Sounder Reading

[iank]

This post is in responce to some comments made on a thred in the saltwater section started by Burley_Boy, ref sounders, some of the comments were of the nature that some people have not seen an arch on their sounder and were wondering if the arch was a fallacy. While out fishing today I took the following photos of my sounder and have explained my interpatation of what is shown. The sounder used is a lowrance X97, it is set on auto for all of the photos, and the boat is drifting. Can users of other model sounders post some photos on this thred as well so that people new to the game may get some Idea of what they are looking at.
Photo 1 scattered schools of bait

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/sounder_001.jpg

[iank]

Photo 2 arrows numbered 1 are scattered fish (queenfish of 50-80cm
arrow number 2 school of bait

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/sounder_004.jpg

[iank]

Photo 3 school of active fisf in this case more queenies but with the odd golden trev mixed in with them

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/sounder_007.jpg

[iank]

Photo 4 a school of fish holding on the edge of a drop off, arrow points at what I would calla single fish

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/sounder_008.jpg

[iank]

Photo 5 this is it a complete arch as well as a partial arch 2or3 smaller fish here. arrow points to a small bait ball

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/sounder_009.jpg

[iank]

Photo 6 not your classic arch but close enough, 3or 4 large fish shown here with the top fish moveing down to the bottom

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/sounder_010.jpg

[iank]

Photo 7 the classic arch by 2

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/sounder_012.jpg

[iank]

Photo 8 2 large fish moveing thru

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/sounder_013.jpg

[iank]

Photo 9 not of sounder but the only golden trev I landed today in amongst about 30-40 queenies, after taking the photos I spent the rest of the time dropping plastics the the schools of fish.
Ian

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/sounder_016.jpg

[CHRIS_aka_GWH]

excellent idea - i'll see if i can get some on film of estuary stuff around the pin -

notice class the degree of snowing in ian's shots - he's got the sensitivity up & if he's like me the filters off

[blaze]

Hi Ian
Thats really top stuff, if I wonder out over the weekend I will get some pics of my crap sounder and put up, prob be just bottom as there seems to be no fish at the moment, think they have all gone for warmer pastures
cheers
blaze

[CHRIS_aka_GWH]

back the tail of ya boat over one of those salmon farm nets blaze - that should show some arches :o

[ANYFISH]

good work on the picks

[Robbo_Townsville]

Looks like a top days fishing under that sounder.

[Heath]

Snaffled some of these pics from a post back in December ;D

This is a pic of a ledge we fish for Snapper. Typically it is a reef rising from the sand. Notice on the left how thick the bottom is shown, this is sand. Less reflection = more absorbion of the sonar signal so a thinner line. Notice on the right how thick the bottom is, this is reef. Harder surface = more reflection.

You see the bait schools holding on the reef. The one closest the top will be a bait school or similar. The larger shoals are squire & snapper.

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/snappermarka1.jpg

[Heath]

This one shows the same reef but I have it in split screen mode. The left side is at 2x zoom.

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/sounder05102003a.jpg

[Heath]

Setting your gain is probly the most important thing you can do. I set my sounder to 100% & then back it off until the area I am looking for fish is clear. This means you may have some degree of surface clutter.

In this picture I have split screen, running 50khz on the left & 200khz on the right. Notice the surface clutter all the way down to around 40m. I was not interested in anything else higher in the water column, just down deep. Notice how the bottom looks. A big thick bottom with a fuzzy looking appearance towards the bottom of the screen. This is wire weed on reef. You can see the difference between it & the first pic of a hard coral & rock reef. The schools of fish were a mixture of slimys, squire, pearlies, sharks, YTK, Cobia & a host of other fish.

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/sounder30082003a.jpg

[Heath]

In this image you will notice 2 horizontal lines on the screen. That is my live bait, right in the strike zone. Ealier that morning I watched a line descend to my bait, it was a fish of some sort checking my livie out, but I didn't get the chance to get a picture. My livie is right at the level of the bait ball on the screen. Notice a clear patch on the bait ball? This is where a predator has raced through it & scattered the bait. You can also see some large fish (arches )hanging around the bait ball.
The thick bottom gives it away as reef, with growth a depicted by the fuzzy appearance.

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/aaaaaa.jpg

[Heath]

When bait is dense, it's sometimes difficult to see large predators. But the old saying " Wheres there smoke, theirs fire " usually rings true as far as bait is concerned.

[iank]

Heath great photos, could you give a bit of info on what brand and model you are useing so that we can compare what the pic is like on different sounders.
Cheers Ian :)

[vertico]

ill get some shots off my matrix 25 and post them
Id like you to see what is hanging around my spot X
cos I dont know what it is , hangs around mid water
will post some pics soon

[Heath]

Ooooops, forgot that Ian.

Lowrance X88DF [smiley=2thumbsup.gif]

[loozitt]

Excellent photo's guy's.

This is what fishing is about, finding the fish. I know alot of people that go to there fav spot anchor up and drop a line and wait. I'm the opposite. I chase them all day, using my sounder.

Another thing I'd like to mention, is that alot of us spend thousands on buying an expensive boat to suit our fishing needs, but skimp on spending a few extra dollars on a half descent sounder. (The sounder is the most important tool on the boat, and is often overlooked)

[blaze]

Hi all
Keep the pics coming love looking with the interpretations of whats happening
great stuff
cheers
blaze

[Burley_Boy]

Brilliant Iank, thanks for taking this post further.
To compare I'll get some shots of my cheapie sounder (Bottom of the range Hummingbird SX100) and we can see the difference spending a few extra bob can do.

