Some interesting stuff!!!

[Randall]

How was Fitzys deal outlining the massive potetial for our freshwater impoundments?

Awesome stuff. Bring on the 10kg+ Jacks and Big eyes in dams huh?

A lot of behind the scenes work has been happening to further the cause of this new species stocking.

I have visited the Gladstone area hatchery where they have about 40 Mangrove Jack Brood Stock in a big above ground pool. The average size of these fish is around the 60-70cm mark. Well fed and aggressive as hell!!! Gotta keep all fingers well out of thier strike range. I have fed them on more than one occassion and I can tell you, the water just "explodes" when you toss in a pilly!!! Awesome stuff to see.

Randall.

[seqfisho]

Yeah some of the stuff he was talking about was making me twichy, you would have to think twice about water sking with 60lb jacks and trevally roaming about :o ;D ;D :o

Lets hope the goverment beauracrats pull thier heads in and allow some more stocking and bring our dams up to there full potential, as I think Fitzy said that they are only running at 10% capacity.

Could you imagine Somerset and BP or Faust etc, being 90% better than they already are ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

More power to the stocking groups, they deserve every bit of support possible.

Glen

Eat Sleep FISH!!!!!!

[Brett_Finger]

Forrest,
i can tell you mate, fresh water fish stocking in QLD is very bloody luckey to have a man, the likes of Fitzy going to bat for it... :D

the future of stocking in QLD is looking good if the likes of this Man is anything to go by.

although the "head in sand", "Barra should stay in the north" , attitude of some members is down right discreminaty. >:( >:(
Hookin,Brett
( please forgive the poor spelling)

[Wesley_Pang]

Randall,

Sorry I could not get along to the soft plastic do.

Stocking impoundment is great news, but it is not the answer.

We have to preserve our wild saltwater fishery. We can not neglect the poor state of "natural" fishery, and try and compensate with a "man-made" impoundment fishery.

It will be a sad day when the only fish we can catch is in some dam.

Wes

[Randall]

Wes, you`ve missed the point.
By stocking Dams,(put and take fishery), relieves the pressure on the salty stuff to a degree helping to boltster numbers again. Of course, much work needs to be done with the pro-netters who rape fish nurseries,(our estuaries).
I dont see it as a "compensation", rather, a new work completely seperate from the salt. The salt needs a whole new set of caring anglers to pick up this ball. Currently, we have another set of committed anglers running with the freshwater ball.

Stocking in the salt is a bit about too little, too late. The repair of fishstocks will only be achieved by less pollution, banning pro-netters, and better resourses to monitor bag limits. Oh, and of course, lots of time.

Randall.

[Redback]

hi Randal you are right with time and less netting and polution it will heal
its just a shame that the stocking of impoundments on th sunshinecoastis grinding to a holt currenntly stocking of one impondment has ceased and another is only a page away from closing its books due to lake of Dedicated anglers onthe coast shine coast this might sound like a whinge but very serious indeed the local stocking group has only three
members
cheers cameron

[Fitzy]

All this info about the potential of our inland fisheries isn't the stuff of dream. Not the stuff of fairies, no little devils sitting on shoulders etc, etc, its cold hard facts.
New species of fish in our far under-utilised lakes have the potential to be multi-million dollar earners for the Sunshine State as well as giving us locals some of the best fishing going.

The nervous "Nervous Nellies" who are scared to do anything outside of maintain the status quo would have any future potential fish species for stocking knocked on the head, just in case they might eat another stocked fish.
Concessions are made to radical tree huggers even before proposals are put forward for consideration. They forget this it US who are the conservationists, not the renta crowd, tree sitting, ratbag element. It is quite obvious that many who are in a representative/consulative position for anglers in this regard have never been a union rep!
If they'd wake up & smell the coffee, they'd realise that bass already eat bass, yellowbelly eat bass, silver perch eat yellowbelly etc etc etc.
All the fish we stock are predators, they will eat anything that swims past them if they can fit it in their mouths. However this is most unlikely due to the massive amounts of docile bony bream, banded grunter, various gudgeons, gar, shrimps, crays etc etc that are far easier prey to catch.

