Online petition ramp security

[bidkev]

Anyone know how to get one up and running? Seems a petition from thousands of anglers would achieve more than me harping on at my local councillor.

I was parked at Bald Hills station waiting to pick up my little feller off the train. Kids were passing through the cars parked on the car park whilst some knobhead was flying backwards and forwards doing wheelies on a trail bike......just missed one girl by inches. Anyway, I got out and as he drove past I pointed to the cameras and shouted, "you're on film matey".....he soon dissapeared. ;DAnyway, it got me to thinking what a bloody good deterrent they are, when the idiots finally realise they're there ::)

Two more cars done at deepwater bend the other day, and in broad daylight!

With all the expense of rego and fuel tax that us boaties have to contend with, I would think that video cameras at ramps would be small return, and a drop in the ocean by way of expense, considering the revenue raised.

It's getting so bad that you daren't do overnighters anymore. Any ideas anyone?

kev

[snasman]

No ideas Kev but a brilliant thought I'd sign, its only a mater of time b4 1 of those little buggers gets my car or trailer as its always parked down at the bend .A camera would be great and some more lighting wouldnt go astray.Have you got an email addy for the local councillor post it on this site and we could all bombard him/her with requests.cheers Snas

[major-defect]

I'd sign that!20 years ago I came back in to the second ramp in Cabbage Tree creek on a Sunday arvo and somebody had stolen all the rollers of the trailer,some choice words were used.

[Darryl]

I would happily sit down in the car park with a big stick and a bottle of rum on your fishing nights.

For a small fee . ;D

Darryl.

[jim_farrell]

I'd happily sit and watch darryl re-educate someone with his big stick.

[bidkev]

I'd happily sit and watch darryl re-educate someone with his big stick.

I'd happily bale him out if his stick wasn't big enough ;D

I know that there are ways of running online petitions, it's just a matter of being pointed in the right direction as I'm not too computer savvy. I'd be prepared to do the work once it was up and running.

The petition would be aimed at the state gov't as opposed to local problems as I think we all have trouble at ramps wherever we are. If it became a state (labour) issue via risking lost votes, then hopefully more funds would be made available for local problems. We could even try getting Insurance companies onboard on this one.

kev

[Az]

perhaps the fishing party may be able to assist? :-/

[Dirtysanchez]

There is a local government petition are on their website, they had it running recently for the people who will be affected by the tunneling that will occur when they do the new traffic tunnels that Campbell Newman is planning

Check out the Brisbane city council website, or Pine Rivers council website ?
if not just start a new thread here and use the polling method and I'll sign it too

Seeya

Russ

[bidkev]

There is a local government petition are on their website, they had it running recently for the people who will be affected by the tunneling that will occur when they do the new traffic tunnels that Campbell Newman is planning

Check out the Brisbane city council website, or Pine Rivers council website ?
if not just start a new thread here and use the polling method and I'll sign it too

Seeya

Russ



I'd like to spread it a bit wider than that Russ, but thanks for the suggestion. I'd like to cover the whole state so that gov't can see that it's not just isolated to particular ramps and that just as they protect parking at Queensland Rail, they have an obligation to protect fishos at ramps.

The only thing that I can think of atm is to carefully word the petition, copy enough sheets to cover all the tackle shops, (major stores included), and to post 'em off with a covering letter requesting that the stores photocopy the initial sheet to provide enough copies to cover their customer base.

Yes you're right Az, perhpas TFP can assist in the wording, the covering letter, or some other way, and I'll do the admin (researching tackle shop addresses, mail shots etc).

I welcome any input and the more we get on board here,and if it pays off, the more relaxed we can be on the water, and the safer when we return. The thought of returning from a trip as dark is falling, to find a winch or roller knicked, 5 panicky crew, and a 21/2 ton boat to shift doesn't bear thinking about. I've had a winch knicked before and it ain't no joke with 5 hungry kids waiting at a ramp.......rather spoils your day :o ::) :'( ;D



kev

[flatstrap]

Guys guys, security is a major issue everywhere (trains, planes, car parks pubs). Look at the bigger picture. You can't even guarantee your home is safe. There is a global decline in standards of personal behaviour and responsibility. Now, how can we fix that? L-o-n-g timeline for a fix. There's bastards out there that won't pay for boat bits or trailer bits. Restaurant owners buy illegal fish and crabs from shamateurs. Anything to save a buck. Bottom line...it comes around and bites you on the Ar*e!

Fix yourself, and fix the problem...flatstrap

There is no right way to do something wrong...(author unknown)

[Dirtysanchez]

Yes Flatstrap, your point is valid, I remember years ago we used to fish on the beach & 4wd on at certain points along the beach and often we would see cars that were parked there that had been broken into while the owner was still down the beach fishing etc. We'd drive down and let them know, sometimes drive them up so they could check that it was their car, very infuriating !

We chased one guy once who was in the act when we came over the dune, we got back into town and by then we had lost him (tyres were down to 18PSI so we couldn't put the foot down).
Anyway we reported it to the police, gave them rego number etc and they just didn't seem to care about it one bit !