[JB]

Top report fellas, one of the best i have seen in ages. ;D

[Cloud_9]

will try to do same next trip with my colour sounder. have some good spots off the gold coast.

Cheers Cloud 9

[jimbamb]

Good stuff blokes!!.
This is one of the best threads i have seen .Thanx for sharin valuable info with mugs like me who had no idea wat we are lookin at.

[MTpockets]

Hope the weather settles long enough for the boys to get some good shots. Cant wait to see some more posted, getting very interesting....
cheers
Les

[Heath]

Found another pic.

Kirra bait schools in summer. Big fat juice slimys being molested by small Blacks 30 - 60kg

The big game boats pulled fish off here all day every day for about 4 weeks straight.

Us???? Well..... we only wanted the slimys for mackerel baits ;D

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/sounder07022004b.jpg

[Heath]

A pic of our old sounder. Didn't know what we were missing until we got a good sounder. The same ground we had been fishing for 3 years took on a whole new meaning with increased visabilty from a quality sounder.

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/baitsounder.jpg

[Mr__Bean]

Learning HEAPS here guys, please keep it coming.

- Bean

[smerl]

Rob,

I'd be interested in hearing your report on the Raymarine too. Those digital colour sounders look to be the way of the future.

Cheers,

Smerl

[tonyp]

this is a Fishmark 480. In freshwater dam, all on manual .
Bass on bottom and not wanting to chew my lure. Boat was drifting very slowy over these fish.

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/IMG_0322.JPG

[tonyp]

a tad more active but still no luck,different small school

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/bassjpg.JPG

[blaze]

Any chance one of the mods can make this one sticky, I think it is a real good learning tool.
cheers
blaze

[CHRIS_aka_GWH]

what was lowered doen tony (line mid screen) - were you jigging?

[iank]

At last no wind :D :D
This photo shows a school of small school mackrel ( 40-50cm) had to drop a jig down to find out what they were.
Ian

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/macks_001.jpg

[iank]

this photo shows clumps( arrows) of weed that is kelp like in looks but the leaves are only about 1 inch wide, the water was clear enough to see the bottom.
Ian

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/macks_006.jpg

[moondancer]

This thread is worth millions! WHilst I am still big time in learning mode, I hope to be able to add to the amazing wisdom & learning that this site brings together. Goes to show how such a strong common bond in fishing brings out the best, and the generosity in people~!

Thanks to all who have contributed to far - my turn will come (probably as a question!!)
Lawry

[iank]

What has happened to the weather, 2 windless days in a row, shot out for another quick fish this morning and took the following photo.
This is what 10-12kg spanish mackrel look like on my sounder (hooked one about 4 seconds after takeing this photo, the vertical lines in the pic are interference from a boat powered by a 4 stroke about 20 meters away, have found 4 strokes cause this up to about 50 meters away with some models being worst then others.
Ian

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/bot_wash_001.jpg

[scott_b]

Gday Ian
This is great ,I havn't been on much lately so its the first time I've seen it. Have you got any pics of the mack ?. Hows the temp up there ,has been down to -10 here.
Great to see a helpfull post wamjam

[iank]

Hey Scott,
How is the cod fishing going with those temps, I think I would just stay in bed all winter untill the weather got up to at least 20 degrees. I thought it was bad last week when we got down to 14 over night for 2 days in a row and all of the shops up here sold out of warm gear, tonights forcast is for 19 over night up to 31 tomorrow. Did'nt get any photos of the mack, they are that thick at the moment that in 2 trips totaling 4an1/2 hours on the water trolling lures we have caught 4 spanish and 14 school macks plus 1 longtail that deceided that it to liked crazy deeps. When do you look like getting up here again?
Talk to you again soon,
Ian

[scott_b]

Too right mate too bloody cold for any fishing but cant stay in bed ,this mob I work for think I got to turn up every day. Hope too get up in the near future.
wamjam

[MTpockets]

good stuff Ian :)

[Heath]

the vertical lines in the pic are interference from a boat powered by a 4 stroke about 20 meters away, have found 4 strokes cause this up to about 50 meters away with some models being worst then others.
Ian


Yes, my sounder does the same thing, but I also found that other sounders of the same model on other boats if fishing in close proximity can cause this as well.

[Heath]

Wall to wall Pearlies. Sorry bout the reflection ;D

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/sounder26042004.jpg

[iank]

What has gone wrong with the weather , a weekend with perfect fishing /boating conditions. ;D ;D
Photo this time is of a small school of GT's in the 5kg range.
Sorry about the poor photo
Ian

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/adam_zane_001.jpg

[iank]

again wall to wall queenfish

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/adam_zane_007.jpg

[blaze]

Hi Ian
How big would that schoal of queenies be in numbers
cheers
blaze

[SeaSaw]

I can count 12 ::)

Well, you can see about 12 individual fish swimming into the school on the left hand side and then about 6 leaving the school on the right. Notice how the thickness of the school gets larger as fish join in and then thins as individual fish leave.

[SeaSaw]

I took a few pictures on Friday night while I was out, but they didn't come out very well. Any hints appreciated. Should I use the Sports function to reduce the chance of blurring ?

I'll attache one of the photos - this shows a school of undersized Pearl Perch (the left half of the screen is bottom zoom and the right is normal).

Thanks,

Mark

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/Web_000_0335.jpg

[Somethn_Fishy]

hi everyone,

Thanks for all the info on this thread it is one of the best i have read. I am only just starting to fish out wide off the Tweed and this site Rocks.. Hopefully can get a few posts on hewre with ics myself one day... got to get some bragging size fish to pose for me though..

