What is wrong with my 90HP Yammie?

[Skipsta]

I have a 90hp Yamaha, 2002 Model on a 5.2 metre plate centre console. (3 months old). The engine has 60hrs (10hrs over recommended service time - just don't have the spare $300 right now :()

Last Friday night I went fishing down the bottom of Peel. About 11.30 p.m. we decided to call it a night and head back to Raby Bay, 5.5km away. We got 500 metres then the engine revs dropped down to idle. (Sounding sick as it did so) Then the engine cut out. It kicked in again, but every time I went over 1100 revs it would sound crook again, so the solution was I had to idle back to the boat ramp at 7km/hr. (In increasingly heavy seas and winds) It cut out about 4 times even at idle and we barely limped back to the harbour.

On the weekend I checked the engine out and found a few things which may (or may not) explain what the problem was. The fuel in the fuel filter (water and solids filter) was cloudy and there was quite a few small aluminium filings which I suspect have come from the recently built underfloor fuel tank.

The engines plugs were oily and there was even some minor spew over of oil out of the three spark plug holes.

Other than that (in my limited knowlegde :-/ everything seemed fine.)

I thought it may be a. Water got into the petrol somehow (or a foreign fluid) or b. the iron filings may have clogged the jets. I will take it to get it serviced when I can afford it, but I was hoping some of you techy types may have a solution and could assist me with a remedy from home.

I can post any digital pics that you may need to clarify the situation.

Cheers in advance.

Skipsta

[finga64]

sounds like fuel starvation to me. Check the fuel flow to the motor (ie take the attachment that attaches the fuel line to the motor and pump the primer bulb). If the fuel comes out in a steady stream then the blockage is in the motor side somewhere. If the fuel doesn't come out the blockage is between the fuel filler and the outboard. Simple #:) Hope it is only a blocked fuel line for economics reasons.
That happened to me once and it was only stupid me didn't plug the fuel line in properly. Luckily I always give the boat a little bit of full throttle before I go over the Evans bar :-/

[Big_Kev]

Sounds like you have water and other crud in the fuel.
Clean out the tank and change the filters.
Two stroke probs are either related to spark or fuel.
Read the operation manual it may give you some idea's on troubleshooting your motor.

[NQCairns]

Sounds like Finga is on the right track IMO the filings will not make it past the filter, replace the filter then flush the lines toward the engine if you are handy enough, if not just replace the filter and start it, throttle around at idle for a while to use up any contaminated fuel if any then it should run as normal.
Or don't take any risks and leave it to a mechanic, it's not impossible that it could be another more serious problem being near the age where it will most likely happen. cheers nq

[Burley_Boy]

Agree that it sounds like water in fuel, depending on how good your filter is there is a possibility you now have water in the carbies and will need to strip them down and clean out the crud. Fuel cloudy sounds like water in fuel to me and its cloudy rather than separating due to additives to break down the water :-/
Cleaning is a great exercise so do it yourself and as soon as you remove the float bowl on each carby you will see if there is water there and if so you will have to continue the cleaning process.

Let us know how you go,
cheers
BB

[Skipsta]

Thanks guys. Would there be some sort of site on the web with a step by step of cleaning out carbies. I'd like to give it a go. I may not even have to, who knows ;D

Would I also have a case to have it fixed by the boat builder (Boat only 3 months old). If it is aluminium filings, surely it is there fault for not cleaning it out properly? Also how would water get into an under floor fuel tank where the filler is shut tight and under a canopy?

Cheers again :)

[blaze]

Silly question
Have you had the boat out with this tank, not something silly like no breather on the tank or even blocked breather.
cheers
blaze

[DaveSue_Fishos_Two]

My advice would be to just do what you feel comfortable and confident enough to do. If you feel that to remedy the problem may be beyond you, wait until you have the $'s and take it to a technician. Your engine is quite a sophisticated piece of machinery, it is all you have between the boat and the ramp (except for the bloody oars), and you may well find that a techinician could have to fix not only the initial problem but others that you may cause through lack of know-how. I'm not rubbishing you for wanting to have a go, but be careful. A few hundred spent now with qualified servicing might just save you a lot. If it is a simple problem, then the tech won't charge much to fix it.

Cheers and good luck

Dave

[adrian]

have you check the oil level the oil tank . mine did a simlar thing when the oil level was low. blaze may be on to something as this may also cause the problem

anzac

[Skipsta]

Oil level is fine and the breather doesn't appear to be blocked ??? ??? ???

[INDULGENCE]

Hi
Two quick things to check
The position of the breather if it is outside the boat (where it should be) make sure seawater is not being forced into it whilst travelling.
The other condensation in the tank, on cold nights after a warm day try not to leave the tank empty out in the cold.
Sorry I forgot it will be water in the fuel, like the other guys have said the aluminium in the tank will be caught by the filter.
If the problem persists install a water trap type filter prior to the motor.
lotsa
Wally

[noluck]

i had ones problem with breather of fuel tank was kinkt??(speling)
band and could not let fuel go free onse is fix no problem atall could not idler and get past 1500rpm
cheers no_luck

[OandaFX]

Hi Ive got a 2000 70hp yammy and have great reliable boating with it.(touch wood). Its similar to yours
Learnt many years ago that fuel in the water is a big stuffer upper.
Easy clean out of the carbies is to undo the brass coloured screws at the bottom of each carby bowl. Should be three of them(bowls therefore screws) They have a big screwdriver slot and hex for a spanner as well.

simply unscrew them and remove, then squeeze fuel bulb a few times and the petrol will run out. when it looks clean, replace screw. repeat for all three.

