Maybe we should take a tougher approach

[blaze]

Any one see 60 minutes in regard to the the illegal fishing in the northern part of aust (or the southern parts they chased half way around the world.)
Just seems to me we spend a lot of resources targeting local fisho's (rightly so to), but out of 8000 boats up north they captured 200?
Lets not get emotive about the answers (not related to drugs etc, they done this, we should do this) but surely our fisheries and armed forces should have standing orders to disable any illegal boats in our waters. (i mean to say one got away with sharpened bamboo sticks)
Howard talks the talk about protecting our borders but does not walk the walk, who is he bowing to on this one slurp slurp. read into that what ya like
cheers
blaze

[sackrash]

Hi blaze,

refer to something should be done and get back to me, Im more than happy to represent ausfishos

rashy

[Thunderbird]

Saw the program and was amazed at how an old shitty boat with bamboo spikes can get away from a navy ship.
They should be able to fill their boats with lead.

[Volvo]

You said it in a nutshell Blaze..Shoulda shot the arse out of that Boat they showed..Do it to a few and wander how many more would run the gauntlet!!??..
They is taxdollars thats spent allowing such aceholes to make a mockery of us..
Cheers

[bugman]

Volvo, That new Avatar is pretty scary :o

Blaze,

I'm at a loss as to why they would chase that boat for over a day and still fail to apprehend it. Even the captain of the Navy ship said" they've attempted to ram us" as the fishing boat crossed in behind them at one stage.

Surely that is enough for those higher than the captain to allow him to take the measure neccesary to put a halt to proceeding. Let's not worry about going out in the rubber duck to board the boat. Pull along side in the patrol boat - break their bloody bambo spears and keep nudging them until they see the error of their ways. If they continue to try and avoid they face the consequences of 100 tone of steel agains 15 tonne of ricky wood. Then use the rubber duck to go back and pick up those that are left floating the water.

But let's face it - unless we build another 20-30 boats and keep a massive amount of staff and resources patrolling the area - it's only window dressing >:(

Bugman

[gunna]

That was disgusting wasn't it. As was MacDonalds sidestepping the question. Even blind freddy would know that once the illegal fishos start radioing other boats that the got away by refusing to stop then word will get around fairly quick. The only doubt on the process is whether the Navy didn't want to get fair dinkum with the 60 Minutes cameras onboard. Maybe in other situations they might have taken some action. Lets hope so or it will be even more open slather than it is now.

[Fisher_Boats]

It's a bit of a worry alright..They are on our doorstep, even camping on the beach.
Pretty embarrassing being beaten by some bamboo poles.
As Brett said ram them with the bigboat that would snap their bloody poles off. ::)
Chase them for a day and a half and then lose them ,pretty useless and expensive exercise.
It makes you wonder alright
My two bobs worth

Col

[blaze]

maybe be smaller hi speed pursuit vessels, able to get in position better, armed with 50mm. dont like to say it, but maybe a bit like the yankie coast guard. Rest assured you could run 20 smaller boats for the cost of one of the bigger ones. If you think of it a bit like the land coppers never pursuing there would be more trouble than there is now.
I will even go up there, month on month off, you wouldnt see them escaping.
Idont agree with the death penalty
When caught
jail them all for 6 months BUT each day they are in jail use one of their bamboo canes and give them 5 lashes, make them burn there own boats, then fly them back home to tell there story and send there goverments the bill for taking good care of their nationals

I am going to send the minister an email, yeh I know it probable wont get read but at least I will have tried
cheers
blaze

[major-defect]

What have they got a gun on the nose for???If they don't intend on using it.

[bidkev]

Pretty scary that the navy can't/won't take appropriate action. I wonder if the pollies really think the diplomatic row will be worth the protection of our fish stocks.

One things for sure in my book........they should have more balls like those plucky little icelanders. They only owned one old minesweeper but back in the days of the cod wars when they proclaimed a 100mile zone, they made sure they bloody defended it. The british Navy went out to protect the UK trawlers who had always fished a 50 mile zone, but when it came to the crunch, they were useless. The Icelanders put a shot over the bow of a British Frigate ;D and the bugger withdrew ;D Some of the British trawlers had more guts and continued fishing without navy protection. After a few of their boats were impounded by the Icelanders, it soon stopped. If you're in the right, then you're in the right and should defend it to the death. ..........Of course, it may just be that this bloody gov't ain't sure if it's in the right. It perhaps doesn''t want to be seen as "Imperialist Whiteys" using "gun boat diplomacy"

cheers

kev

[Az]

I was about to start a thread on this also, damn disgraceful and unfortuantely I don't see the australian government assisting any further as they feel they are already making inroads into the problem... BS!