Thanks all.

[MICHAELG]

yes a great thread

I plan on being on the water some time this w'end, will try and get some shots of my NAVMAN 4500 colour

Michael

[Burley_Boy]

Here is a picture of my SX100 at the 24fathoms. Note that this is only a 100W unit and the picture just shows the bottom (ie that there is one) composition is tricky to pick up at that depth at least for me but its over a reef bottom. Sorry about the fuzzyness but it was moving a bit at the time.

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/SX100-1.jpg

[Burley_Boy]

So at the 24fathoms I'd get pumelled by a whale before it would register on the sounder but here I've come in a lot shallower (still a few K's out the seaway and I spotted this contour. The sensitivity is on Max but I'd say there is enough structure there to mark the point and I'll be interested in checking this spot with my new Matrix37X that has just been fitted.
There was definitely both reef and reef fish at this point.

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/SX100-3.jpg

[Snap]

Went out wed 30th to Barwon Banks, took a few snaps but only one was any good. i was a bit late on this shot but you can see the fish to the left of the screen.
Pearl perch & iodine bream.
Catch was good, parrots, pearls, moses perch & 1 snapper with knob among others.
As for input to current thread, i run my sounder in man, fish id off & wick wound up to 8-9/10. Cant see much up top but that dosen't matter when your bottom bashing.

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/ju_04_sounder.jpg

[Cloud_9]

was at sommerset the other weekend and missed the perfect shot. screen of the matrix 20 i bought for the tinny was a wash with slashs, we got slammed fish after fish 45-50cm bass. too slow with the camera :-[ :-[
but when the fishies are bittin the camera sits there till one comes on board and sounder pic are for quiet times. :o
some top shots there fellers.

Cheers Cloud 9

[Mortalkombat]

Furuno 582l Riv ground in 250 FATHOMS

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/FUR1A.jpg

[Mortalkombat]

Same day a few boat took a number of Blues to 150kg off this area

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/FURBAT1.jpg

[Mortalkombat]

same bait

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/FURBAT2.jpg

[Mortalkombat]

I had 4 hits from small blacks off this bait school solo it was mayhem!!!!

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/bat4.jpg

[Mortalkombat]

same bait

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/blk2.jpg

[Mortalkombat]

another pic

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/bl3.jpg

[Mortalkombat]

last one wasnt to good so try this one this bait was huge and the small blacks were down current of it maybe 500m i had the hits then found out why they were there! BAIT! the depth is in fathoms

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/bait33.jpg

[Mortalkombat]

what was feeding on this bait

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/billy33.jpg

[Sportfish_5]

I wish you guys would get your GPS connected to those flash new colour sounders ;)

[Mortalkombat]

Why? Sportfish lol

[bakes]

good stuff guys this post is awsome nice fish there mortalkombat

[Smithy]

Missed this post first time round. Thanks for the link in the current sounder post SeaSaw.

Rob Mackmauler,

just curious to know why you changed your 760 to the new 600?

[dazza]

hi all
finally got some pix organised.
i have a lowerance x70a with an 8 deg thru hull transducer. it is a great old sounder.
this pic is a patch of bait with red emperor hanging on it the reds are the block looking pattern in the middle of the bait. on our sounder reds show up "blocky" we don't really see arches, snapper, pearlies etc show up as arches. there are a few hanging around the bottom of the bait school
taken in 49 meters. the reds are down off of the ledge (far left of photo). best we draged out of here was a 9kg model.
cheers
dazza

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/redshow1_1.JPG

[dazza]

another patch of reds.
they are to the left of the bait school. turned out to be a heap of little buggers with a couple of legal sized ones spread through them.
one day the old sounder is going to give up the ghost. will be interesting learning how to use one of those you beaut new colour jobbies ;D ;D
cheers
dazza

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/redshow2_1.JPG

[adrian]

this post is great as i just got a new sounder and from this site i'm learning heaps already can't wait to get out and try mine

anzac

[Shazbanger]

Why do the fish show as an arch shape? and not a fish shape ???

[Sportfish_5]

Shazbanger - Follow this link and it explains why you see fish arches ;D ;D ;D ;D


http://www.lowrance.com/Tutorials/Sonar/sonar_tutorial_10.asp#Why%20Fish%20Arch

Cheers

Greg

[Shazbanger]

Thanks for that article made alot of sense! 8)

[Render]

Heath, mate...

Brace yourself for what I am about to tell you.

Some plagiarizing toe-rag has taken your posts and pics from this thread and sold them to B&B magazine! :o :o

As if that wasn't enough, he's also stolen your first name and added an obviously-fake, unfeasibly complicated surname beginning with 'Z'. I reckon he came up with it by running his finger across the bottom row of his keyboard, meself.

If you decide to have this shady character up before the courts, you can count on me to stand witness for you, mate.

Honestly, society these days!

Cheers,

r

[ballast]

Thanks for all the info guys. This is an excellent post.
I have just bought a second hand boat which has a Lowerance X75, this is a bit of a step up from my HB wide one hundred on my old c,console. I am really enjoying all the features and am looking forward to playing with the settings after the info from this post. However the sounder is doing something strange and I was wondering if anyone might have any clues as to why.
The screen tends to fade out almost so much as to be unreadable. At first i thought it may be a contrast thing, but when I was looking for the contrast setting I found the DIGI screen which shows a display of volts. The fadeing seems to be related to a drop in volts whether the moter is running or not does not seem to matter. I have cleaned and tightened the battery terminals, but is no better.
I was hoping some one else may have seen the same problem and have some advice.
Again thanks for the post, Keep them coming.
Cheers, Brad.