The Translocation Policy in its current form I feel is totally unworkable & needs to be torn up & re-worked. If we were to start stocking our rivers/lakes anew from now, we would NOT be allowed to stock virtually any of the current species that we all enjoy today. This is how rediculously unworkable it is & an example of how it is being selectively applied, as if to comply with some hidden agenda.

In the December edition if Bush N Beach I've made public just one example of the crap this is going on in QFS freshwater research. I'm told the Minister for Primary Industries is well aware of this piece & questions ARE being asked. I eagerly await his reply.
More dirt is forthcoming. >:(

We have a big future in freshwater fishing in eastern & northern Australia, Qld was once leading the way, however this title could now be disputed. We only need to kock down a few hurdles (stuff jumping over them) before we can all benefit from them.
The sky is the limit!

Fitzy..

[Fitzy]

hi Randal you are right with time and less netting and polution it will heal
its just a shame that the stocking of impoundments on th sunshinecoastis grinding to a holt currenntly stocking of one impondment has ceased and another is only a page away from closing its books due to lake of Dedicated anglers on the coast shine coast this might sound like a whinge but very serious indeed the local stocking group has only three
members
cheers cameron
Top point Cameron. Without the community based stocking groups, there is no fishery. QFS won't do the work so if one group folds due to lack of support, then the waters they stock cease to have fish.

I would encourage everyone to become a member of their local stocking groups & play an active role in your own fishing future.
Most group's membership is nothing (or next to it). I'm sure they would love to have a representative from their local fishing clubs as well.

Its not hard work, yet very rewarding & there's lots to be learnt as well.

Cheers,

Fitzy..

[angelena]

up in gladstone last week some a######le turned the pumps off in the stocking tanks. >:( a lot of fingerlings were lost that day. Can't remember exact figures but will post the amount when i find out again.

[Randall]

At the Hatchery in Gladstone Angelena?

Randall.

[Jack_Lives_Here]

Sorry I couldn't make it Friday night - had a date with some bunnies down the New England.

Jacks in local impoundments - LUV IT!

I gotta say though, expensive exercise - new reels, line etc. TLD's, 24kg standup rods with 100lb braid. ;D ;D ;D WHOOO HOOO. 8) 8)

[angelena]

randall, yeah the hatchery near the bridge to the marina. they lost $15,000 dollars worth of fingerlings.It made front page news.

[Randall]

Wow!! I know the boys there quite well and I bet thier suitably pissed!!!

Was it an act of vandalism or just an accident?

You have to break into the complex to switch off pumps.

Randall.

[angelena]

i'm unsure I'll see if I can find out. Unfortunately my memory isn't that great. I think it was vandalism otherwise the paper probably wouldn't have been so interested.

[angelena]

In todays paper it says they caught the little b######d who did it. It was a 15yr old boy who broke in and has been charged for the deaths of $15,000 of barra fingerlings. Well at least they caught him but because of his age I wouldn't be suprised if all he gets is a fine and a rap over the knuckles. >:( >:( what I'd like to know is where the hell are his parents?

[Randall]

They should put him to work in the hatchery to pay for the damage he has caused!!

The shittiest jobs they can find. And right through the school holidays as well....that would make him think twice about a repeat performance!!

Thanks for the update Angelena.

Randall.

