Fanatical garbage against rec fishing

[Scaly1]

Hi people

Please have a look at this link
http://www.westernangler.com.au/forum/Fishing_Sucks%21/m_60555/tm.htm

Its a discussion about this site
www.ningalooreefteach.com

The operators of this dive site have a severe anti-fishing bias-Here's an excerpt that has been removed from their site but there's plently of other misinformation and B.S to see

Fishing Sucks!


Fishing is boring, absolutely boring, just plain boring and just plain dumb. Most people fish because they are scared of the water, the animals and just don't understand how it all works down there. If they did then they would not inflict such cruelty on the animals.

Why sit uptop and dangle a hook doing the lucky dip thing, when you can get in amongst it and experience the animals in their world. It is astounding how much money some people spend to come here to see and catch a fish, when all you have to do is get in and go down and you can see and experience more fish and marine life than most people will see it their whole life. Not only tha,t but it's a whole lot more exciting, and the animals are left there for the next person to experience.

It's only a matter of time until the "lucky dip people" on the Ningaloo Reef and in Western Australia realize that there is much more money in showing people the animals than killing them. Killing & attacking the marine life will become like smoking- a bit silly.

Who would of said ten years ago that smoking will be stopped in Pubs, attacking the marine life for no other reason than for fun will go the same way.

Fishing is feeding the marine animals and conditioning sharks to associate boats and people with food. As more & more people come to Ningaloo Reef and get in the water to view the marine life, fishing bodies and operators may find themselves in court dealing with a shark attack victim's family, ie "the day defore you were fishing and feeding sharks near the local dive site - snorkel area were the shark victim was taken".

Times are changing!


www.fishinghurts.com

If you are planning on visiting Ningaloo reef, then make sure these guys are not on your list of where to spend your hard earnt dollars

Please email reservations@exmouthwa.com.au and voice your concerns that this type of person could be operating in a small town and damaging the lively hoods of other business.

Thanks for your time

[Daintreeboy]

crikey that's a bit radical! I wonder what they have to say about the people that dive and fish? Or Spear?
I also wonder what they eat for food? I hope it's not fish....ever.
There are some real fools about these days

[Scaly1]

Hi Daintreeboy

Yep- A sad state of affairs. Not only do we have to contend with Maine Park issues but we have these idiots operating in the same areas spreading lies and misinformation.


>:( >:( >:(

[toro1]

absolulety narrow mindedness on their behalf, think about all the coral thats been stolen from reefs, charter boats i think have stopped anchoring but what about dive boats, i bet they still throw thier anchor out when it suits them, what these people need to relise that one could easily attack their recreation, imagine if all the fishing community got together and decided that its about time that they are no longer allowed scuba dive, after all fishing has been around a hell of alot longer than what they do. also do they not relise that they are the ones swimming in the sharks habitat, a shark has a mind of its own , how can anyone blame anyone else for the actions of a shark, maybe by feeding the sharks they might be to full and they wont eat the next diver, so maybe they should be thanking us for what we are doing cause there might be more attacks. >:( >:( >:(

[Dug]

Save the carrots!

Save the broccoli !!

Shoot a vegetarian ;D

[Maria]

Honestly, that reads like it has been written by a school student. I'd be extremely worried if that article was written by anyone who occupied some position of authority.

Ben

[el_carpo]

No problemo mi amigos. Arguments with divers are easily solved. "Drop depth charges!" Ka-booooooooooom! :o

Just kidding. Just kidding.

Just say, "Shut up! That's why!" when they start messing with you, asking why you fish. THEN you drop the depth charges. ;D

E.C. ;)

[PinHead]

I hate to say it..but you have given the author of that dribble some credibility by posting it on here and discussing it..If they see it on here, they will be pleased that is has gotten attention.

[Kendall]

I have been fishing and diving for over 20 years now and enjoy both equally and also plan to go to Ningaloo reef next year to do both.
I have travelled to various parts of the world and done both sports and have seen the ill effects of both, and the minority of cowboys that participate in both.
But on the other side I have seen a lot more people take their chosen activity very seriously. They enjoy what they do and they work hard to ensure that what they do has minimum impact and is there for future generations.
No disrespect Pinhead but sites like this that do discuss these sort of reports (as ridiculous as they may be) might just allow the authors see that anglers are just as passionate about what they do as the divers, and as long as everyone follows the rules (even though some are hard to comprehend) set in place concerning their chosen activity, then it will be there for a long time to come.
I do agree that the article posted here is a very narrow minded view, but after reading a few of the other reports written in the www.ningalooreefteach.com website. They do have some well researched articles. They do warn on their home page that it is their opinion and theirs only.
What would be good to see is that any retort from anglers be constructive and founded and not based on narrow minded views or slander.
As I said I am passonate about both sprts and do what ever I can for the benifit of both.