[Leo_N.]

I had a similar problem a while back. Re-wired just about everything before realising that my battery was on it's way out. My advice is to try it with another battery. If that doesn't help then it is likely to be your wiring itself. If your outboard has an alternator connected to the battery (as your post indicates), and there is no difference between running or not, then maybe it is more likely the wiring. A multimeter would help - checking the voltage coming out of your battery and then at every other point that you can will identify the problem quite quickly.

[ballast]

Thanks Leo_N.
I will try your advice. Very frustrating as it seems to be able to tell when I just about to where that secret bombie I was told about when it fades out. Other than that it certainly is an advantage to have a decent sounder, albeit an older one. Makes me wish I had upgraded ages ago.
Cheers, Brad.

[Heath]

Heath, mate...

Brace yourself for what I am about to tell you.

Some plagiarizing toe-rag has taken your posts and pics from this thread and sold them to B&B magazine! #:o #:o

As if that wasn't enough, he's also stolen your first name and added an obviously-fake, unfeasibly complicated surname beginning with 'Z'. I reckon he came up with it by running his finger across the bottom row of his keyboard, meself.

If you decide to have this shady character up before the courts, you can count on me to stand witness for you, mate.

Honestly, society these days!

Cheers,

r

WHAT!!!! The bastard!!!!! ;D
Damn good looking bloke in real life though :P

I get some of my ideas for article content from this site. Especially when a topic such as sounders gets huge interest, makes sence that the readers would most likely be finding the same difficulties as us here on the site. I like to throw something different in, especially when the fishing has been slow.
The pictures and comments contained in this thread beats hands down what any book or manual tries to tell you.

[Burley_Boy]

Yep Heath that the pickies and comments here beats any manual is a sure thing. I gave my new Matrix 37 a run last weekend offshore onthe 24's and 36's. What an eye opener compared to my old SX100! :)
Still heaps to learn and I came back and read through all these posts again. Used the whiteline function but it seemed to make the unit less sensitive but I'll have to check that again. That there were peaks of 10M just a few K's out of the seaway was news to me and to see fish sitting over the edges of the ledges was fantastic. Now I just have to work on my anchoring technique to spot target where I want to fish ::)

[wessel]

This may sound a bit stupid, but here goes???

The sonar pics up the airsac in the fish - which gives you the return. As far as I know, and forgive me for being wrong if I am, but tuna do not have airsacs.

So where does the return come from then that you see on the sounder - just the size of the buggers or what?

Never too old to learn something new

Wessel

PS: Very frustrating day when you stand on shore and can see the tuna feeding in massive schools of sardines not even a kilometer offshore and the boss decides to have a meeting that will last till after dark - work sucks on ocasions like this. No wind, 30 deg C weather , sea swell less than 1 foot high, water temp at 27 deg C and three more days before the weekend.

[littlejim]

Ballast,

you might have done this already, but just in case. Check the power plug where it goes into the sounder. Mine corrodes readily, and if the corrosion builds up produces problems similar to yours. WD40 plus a few push-ons pull-offs seems to fix it till next time. Periodic WD and vaseline helps keep the corosion at bay.

[Leo_N.]

Wessel,
Depth sounders work on the rebounding of sound waves. Many things will rebound sound waves to some degree, but a change in density (from low density to higher density) will return some of the sound wave energy in terms of a rebound sound wave. This is what your reciever recieves and conveys to the sounder for interpretation. For example, thermoclines often exist in lakes where there is little mixing of water - the lower layer is colder and therefore more dense. The transition between the two layers represents a rapid change in density and will therefore show up on your sounder (if sensitivity is high enough). Likewise, swim bladders are filled with air and therefore represent a large contrast in density to the fish tissue. Fish with large swim bladders are therefore more likely to show up more clearly on a sounder. However there is also a difference in density between the water and the fish tissue, so fish without swim bladders will still show up, but may have different type of "show" than those with swim bladders.

If anyone doubts this, try dropping a metal jig down to the bottom near the transducer (definately no swim bladder) - you should be able to see it sinking on the sounder.

[ballast]

Cheers Littlejim.
I will give that a go as well. I called in to Super Cheap and bought a super cheap and nasty multimeter as per Leo_N's advice,so I will give it a check over tomorrow arvo. Thanks again for the replies,I'll let you know what I discover.
Cheers, Brad.

[Burley_Boy]

I'm with Leo on that swim bladder stuff. ;)

[adrian]

Heath, mate...

Brace yourself for what I am about to tell you.

Some plagiarizing toe-rag has taken your posts and pics from this thread and sold them to B&B magazine!

As if that wasn't enough, he's also stolen your first name and added an obviously-fake, unfeasibly complicated surname beginning with 'Z'. I reckon he came up with it by running his finger across the bottom row of his keyboard, meself.

If you decide to have this shady character up before the courts, you can count on me to stand witness for you, mate.

Honestly, society these days!

Cheers,

if this guy had asked us then maybe we might have said ok but this low life should be taken to court

to ausfish
maybe the chat borads should be made password only
Anzac

[Heath]

PML at Anzac ;D ;D ;D ;D

I don't think its too much to worry about mate 8)

[Cheech]

So Heath, we have you, Brian, Greg, Flathead Fred that write for B&B. I think I recall Jeremy do a few writeups of his club as well. Are there any others hidden under an alias? Just curious. Adds a different dimention to reading a magazine when you feel like you sort of know the contributors.

