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The_Walrus
16-10-2003, 10:51 PM
[smiley=help.gif] My Yammi 25/4 is now out of warranty & I plan to do basic servicing myself.

For the engine oil, can I use a good automotive oil or should I stick with brand names ie Yammalube?

What oils do members use?

Luc

bj
17-10-2003, 04:57 AM
Mate I'm in the same situation as you.My motor will be out of warranty shortly also.I have been advised definately not to use automotive oil.A pro fisherman around my way has a Mercury 4/S and he was telling me a while ago as soon as the motor is out of warranty to get out of Mercury oil and go to Castrol 4/S oil.Apparently he had a lot of trouble with his motor and it was because of the Mercury oil.
How much truth is in this I don't know,but I will be looking into it when my motor is out of warranty.

The_Walrus
17-10-2003, 01:59 PM
Hi bj,

I've had a look at the Yammaha website and it says to make certain that you use oil with the same specs as in the relevant outboard manual.

Nothing about using "marine" oils.

Luc

clutter
17-10-2003, 05:44 PM
Luc,
I am also in the same boat (pardon the pun) as my yammy 40 4s is just out of warranty. I have just looked in my manual and it has it all listed on page 4-3. The specs are; API has to be either of the following SE, SF, SG, SH and SAE can be on of the following 10W-30, 10W-40 or 20W-40. I use a 10W-40 in mine.

Also, capacity without filter change - 2.0L, with filter change - 2.2L. Recommended gear oil is a SAE90 Hypoid gear oil.

Cheers,
Clutter

clutter
17-10-2003, 05:46 PM
Forgot, the oils are just automotive.

Clutter

Big_Kev
18-10-2003, 11:28 AM
I have generaly found that Jappanese manufacturers list basic requirements when it comes to oils.
I would think that if you stay with the Yammalube you will not have a drama. But if you have a preference for a better brand so to speak I would be staying with a reputable company that only makes oil such as Castrol. Can cost a little more, but you get what you pay for.And if you talk to the rep he can steer you in the right direction. IE: I would definitely not go for a no name or big department store brand.
If you are worried about your engine you can always get an oil analysis done on the used oil that will tell you all the important stuff.
I myself don't recomend changing oil types midstream so to speak in any engine that has been running on the same oil type for an extended number of service intervals.
Hope this helps cheers Kev.

Andyok
18-10-2003, 06:22 PM
Each oil supplier such as Mobil, Castrol or the like has a listing of what oils are suitable for each engine whether it be a marine or automotive. I suggest you contact your local distributor who will advise you what oil is suitable.
If he does not know he should be able to find out or give you a contact for the manufacturer that can tell you.

I personally have never used the oil branded by the engine manufacturer and sold at an exhorbitant price even during warranty, the only thing to do is to ensure the oil meets their specification that is listed in your owners handbook.

Hope this helps.

Andyok

nofrills
19-10-2003, 04:47 PM
hey guys
just been sorting out the same problem myself.im now useing a castrol automotive oil in my yammie100 4 stroke after checking with sundown marine.and the teck department at castrol.i also managed to buy a genuine yammie oil filter from the local motorbike shop and its about 30% cheaper than the same filter from a marine shop.castrol also has a high temp waterproof grease
so you can do your bearing buddies and your donk with the same gun.
cheers scott ;)

Sniper
22-10-2003, 04:31 PM
Valvoline XLD Low-Vis has a cj rating by memory and is a 10w-40 or 30. A local outbourd mechanic buys it off my work for all the 4 strokes he services. Marine 4 stroke oils are the same as automotive oils. Have been told this by a few technical advisers from different oil companies which do both auto and marine oils. Just a different label. As for gear oils, use marine gear oil. Has a few different additives and goodies in it. Once my 4 strokes out of warranty, I'll be using XLD Low-Vis. Available at any good auto store. (And no I'm not going to plug my work lol)
Cheers Bill [smiley=rifle.gif] [smiley=rifle.gif] [smiley=rifle.gif]

davo
22-10-2003, 05:03 PM
I've got a Yammy 60 HP 4 stroke and when it was new i thought about going to a fully synthetic oil. The lube expert at work said don't do it. Firstly the synthetic stuff can ruin the seals in your engine if they're not designed for it and the other is that fully synthetic oil tends to attract moisture. When I found this out I checked with Yamaha and then a mate who was running his Honda on it checked, the results were the same. I have been thinking of using an alternative oil too but have a good think about it first.

Kerry
23-10-2003, 05:58 AM
So what is the "cost difference" between the "proper" oil and the alternate (el cheapo) oils?

