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boodo
27-04-2006, 05:53 PM
hi there lads,
after some info on upgrading my current motor which is a 60 yammi 2stroke to either a 60 or 75 evinrude etec or perhaps a 60 4 stroke yamaha my centre consol is only rated to 75hp so i couldnt look at a 80hp yamaha 4 stroke could i ?


any ideas i will listen boodo

Blackened
27-04-2006, 06:49 PM
G'day
I'd reccomend the optimax but they dont come in that low a horsepower. About the rating of the hull, dont go over the manufactured maximum as this will void warranty (if there is some remaikning) and insurance. Also downright dangerous. Watch the weights in the 4 stroke. Other than that just consider the other input.]
Dave

joey_1987
27-04-2006, 07:04 PM
Hey, you could get an optimax because there is a 75hp optimax. If you want a 4 stroke, then Suzuki would probably be my pick, very reliable, and smoother and quieter than the DFI 2 strokes. Fuel economy between DFI 2 strokes and EFI 4 strokes is very similar, DFI 2 strokes use slightly less at idle and slower speeds but EFI 4 strokes use less at higher speeds and WOT. Here is a test which compares the engines you are looking at http://boatpoint.ninemsn.com.au/portal/alias__boatpointau/tabID__200859/ArticleID__119526/DesktopDefault.aspx
Joey.

seatime
27-04-2006, 07:13 PM
Hey boodo,

Ditto Blackened's comments, do not exceed max hp rating for the hull. Carefully consider the added weight of changing up to a 4 stroke. It could drastically change the handling and trim characteristics of your C/C. cheers

MTS_-_fish_magnet
27-04-2006, 09:21 PM
Evinrude E-Tec if they do the smaller size (I'm not sure theydo).

300 hours and no service!! What a winner.... :)

saurian
27-04-2006, 09:43 PM
boodo,
i am a 4 stroke convert, 60 yammy, smooth as but i do not think
the power will be quite like 2 stroke, as for other comments about
fuel economy, only upper revs will the hi tech 2stokers
come anywhere near you. Especially if you average fuel
consumption out for an average fishing trip, not per revs versus
speed attained.
have you been in similar boats as yours with both2/4 strokes?
post a column to see if someone will give you a run
in either of the choices, might help. good luck

Geoff_Atkinson
28-04-2006, 08:19 AM
Go the E-tec. It's the same motor as the 90HP without as much power.
I dont know how it is done but bore, stroke, displacement, weight, size are all the same but power is different.
If set up correctly, the E-tec is a real winner.

Coontakinta
28-04-2006, 09:04 AM
Something that may be of interest to u on this subject, but then again may not :-/, is that some 4 strokes in the hp range u describe are fuelled via a carby where as the e-tec uses injectors.

I didnt like the idea of 4 carby's on a motor hence went to Di 2 stroke

Geoff_Atkinson
28-04-2006, 10:48 AM
Yes,

I noticed the same thing when I bought the E-tec. When we started looking, our aim was for a Yammie as we have friends who raved about theirs, but when we looked into it could only get it in carby mode.

Then went down to E-tec and Optimax, Optimax was cheaper but in the end it was the quietness as well as 3 years with no service and no run-in period that made the E-tec win.

timddo
28-04-2006, 04:03 PM
There's no point comparing E-tec's with 4 stroke, E-tech is a 2 stroke and should be compare with a 2 stroke. 4 strokes are quieter and more fuel efficient. better still cost hardly nothing to run. but 2 strokes have the power ( just to get running,) once on they way 4 strokes perform better and have a strong torque.

2iar
28-04-2006, 04:41 PM
I'd agree with looking at the Suzi. I've got the 70 myself, and really happy with it.

Was looking at another boat with 80 Yammie, but they weighed the same as the 115 (I think, whatever the next one up for the yammie 4 strokes was).

However my boat's also rated to 75 - so I went for the suzuki as the 70 weighed the same as the 60 - that is, it's the most grunt for it's weight. The 80 Yammie had the least grunt for it's weight, as opposed to the 115 (if you see what I mean).

Good luck,
Mike

nodjule
28-04-2006, 08:15 PM
In other words, buy the same motor as I purchased, blah blah blah.. :-? :-?