[blaze]

Hi Randall
I like your idea of punishment, it certanly fits the crime and maybe give this young fella some idea of whats it like to be responseable for ones own actions
cheers
blaze

[gruntahunter]

Gees I think you guys are a bit draconian, the poor kid probably has had a bad upbringing and shouldn't be held responsible 4 his actions . >:(

[blaze]

Hi grunta
suppose i am a bit tough because in this day and age why should one be responsable
cheers
blaze

[Vern_Veitch]

Fully support stocked impoundments and the way our native fisheries are going, it might be the only way that rec fishers can have a chance of catchin a decent fish or 2 to eat or release.
Can't agree with Fitzy over introducing fish to catchments where they are not native though. Take a look at what has happened in Europe and North America where fisheries have been wiped out by the introduction of species and/or strains that are non-native.
All sorts of reasons from outcompeting for food to introducing vermin and disease unwittingly to catchments where there is no resistance to the new infestation.
Can't happen in Australia? Oh really?
I'd rather not find out the hard way.
Vern

[Fitzy]

Can't agree with Fitzy over introducing fish to catchments where they are not native though.
Vern
What species and which catchments do you refer to Vern?
Barra & rivers that feed Moreton Bay perhaps?
That old cry has been dragged out more times that a Village People album at the Sydney Mardi Gras.
Those that believe that propoganda should read some history books and also take a quick browse through Ern Grants Guide to Fishes occasionally.

The fact that Qld Museum doesn't have a specimen taken from Moreton Bay doesn't mean they weren't/aren't endemic. It could simply mean they never caught one. They don't have a Jungle Perch from the Brissy River either, yet nobody disputes they are/were endemic.

Bet they also recon there were never any crocs in Moreton Bay either! ppphhhhtttttt
Pros in the southern bay area still capture the odd specimen occasionally.

Just setting the record straight mate.

If you were referring to another species &/or location then please let me know. I cannot think of any other example that I've endorsed that even remotely fits your description.

While ever the Translocation Committee &/or the Freshwater MAC allow the continued stocking of Murray/Darling species east of the Great Divide, I'll not be taking anything they say as even remotely responsible.
The selective application of the Translocation Policy makes a joke of every other decision they make.

What's good for the goose........

Cheers,

Fitzy..

[Brian]

What a waste of fingerlings but ...sorry have to say Don't always blame the parent which seems to be the case when a kid (including teenages) does something wrong. In many cases the parents are unaware maybe asleep and the kid / teenager slips out for a bit of fun with his or her mates. They do something BLOODY STUPID and everyone BLAMES the parents CRAP.

If the kid / teenager did it BLAME THEM not the parent all the time. I do agree with Randell they should be made to pay by working on thier holidays as i'm sure to take this away will teach them more that a fine WHICH in the end the parent ends up paying.

Brian

[gruntahunter]

I say cut his bloody fingers off and while you're at it cut off his dads d### for bringing him in to the world and as for his mum........ ::)
What sort of fish were they, I hope they weren't Jacks?
Only jokin Angelena! ;)

[Fitzy]

Agree with you Brian. My folks didn't have a clue where I was most of the time, day or night. I got home from school, jumped on bike, motorbike, horse or on foot & was gone (mainly out in the bush) until dark or well after. Weekends I was gone from Friday arvo until Sunday night. My parents were fine folks & pretty strict, I was just too bloody quick for them to catch. ;D
Yep, I got into trouble & got hurt several times, mainly doing stupid things.

Guess things haven't changed alot. ;)


Fitzy..

[Vern_Veitch]

Fitzy,
I agree fully that it is not only inconsistant but down right irresponsible to stock fish from western flowing streams into those that flow east and vice versa. Could result in the sort of cattastrophe that has occurred all too often in North America - all done originally with the best of intentions.
I personally do not know what you have proposed but would cation that just because a fish or 2 may have swum into an area outside its normal range does not make it endemic, I have a report of a great white shark caught many years ago in a shark net of Lucinda. As far as I can find out it is the only one ever reported that far north.
Early last decade a report was published expressing strong concerns about mixing different genetic populations in areas where they are abundant. Further research has poured cold water on the original concerns but if we are not sure, it is better to be cautious. A good example of how fish can spread is with carp and tilapia that seem to find their way to places where they could not have swum and no human would have carried them. Native fish in some circumstances can be just as much of a problem.
Since barra have been stocked in Tinaroo, sooties are much harder to find and small barra are notable by their apparent absence, beleived to be because the big ones are eating them. This theory is backed up by reports from aquaculture farms who go to great lengths to seperate barra size classes.
I personally cannot wait till they start stocking jacks into dams within their natural range - including the Brisbane catchments. But maybe I am being a bit careless on that issue in the hope that they will eat out most of the tilapia as well as providing great sport. We need to give it a try in a restricted area and make sure we leave it long enough to see what the results are before we jump in with both feet.
Our fisheries are too heavily impacted by habitat loss and modification, including some inappropriate dams and certainly by overfishing as well to be inadvertently making matters worse.
Perhaps I am over cautious.
Vern