Is the difference that much compared to the overall cost of things considering possible maintainence/overhaul costs or are we worrying about saving a few cents now instead of bucks down the track (maybe).

Oil doesn't go off and buying (good) oil in bulk might initially cost more but in the long term it's really saving money (all round).

As for gear oil, there ain't no way I would be running ordinary old automotive gear oil in my gear cases.


;D anyone see the new 4 Stroke commercials #[smiley=stunned.gif]

It's heavier! It's bulkier! It's slower! It costs more! BUT YES IT'S QUIETER AT IDLE!!!!!!

New commercial #::) nah, just kidding but Yes that's ALL true #:D

And with 2Strokes being those evil 2S oil burners #:-X Yes #:o they've found that magical vacuum place in space where used 4 stroke oil is vanished never to harm the earth again #[smiley=speechless.gif].



Cheers, Kerry.

NQCairns
23-10-2003, 04:19 PM
Hey Davo, Buy some blended oil you only need like 20 or so % synthetic to get all the benifits of a synthetic in blended oils they say.nq
Also read at

clutter
23-10-2003, 04:27 PM
Just on the difference in oils. Some years ago (late 80's early 90's I htink) a test was conducted on taxi's in New York to find out if there was any notable difference between oils and service intervals. A fully reco'd engine was fitted to a taxi then that old engine reco'd and fitted to another and so on and so on (about 40 taxis in all I believe). Taxi's were paired up with both taxis running the same oil but one running normal oil changes (5000 miles) and the other going twice (10000miles) the interval. 20 different brands and grades were used. Obviously this all took some time, 5 years or more and at the end each engine was stripped down after about 500 000 miles and examined. A total of over 20 million miles.

I know this is long winded but the end result was that there was no appreciable difference in wear between the engines and the conclusion was that there was no advantage to running oils above the grade and class recommended by the OEM. Fuel economy was all pretty much the same also.

The reason this was of interest to me was that back then I was an engine reconditioner. Something to think of anyway. Think it may have been reported in a Choice magazine also.

Clutter

NQCairns
23-10-2003, 04:28 PM
Hey Davo, Buy some blended oil you only need like 20 or so % synthetic to get all the benifits of a synthetic in blended oils they say.
Also read at http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/ on the forum that 10w is now the same grade as the old 5w oils, you wont catch me putting a 10w in any motor out of warranty, unless I lived at threadbo all winter, all manufacturers that use 10w do so for the added fuel economy but this at the expense of wear, who cares about a 1% boost to economy when the tradeoff is wear? nq

nofrills
23-10-2003, 05:59 PM
hey kerry
never seen that add.us four stroke owners dont watch tv cause were all out fishin instead of saving our pennies for a tank of juice.
gota go the radio is playin SMOKE ON THE WATER ;D

Kerry
24-10-2003, 03:47 AM
Hey Nofrills if you had then that would be a worry ;D

As with all good magic tricks the SMOKE eventually clears and presto all will be revealed.

Cheers, Kerry.

whiteman
24-10-2003, 08:15 AM
So what's wrong with Valvoline Marine oil at a great price from Super Cheap?? It has the same rating as required by my Yamaha owners manual. And it has a picture of an outboard on the packaging. It MUST be good!

aido
24-10-2003, 01:51 PM
that valvoline tcw3 outboard oil works for me.
bought it for $19.95 if i recall.
exactly what the outboard mechanic sells for 29.95 and recommended
for using in my suzuki for running in (50:1 extra in the tanks).
ten hours of that sure made the smoke goods at idle, but would'nt notice
any when underway. my oil injection is proven after 450 ltrs fuel and 4.5 ltrs
from the normal injection system, about 100:1 sounds right to me.

hey, just a quick search found this link..
http://www.datateck.com.au/lube/valv_au/default.asp?section=5

very intersting, it suggested this one for me

http://www.valvoline.com.au/graphics/temp/productpic/FA03.jpg

The_Walrus
24-10-2003, 05:22 PM
Hi all, ;D

Thanks for all the advice.

I was looking at using castrol oils as I use this in my ute and have not had any problems.

I wanted to confirm that generally, "marine" oils are automotive oils repackaged with greater $$/litre to boot. :-X

Nofrills, which motobike shop? 30% less than a marine dealer sounds good to me. ;D ;D

Aido, that valvoline site looks usefull.