:-/

[Chimo]

If i may make a suggestion and seek some feedback?

Past experience with petitions when working in state and then local govt has been that a petition can and frequently is seen as one complaint.

There seemed to be a more meaningful reponse including the odd bit of action when individual complaints ie individual letters or emails were received from voters/ ratepayers.

Perhaps providing (on this site) draft material identifiying the issues and needed improvement be that thru cameras or security visits with lists of suggested recipients across the state that we could send on as individuals who wish to raise the issue with members of parliament and local councillors.

I know that on the Gold Coast in the last few years I have twice had break ins in daylight at both the Sundale Bridge ramp and at the ramp adjacent to VMR on the Spit.

It would be nice, with the fees that we pay, to be able to park safely at night but right now I'd even settle for safer daytime parking. What do you think?

Chimo

[Darryl]

Yes i do agree Chimo, but the problem is people want to do something about it, but when it comes to actually doing it they wont send an email away.However if you are at a boat ramp people will sign a petition because it's quick and easy.

Dunno, all valid points and good information.

[bidkev]

Thanks for the suggestion Chimo. I agree with what you say re petitioning having the appearance of coming from one person, but if the petition is raised statewide and then submitted by an "official' body such as TFP, then I think that ears would prick up. It's not gonna look like some old cook trying to protect her cat sanctuary. If the petitions were headed with the name of the small (or big) business who gather the names, then I can't see how it can be easily dismissed. As I say, perhaps we can even get the insurance companies to exert pressure in some way.

I think the first step would have to be gathering evidence to support the petition, I don't mind how long this takes to get off the ground as a slow good job will reap more rewards than an amateurish bungled one. To this end I appeal to any members who have anecdotal (or otherwise) evidence of incidents that have taken place at ramps to furnish these via pm. Location approx date and offence preferable supported with name of victim (if known) would help. If you are a member of another group or club, I would also appreciate you "putting out the word" on this. At the same time, I will approach the police and see if they keep records of incidents and if these are available to me.

I would assume that thefts of rollers, winches etc, mainly go unreported due to Insurance excess, but the issue is not only one of financial cost to the victim but also the cost in time, effort, distress, and safety, to those who are left hanging onto boats for hours on end whilst the skipper tries to sort out the problem.

Let's try and get this thing rolling and make sure we get something back for our rego fees and input into the economy. If anyone else wants to run with this, then I'm prepared to take a back seat and help with admin, mail shots etc 'cause I really do think that this is one hell of an important issue. I know folk who simply won't go on overnighters any more or even early morning starts and I'm pissed off that it distracts and diminishes our sport so much. Blokes who have worked hard all their lives and their retirement is tarnished to the point that they can't even enjoy freely their hard-earned leisure time. I had one old boy near to tears when he saw his car window smashed......Insurance excess again..and yet another strain on his pension :'( Until someone nicks your rollers or winch, and you can't trailer your boat, I don't think you can appreciate how much grief it causes the elderly fisho let alone the average guy. This is one hell of an important issue to my mind.

It's about time we made ourselves heard 'cause things will only get worse, not better.

kev

[bidkev]

To add: For those who may think that the cost is likely to be a major problem due to linking to a central monitoring system and we may be on a lost cause because of this. There are surveillance kits whereby the recorder is in situ in a weather and tamper proof box. The tape is only accessed if an incident is reported and is set to rewind and re-record if not accessed.

kev

[thesimmos]

I doubt they will do anything anyways.

I know there are alot of clubs and places that charge a small fee to use their ramp and park over night.

Some charge around $400 a year... I guess thats similair to any insurance charge and I guess it gives peace of mind.

Although I do agree to the idea of having a camera or two at each major boat ramp.

Most major boat ramps have a VMR there.

Maybe they can fund raise and look to buy one or two and get this kind of monitoring if they want to encourage more people to use their ramp and maybe this will bring more member support.

More member support means more $$

[Gbanger]

i read an article in an old issue of club marine the other day, the author says he leaves his car unlocked with 5 bucks hanging out of the ashtray to let potential theives know he was expecting them..

he didnt mention what drugs he was on

[choppa]

kev,,,, just read through the replies quickly,, but to give you a possible heads up try to speak to the Caboolture Shire Council,,,

about 3-4 years ago,, there was a commotion here on b/isl over the amount of breakins and vandals at Skirmish Point ""car park,,"" along with Buckleys Hole,,

the tourists were going ape over the amount of security that LACKED,, and the local boys in blue had nothing to go on,, other than a suspicion

cut a long story short,,, they installed cameras at skirmish,,, cordless,,,vandal proof,,state of the art equipment,,,,unsure of the all up cost,, 2, maybe 3 grand,,,,

lasted 2 weekends after being installed,, they even took the sign which was concreted in the ground as a bonus

Buckleys Hole had 1 camera,, was cordless as well,, and was placed in a bird nest box in a TREE,,