Cheech

[mr_phishy]

HERES A PIC OF MY NEW RIG, LCX 15MT, STILL LEARNING HOW TO MAKE THE MOST OF IT. IT REPLACES MY X51.

IT IS IN SIMULATOR MODE SO DONT ASK ABOUT THE CHART DIPSPLAY!!

MY CUSTOM BOX IS GREAT, COULD SIT ON IT ITS SO STRONG!!

MICK

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/DSCN2259.JPG

[Heath]

So Heath, we have you, Brian, Greg, Flathead Fred that write for B&B. I think I recall Jeremy do a few writeups of his club as well. Are there any others hidden under an alias? Just curious. Adds a different dimention to reading a magazine when you feel like you sort of know the contributors.

Cheech
You also have Clutter & Mono (Mark Stuart) as well. Bill Corton sometimes sticks his head in & oh' don't forget Nugget as well. Oh almost forgot.... Alan Deaner is on here as well.

[bidkev]

A brillaint thread and most informative. can anyone give me their take on these 3 pics. It would be interesting to see how different individuals would interpret them.

cheers

kev

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/sdr.jpg

[bidkev]

pic 2

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/sdr1.jpg

[bidkev]

pic 3

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/sdr2.jpg

[blaze]

ok I am just bumping this cause i think its too good of a learning tool to disapear, hope to put mine own pics to it when i get some
Maybe it could be edited and made sticky
cheers
blaze

[mini696]

OK I'll give this a go... I have only learnt how to interpret them through this topic.

Very simply
1. Thermocline at 40m (feet?) Wrong
2. Larger predators above this thermocline Wrong
3. Baitfish belowwrong

As for specific species I guess you cant tell until you drop a hook down there.

[banshee]

G'day Mini,I think you'll find number 1 is the bottom,number 2 could be worth a drop,but the lack of structure would say to me they are on the move and number 3 are the echo tails.

King tin,I have a unit similar to this and I find it better to run the screen split three ways,a zoom showing the bottom third of the water column,a full top to bottom window and A scope to show what is exactly under the boat at any given time.

[mini696]

Wow... How wrong was I...

F for me!!

Is the bottom hard there??

[mini696]

I was looking at that completly out of scale!!

Dumb-arse!! :-X [smiley=dunce.gif]

[swoffa]

Hi guys,
I'm new to this site (although a few of you should know me from around the traps). A mate emailed me the link to this thread and I have to say it's one of the most educational threads I've ever seen on a fishing site.

I recently installed a Garmin 160 Blue on my boat and I'm haveing trouble setting #it up and getting clear readings. Has anyone else played with this unit?
Mine is installed on my Minn Kota so I can see it up the front, ie. it doesn't get used when I'm underway. I also have a crappy Raymarine sounder at the rear of the boat, I only trust that sounder for bottom structure and occasional holding fish.

I mainly fish shallow water for bream and jews, so I should be able to distinguish fish from structure. At the moment I'm running it on dual frequency (50khz and 200khz) and running most of the seeting on "auto" (gain, noise reduction, range etc.). All I'm getting is either a mostly blank screen or heaps of patches and dots coming through. I can't get anything resembling an arch, I can only distinguish fish when the symbols are turned on. Any pointers on fine tuning the setup? Ie. adjusting the gain and noise reduction.

If it's ok with you guys I'll take some pics of the screen while watching my other sounder on fish symbols so I know what's fish and what's not, and I'll post them up for you gus to interpret. #:)

Thanks in advance,
Andrew

[blaze]

Hi Andrew
first up welcome
This is indeed a good learning tool and it is good to see it back at the top again, post some pics of your sounder in action. Must do the same myself (weather gods are ya listening)
cheers
blaze

[swoffa]

Thanks mate.
I just remembered that my Minn Kota is with BLA getting fixed, so I can't use that sounder until I get the motor back. I'll get some pics asap.

[gunna]

Hi guys,
I'm new to this site (although a few of you should know me from around the traps). A mate emailed me the link to this thread and I have to say it's one of the most educational threads I've ever seen on a fishing site.

Andrew

Surprised it took you so long to get here Swoff. You might also know me - I cooked you a barby breakfast not so long back. You are 100% correct with the above statement. You almost got to see it previously because I thought it was so good I posted a link to it on Sportsfish about 2 months back. Unfortunately they deleted my post within minutes. Bloody inter-forum rivalry goes too far sometimes. Site owners should see the value to their members thats in a post like this and let it ride.

[swoffa]

Peter? I can't remember who was cooking the bbq that day...

I thought I'd signed up here before, but I had to register yesterday, now I'll never get any work done.

The inter site rivalry gets to me to, especially with a thread as useful as this. In the past when asking boat questions I've had to post them on 3 sites instead of one with a link on the other 2... I guess it'll be 4 sites now. :o

[gunna]

You will find this one HEAPS better than the Sydney site. But you will get the shites with the fishing reports. Very jealous I am.#

[Heath]

You'll find "BREAM" is almost a dirty word here ;D ;D ;D

No intentional malice is/was intended by the above comment. My thoughts and comments are my own and not expressly viewed or endorsed by the wider fishing community. Basically if it fits on a 8/0 hook it goes out as live bait.....

[swoffa]

You'll find "BREAM" is almost a dirty word here ;D ;D ;D



That's alright, I spend most of my time talking about bream on the other sites, it'll be a welcome change to hang out here. ::)

[aussiebasser]

Hi swoffa.
1. Try to avoid running the sounder off the same battery as the Minn Kota.
2. Try running just the front sounder on it's own.
3. Check for interference by trying the sounder with the Minn running and without.