Chris_Riethmuller
28-04-2006, 08:46 PM
Timddo,
sorry mate but I have to disagree, I suggest you do some research on these late model 2 strokes, they kick arse and in most cases are more fuel efficient, quieter and more torque than the alot of four strokes.
wake up and smell the roses timddo :P, 4 strokes are a thing of the past, where have you been!
Kind regards Beefa :)

Dignity
28-04-2006, 09:25 PM
boodo - have often thought of changing to a 4 stroke but last year went to the Daly River with some friends and we had 3 almost identical boats - 5.2 - 5.5 centre consoles, 1 had a 2 storke yammy, 1 a 4 stroke suzi and 1 had an etech 70 on it. The etech was as quiet, got up and went as fast as any of the others (didn't match the 200hp of the Barra Classic boats) and the fuel efficiency was actually better over the 2 week period than the other two yet this boat probably did more trolling than the other 2. The owner of the etech did tell me he had reservations due to bad publicity and initially he did have some problems but the dealer bent over backwards to fix them. He has now been running his motor for nearly 2 years without a glitch. Mind you he does have to use their oil (which is not cheap about 50% dearer) to maintain the warranty. After that trip I would seriously consider an etech as being pretty well on top of the list followed by a 2 stroke then a 4 stroke.

saurian
28-04-2006, 10:20 PM
boodo,
Sounds like e-tec in your size range is the go, buy post verdict ( so far)
Try both out , etec efi 4str, and spend that money.

Geoff_Atkinson
29-04-2006, 10:29 AM
Timddo,

You obviously have not seen or heard an E-tec running. My father in law has a 100Hp Merc 4 stroke and my 90Hp E-tec is way quieter, and better on fuel.

When trolling or motoring through the 8Km/h zone in the inlet, I can have a normal conversation with whoever is standing alongside me with no shouting.

No smoke, the E-tec complies with the strictest emmission controls there are, and are actually better than most 4 strokes.

I agree with Beefa, wake up and smell the sea breeze, dont listen to all the bad publicity. Yes, E-Tecs have suffered from bad publicity in the past but BRP, with their dealer network have bent over backwards to ensure owners are well and truly satisfied with the product. The latest models seem to have all the problems ironed out, so you should be able to own one with confidence.

Maybe all the bad publicity was prompted by either manufacturers and/or dealers of 4-stroke or older technology 2 stroke opposition products because they are worried about the impact the new technology would have on their sales.

Buy the E-tec and enjoy your boating.

Cheers

Geoff

saurian
29-04-2006, 04:07 PM
Sea Raider, better check father in laws cowling again ,

phewy
29-04-2006, 05:42 PM
;D Time for some quick backpeddling. How bout, Oh sorry, my mistake, it wasnt a merc something else or sorry it was a typo I meant to say 115. Nah, no honest mistake here. Hand the man a shovel.
If you are going to make some porkies, at least get the facts right. ::)

Darren_R
29-04-2006, 08:10 PM
Gday, Sea Raider is right, I have had normal two strokes, 4 strokes and now Optimax 75. The Optimax is just as good on fuel as the 4 strokes, not quite as quiet as the 4 stroke but better performance. I would throughly recommend the Optimax.

2iar
30-04-2006, 04:24 PM
In other words, buy the same motor as I purchased, blah blah blah.. :-? :-?


No, other words were not required.

Boodoo was seeking opinions on a particular set of circumstances similar to those that I found myself in when makng a purchase, and I gave him mine (for what it's worth). Nothing more, nothing less.

I hope the collective information in the thread assists him in arriving at a decision, or at least makes it a little bit easier. It doesn't make any difference to me one way or the other what that decision is, though I hope it's the right one for him.

Exchanging opinions, knowledge and personal experience seems (to me at least) to be the most valuable purpose of any Ausfish forum. Perhaps you disagree - if so, that's your opinion and you're entitled to it. In fact, you're even welcome to express it.

Good luck,
Mike

fishn-ads
30-04-2006, 05:50 PM
I saw a promo DVD on one of last months boating mags. Yes it may be Evinrude sales department at it's best? but it does make for interesting viewing. One of you computer gurus maybe able to find it on the net and post the address. EVINRUDE E_TEC CHALLENGE E_TEC vs 4 STROKE

Ron173
30-04-2006, 06:14 PM
Mate,

GO THE ETEC, YOU WONT LOOK BACK.

Posts on here bout oil being exy etc., not true, you use so little of it.

Also the 4 strokes need heaps of servicing, that includes oil and oil filters, ETEC is 300hrs or 3yrs!! that more than makes up for SLIGHTLY (not 50%) more exy oil.

