03:12 PM
G'day all,

As you may or may not know, we've had some trouble lately with our 1995 70hp Yamaha outboard. Up until 2 weeks ago, if you had asked me what I thought of Yamaha, I would have told you that they are the best donks that ever touched the earth. Well my opinion has changed somewhat to a good degree below that.

To give you a bit of background, our donk was purchased with the new boat back in 1995. In the years it spent in Sydney the boat was used about once a month up until 1999. Once up here on the Goldcoast the boat is on average twice a week. It currently has 440 hours on the clock however the engine hours are roughly 75 - 100 hours below that due to the ignition key being left on for 4 days or so :-[ #:-[, The motor up until a fortnight ago has performed faultlessly. 2 weekends ago on starting it up it sounded a bit noisy, by the end of the trip it was REAL noisy. Got my resident outboard specialist to have a look ( Gotta give my mate Garry a wrap #;)) & it was diagnosed as a very sick puppy. The engine was pulled down the next day. Upon cracking open the crank case we were presented with the picture below. I don't know if you can see it, but there is metal all through the 2 main center bearings.
www.users.bigpond.com/the_nest/centerbearings.jpg
www.users.bigpond.com/the_nest/stuffed_bearings.jpg


This was dissapointing alone, but the following events that followed, I hope will enlighten you fello boaties.

Garry's first observation was that the crank was a pressed crank. This immediatly meant that the work would have to be done by a specialist who could pull the crank apart & then press it back together. On the Monday following the breakdown I started tracking parts down. Now to me it makes sence that you go to the nearest dealer to source them which I did, after all you ASSUME that dealer or dealers as the case turned out, SHOULD know about the product that they sell & maintain.
My first stop was at ***** ****** Marine in Brisbane. Spoke to a fellow there *B* who took all the particulars down. A parts list was compiled & then he dropped the bomb shell.... You can't get the bearings alone, you have to get a whole crank. "WHAT"!!! was my reply. I was informed that $1300.00 will see me with a new crank. I felt crook to be honest, *B* suggested I might find a second hand crank at a outboard wreckers. So in hope I called the 2 in Brisbane with no luck. ( Feeling really crook now :'() So I decided to ring the big smoke ( Sydney ) and talk to some wreckers down there. This is where my luck changed. I called NEPTUNE MARINE 0295250990 who are at 40 Bay Rd Taren Pt. I spoke to a fellow there called Nick. After I explained my situation he assured me that you can get the bearings as he had replaced no less than 3 sets on Yamaha cranks in the last 6 months. With this info I called *B* back at ****** ****** marine. After explaining that the bearings can be sourced, I was hit with the statement " Good on him" now I don't know how to take that or exactly which context it was ment in. Anyway, *B* said he will check with Yamaha. He called back later in the day & I was advised yes they were available & they were........$65.00 ea. YES $130.00 V $1300.00. So I went down to order them off *B*. I was then advised that they could only get one & not the other. This really started to give me the shits by this stage >:(, how the hell could this be right?? The different between the 2 bearings being one has a circlip on it to keep it in position. As pleaded with *B* to ring Yamaha while I was there so I could talk to them. Nup, as he turned his back on me the only comment was "You're up for a new crank or you'll have to get the bearing made" He was backed up by a girl there who handles the spare parts as well. Well it looked like I had outstayed my welcome there so I rang another 2 dealers & was told the same thing "New Crank". So I called Neptune Marine & talked to Nick & a of today I have the bearings in my hot little hand. I took my crank to a place in Brisbane called Serco who could not have been more helpfull in telling me what I need & where to get them at the right price & they work with pressed cranks. You see, I am up for new conrods, pistons, top & bottom bearings. I was put onto a place called Victory Parts 0754853433 on the sunshine coast. Initially I was after the conrod kits & was going to buy everything else from Yamaha eg Pistons, rings, powerhead gasket set, waterpump etc etc.WELL he advised he can supply it all. I can tell you he has saved us around $400.00 in parts compared with Yamaha.

So at the moment, my crank is in bits at Serco Brisbane awaiting all the parts to arrive there & the donk is in bits in my oldmans garage.

I know this long winded.

The point I am trying to make is, did the dealer or dealers really didn't know that the bearings could be sourced?? I have my suspicians, >:(
For $130.00 in parts that couldn't be sourced by a dealer to $1300.00 for a crank!!!!