3 signs were erected,,, 1 was vandalised by bending,, 1 was painted with graffiti,, 1 still stands today nailed to a post,,,, they havent been able to prosecute because they cant find the box with the camera in it,,,,,,,

council refused to replace the cameras,, and have since placed new signs warning people to secure their vehicles and remove valuables

the marina boat ramp (just prior to the bridge),, spent thousands upgrading the ramp,, extra lights,,, and even had the local security guard doing drive bys,,,,it changed nothing,, other than the first month or two being quite,, then back to normal,,,,,we only seem to have this problem predominatley around tourist seasons,,, easy pickings perhaps,, or less educated

the point being,,, that if you get a head start on why they dont follow up with a more positive aspect towards security,, it may be less of a hurdle to cover when your in full swing,,,,

[Heath]

I think that the VMR could make some very good $$$ out of this. Simple $5.00 donation. To have someone at the ramp I think people would pay for that sort of thing. He doesn't need to be a hero or security guard. Just the fact of someone being there keeping an eye on things would be enough.

I'd certainly donate $5.00 every time they were there.

[el_carpo]

WHAT THE......?!!!

I don't know how you guys can keep your cool. My blood was boiling just reading through this thread.


Being unfamiliar with the locations you guys are talking about, I don't know exactly what kind of set-up these launches have.

If these launches are in harbours/marinas and you have to pay entry fees to get into and use the harbours/marinas, then the company or government taking the fees has the responsibility to provide security for your vehicles. If they don't, then you should demand they start. They are at fault.

If the launches are free to the public (public access) and it's also a public parking lot and such, then the local police should get to work. If an area is a known hang out for trouble makers (and from Chopper's post, it sure sounds like it is) then it's a no-brainer. They should do surveillance and catch the rats. Also, an occassional drive through wouldn't hurt. They have to make their presence known.

I can't believe they just took that insult! That's what it was! Those little ****s destroyed and STOLE security cameras and the response was to shrug and say, "We don't know who did it. We better not use any more cameras lest it happen again." Horrible! If nothing else, they should have put up "dummy" cameras and set up a surveillance trap. It sounds like they gave up! Surrendered! To thieves and vandals!........and you guys are left to fend for yourselves. And, of course, if you ever did fend for yourself, you would probably get arrested and sued by the rat who robbed you!

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!! !

I wish I knew how to help you Kevin, but my computer knowledge is not so good. It's great that you're trying to help make it better for folks. I hope you succeed and that you get a lot of support.

Good luck

[Scottnojack]

I would be very keen on signing a petition or giving any help that was needed as I frequent that ramp alot. I have had a mate who about six months ago had his tralier disconnected and left at the ramp and they took off with his car. Never seen again!!! It's only a matter of time until mine or your trailer, car or both gets knocked off. I will help get something happening wherever possible.

Scotty

[jim_farrell]

I'm with you el carpo. If the police show such little interest when these cameras get stolen, what hope is there when private goods get stolen.

Kingtin, even a sign to say the area is under surveillance may make a difference.
I think you would need a website to host your petition firstly. There are petition websites. However, a petition section in the council website where the public can enter the topic is a better idea. Maybe a different topic weekly.
Surely if there was enough interest in your topic they would have to act. Then again, maybe not....

[Darryl]

http://www.parliament.qld.gov.au/view/EPetitions%5FQLD/

[Camo]

I think the only way to get the Government to move on anything is to convince them that there a lots of votes in it. Unfortunately one petition is not going to do it, and even if you did convince them, what they'd come up with would be a user pay system. They'd start charging you to use the ramps.

After all they would consider us boat owners to be rich capitalists, who can afford to replace our gear when it is stolen. They will however provide free needles, clinics, and whatever else, to the druggies who steal your stuff. >:( I know I'm cynical, I guess I must be just getting old.

Even so I think Heath's idea is a good one. I would be willing to pay 5 bucks to use a ramp if I knew that the car and trailer would be secure.

Camo

[choppa]

el carpo your anger is not alone my friend,,,, to fill you in Bribie island is just that,,,, an island,,, we have a local police station,, manned by half a dozen or so officers,,, but come 5.30pm,,, the hooter sounds and they pack up and go home,,, we then have """mainland"" police take over,,, which includes the transferring of all incoming phone calls to the local station,,,and also by patrols by 3 other areas who share the workload on a rotating shift style basis,,,

1 day there here in force after hours,,, others there scarce,,,,we see more in summer than winter,,, etc etc

the perpetrators get to know the routine,,,not only here but everywhere,,, and there lies some of the problem,,,

my reply (after i read what i posted) sounds extremley negative,, but it was not intended that way,,,

i was basically trying to point out,,,if we can combat the reasons behind the lack of security up front,,, it leaves bugger all to argue about later,,,

(does that make sense????????)

choppa

[el_carpo]

Yes, it definately makes sense. Sounds like some changes need to be made in the system. The situation you described with the police running on regular schedules is the same thing we went through here. There is a park where hoodlums liked to hang out and cause trouble near my house. A police car would arrive at exactly 5:00 PM and leave at 5:30 PM every day. Guess when the punks would show up.

Good luck.

Kind of reminds me of the famous (or infamous) quote by a former mayor of Chicago----

"The police aren't here to create disorder. The police are here to preserve disorder."

Hay caramba! LOL