[swoffa]

Thanks Dale.
I'm running the MK and front sounder off the same battery and haven't had any issues so far. I was planning to run it off my other battery but haven't had the need.
I've tried turning my rear sounder off and haven't noticed a difference on the front on. Is it likely that the 2 transducers would interfere with eachother?

There's no interference by having the MK running.

[swoffa]

I finally got around to taking some pics of the Garmin. I'm keen to hear everybodies theories on what is showing up and how I can set it up to be more accurate.


I played around with the "gain" and "noise reduction" for the following pics.

Picture 1:
Noise Reduction: Auto
Gain: Normal

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/sdr2.jpg

[swoffa]

Picture 2

Noise: Auto
Gain: Normal

(my other crappy sounder was marking fish near the bottom when I took this pic, which is what I assume is showing on the right hand side)

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/sounderpic2.jpg

[swoffa]

Picture 3

Noise: 90%
Gain: Normal

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/souderpic3.jpg

[swoffa]

Picture 4

Noise: Auto
Gain: +2

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/sounderpic4.jpg

[swoffa]

Picture 5

Noise: Auto
Gain: +2

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/sounderpic5.jpg

[swoffa]

Picture 6

Noise: Auto
Gain: +2

You'll notice in this shot that there's a vertical mark under the ground level on the right hand side, this happens when I press the power control on my Minn Kota.

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/sounderpic6.jpg

[swoffa]

Does anyone know what the vertical lines are that are showing up in all the pics?
I can get rid of them by turning the noise reduction to 100%, but I fear it won't pic up much when set like that.

Thanks in advance.

Andrew

[dfox]

Looks like you have to sounders on at the same time mate, all those vertical bars look like interference from another unit...foxy

[swoffa]

I'm running 2 sounders at the same time. Do I have to turn the other one off or can I do something to stop them interferring with eachother?

[Fordo]

Swoffa,
I don't think you are going to be able to stop one sounder interfering with the other.
I think you'll find its stray return signals from one transducer hitting the other transducer.
Do you get similar vertical lines on both units?
And if you turn one unit off do you still get the vertical lines?

The lines under the bottom reading from the Minnkota started is another problem I think you'll find.

Fordo

[swoffa]

The sounder at the rear doesn't show interference from the front one. I'll try turning thr back one off next time and see how it shows up.

[swoffa]

What's everyones opinions on the other marks showing up on the screen? ???

Fish? singles of bait schools?
Structure?

Also, how should I set up the noise reduction and gain? ???

[Fordo]

Swoffa,
Here a link if it works to Humminbirds troubleshooting page to do with Trolling motors. http://www.humminbird.com/generic2.asp?ID=435

It may give something to try or look at

Regards Fordo

[swoffa]

Thanks Fordo.

The unit itself seems to be working alright as far as power goes, and now I know that the other sounder is causing the interference I can just turn it off or put up with the marks.

My question is more about interpreting the display and setting up the unit to show fish and not all the other crap. I want some tips on what setting to adjust to give the most accurate display, and how to read the display. (ie. what's structure, what's fish schools and what's individual fish?)

I was kinda hoping that someone could go through the sturctures shown in some of my photo's and tell me what they see them as being...

[swoffa]

I stopped the interference by running the sounder on 200Hz only.

Now I have to install a grounding wire to reduce further interference from the maxxum feature on the MK.

[iank]

swoffa,
Here go's my best guest, pics 1, 3 and 4 interference.
pic2, 2 fish on right hand side of sounder.
pic5 2 ledges, lower one looks likes it has a overhang, bait holding over them.
pic6, hard to say but here go's, top line a fish moveing down closer to the bottom, middle fuzzy line, fish right on edge of tranducer cone or a steam of bait fish, bottom line a fish or more likely some thing suspended/anchored off the bottom. Hang a bait/plastic
directly under the transducer next time you are out and you will see what I mean.
Cheers Ian

[swoffa]

Thanks for that Ian. There seems to be some consistency in what everyone is saying, which is helping be to read the sounder.

I installed the grounding wire (connected the -ve of both batteries), I haven't noticed a difference but it should help prolong the life of the Garmin.

[Burley_Boy]

I run a Matrix 37 and am curious if others have preferences using the whiteline/structure ID / or the inverse function. I'm getting better with this unit but there is heaps more to learn.
thanks

[iank]

was out chaseing sails on monday when I took this photo, sorry about the quality. What the solid red shows is wall to wall bludger trevally that would gang rape the pushers every time we got this show, in the end whoever did'nt hook one had bragging rights, caught them on pushers,plastics and fly. Raised 7 sails for 5 shots and missed them all :)
Ian

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/dundee_006.jpg

[iank]

one of the bludgers jigged up on a snapback.
Ian

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/dundee_004.jpg

[devocean]

Love catching those buggers

[qcr]

I Guess you could say I just bumped this, but has anyone more recent info as an amature this thread is fantastic and has alredy solved some of my problems.
Thanks

[stunnedmullet]

I have to agree with many others that this is an incredibly invaluable post. Especially coming from someone who is in the process of deciding on a fish finder/sounder for a 4.2m tinnie. On that point I have been looking at Lowrance X47, X47 E and Eagle. I know I should spend more but after doing the finances on a new 420 Quintrex explorer and a 30hp Yammy I need to make do as best I can. I will predominatly be using the outfit in Nth Qld creek systems. I know that this is in a different ball park to the previous discussions which centred on offshore hints, but I think info for the estuary fisho would be greatly appreciated.
Leaning towards Lowrance at present as it seems to have the best pixel resolution for that price....as I know I can get the x47 bought an installed for $300. Does anyone have any thoughts on this model ???