ETECS can and ARE compared with 4 strokes, because they are such high tech 2 strokes with such good fuel eco due to direct injection, that they are compared with similair 4 strokes.

Cleanest engine on planet. PERIOD.

LOOSE WEIGHT AND GIVE UP SMOKING, .... GO ETEC

Ron

phewy
30-04-2006, 06:20 PM
Mate,

GO THE ETEC, YOU WONT LOOK BACK.



Oh yes you will look back. To see how far you have to paddle back. #:D


Nah.....I'm only serious lads # ;D

Here's a link to the Infomercial DVD anyway. ;)

http://www.etectvoffer.com/

boodo
30-04-2006, 06:55 PM
many thanks lads for the info i will be sure to take all your wisdom into accout when selecting the new motor.

thanks boodo ;) ;)

Geoff_Atkinson
02-05-2006, 04:49 PM
Phewy,

No apology offered whatsoever, it turns out it is a 115 and definitely has Mercury written on the side.

And now for my version of a rather infamous quote:

"I'd rather have my Evinrude towed than drive a Merc"

Don't be so serious!!

Cheers,

Geoff

saurian
02-05-2006, 07:45 PM
Sea -Raider , i made you look , just got synical because etecs are just getting such good feedback from everyone.
I am a 4 st convert , but etecs , well i need 2 buy 90 hp/115 hp motors
in the next 6 months or so and i think i need to go in a run in a few etec powered boats before i commit big bucks....
Why so many choices

phewy
02-05-2006, 08:04 PM
Wasn't expecting an apology, certainly didnt ask for one. Just offering you a shovel for the stuff your leaving behind. So now your comparing fuel econ between a 90 hp and a 115hp???....bad enough when you stated it was a 100.
And Merc? Well I doubt whether they will ever ever need anyone to pull them out of the murky depths of total failure.

saurian
02-05-2006, 08:14 PM
Phewy,take it which ever way you want .
Good guess about fuel economy , yes fuel economy !
21 ft alloy cat , 1600 kg , 2 90/115 4 st versus 290/115 etecs.
If anyone has new 115 etec , tell us the facts.
Remember i am only " considering " etecs because of weight .
Screw the servicing costs etc..
Pity shovel is not big enough to fit monos in.... lots of them..

Dignity
03-05-2006, 10:01 AM
Thought one of the fishing/boating mags did a comparison a few mon ths ago, Don't know which one as the boss gets them from the library for me so I can't look up back issues. Maybe a search on the net will produce the goods. Phewy where is that camping site on your avatar?

sam

joey_1987
03-05-2006, 11:33 AM
Heres an article which should interest you. http://boatpoint.ninemsn.com.au/portal/alias__boatpointau/tabID__200859/ArticleID__119833/DesktopDefault.aspx Joey.

phewy
03-05-2006, 07:42 PM
Guys, I know the e-tec would suit some peoples needs over some 4's. I am not totally against them. Each to there own. Hell, if I hated them so much would I have posted the link to the e-tec infomercial dvd? ::) :)

Sam (dignity), no, its no camping site. Although we get plenty of people wanting to set up camp. It's the backyard of a Holiday house we own at Marlo, East Gippsland, Vic (where the snowy meets the sea). Thats the snowy river/estuary in the background. #8-)

saurian
03-05-2006, 08:06 PM
Joey , thanks for that , had a quick scroll through , optimax looks good
but price , well times by two . Scary.
Think 90 etec may get lots better fuel ??? ta

joey_1987
04-05-2006, 12:12 AM
I believe the results in that test were based on the FICHT 115 because it says that they couldn't get a 115 E-tec to test. I would have to say the price difference is very unusual and I am sure a call to the dealer would reveal a very similar price to the Optimax. Joey.

bushbeachboy
04-05-2006, 09:44 AM
Questions about service costs on an E-Tec: If you don't get it serviced for 3 years, what is the cost of the first and subsequent services? Do Evinrude dealers miss out on income by not servicing the E-Tecs for 3 years? Does it get 'caught up' over the next 3 years or so? What are the recommended service intervals after the first 3 years?