It was disgraceful the navy couldn't even board that ship due to the metal poles they put out the side, doesn't send a very strong message! sink the bastards then and there!

Props to the local aussie fisherman who boarded the illegal fishing boat himself!!

[Fisher_Boats]

Be better off with solid fenders around the boats like the Hong Kong police use. Closed cell foam with a polyurethane coating. The Brissy water police have one as well. Rubber duckies just aren't tough enough for the bamboo poles ::)
That,s me in the far one with mackmauler as a decky ;D ;D

[Volvo]

;)Should be Brett , spent enough time trying to ge the little fella lookin like that lol..
As for the post, lets hope we is not afraid of upsetting the Indonesians ey :-?..
They sure arent worried about upsettin us..
Cheers

[Big_Kev]

Am I just a redneck or was everyone else itching to get on that 50 and drill some holes in the ice boat along the waterline?

[Commodore]

Dead right Volvo,
The fisherman and their government couldn’t give a stuff, so we get a few boats, burn them, fly them home so they can built a better boat and come back again…. >:( :o :-?
I support the local guy going vigilantly style and stopping these thieves and protecting his patch, could make an interesting holiday destination ;), bring own 50 cal. Weapon, heaps of targets plus great fishing…. ;) ;)I’m with you Real Hard.
Seriously, this is a great concern and what if you reversed the situation and it was our fisherman going into say NZ waters, do you think the NZ government would be having a word to ours? Do you think Aus Gov would take action immediately?? :o :-[
If we as Aussies are going to play by the rules, and mostly respect our closest neighbours rights, plus give $$$$ in aid, and they come here a treat our home like its theirs, without respect or invitation, then we need to take much stronger action.
WE GOT BIG GUNS, USE THEM. :-X

[theoldlegend]

Seems to me that John Howard and his mob will do just about anything to keep the Indos happy. Didn't he throw $1.8 billion at them after the tsunami?

Yeah sure, we see a few boats caught and burnt on the beach, looks good, but I really think they really aren't too concerned about this whole illegal entry into Australian waters etc by Indo fishermen, but when it's illegal immigrants, then there's some mileage in that for them.

The number of boats and personnel they've provided for our northern waters is an absolute joke.

TOL

[Commodore]

The other big concern as pointed out in the show was the fact they carry other livestock to our shores… >:(we have enough ferral animals as it is let alone ones with foreign diseases. :o Just as well we stopped shooting crocs, great natural defence system. :D

[Spaniard_King]

Hey Guys,

I would suggest that not too many get away 8-). The Navy boys had to pull it up with the cameras watchin ;)


Garry

[land-lubber]

dont know if u guys picked this up, but the navy bloke did mention in passing that there is new equiptment on the way that will help them to deal with these robbing mongerels. as i said in the fisheries officer post, im a crack shot at 1000 yards, id be happy to shoot holes in these boats below the water line [smiley=rifle.gif]

[Owen]

It'd be funny if it wasn't so sad :(
I didn't see it and I'm kind of glad I didn't.
I once saw a documentory on the US Coastguard approach.
They bailed up a wooden trawler crossing from Cuba.
They warned it twice to stop - each time getting the "no speaka english" reply.
They they put a call out over the loud hailer saying "Clear the bridge we are about to open fire in 5 seconds"
Amazingly a whole bunch of people learned english immediately and bailed out.
When the five seconds were up they literally cut the bridge off the old trawler with a twin .50 browning.
Needless to say the captain of the boat then decided to allow it to be boarded ;)

I'm sure our navy guys would be more than happy to do the same if the pollies took the shackles off them.

cheers,

Owen

[harry_h01]

I saw the program last night and I shook my head.

The captain of the navy ship stuffed up. He should of come along side and used his bigger steel boat to break the bamboo poles, or sat in behind the other boat and forced it sideways with his bow wave.

When I was working for my previous employer they put forward a suggestion to the governement to cover this very issue. It involved a number of satellites, boats and shore based radars. Very effective and it sealed off the whole top end to any one trying to come in. You could track a boat from the moment it crosses the line through to where ever it went or was going, and the sat coverage could even identify when they were fishing etc.