[Kerry]

....They do warn on their home page that it is their opinion and theirs only....

And a typical (sucking) opinion that shone thru in many of the GBR zoning submissions and meetings. Divers (coomerical operators especially) do appear to think there is one rule for themselves and another for everybody else.


Cheers, Kerry.

[Derek Bullock]

The return of PETA.

Don't discount any of this stuff. They are a force to be reckoned with and they are about to descend on us big time. This may well be the start of it.

Maria - I expect that was written by a very highly knowledged professional and done in a way to make it look simple.

Pinhead - on this occasion I totally disagree with you. This is the start in Australia of an ongoing battle that has already been lost by fishers overseas in some areas.

Those of you who are interested, and you all should be, I would suggest you go to http://www.fishinghurts.com/ and subscribe to the PETA Newsletter to keen up with what they are proposing to do. It's a free online newsletter but I would suggest you set up a yahoo email address to do it as you can expect to be hit with all sorts of things.

Below is a quote from PETA


What’s wrong with catch-and-release fishing?

Have you ever seen an injured dog who has been hit by a car or a cat who’s been seriously hurt in a fight? Unless they are treated by a veterinarian, these animals are likely to die from their injuries. Fish are no different: A hook through the mouth causes a serious and extremely painful injury that is often fatal without treatment. But anglers just toss injured fish back into the water—often without realizing what they’ve done.

In addition to the wounds that are caused by the hook, fish released after being caught can suffer from loss of their protective scale coating, dangerous build-up of lactic acid in their muscles, oxygen depletion, and damage to their delicate fins and mouths. Upon being returned to the water, these fish are easy targets for predators and other fishers. Researchers at the Oklahoma Department of Wildlife Conservation found that as many as 43 percent of fish released after being caught died within six days. Catching fish is cruel and unnecessary, whether they are killed on the spot or thrown back into the water, injured and exhausted.

I can see this being the fight of the century for groups like The Fishing Party.

Cheers


Derek

[nonibbles]

What really gives me the shirts about these sort of comments is that somebody who dislikes a particular activity and therefore does not participate in that activity proposes to have a valid opinion on that activity. I like the odd snorkel, I would like to scuba but I think my health now rules me out, I love the undersea world. But because I do not have enough knowledge of those activities, I keep my opinion too myself about supposed activities/arrogance and ignorance of activities I know nothing about. But I do know what a d!ckhead is and it aint the fisherman in this instance.

[dazza]

hi all,
Derek has nailed it, we all should be very interested in what these guy's are crapping on about. Much closer to alot of our own backyards is an organisation called "save the bay" this mob would have all rec fishing stopped in the bay tomorrow, they activley lobby govt constantly (squeeky wheel) on all sorts of matters. last time i was on their site they had a few articles that PETA had put out, it is in our backyard and if we want to stop the rot, we all need to get active to protect out great pastime
cheers
dazza

[kc]

Derek has hit it on the head. I have just fininshed drafting an article for a couple of fishing mags on this very issue. The clear target of groups like PETA is Catch & Release and it will be the fight for the very survival of rec fishing as a mainstream activity....as opposed to the relm of a marginalised few.

So much of the closures have been driven by a similar agenda, wrapped in green paper and "sold" to the non fishing public as sound environmental management.

Recreational fishers are the next "duck hunters" and until the government comes to fear the rec fishing vote, more than the green vote, we are on a hiding to nothing.

We even know how the ultragreen movement will go about it and the tactics that will be used. (Which I am happy to talk about privately but am not going to post, based on how they did it in Germany where C & R , Live Baiting and all form of fishing competitions are already banned).

What price a second hand tinny in about 5 years time??

KC

[DR]

mmmm, if only.. every now & then........