[Brett_Finger]

Vern,
on another note, am interisting read in the latest Fisho re/ spottie macks.
who makes these stupid decissions??
Hookin,Brett

[Vern_Veitch]

Brett,
The Minister is normally the final decision maker although he can be over ruled by Cabinet. In general, the minister takes the advice of his department. Unfortunately, on Spoted Mackerel, they did not take the advice offered to them either in the stakeholder workshop or by the MAC.
It seems that either the Minister or a senior Fishery Manager made an arbitrary decision and ignored the advice.
Vern

[Fitzy]

Vern,
The beauty of stocking any catadromous fish is that if there's aver a problem in the future, simply stop stocking & all will revert to as it was pre-stocking.
The fishes life cycle & angling pressure will see them all gone in short order.
For those that don't know, catadromous fish need to migrate to salt water to breed & commonly move into fresh/brackish waters during their juvenile stage. Some adults then move back up into the fresh after spawning. These include bass, barra, trevallys, mangrove jack, jungle Perch, estuary perch & several mullet species. Eels only ever go to spawn once in the coral sea & then die after releasing their eggs into the offshore currents to be dispersed.

Cheers,

Fitzy..

[Fitzy]

Brett,

It seems that either the Minister or a senior Fishery Manager made an arbitrary decision and ignored the advice.
Vern

Surprise, sur-bloody-prise!!
Then they still get to say they went the public consultation path & attempt to throw it all back on our shoulders.

The worst thing that happened for Qld was Labor party winning a landslide election. No opposition gives them the power to do anything they like with nobody to question them.

Wish I had of voted conservative now. :'(

Fitzy..

[Vern_Veitch]

Unfortunately Fitzy, it has not worked that way in North America. Fish introduced were in many cases unable to breed but still lived long enough to threaten wild populations, and if a disease is introduced with the fish that is not native to the area or stream, that can last long after the fish are all dead.
Please do not get me wrong, I support stocking but it needs to be done properly and we have made a few mistakes in Queensland already.
Vern

[BOMBER]

Hi All,

Everytime Barra, Mangrove Jack or any such species is mentioned of being stocked South of about Gin Gin, certain sections of the fishing fraternity put up the the barriers and no amount of talking can get them to even consider these species in the SE corner of Qld. What if certain people in the community don't want to chase Bass and Yellowbelly etc everytime they go to a dam and don't want to travel minimum 4 hours North or too a small stocked pond on the Sunshine Coast what if they want to target a species outside of the ones in our S.E dams at present. Shouldn't they have a right to say not only what dams their monies are to be distributed too but what sort of Fingerlings there money should be used to purchase. This idea i am about to propose is probably over simplfying the situation but here goes. What if one dam in the SE was stocked with the species mentioned ie Barra, Mangrove Jack in particular, to fish here you pay not only for a SIP but a permit to fish this dam as well like we already do for Cressbrook, the fee would be more expensive of course say around $150.00 per year in the first year then revised after that initial year daily/weekly permits could be in the vicinity of say $50.00. The Sip scheme would also apply to this dam in the initial year to help with Fingerlings. The monies for the second licence ie the $150.00 per year or the $50.00 per day/week could go towards research etc at the dam. I realise that the next concern will be these species going over the wall in flood etc but whats to stop a net being installed at the bottom of this dam wall similar to Hinze.This is just an idea I had oneday whilst driving to Faust dam, I like catching Bass etc but really enjoy the buzz of Barra and believe that it would be an excellent draw card to our SE, we already have the best Bass impoundments why not Barra and jack as well.