Major tip, get a glass bowl water separator type of fuel filter and put it where you can see it easily.

I strongly recommend you do it yourself. Nothing too tricky here. the tips from the others are also correct and do these.

An easy way to clean out your tank is to get a nice big siphon hose 16 - 20mm, a couple of buckets, tip your boat as high so the gunk runs down to the end where you are siphoning from. siphon out fuel. separate water and put back in, unless you suspect it is dead, then give it to your lawnmower or use as weedkiller!

Then go for a conservative trip.in a river or something. Don't go screaming off over bars!!!

[gropeher]

I once went to the fuel station and filled my car up, the petrol station fuel tanks were full of water and hence I had a similar result in performance. When I went to complain to the station to complain and ask for another $40 worth of fuel, they refused. There were 2 other persons there at the same time complaining and a garage full of potential clients ready to fill tanks. I promptly informed all clientelle at the station of the problems and they left without filling the tanks. The station threatened to call the police, I told them to go ahead as I had a few things to discuss with them about selling faulty product, they didnt, I left shortly after and have never been back.
Up yours again Caltex at Capalaba.

[Hagar]

G'day Skipsta
Would tend to agree with the posts suspecting water in the fuel system but go back to the cause of this first before spending time on the next steps . Is there still any water in the fuel tank that will be sucked into the new filter and your clean carbies after you clean them ? . If even possibly yes I would drain the tank and start afresh as the first step . As you said - how did you get water in there anyway ?
Then :
Use the squeeze bowl to flush the fuel line .
Replace the filter cartridge .
Flush the fuel line to the engine from the filter into a glass jar and check for water.
Drain or dismantle the carby bowls .

There should be a bronze drain plug at the base of each carby bowl with a crush washer underneath . If you can remove these one at a time and flush fuel thru the bowl with the squeeze bulb it will flush the majority of the water out . Make sure the crush washer goes back under the plug . Do this to each carby .This should get it running well enough to tell if water was the cause . I would be careful running a rough running engine under much load .

Dismantling carbies is probably best left to the skilled if you are not confident . Depending on your luck as you remove them and strip them you may be able to re - use the manifold and carby bowl gaskets if they do not tear . Otherwise you will have to replace them and they are not cheap .

Chris

[Skipsta]

Thanks again guys.

The breather is on the outside of the boat on the starboard side. #The night in questions was quiet and the boat was trimmed properly, so no water would have gotten in here. #I took the cap off and blew and sucked in it (Would have looked bloody comical). #There didn't seem to be obstructions. #I already have a plastic bowl fuel filter which also separates water. #

I took the bowl off, cleaned the aluminium filings out, then replaced. #I have squeezed the primer bulb like crazy but the filter is not filling up again. #Could this mean a blockage, or is there some other sort of suction that needs to be done to get the fuel from the tank to the filter whenthe filter is empty?

There was all that bad rain we got early last week, and my boat wasn't under a tarp at the time, whether this rain could get into a sealed tank through the filler, I feel is prob unlikely.

But even had water got into the tank, surely the filter would separate the water?

I will have a look at the carbies and if it looks simple enough, I'll give it a whirl, otherwise I'll send it to the professionals. #I was going to send it to Karee Marine at Rocklea, which I had heard good things about.

Is cleaning it out of the carbies as simple as draining the dirty fuel out, or does the thing have to be stripped and rebuilt. #Also is there any additive you can add to clear jets etc if they are clogged?

Many many questions. #I'm very impressed by the response though guys. #I'm still dumbfounded at how effective the net and chat forums are at solving everyday probs #;D

Skipsta

[Burley_Boy]

Not sure why the bowl is not filling from the bulb but I'm sure thats a simple one for someone else.
I had a lot of water in fuel issues and spent a lot of money with my local "professional" a major distrubutor on the north GC as I thought I'd better not touch it. They happily took my money and fixed issues that didn't exist before I finally stripped the carbies and found water in the fuel. They wanted to replace the electric module at this point....so please excuse my scorn at some who should know better. (the boat went back 3x at full chargeout prior to this).

Water seems to have the incanny ability to block small orifices... :-/ with bubbles of water and I never had much luck just draining the bottom. By all means do that first and if you find water and then the problem fixes itself then [smiley=laola.gif]
However if you find water and this does not fix it then basically it may need to be stripped down to the point of removing jets and washing in metho before blowing clean. And I mean really thoroughly. This is a job that is not difficult but you may also ask a pro to do for you.

I got water in the fuel it seems from not having enough fuel in my tanks when parked. These days I refill after each trip and check the filter for water after each trip, No issues since. ;D
Good luck.

[mako_5.2]

I had the same problem a couple of months ago with a 115 yamaha. The mechanic told me if the water sits in the carbs and corrodes up it can block the jets up. Was told to try flushing fuel through the carbs if it happens again but if bad need to strip carbs. This happened about a month after a service and cost $180 to strip and tune again. Mine only had 70 hrs on it and I leave the tank full but still regularly find myself draining water off the filter.