So what did the government do - sorry would cost to much and we are not ready for it yet. Quote "Also there isn't that bad a problem up there for us to go spending so much money on".

So now 60mins picks it up and the governement is looking to cover themselves again.

Go figure.

Harry

[Az]

they're taking over $100k worth of sharkfin and other fish from our waters each trip, yet only cop a $27k fine, obviously the penalty isn't harsh enough!

[Louis]

What a disgrace.

The world looks at Australia as a soft touch---sees it as a sign of weakness---and uses and abuses us for it.

When will our politicians wake up.

The navy in this instance needs the right to be able to shoot holes in these vessels at the waterline.


Louis

[bidkev]

What a disgrace.

The world looks at Australia as a soft touch---sees it as a sign of weakness---and uses and abuses us for it.

When will our politicians wake up.

The navy in this instance needs the right to be able to shoot holes in these vessels at the waterline.


Louis

Louis, that'd take too long for 'em to sink and allow the buggers to take to the life rafts! :o Don't you mean *below* the waterline? ;D

kev

[Lucky_Phill]

Not sure on international protocol regarding other countries nationals tresspassing and breaking another countries laws, but maybe it's about time, Australia, as a Nation with some clout, started to adopt the," shoot first and ask questions later " approach.

Haven't seen the program, but have seen similar and know of the situation. Just today, in the press, That Uraguian boat chased and caught after a 2 weeks, for illegal Patagonian Fish poaching, was found not guilty in Australias Supreme/ High court. WTF ?

Keep the topic alive, and if you are keen enough or can spare a couple of minutes in your lifetime, people. Email, write and or phone you r Federal Member.......................Just do it !

Cheers Phill

[bidkev]

Saw the front page of the courier mail whilst standing in the supermarket queue. Didn't get to read it properly but I think it said something about the pro fishers offering their services to be the navy's eyes and ears up north. Gonna try and read about it online in a minute.

kev

[szopen]

I know it might sound a bit out of place.
I live in another country and I have not seen the show.

Reading through some of the posts above.

Regarding the firing of guns at a foreign boat in such siutuation.

Just imagine what would happen if Navy actually fired.
Bullets would hit.
A couple of teenage boys (lets say 12-13 years old) on the boat got hit and killed.

Everything over 20k worth of fish.

I know it is an extreme situation but also something to bear in mind.

And what would be said if it was an Aussie boat not fishing but accidentally crossing into another country waters.

Not such a simple thing as "shoot them all and let God sort them out" is it?

[Dave]

Yes I did see the show. What an absolute disgrace. This is our taxpayer dollar following this little tub around for no results. I totally agree with the shoot first ask questions later resolve. Sink the boat where it sits then use the rubber ducky to pick up anyone left floating, then straight onto the first plane back home. hopefully this might be a deterant for the rest. That is why they are using such shi##y little boats, if they do get caught it's no big loss, go back home and the drug lords will buy them a new one to keep going. Imagine if we were to refuse to stop for a fisheries inspection. Do you think they would just give up. Not likely, and that might be for one to many snapper or pearlies, not half a boat load of shark fin.

Does anybody know if you can do an electronic petition. that way we could sign the petition with our ip then when plenty of signatures someone prints it out and send it off. Could be a very productive tool.

Thats my 2 cents worth.

Dave

[Big_Kev]

I know it might sound a bit out of place.
I live in another country and I have not seen the show.

Reading through some of the posts above.

Regarding the firing of guns at a foreign boat in such siutuation.

Just imagine what would happen if Navy actually fired.
Bullets would hit.
A couple of teenage boys (lets say 12-13 years old) on the boat got hit and killed.

Everything over 20k worth of fish.

I know it is an extreme situation but also something to bear in mind.

And what would be said if it was an Aussie boat not fishing but accidentally crossing into another country waters.

Not such a simple thing as "shoot them all and let God sort them out" is it?
#



You are speaking of people refusing to go by the law in our country and acting in an agressive manner snubbing our law enforcment.
These people are only to proud to shoot our boy's and girl's for the sake of thier laws.

[blaze]

ok this is the first of many emails I have sent, supplied with all the info to get the most responce. I have not done a draught of my email as I think every body should put there own personel responce to it. I did note though on some of the email links I will post they do say if the question is not in regard to your postcode location it wont be answered (good way to junk a lot of emails)
this is the link to email the Prime Minister
cheers
blaze

http://www.pm.gov.au/email.cfm

Email your Prime Minister
Thank you for your message to the Prime Minister.