Again, thanks for all your replies. [smiley=2thumbsup.gif]

Luc

nofrills
24-10-2003, 06:14 PM
walrus
any yamaha bike shop.mines a 100hp and just thought id check yamaha must use the same filter on some road bike.allways worth a check for the other sizes never know your luck.guess honda could be the same story ;)
cheers nofrills

dazza
25-10-2003, 05:48 AM
on the subject of oils can someone clarify the following:
i was told once that if you mix different 2 stroke oils they tend to aggregate and stuff up the fuel injection.
is this true or bs
cheers
dazza

NQCairns
25-10-2003, 12:56 PM
Hi Dazza, it is now BS, with the old tcwII standard it was true if you were unlucky enough to buy another brand of oil that was actually different apart from colour. For any oil to meet TCWIII it must be miscible?(no idea how to spell that) with any other TCWIII oil. Nq

Kerry
25-10-2003, 03:19 PM
It might be admissible but mixing 2S oils isn't something I would do. Just one of those things I don't do.

Cheers, Kerry.

Big_Kev
25-10-2003, 04:07 PM
As for the filters from a motor bike fitting the Yammie.
The engine is more than likely a motor bike engine standing on its head.
Honda do it and so does Suzuki so I would think Yammie are hard at it too.
And Kerry that magic place where the waist oil goes must have been found, at least that is what I pay the dealer the enviromental charge on the service bill for to take it to.
Most of the big diesel engine manufacturers have systems to burn the oil through the fuel system and just top up the aux tank and change the filters now and then.
Cheers Kev.

Kerry
25-10-2003, 04:20 PM
All very interesting but really it's not all that difficult deciding which oil one really should be using.

It's easy really ;D one goes down to the local seller of outboard spares and there price one single (just the 1) valve for one's outboard then to really shock the system mulitpy that by the number of valves required and then all this talk about a few cents for this oil or that oil really should vane into insignificance.

Cheers, Kerry.

Kerry
25-10-2003, 04:25 PM
.... Most of the big diesel engine manufacturers have systems to burn the oil through the fuel system and just top up the aux tank and change the filters now and then.

;D now if someone could only develop an outboard that did that, the KISS outboard :D but then didn't somebdy do that yonks ago and called it a 2 stroke :o

Cheers, Kerry.

Big_Kev
25-10-2003, 04:40 PM
Kerry I was only trying to help you to fill your space as you said.
Cheers Kev.

NQCairns
25-10-2003, 07:49 PM
You made me chuckle there Kerry - Not admissible but miscible (may be mixed). Had to go find the dictionary again for the spelling, I should stop being so lazy.
Just rambleing here, It is sort of interesting to me about 2stroke oils how only price dictates quality in the minds of the consumer.
This is completly hypothetical but somewhat true i would guess. If oils were unregulated from a public/environmental health point of view there would only be say 20 combinations of oil blends that would work. Although oils are heavily regulate in this way especially in the USA, also any oil must pass the tests to be certified with the independent TCWIII rateing. With all these factors dictating what an oil must achieve combined with not one single oil company or any of the outboard manufacturers brands making any special product claims above any other 2 stroke oil? Where is the free market? all the companys say they have conducted extensive internal testing on their oils. Why has all the business/Marketing text books been thrown out just for 2 stroke oil?
Could it be that all the TCWIII branded oils apart from minor changes are identical and afford no real protection over each other.
Those with synthetic yell it out loud, why not mineral oil 2stroke sellers?
I may be cynical but if any seller had an oil that actually was a cut above all the rest or worth the premium price they would let us know very loudly indeed, it is in their companys best interest, internally whoever decided to keep it a company secret would never ever want the market or shareholders to find out, if he wanted to work in business again. Nq

nofrills
27-10-2003, 06:08 PM
kerry
mate im not trying to save money on oil for my donk.what started me looking around was the local yamaha motor bike shop dosent sell yamalube because they recon its crap.thats their words not mine but i figure these guys rebuild a lot of race bike engines that cop a fair old floggin so i would hope they have some sort of an idea.
anyone who forks out the big bucks for a four banga would be an idiot to skimp on the oil im just trying to look after my donk.my yammie is 10 mths old with just over 300hrs so if someone can sell me an oil thats twice as good at twice the price ill gladly buy it.
the thing that worries me with all this oil is youve really got no idea what your paying for.
cheers nofrills

dazza
28-10-2003, 06:56 AM
Hi
Thanks for clearing that up NQ. I always try and use the same oil, sometimes a "super special" sees me buying something different.
Aren't most of the smaller 4 strokes motorcycle engines tipped on their sides, with a bit more stainless steel built in?
cheers
dazza