[charexblue]

[smiley=wut.gif] [smiley=wut.gif] re original feeding fish from boats ??? ??? when watching fishing shows that include WA it appears as though the boats feeding the fish are the tourist boats attracting fish to their boat [smiley=laola.gif] [smiley=cowboy.gif] ::) who is going to sue who ??? what did he write again "the rec fisher was it " [smiley=guitarist.gif] [smiley=guitarist.gif] ahh well sounds like a usual screwed up statement // makes a fella tired it does // ohh need bait for some big crocs anybody know what nice juicy plump expert bait to use and what web site to get some ;D ;D just joking
all the best peter

[mariner_22]

Recreational fishing is the most popular hobby in Australia and with a large amount of these people owning watercraft imagine the loss of revenue to these companies who produce boats and outboards not to mention the loss to the tourism industry particularly inareas such as the cape that rely heavilly on recreational fisherman as a source of income. Don't worry guys it will be a cold day in hell when a government puts a ban on recreational fishing.

mariner 22

[kc]

Ahh! Mate, I have some news for you....they have already.

33% of NQ is now no fishing. 1800 kilometers of the Queensland Coast north of Bundy is either no fishing or restricted fishing. A KPMG report ino the effects on these closures is NQ is putting the figure in excess of $100M a year.

If you make it too hard, too many rules, too damn difficult people just stop fishing....fact!!

Great Sandy Straights is now being zoned, Morten Bay is next. Bryon Bay is GONE, an area stretching from Montague Island to Ulladula is next batter up in NSW.

Fishing is being banned in all know Grey Nurse habitat.

The government will do whatever it wants to do and as long as they think the green vote is bigger than the fishing vote it will continue to force closures.

Yes this is big business but if, through a long and carefully planned startegy, recreational fishing is depopularised among our young and marginalised with the constant "overfishing" propogander.....how long till it just fades away and becomes a very marginalised and socially unacceptable passtime?

The government (federally) is prepared to pay the $300M to the recreational fishing industry it will take to "restructure" the industry in NQ. Sales of boats, outboards and tackle are down as much as 40%, not because the government has totally banned fishing but because the zonings have, in effect, made it far less popular.

It is all about death by 1000 cuts and we are heading the same way as Germany..interestingly the birthplace of Green politics.

KC

[MulletGuts]

Quote "Most people fish because they are scared of the water, the animals and just don't understand how it all works down there"
::) ::) ::)

Yeah.... I think we're all scared when we go out....... and if you're not... you should be!!! Some of those 'pin whiting... why they'd take a leg off....

not to mention the sole down that way, hey Beefaman.

Might be why I surf fish most of the time. But then, you can't get too close to the water to cast. I prefer to hide in the trees and wait for the fish to beach themselves.

[squidgiepalmer]

may i ask who kill grey nurse sharks :-X no one knows but i do and the were flippers
Cheers Squidgie Palmer

[mariner_22]

To KC the reason for the closure of these areas is to preserve our fish stocks and I take great pride in the catch and release method. My comment was directed at the overall act of a person being banned from picking up a fishing rod throwing it in the water and fishing when you think about how much fishable water we have compared to the areas closed there really is no comparison and to those who give up the sport because of a few closed areas are not really true to the sport. I live in south east Queeensland and I can only think of 2 very small closed areas, which reitterates my point about the lack of closed areas.

Mariner 22

[straddie]

Fishing Sucks - It looks so much like that was written by a 15 year old girl with nice warm fluffy "everything is beautiful" outlook of life that I can't see why anyone would bother about it. The big nasty real world will open their eyes up to how things really work soon enough.

That quote from PETA holds a hell of a lot more weight and should be what we fishos should be more concerned with.

[bidkev]

I wouldn't worry about it. If the author speaks as badly as he's written, only illiterates would listen to him..........and they'd probablty be bored to tears anyway :-)

kev

[bidkev]

<snip>

It is all about death by 1000 cuts and we are heading the same way as Germany..interestingly the birthplace of Green politics.

KC

As I've pointed out before, Hitler's National Socialists were "prime movers" in the advancement of the Green Movement. Anyone who's got the time to do a google would be appalled at how the right wing groups in America and Europe are using the Greenies and vice versa.

And they tell me that democracy is alive and kicking......WHAT!!!!!! when such a minority group can have *so* much say! What tickles me is that all those "lefties" swinging from trees have absolutely no idea what they're caught up in.

cheers

kev

[Draco]

Oh my god........ first i had to laugh at what was written in that article , in fact my ribs are still sore from laughing..