Your message was successfully transmitted.

If you entered a valid email address, you will receive an email within 24 hours acknowledging receipt of your message. If you do not receive the receipt, this may mean there is a problem with the email address you provided.

If you have supplied a postal address, a reply may be sent to you via Australia Post. Your message may also be forwarded to other Federal Ministers for their consideration.

If you have any problems with this service please contact the Web Administrator.

[blaze]

some more links

fisheries@daff.gov.au
http://www.maff.gov.au/contact-us.html
http://www.mffc.gov.au/contact-us.html
http://www.psmaff.gov.au/contact-us.html

[Dug]

I did not see the program but if the navy can get close fire hoses are a non lethal method of stopping small ships.

It makes a joke of Howard and his border protection policies, If it will win votes he is interested, if it is just protecting Australia and Australians then who cares. :-[



Thus endeth my rant :-X

[blaze]

I am not advocating blowing them outa the water, but the vessel on 60 minutes could have been stopped. If it takes a few shots to slow them down, even at the risk of taking a life, so be it. If our vessel were fishing in their waters I think their responce would have been different (they seem quite quick to pull the trigger.

The Fishing Party

where are you on this one ( not having a go but you are supposed to be the party reprosenting the average joe fisher), I understand that you as a party will be appalled but did you not say you as a party you helped elect a National Party member and now had some clout (for want of a better word). NOWS THE TIME TO PULL THEM STRINGS and if you make enough noise on this issue which involves more than just fishing, it involves
National security
Fisheries
customs
makes you all of a sudden more than a one issue party
and
I aint finished yet
cheers
blaze
lets all email at least 1 member of parilment

[szopen]

Reel Hard,

As stated in my post I do not think I am entitled to say what is the best course of action in such situation.

It is my personal opinion as an outsider.

With the current world situation, media attitude, "shocking news" selling the papers and other such stuff it is only fair to say that in the event of fatalities in such an encounter it would make the front page news.

Results of such an event.

Major outcry in the media.
Australian Navy "killing innocent kids".
Worldwide condemnation.

Lost votes at home.
(Maybe not, but for people really pulling the strings that is the only thing that matters).

Some of the things to take into account would be:
- what would be the response of family memebers of a person killed over some irrelevant amount of fish (my understanding being that in Indonesia and in other nations involved family can be quite a number of people). What would happen if they went on a vendetta style of "hunting" innocent Australians inside their country to "avenge" a death in the family.

- Would it be worth it?

- Whould your advocated response be different if a boat in question was from another country (NZ, Japan, US and other countries not quite in agreement with Oz declared teretorial waters) ?


I belive that the laws of the land should be enforced.

If as somebody wrote the highest fine for breaking the fishing regulations was 27k I do not believe it would justify taking life.
I also don't think it would do anything except raising the fish price in HongKong.

Not in the short, not in the long term.

We fishos feel very strong about the thing.
We need fish in the water to keep us alive.
We can get very upset about others taking our fish from us.

Would you actually shoot a poacher?

As it happend in my life (I hunt) I have beeen in a situation where a poacher was corraled during a large day hunt and the stupid b@ST@##d started to shoot back.

The whole thing ended without any issues but I did have problems going to sleep for a while afterwards.

Not such an easy thing to shoot at another human.

[wiseguy67]

Well....
I agree the issue is a hot one but to open fire with 50cal. is not the solution. The vessels could easily be deactivated by a system of getting a rope or net type material in line of the prop. The vessel would stop in its tracks. Sort of on the line of a spike belt used by police to slow/stop cars. SIMPLE method.

All the millions spent trying to stop what appears to be unstoppable would be better spent on the cause: go to the offending countries and set the fishermen up with enough money to start fish farms etc. Rehab the reefs in their regions? Educate them in the importance of sustainable fishing methods....

I believe the international rules of combat do not allow our navy to open fire on fishermen.
It would cause quite the stir with our neighbors.

I see too much generalization going on in these debates over everything from Rex Hunt bashing to LBGFishos making a mess of 1770!

I find myself reading these posts and shaking my head. Initialy wanting to say my bit but in the end i see its not worth the effort.