[stu68]

Hi mullet,I"ve got a lowrance x47e I"m very happy with it it does a great job for the price.It gives good reading at speed and the zoom gives pretty good detail.I payed $250 a year ago ,so you have got a good price for $300 bucks installed.What got me in was the size of the screen,after 20 years of welding the eyes aren"t as good as they could be.
I own a 4.2 wide body Quintrex, happy with that to.
Cheers stu. ;D ;D

[stunnedmullet]

Thanks heaps for the feedback Stu. Yep I can get the X47 bought and installed for very around $310 but the X47e is about $50 more. Both have exactly the same functions just that the X47e has a bit bigger screen. I thought that a Lowrance would be a quality product but with so many about(and me not bein an electronics genius) just wanted to make sure I was on the right track.
As a matter of interest Stu what make of quinny do you have and what pushes it.
The mullet ;D

[stu68]

Hi Mullet
It"s a 4.2 widebody dory it"s got a 30hp 2 stroke Merc on the back.I"ve also got a handheld lowrance ifinder gps which I"m still
trying to work out, I should read the instruction book 1st ;D ;D
cheers

[Wyoming]

Guys, I have recently purchased a new Navman 4600 that I bought based on its published specs. It looks fantastic in the boat but it CAN'T FIND ONE DECENT FISH IN THE ENTIRE MORETON BAY!! I spent over $1k, got the big screen (bigger than a drive-in according to Treasure) and it still can't find a decent fish.

In fairness, it has only been fitted for the last couple of weeks and it will get a proper work-out over the weekend. I'm going to try for a cod or a tailor (or anything suicidal) at Amity and around the Rainbow. I also fitted up the matching Navman 560 GPS and I am really impressed with it. It has the best daylight screen and the screen regenerates really fast, much better than the Furuno that I was previouly used to and about 25% of the cost. The final piece of the package is the Navman fuel transducer that interfaces with the GPS (to obtain distance and speed data) and reports fuel burn, economy and remaining fuel - a great product.

[devocean]

Have you tried the zoom feature

[Wyoming]

Yes, but I am certainly no expert, but always willing to learn. My understanding is that the zoom feature allows you to focus in on a particular section of the water column without confusing the issue by showing that part that you don't need to study. Also, I have to understand what the A-Scope really does and how to use it. ???
Have you tried the zoom feature

[devocean]

Zoom will cut out say the top 20 feet and focus more on the bottom. I only have a Lowrance 47 ex which is a pretty crap sounder and I can pick up fish no worries up to 50 foot really well. With the zoom I cut out the top 30 feet and even more fish show up

[Golden_Monk]

I have a sounder Lowrance x125, I saw quite a few arches over the weekend whilst fishing a bream comp, I put them down to weed, can floating weed show as an arch as well?

[devocean]

No because the sounder picks up air pockets in the fish I believe not weed. Weed will probably show up as a dense block or darker bottom line

[Burley_Boy]

The arch is formed by the return entering and leaving the centre of the beam so I'd say any point source return moving under you may return an arch shape. Check the Lowrance tutorials for great info on the subject.
If you can't see fish on your sounder then read these 18 pages of sounder posts and you'll note that the location of structure is the real issue and what you should focus on rather than trying to spot a big fish. Look for structure and baitfish, up your sensistivity.

[Outsider]

Pic I took a couple of weekends ago seconds before a triple hookup on wahoo.

Had driven over this ball a few times and was starting to wonder what all the fuss was about.

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/Sounder_shot.JPG

[blaze]

worthy of a sticky
cheers
blaze

[Mick_the_Fish]

Great thread and some great pics and commentary Ian. It takes a long time to learn to read these things and threads and discusions like this are well worthwhile. 8-)

[bidkev]

Hope to post some pics from the lowrance X52 on my new tinny, before the end of next week...............if I can find anything in the Pine that is! 2 bloody trawlers working it today!

kev

[Jusel]

Interested in any ones comments on Humminbird matrix sounders and the settings they use. I run a Matrix 35 and seem to be able to distinguish fish and bait balls without too many drama but don't seem to get much change from sand to reef as far as bottom texture goes.

[bidkev]

I have a sounder Lowrance x125, I saw quite a few arches over the weekend whilst fishing a bream comp, I put them down to weed, can floating weed show as an arch as well?

The manual with the X52 states that if the fish feature is used, then this can mistake weed for fish, but if the arch feature is used, then this will only identify fish.

kev

[grumpyoldman]

Great pics...I've just installed a X107CDF in my 1950 Signature. Boat has an unusual "cut-away" at stern and I was not happy with the idea of a transom mount so I settled on a "shoot-thru-hull". Found a "sweet spot" by pouring a bucket of water into the hull just behind a drain plug and got the "sleeping partner" to hold tranducer against hull - got a good reading, marked the spot, dried it out and stuck tranny in with Sikaflex. Last weekend I was getting solid bottom reading in 145ft at 20 knots!! At 6-10 knots, you could spot a a flounder I reckon - bloody awesome bit of gear. Can't wait to see some pics like yours

[skippa]

Grumpy,

Here's some pics of mine in action a while back off PL ....

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/Lowie.jpg

[skippa]

another in the Whitties ....