The authour of it has every right to be stupid, just as long as he doesnt abuse the priviledge !!

[Volvo]

Trouble is that a lot of these closures and ongoing restrictions are going ahead with the BLESSING of Rec Fisho's :(..
So,maybe till time comes where one sez "Its my right to be able to go catch a feed" (without rapin n pillaging offcourse) we will still be lookin at what we may have lost in ten years time??...
The indiginous sector claim their born rights, why cant you n i??..
And for once agree with Derek :-X...
Cheers

[kc]

I think Mariner 22 you might be missing a point here. Your comment "I take great pride in the catch & release method" is the very thing which will and is making us a target.

Q : How do you justify injuring/hurting/causing pain/causing stress to a poor defenceless animal for your own personal gratification???

Hard question to answer hey!

For the record TFPQ supports marine sanctuaries/No Take Zones BUT they need to be justifiable. Clearly closed seasons and no take areas can and do have benifits for fisheries under pressure but what is the point of a closure ie the Grey Nurse lock-outs when evidence suggests there is no impacts by recreational fishers AND other impacts are allowed to continue.
As an example we absolutely support the barra closed seasons because it is good science, good sense and the stock was under pressure. On the same analysis we absolutely oppose the reef fin fish closures because the science is wrong, 33% is already protected forever and the stocks are not under pressure...........the reef fin fish closures are a PR stunt, the barra closures are a great benifit. The pro have quotas...they don't care, all the fin fish closures are doing is locking out recs, stuffing tackle shops for 3 weeks(during some of the best weather of the year) and all to protect a fish not in trouble, only 6% of which actually attend a spawning aggregation & all bred in September this year, when the closures hit Oct, Nov & Dec??????

There are now reams of evidence, hard core science, regarding the health of the GBR fishery and the lack of impacts by recreational fishers yet, at the behest of the green lobby, 33% was closed to rec fishing and an additional amount restricted. Happy to provide copies of both Mapston et al and Ayling et al or go to the reef crc website and read technical report 52.

It is all well and good to be living in the SE corner and lable people in the North who have given up as being "not true to their sport"...hard core nuts..like me...don't give up.

It is the 3 times a year Mum, Dad & the Kids who have given up because it has all been made too difficult, to risky and too confusing..the net effect of this on industry has been substantial.

This will also be the case when Morten Bay and GSS are zoned. Hard core fishos will not give up but occassional fishers will, families will, and holiday makers will go elsewhere.

The message (subliminal) will be, recreational fishing is tolerated but not really welcome........(so take your caravan & go somewhere else....or don't take your kids fishing......or don't join a fishing club etc etc).

Hard core fishos will keep fishing but "we" are not the bulk of the sport or the bulk of the financial contributors. We may be the bulk of Ausfish posters but are not really representitive of the sport in general.

KC

[Kerry]

C&R is deemed by many organisations trying to curtail fishing (in general) as absolutely no different as some want things entirely banned be it C&R or whatever so the sooner C&R people see themselves in the same light as ALL recreational fishing comes under the same banner, the shutdown, closure, Zone it banner brigade.

So in the overall scheme of these things lets not differentiate C&R is any different as a recreational fishing activity.

Cheers, Kerry.

[cooky]

I'd say from the PETA b**lsh*t and that ridiculous "fishing sucks" article that C&R has MORE to fear than fishing in general.

It's fishing as a SPORT they seem to be targetting, not 'fishing' so much. C&R is easier to attack than fishing for food in my opinion. I support C&R, however I just think it's an obvious choice for policital attack from these groups. PR spin can easily brainwash the public into thinking it's an absolutely disgraceful practice - can just imagine the advertising campaign using NEMO and friends being release half f**ked back into the water. LIke the fool said who wrote that article, you'll be compared to smokers - probably be worse off actually - leper like.
I can just imagine fisherfolk hiding their rods / tackle boxes in the future and hanging wakeboards / tubes in CLEAR view. The neighbours will say "nice weather today, enjoy yourselves" and you'll sheepishly say "yeh got to take advantage of this 'skiing' weather". You'll be fishing off the coast in the middle of nowhere anchored, spot another boat coming your way and quickly pull anchor so to avoid the embarrassment of participating in such a cruel and disgusting practice.