Yes write to your MP, but take the time to use snailmail. It can be more effective.
make your point clear and concise keeping in mind that you may not ever see a change.
My father has been talking revolution for years but... like most of us its all talk.
When i ever i get into it with him i get all fired up and then have to let it go.

Unless there is a true change in leadership change may not happen in my life. The planet as we know it will not sustain the present conditions it is enduring by mankind. Cripes there's oxymoron in that word; mankind.....

Too much time spent concerned over the state of our country/world is not healthy, it's time to go fishing.
Maybe i will just go look at fishing reports and avoid these debates.

[szopen]

wise67 wrote:
I find myself reading these posts and shaking my head. Initialy wanting to say my bit but in the end i see its not worth the effort.

It is worth.
That is the reason we all are here.

Shooting to kill first although very "manly" is rarely the answer.

[bidkev]

Well....
# <snip>

Too much time spent concerned over the state of our country/world is not healthy, it's time to go fishing.
Maybe i will just go look at fishing reports and avoid these debates.


Neither is apathy, turning a blind eye, listening/talking to others to become informed/educated, or arriving at a consensus without informed debate/discussion.

cheers kev

[Az]

I know it might sound a bit out of place.
I live in another country and I have not seen the show.

Reading through some of the posts above.

Regarding the firing of guns at a foreign boat in such siutuation.

Just imagine what would happen if Navy actually fired.
Bullets would hit.
A couple of teenage boys (lets say 12-13 years old) on the boat got hit and killed.

Everything over 20k worth of fish.
#


you're a fool to think its just 20k worth of fish, thats less than the fine, these boats are taking in excess of $100k worth of fish from our waters each trip

[wiseguy67]

Neither is apathy, turning a blind eye, listening/talking to others to become informed/educated, or arriving at a consensus without informed debate/discussion.

cheers kev[/quote]

Your right.
I find it to be overwhelming to see it, read it 24/7 and by going to wet a line is a temp escape from it all.

By all means i applaud those that stand up and do something.

The media does not always tell the truth or know the truth. As i'm sure your well aware of. The level of stupidity throughout is shocking and the amount of complacent believers is just as shocking.
weeding out the nonsense to read the informed/educated opinions is worth the time when looking at this and other current affair posts.

cheers wise67

[bidkev]

[quote author=Az link=1131272789/30#37 date=1131406679
<snip>
you're a fool to think its just 20k worth of fish, thats less than the fine, these boats are taking in excess of $100k worth of fish from our waters each trip
[/quote]

Mate, that's a bit hard calling someone a fool like that. There are thousands of misinformed, or even misguided citizens, but they aren't necessarily fools.

kev

[Az]

;D

well get educated people! :-*

and wise67 I agree with you about the media and the amount of complacent believers, however in this instance I don't see that as the issue!

[Big_Kev]

Reel Hard,

As stated in my post I do not think I am entitled to say what is the best course of action in such situation.

It is my personal opinion as an outsider.

With the current world situation, media attitude, "shocking news" selling the papers and other such stuff it is only fair to say that in the event of fatalities in such an encounter it would make the front page news.

Results of such an event.

Major outcry in the media.
Australian Navy "killing innocent kids".
Worldwide condemnation.

Lost votes at home.
(Maybe not, but for people really pulling the strings that is the only thing that matters).

Some of the things to take into account would be:
- what would be the response of family memebers of a person killed over some irrelevant amount of fish (my understanding being that in Indonesia and in other nations involved family can be quite a number of people). What would happen if they went on a vendetta style of "hunting" innocent Australians inside their country to "avenge" a death in the family.

- #Would it be worth it?

- Whould your advocated response be different if a boat in question was from another country (NZ, Japan, US and other countries not quite in agreement with Oz declared teretorial waters) ?


I belive that the laws of the land should be enforced.

If as somebody wrote the highest fine for breaking the fishing regulations was 27k I do not believe it would justify taking life.
I also don't think it would do anything except raising the fish price in HongKong.

Not in the short, not in the long term.

We fishos feel very strong about the thing.
We need fish in the water to keep us alive.
We can get very upset about others taking our fish from us.

Would you actually shoot a poacher?

As it happend in my life (I hunt) I have beeen in a situation where a poacher was corraled during a large day hunt and the stupid b@ST@##d started to shoot back.

The whole thing ended without any issues but I did have problems going to sleep for a while afterwards.

Not such an easy thing to shoot at another human.

