Compulsary tests for old fibreglass boats

[seabug]

# #Hi Guys and Gals,
I am raising this question as there seems to be no standards for secondhand boats.

I spent $1000 getting my boat engine ready after a long storage only to find that the underfloor wood was compost.My fault,I did not remember to undo the bungs,but boat was only suitable for wrecking. And was wrecked.

How many times have we seen posters on this forum rebuilding #rotten hulls or describing hulls/transoms that were spongy/suspect.

There must be a lot of boats for sale that need attention ,but are waiting for some inexperienced person to buy them.

Compare this to the motor industry where old cars are taken out of the system through Roadworthy checks.

Cheers #
Seabug

[blaze]

A lot of early built boats including some of the major brand names (no names) have a very poor stringer bulkhead (sub floor frame work) design. This has become appent to me after the failure of my hull which has the same designed frame work. I did a thread a long time ago and one of the major faults with hulls is that where the bungs come out they are just drilled through the transom and a drain plug put in. The water ingresses here and climbs the transom. The new way is to fair all the timber away from this point and replace with solid glass.
My boat broke her back on the bulkhead at the entrance to the cabin, shattering up through the cabin. They tell me one of the reasons is there is too much flex in the front compared to the back. The guys doing these repairs build survey glass boats and have said most production boats would not go any where near meeting survey requirements even with there level flotation etc.
cheers
blaze

[Spaniard_King]

makes good sense to get a boat inspection by a suitably qualified professional hey ::)

Garry

[billfisher]

I think its better left to the owner/ buyer rather than have a compulsory inspection system. Under such a system who would do all the inspections? You would need an army of shipwrights. I wouldn't want the expense and hassle of getting my perfectly sound boat inspected every year.

[seabug]

"" I wouldn't want the expense and hassle of getting my perfectly sound boat inspected every year.""

Sorry,I may not have made it very clear.
My thoughts were not to have every boat inspected yearly.

Just for some way for having OLD FIBREGLASS boats checked at point of sales ,so dodgy vendors and lying salesmen could not flog them off to inexperienced newbies that try to buy a boat cheap, and sometimes get a LEMON
See comments on forum titled "WHAT WOULD YOU DO."
Dealers would not like losing money on trade-ins

These buyers would be the ones that would not be able to make the necessary repairs ,and could get into strife at sea.

Regards
Seabug

[billfisher]

Still sound like too much red tape to me. Also most dealers offer 3 months warranty so they shouldn't be able to get away with selling unsound boats. Another thing a fiberglass boat with faults can be a good buy for a handyman if the price is right. Virtually anything can be repaired with fiberglass and with the price of new boats it is often economical to do so.
PS don't forget than aluminium boats can have just as many problems, eg corrosion and cracking.

[sf17fisherman]

there is a system already in place
the buyer hires a shiwright/serveyer to inspect before he makes a dession
couple of hundred dollers but for that you get a inspection that covers all the bases and lets you know what the condtion of the boat is really like

if not to bad your saved thousands thruogh possable repaires
if only a few thing wrong you then have a document that you can bargin with
and if in A1 condition well then you have peace of mind knowing you have a good buy and a safe buy ;)

[seabug]

Phew,this is hard.
My point is that such junk should not be for sale either by private vendors OR dealers
Unless it is clearly labeled as such,perhaps with the estimated cost of repairs clearly shown.

Why do we tolerate this sales system for boats when we do not tolerate it for cars?
Why should the buyer have to prove that the boat for sale is safe+sound

Old cars go to the metal recovery centre.

With old boats it seems to be get some poor sucker to buy it if you can!

End of story
Regards
Seabug

[Spaniard_King]

Sea Bug

Are you saying we shouldn't have boats in the lower end of the market because thats where all the truly Sh!tty ones end up.

I am affraid the second hand market is always going to be a grey area to delve into. I don't think it's a matter of the seller getting away with it either, to me it's should always be the buyers resposibility to know what they are buying.

Garry

[Y-Not]

When I bought my 24 yo cruise craft (damn Fine boat I recken) I put it into a reputable boat yard to get the motor checked and have them have a look at the hull. caost me about $120 for the inspection but they gave the hull a clean bill of health ditto for the motor but picked up problems on the trailer which the previous owner had to get fixed before they would issue a saftey certificate for it. Good Value I think :D

[seabug]

"Are you saying we shouldn't have boats in the lower end of the market because thats where all the truly Sh!tty ones end up. "

Do not beleive that I said or implied that a person should not be able to buy an old or cheap boat ,of any sort,as long as it is SOUND

And I have allready said(earlier post) that selling unsound ones is OK as long as faults are listed.

And I really do beleive that the buyer should not have to PROVE the seaworthiness of any vessel that is for sale, by private or dealer vendor

Regards
Seabug

[Y-Not]

No Seabug I am saying that it is up to the buyer to do what they feel they need to feel confidant they will be happy with what they are paying for. I paid someone to check it out as I didn’t have the confidence to do it myself.

[youngfisho]

sea worthyniess is next to road worthyness. You wouldnt drive a car with bald tyres, crappy wheel alignment and a leaking radiator that gets 30 litres to the kilometer. Same with boats. Yes I believe there should be a system whereby boats get checked (esp older hulls prone to rotting in the transom and floor).

If for some reason the boat sinks or cracks then sinks then who is to blame. boats that arent sea worthy are just as dangerous as a car that is unroadworthy but you cant drown in a car which has broken down due to over heating. But you can drown if your boat sinks or takes on water due to hull cracking etc etc.

andrew

[Spaniard_King]

I am sorry but you won't be cutting holes in the floor of my boat to check if it's OK ::)

A good fiberglasser can hide a multitude of sins :-X

Garry

[redspeckle]

Great Topic seabug
The trouble buying 2nd hand boats it geting good a boat ,trailer and motorin good condition, one or both is below standard if you are lucky can score all 3 very well

Maybe a way someone [smiley=idea.gif] comes up with a simple thing to check the hull of the boat is sound in fiberglass ( not a drill ) like a fridge mangent for cars
Least with aluminium boat the stringers not going to be rotten its all made out of one main material, Fiberglass made out of two main materials Wood and fiberglass

At the end of the day it all comes down too how its been look after
eg being out in weather or housed from it when not in use
Great point ther made by youngfisho in his post [smiley=thumbup.gif] maybe come up with safety certificate sea worthy one like for vechiles roadworthy one (safety)
Mitch

[billfisher]

It think it is just a case of let the buyer beware. I wouldn't assume a car is free from major faults just because it has a roadworthy certificate either. The inspections are pretty basic and there are too many ways around the system.
Coming back to boats I think it is easy to spot an unsound fiberglass hull. If you can push any part of the hull in by hand I wouldn't trust it. Similarly with the transom you can put up and down pressure on the out board leg and see if there is any flexing or crunching sounds. Tapping the transom with a small hammer or spanner will show up any areas of moisture as well as these areas will have a dull sound. Also there are moisture meters available which will detect underlying moisture. If it passes these test it should be OK for quite a few years.
Finally if it is an old fiberglass hull try to get the price down as much possible. At the end of the day fiberglass boats depreciate quite a bit in value with age. This is the markets way of factoring in the potential problems. If problems arise it is then usually economically viable to repair them.

[Whats_a_fish]

I asked the old fella a question just like this the other day and he told me to look for cracking around the transome and thin ness in the floor. So i asked how and he said to tap on it , if the transome sounds hollow then it is. If the side sound different to the bottom then is has done much river work and is a bit thin or rotten.also look for cracks all over and bits of glass that have come off.