Regards,

THE BOMBER

[Fitzy]

Vern,
You need to compare apples with apples. A major part of the problem in Seppoland was due to them hybridising & narrowing of gene pools. Many of their fish were then very susceptable to diseases as a result.
To quote one leading aquaculturalist
"if its a success they call it line breeding, its its a failure they call it in-breeding".

Here we're talking about stocking fish that are native/endemic to that system. Not about importing outside fish or playing god with Darwins theory of evolution.
Jacks, Barra, trevally & mullet are endemic to almost every coastal system on the Qld coastline. Thus there should be no problem with their stocking &/or diseases. We would only be introducing a disease that is already there & local fish should already have a natural immunity. #;D
However in the case of jungle perch, trevally & mullet there is no govt research presently being done. NOT GOOD ENOUGH!
The fellas at Gladstone hatchery are playing with mullet & have some big eye trevally brood stock ready to start playing with them.
In all other cases, there desperately needs some trials to be done, particularly in the SE corner, again this is not happening.
It seems ironic that many folks that are opposed to new species are still advocating the stocking of silver perch east of the Great Divide & even pushing for bloody Barcoo Grunter as well. How bloody stupid is that?

I agree that trials are needed, but with virtually none being done, our freshwater fisheries potential is stagnating.
Vern you & I have both read the stats, freshwater is one of the biggest growth areas of rec fishing. More work to develope new species should be a priority to match this growth.
There's plenty of food/room available in these underutilised lakes. There's plenty of anglers to target them. There's the ever increasing noxious fish threat to natives. Yet sutff all is being done to fix any of these problems.
The rec anglers are the jury in this debate & they are going to pass judgement pretty soon. Either we work for them, or we don't. Quite simple really. ;)

Fitzy..

[DR]

just digressing slightly, if jacks are stocked in local impoundments, & do reach the sizes that are expected, is there any chance they may take the odd jet skier or water skier ;D

well, maybe more than the odd one,

cheers

[Vern_Veitch]

In the USA, it was not just GM fish that caused problems, in many cases it was the same species from a different catchment with slightly different genetic make-up.
I agree fully with the research side of the house Fitzy but our research organisations and the committees that feed them are clearly biased towards getting outcomes that benefit the commercial sector.
You may not be aware but there is a lot more money spent on management and monitoring in fresh water by QFS than in salt water. This is despite about 75% of the effort being in the marine areas.
I am not suggesting that we cut back fresh but we are so far behind in research for salt water species that it is criminal.
Silver Perch and Barcoo Grunter should not be allowed in eastern flowing streams and it is management gone mad to even trial such a proposal. But 2 wrongs do not make a right and my previously stated view has not changed.
If barra are endemic to the Brisbane River, then we should be fixing the fishery management, water quality and habitat problems that are keeping them away. Whilst there may be some record of barra straying that far south, perhaps in a year of warm northerly currents, as previously stated, that does not make them endemic. How far upstream did they go and are the other fish who live up there resistant to the known virus carried by barra that impacts on and can kill fish in western catchments.
You may know the answer to that question but I have not been able to access that sort of detail.
At the end of the day Fitzy, you and I debating this issue will make no difference to the decision makers anyway. I have no input into freshwater issues but at the same time, I am concerned for the long term health of the fishery and we need to put a lot more effort into protecting our native fish and the places they live if our kids and their kids are to enjoy a lifestyle that we have been lucky enough to access.
Lots of big barra in a dam do not make a healthy fishery. They do not taste to flash out of fresh water at the best of times and fishing is more than just catch and release although that is my preference.
Vern