#


I am yet to read anyone's point here is to SHOOT TO KILL.
You broach this point in your responses.
I have only read and written about shooting to disable the boat for boarding purposes.
As stated the US coast guard gets results from taking this the firmer stance(wonder why)

Would my advocate response be the same if from a different country A- "absolutely I am not racist".

The shocking headlines read #"Navy kills innocent kids" is a ficticious event you have created in this thread to give your point credence.
No one has been shot dead, and going from the procedures in place no one is going to be shot dead.
The media will always find or invent tommorows shocking headline. "It is up to yourself to read the truth".

You wrote "Not such an easy thing to shoot another human" Tell that to them. They are the one's doing it all at the moment.

Have a good day.

[szopen]

Reel Hard,

You are correct in many points.
- Nobody has said "shot to kill"
- Shocking headline I used to make my point is just part of the argument not reality.
- No one has been shot dead.
- In the end it does not matter if the boats in question was from any country on the map.

The point I was trying to make is that shooting at a fishing boat (whether below or above the waterline) can create a lot of problems and noise way out of proportion to the whole issue.

Back home we have a saying: "Man shoots, God is carring the bullets".
When bullets start flying not intended things can and do happen.

Regarding the effectivenes of US Coast Guard (or border controls) we all know that a huge numbers of illegal immigrants somehow get in don't they?

Enjoy your day as well.
:)

[Big_Kev]

Szopen; I guess at the end of the day we need to do something more then what we are, being laughed at and seen as a soft touch does not curb this problem.
"I"- obviously one of many here see our fish stocks being raped and our borders crossed illeagaly with the posibility of disease spread(potentialy killing Australians) being a very important issue.

When these people threaten our Navy and are agressive it is time to be aggressive in return. If the illeagles know this is what will happen, purhaps they will do different.
No one wants to fight it out, but sometimes to protect what you have you just have to.

[Black_Rat]

We have seen the tuff stance on illegal immigration ie: "Boat People" work as a deterant over the last few years, so why not take a tuff stance on illegal fishing in Australian waters instead of pussy-footing around with them #>:(
My two cents for what it's worth........

[thargor]

Now Im not condoning illegal fishing by foreign nationals in Australian waters. I hate the fact that they are taking from our waters. However we need to look at the big picture to grasp the gravity and desperation of the situation.

These "Indonesians" are generally dirt poor. I mean most havent had an education, havent been to school. Most are in debt to their employers who can be a mix of ethnic Chinese or rich Indonesians. Most have a few other mouths to feed. They come from many different parts of Indonesia and from fishing villages. Most dont know any other way of life. Fishing is the only way they can live. You dont work where they come from you die. Its nothing like here.

Now you might ask yourself - why have the numbers of illegal fishing vessels increased in our waters in the last couple of years? This year is a new record for number of vessels caught. Well its fairly simple really..

For some time the Indonesia government has been selling fishing rights to foreign fishing fleets - Chinese, Taiwanese, Japanese and yes even Australia (Raptis has a few prawn trawlers over that way). There are few if any fishing regulations for these fleets and they plunder away. Guess what!!! They plunder the fishing waters of those Indonesians who used to make a living from it.

Add to this we have more business interests in fishing. Various wealthy individuals buy up a fleet of fishing boats in these fishing villages, employ the locals, get them into debt and pristo you have a willing workforce. For some this debt has quite a history.

So in order to satisfy the employers/owners they must catch big so they take their chances and come into Australian waters where the fishing is good - well great really. They figure that less than 20% will be caught while in Australian waters - its worth the risk.

A good load of fish/fins is going to pay off. They are that willing to take risks that there are many repeat offenders.

So we get tough on them, shoot them out of the water, kill a few. We must remember that there are quite a few juveniles on these boats starting at the average young age of 12 to 14.

Shooting them wont stop them. It might slow it a little but they would just get smarter at it.

We need to get to the heart of the problem. Poverty and lack of employment from where they come from. Fix those and it will greatly reduce their numbers. On top of that the Indonesian government must do their part. But I bet you they wont. They dont really care and like a real conspiracy theorist that I can be I bet some of the money made from this illegal trade is ending up in some politicians pockets.

[Vic1]

Wait till bird flu hits hard and these people not only steal our fish but set sail for Australia as a haven the escape the disease...what will the government do then.....Ive done some reading on this issue and it's scary.......