I can tell you the bearings arrived in boxes named Yamaha Genuine parts :o :o :o >:(

The whole exercise is going to cost us about $1000.00, but if I let a dealer lead me down the golden path it would have ended up 2.5 times that :o :o :o

My next donk if I can help it will NOT be a Yamaha. No matter how big they claim their support network, it does us, the consumer no good, if the support network doesn't know their own product. #>:( >:( >:(

Smithy
02-08-2002, 05:43 PM
Heath what have you been doing? Obviously not much trolling - 440 hours on a '95 model. I have 467 on a '99 model 70 and your story has put the wind up me. Have heard two stories about how I should be treating my Yamaha - one by a dealer and one by an outboard wrecker. The dealer said I should be running a bit of extra oil in my fuel as the Yamaha injection system is a bit light on. This would extend engine life. He was also an OMC dealer and he agreed with me that the OMC was torqueyer and used less fuel. My previous motor was an '86 Johnson 60. I went with the Yamaha because of the weight factor and the internal oil bottle. The outboard wrecker who is also a competitor in the national Formula 1 Powerboat series said the gaskets should be replaced after a couple of hundred hours to extend engine life. On the parts side of things I had one mate that had Yamaha 70s on a cat and one was rebuilt by another national Formula 1 Powerboat racer (they really know their stuff) and they also a big wait for parts. Stuff had to come from Japan. As with all stuff associated with marine and fishing products it is hard to know what is truth and what it BS.

Heath
02-08-2002, 06:09 PM
Since the breakdown, I've read a lot of things about the Yammies,mainly from the USA. People have been haiving the same problem. After rebuiding the engines they have gone on to do triple the hours of the original breakdown & they have all gone back to premix. This is what we are doing also.
You are correct in saying the OMC engines hav more torque, especially from a standing start & parts & repair aren't such a big hassell either.

Cremated_Reddog
02-08-2002, 07:03 PM
#The outboard wrecker who is also a competitor in the national Formula 1 Powerboat series. #On the parts side of things I had one mate that had Yamaha 70s on a cat and one was rebuilt by another national Formula 1 Powerboat racer (they really know their stuff)


Hey Smithy, the first outboard wrecker wouldn't have been Matt from Arizona Outboards on the NSW CC would it?? and the guy your mate got to do his wouldn't have been Kurt Tsakonis? from Syd... if it was arizona tell em Reddog sent you they will look after you a bit better

jack_attack
02-08-2002, 09:11 PM
I may be a bit naive here, but why do you have to get new pistons and conrods? A dropped bearing in a normal (4 stroke) land based engine does not mean you need to replace conrods, gudgeons and pistons. Normally in that case you would get new bearings, get the crank linished or resized if the damage actually got past the bearing caps.

jaybee
03-08-2002, 04:01 AM
This past weekend my brother went throught the same thing but on a smaller scale with his 60 hp big foot. The PTT got water into n sizzled. He had been told down bruns when it played up once before you have to buy the whole unit $640. A mechanic at one of the marine places in mooloolaba said you can buy just the part you need but didnt have stock. So sent us of the a outboard recycler at maroochy. He said same thing can buy the part $110. He phoned his supplier not a problem would be in the mail COD tuesday. Come tuesday the supplier came back with "Mercury will only sell whole unit now" I chased around brisbane for him on Thursday only to be told unit is now superseded but the unit on the new motors is exactly the same and is $1,300. Any way with some advice from the outboard recycler (maroochy) and a local auto elec bruns they fixed the unit for $10.The outboard recycler was really helpful and if in need again he will be the first we contact . Paul (Pops) Malone 07 54436750. He is a straight shooter and refused to take a cent of my bro until the part turned up and he inspected it to make sure it was right.
cheers.

Jeremy
03-08-2002, 04:55 AM
Heath,

I am pretty damn sure which dealer you were talking about who gave you the problems. On Old Cleveland Road? I have used them for outboard servicing for the last 3 years since Hydro Marine at Newstead closed. They seems expensive and can be rude and arrogant, but they are the closest to me (Toowong) and their work seems fine.

Jeremy

Ron_Collins
03-08-2002, 05:41 AM
Hi Heath

I was sorry to read about your outboard and the on-going tribulations. I've owned a Yamaha for about eight years and it's never missed a beat. Neither has my little Mariner, which is due to be replaced because of old age.

You need to urgently talk with Yamaha Queensland manager Cliff Arnold on 07 3899 0888. Tell Cliff about the problems, who you are and what you do.

I'm certain he'll point you in the right direction. Keep me informed on how things progress. Ron Collins, Ed.

Heath
03-08-2002, 05:58 AM
I may be a bit naive here, but why do you have to get new pistons and conrods? A dropped bearing in a normal (4 stroke) land based engine does not mean you need to replace conrods, gudgeons and pistons. Normally in that case you would get new bearings, get the crank linished or resized if the damage actually got past the bearing caps.