[cooky]

Peta - interesting. I just had a quick look at the fishinghurts.com web site you referenced earlier in this post. If you click on the Peta web sites link down the very bottom of the page it is incredible how much funding these guys must have (very very scary). There would have to be over 200 Peta web sites on varous topics and I clicked on a random sample and they are all high quality (expensive). I'm talking millions of dollars of web development and technology. These guys are obviously generating some SERIOUS funds from somewhere and have some backers with deep pockets.

[cooky]

For example, in 2003, the Norwegian Parliament banned operations that maintain fish ponds where people can pay to catch fish. Catching fish just to throw them back is a cruel and inexcusable "hobby," and Norwegians should be commended for realizing that fish feel pain and value their lives, just like the dogs and cats who share our homes.


found proof of my recent post - "cruel and inexcusable "hobby"' - PR material. It will only take a few years before majority of people in Norway are brainwashed and can't remember why they ever wanted to C&R. Human nature is to adapt and we adapt very quickly. Society will be convinced it is cruel and disgusting and similar to wearing motorbike helmets or speeding or public drinking - it will be difficult to even think of an argument any other way.

"can you believe motorbike riders used to ride bikes without helmets - idiots!, can you believe people used to fish C&R - barbaric fools!"

This is Germany and Norway - I wonder if 5 years ago the fishing community said things like


Don't worry guys it will be a cold day in hell when a government puts a ban on recreational fishing

[Volvo]

:)Well said Kerry..Today it maybe C&R, tomorrow the charteries, Wetsuit brigade n then back to the catch for a feed brigade..Unlesss we stand together proteccting a passtime/recreation ???, the handcuffs will get tighter fer sure..
How many years back since there were hardly any restrictions??..
My fishin party sticker stays where it is :) cause i fish n i vote...
Cheers

[agnes_jack]

Hey Cooky
From what I have been led to believe, PETA has a lot of it's funds supplied by some of the very high profile hollywood actors and prominent figures such as prince charles etc. Its not just the hippies we have fighting against our sport and lifestyles. :-/

Regards, Tony :-/

[DR]

if you go to the original post & read the westernangler thread, you will see it,s about a 'dumb shiela' ( yes, i say that with a lot of disrepect') who is doing a bit of self promotion in the local area for her dive charter. hopefully it's going to backfire on her with all the other local charters & she gets what she deserves.

[cooky]

she must be dumb if she thinks Scuba enthusiasts don't like fishing, spearing, etc. I don't know too many that don't enjoy their water sports (fishing). Even a good friend of mine who was with GBRMPA and dived for them as part of his job, now with Fisheries LOVES fishing.

She must be a ding bat

[Kerry]

But then peta once ran a campaign that milk on breakfast cereal should be banned, hurts the cows and all that sort of intelligent stuff this mob generally surface with.

Might have lots of funds but trying to ban milk on the cornflakes then one really has to wonder about this mob, especially when they suggested beer as an alternative, beer on the cornflakes ::)

Oh yeah these are a very dangerous (pathetic) mob but the worst is yet to come.

Cheers, Kerry.

[cooky]

especially when they suggested beer as an alternative, beer on the cornflakes

now I'm starting to like them ;D

[nisrol]

WHY DOES'NT SOMEBODY TELL THESE BL@@DY IDIOTS THET SOME OF US HAVE CONDITIONS THAT DON'T ALLOW US TO GET DOWN AND DIRTY WITH THE FISH.


AND YES THIS HAS GOT ME PI$$ED AS THIS SHOWS IGNORANCE TO THOSE OF US ON PENSIONS THAT LIKE TO GET OUT THERE.



cheers andy

[Boxhead]

A typical oxygen thief scuba diver thinks they have ownership over whereever they dive.... you see it everywhere..... look at the whole grey nurse shark bullshit.... the GNS probably got the shits with all the yuppies poking cameras in their faces, so, they simply went elsewhere.... and good luck sueing someone because a family member was munched.... the responsibility for the diver llies with the charter operator who of which can't count anyway (see: Open Water).

The sooner these people become an entree or a main meal the better..... [smiley=behead.gif] [smiley=behead.gif] [smiley=hanged.gif] [smiley=rifle.gif] [smiley=wut.gif]

Nath...

[Boxhead]

Ants and Cockroaches have feelings to........ Hug one..... it's a spiritual experiance...

Nath....