I'm not asking to be a detractor or a smart ar$e, but out of interest. Getting the 4 stroke serviced every 6 months regardless of the amount of use gives me the $hits.
Cheers

madman1
04-05-2006, 10:06 AM
Etec services after the three years is no dearer than servicing a two stroker.

saurian
05-05-2006, 07:58 PM
Madman 1, all sounds too good to be true......
I think by being human we are waiting for the hit in the hip pocket.
Have etecs been out 3 yrs ??? 90hp ones , has anyone got a cost for 300 hr service ???
Bushbeachboy , if it is normal price at 300hrs they start looking good
yeh ???

Dignity
05-05-2006, 09:28 PM
phewy, verrrry nice, hope you put it to good use

sam

MTS_-_fish_magnet
05-05-2006, 10:51 PM
The reason he might have to use the E-Tec oil is that I believe you can reprogramme the E-Tec to use the E-Tec synthetic oil. The good news is that it uses X% less oil than normal oil. If you want to go back to normal oil then just get it reprogrammed again. I must admit I'd tend to use normal oil as you never know when you might just get stuck without access to synthetic oil.

I'm going to go the E-Tec 150 on my new boat. I can't believe how quiet, fuel efficient, hole shot power and weight when compared to 4 strokes. Boats = 2 strokes, cars = 4 strokes no question. I originally had set my mind on a Honda 4 stroke until I started researching the E-Tec. [I've got a Masters Degree in Engineering and tend to overanalyse my mechanical purchase choices!!]

We've all been conned by the marketers over the past few years who for some reason have sent us down a 4-stroke path.

Go E-Tec....

sjp
06-05-2006, 06:48 AM
bought 60 efi tiller yamaha 4 stroke $7800 last year
priced 60 etec tiller yesterday $10,000 :o
i.ll stick with my yammie

saurian
06-05-2006, 08:25 PM
SJP, FEW THOUSAND REASONS TO BE HAPPY ,

Dignity
07-05-2006, 09:19 AM
The reason he might have to use the E-Tec oil is that I believe you can reprogramme the E-Tec to use the E-Tec synthetic oil. #....

As Sol says "Oils aint' oils". All TCW3 compliant oils (which is all of them now) are synthetic.


We've all been conned by the marketers over the past few years who for some reason have sent us down a 4-stroke path.


Your are so right here, the use of brand specified oil is pure marketing and not legally binding either. I still prefer the e-tecs though.

sam

saurian
08-05-2006, 08:37 PM
Dignity , sounds like real fiction to me .
What can we believe ...???
What amazes me is motor technology is like ford vs holden.
Both go fast and great , but oil is probably the same...
Choices, why so many ???

mcgilld
09-05-2006, 12:22 PM
coupla thoughts-
they look and sound like an awesome motor but:
Anyone who doesn't pull the lower section off a motor after 18 months max is asking for trouble.
I also watched the e-tec promo video and the 'duelling motor' comparison looks like a croc of shit. 13mph versus 30mph - we are talking about the same horse power at similar rev levels aren't we? That had to be a stacked deck. Of course there was no talk of the prop selections, just standard (there is no such thing as a standard prop pitch).

Ocean_Spirit
09-05-2006, 04:11 PM
If you have a look in your E-TEC owner's manual it outlines what is required at your 300Hr service. It is virtually identical to the guidelines applicable to the old carb Evinrude service manual, with the exception of a few unneccessary procedures and the advent of a computer system. Hence, normal aspects such as Gear Oil, Water Pump, Filters, Grease Pivot Points, Spark Plugs, Check Computer for Codes etc.

Even still, what harm is done by having the lower unit dropped every 12 months, new gear oil, new plugs and the Computer Checked, for the sake of a couple of hundred dollars for peace of mind, particularly if you are doing a lot of long range offshore work and rely on a single engine. In terms of longevity and resale value, this would also help.

saurian
12-05-2006, 09:42 PM
Makes sense ocean & mc, good to have another view of typically 2 sided
responses. ta

eugah
15-05-2006, 10:23 AM
I have a 90 Optimax on my boat & it is excellent. I have never owned a 4 stroke but a friend has a Yamaha with carbies & it has caused him no end of trouble.

Dignity
15-05-2006, 07:12 PM
What can we believe ...???

saurian, it's all marketing. you only have to sort the wheat from the chaff

sam

Monza
15-05-2006, 11:17 PM
Have a look at this web site

http://www.oceanskiffjournal.com/SubscriberContent/Articles/Vol01Issue05/General/ETEC1.aspx

Seems to have a pretty good crack at debunking (and validating) some of the ETEC myths and facts