Serco, who pulled my crank apart showed me how the pins & inside of the conrod ( big end) had been damaged. The pins were scored & the inside of the conrods on the big ends was pitted. 2 of the pistons had been gouged, it made no sence only to replace 2 pistons so I got all three. essentually now I have a brand new crank incl all the extras for well under the price of just the crank alone.

Heath
03-08-2002, 06:12 AM
Hi Heath

I was sorry to read about your outboard and the on-going tribulations. I've owned a Yamaha for about eight years and it's never missed a beat. Neither has my little Mariner, which is due to be replaced because of old age.

You need to urgently talk with Yamaha Queensland manager Cliff Arnold on 07 3899 0888. Tell Cliff about the problems, who you are and what you do.

I'm certain he'll point you in the right direction. Keep me informed on how things progress. Ron Collins, Ed.
Thanks for the contact Ron, I will get in contact with him. I suppose the only "good" thing that come of this is that Yamaha itself hasn't got any money out of me, except for the cost of the bearings. Everything else such as conrods, pistons, powerhead gasket set & water pump have been sourced out side of Yamaha for WELL below Yamaha's prices.

One thing I did forget to mention is that I did fire off an enquiry to Yamaha about this & their reply did state that the bearings could sourced & that some of their dealers obviously are unaware of this. My grudge in this whole this is towards the dealers that I requested help from who from the surface by the looks of it, just wanted to empty my pockets.

jaybee
03-08-2002, 10:06 AM
It appears today with outboards like cars there is no such thing as fixing things but rather spare parts replacement..an example when I was in the army a new series 2 landrover back then had carby probs..the corporal mech pulled the carby off to give to me to replace with a new one so the old could be sent away to be fixed. A retiring sergeant said to the corporal to fix it he didnt have a clue..the old guy fixed it in 10 minutes..this story doesnt help Heaths problem but it does prove that todays mechanics are nothing more then spare parts replacement people...which costs the public in the end ... :-[

landy1
03-08-2002, 07:50 PM
;Dhey Jaybee
now youve got me sarted. ah ex mil IIA's cant kill em with a big stick. i am driveing a 30+ year old landy and its a different world from my previous modern "reliable" engines. sure they have issues every now and then but theres a big difference in buying a new peice of fuel line or hub seal than in replacing three gearboxes in as many years. not pointing fingers mitsubishi.
but seriously hows the old saying, find a good mechanic and then buy him a carton of beer each christmas. its hard to find someone who isnt out to fleece you without personal references these days. ah well what goes around etc.
cheers

davo
05-08-2002, 03:54 PM
1995 must have been a bad year. I USED to own a 75hp Mariner. It was the worst motor ever!!! Water in the gearbox 3 times, a coil,stator coil, Oil tank level alarm failure and the list goes on. I wrote to Mercury and never got a reply. I also found out that on the 95'-96' models there were no trim/tilt spares. Seems the suppler went broke and the moulds etc.. for the rams were lost. After 5 Mercs no more.

Smithy
06-08-2002, 05:15 PM
No Reddog, the wrecker was Murray Smith from Hervey Bay. Murray used to do a bit of fishing and was in all of the fishing mags one time with a massive Dogtooth he caught over in Vanuatu or Fiji doing one of those Pakula schools. He bought my OMC off me when it was ready for a rebuild. The other bloke I was talking about was Graham Jeffers. Say no more, he knows his stuff - Team Castrol.

Heath
14-08-2002, 05:04 PM
Well, after sourcing all the parts, I picked the crank up last week & it looked like new. The boys got stuck into it on saturday & by the time I got home the donk was 95% completed, just the electrics to be connected. The job was completed by around 3:30pm on Sunday after noon & the donk was purring like a kitten.

Took her out today to run it in, it started first kick & never missed a beat for the next hour as I put it through its paces. so quiet now, you could be forgiven if you thought it was a 4 stroke. a little bit smokey now that we are running premix & also there is a bit more oil in there during the run in period. BUT its all good.
Just got to get that confidence back.

My mate Garry, has done a splendid job on the engine. THANKS MATE. ;)

jaybee
15-08-2002, 09:27 AM
Glad all worked out for ya heath..was talking to my bro his problem was minor compared to yours..he was saying a few years ago (don't know how many) someone (or heaps o people) got onto the prices tribunal board over outboard spares prices and after that most if not all dropped 50% but it appears with the gst they have hit the top end again..so maybe we should all be comtemplating hitting the tribunal again (on the internet)..surely gst cant raise a price of a PTT from $600 odd to $1300 with the excuse they have been outdated and one unit fits all.
cheers.