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/107c_001.jpg

[iank]

skippa, Hope you dropped a plastic/jig or bait down to them.
Cheers Ian

[skippa]

Yeah Ian,

from memory the whitties one was along North Molle, pulled a lot of heads up from there and finally a coupla noahs .... all good fun tho.


Cheers,
Tony 8-)

[-Sharp]

Go my boring Lowrance b/w sounder.! :'(

[Volcano]

This is awesome stuff.
I am a very new member to both this site and to reading sounders.
I've got a humminbird NS25 B/W sounder..

Although I haven't seen anything even close to the schools you guys have shown in some of your pics, I've noticed my sounder comes up with little pictures of fish as opposed to the "arches" and so forth shown on here. Very keen to see what a nice big school looks like.

Awesome resource. One of the best threads I've seen on these fishing boards.

[Reefmaster]

I noticed in some previous post some have mentioned using the "zoom" feature. By using the "zoom" feature you actaully compress the picture which will give an exaggerated picture that makes the bottom and fish look alot higher and also not as wide as what's really down there. The best way to look at bottom is to choose the "range" you wish to veiw the bottom in. For e.g i use a "range" of 20 mtrs when in water over 30mtrs so basicly i only want to see the bottom/reef in a 20 mtr range. Now all you have to do is adjust the "shift" feature up or down to bring that 20 mtr "range" which will have your picture of the bottom/reef into view.

Most sounders these days have a range and shift feature although some didn't come with the shift feature,

You can make your range to what ever you wish and just move it up or down accordingly to your depth.


As in this pic you can see on the right hand side the range is 20 mtrs and if the bottom drops away i just lower the picture with shift button to keep the picture of the bottom in the centre of the screen.

The left hand side is the bottom discrimination mode which seperates the bottom from any growth or fish to let you know whats what. The bottom always stays on that 0- mark and anything above that isn't bottom although at times when fish are really really thick it will show as bottom.


Regards Greg

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/DSC00044.JPG412512.jpg

[Owen]

Took this pic at Awoonga dam the other day.
If you want to read some info on what I was seeing that would take you possibly years to learn on your own, have a read of Johnny M's comments here

http://www.ausfish.com.au/cgi-ausfish/yabb2/YaBB.cgi?num=1134467079cheers
Owen

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/sounder_screen_001.jpg

[Mad_fisherman]

This thread has taught me so much about my own sounder cheers for all the info

much appreciated

MAD!

[paulp]

Anybody can tell me if the Lowrance x107c has bottom lock.
and is it a good feature

[Angla]

I'm useless when it comes to the sounder

Any advice on what this is would be appreciated

I think I was off Coolum at the time with maybe a school of bait fish under

Angla

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/sounder_pic.jpg

[Smelly]

Paulp - Did you find out about bootom lock on the x107c?

[Smelly]

I noticed in some previous post some have mentioned using the "zoom" feature. By using the "zoom" feature you actaully compress the picture which will give an exaggerated picture that makes the bottom and fish look alot higher and also not as wide as what's really down there. The best way to look at bottom is to choose the "range" you wish to veiw the bottom in. For e.g i use a "range" of 20 mtrs when in water over 30mtrs so basicly i only want to see the bottom/reef in a 20 mtr range. Now all you have to do is adjust the "shift" feature up or down to bring that 20 mtr "range" which will have your picture of the bottom/reef into view.

Most sounders these days have a range and shift feature although some didn't come with the shift feature,

You can make your range to what ever you wish and just move it up or down accordingly to your depth.


As in this pic you can see on the right hand side the range is 20 mtrs and if the bottom drops away i just lower the picture with shift button to keep the picture of the bottom in the centre of the screen.

The left hand side is the bottom discrimination mode which seperates the bottom from any growth or fish to let you know whats what. The bottom always stays on that 0- mark and anything above that isn't bottom although at times when fish are really really thick it will show as bottom.


Regards Greg

Reef Master -

Regarding this zoom - does the X107 Lowrance have real Bottom Lock?

i.e. Adjusting your sounder screen to show for example only the ocean bottom to 6m and locate a 2m rise whilst driving around in 60m of water. If bottom lock is on (say - set for 6m above the bottom) - the top of your screen now shows 6m above the ocean bottom and the bottom of the screen still showing the ocean bottom. That 2m rise will now come up a third of your screen. Bottom lock can refer to auto depth (ie: bottom 6m of water column) which the Lowrance will do, but does it lock bottom in heavy swell? - I do not think so...Please advise..

The way I see Lowarance 'Zoom' function is pretty much the same thing except unable to modify the depth range you want to monitor. So this may show the bottom to 6m above - for example where as other sounder brands (such as Furuno) allow bottom lock to adjust the scale to what you want.

Please advise..

Smelly

[snakecatcher]

what a great post - I had seen some of the things shown here before and wrote them off as weed etc. Definitely gonna spend more time playing around with the manual features of my lowrance x135.

[A_DIFF_PERSPECTIVE]

This is a copy of how I replied to a post in the freshwater section which was accompanied by a photo, posted by Owen. This may be useful to many to read. I will add further pointers after the below post!

I Love AusFish.com.au

Posts: 365
Gender:
Re: What's in Awoonga?
« Reply #11 on: 14.12.05 at 06:37:13 » Barra are the biggest, and the apex predator in the Awoonga system. Barra tend to move as singular fish, not necessarily following in tight bunches or tight schools, although it can happen at times! Singular, well spaced fish are very distinct on a sounder's display in open water, or they can be cluttered and a bit indistinct in amongst cover such as horizontal timber, or concealed within weeds. The second largest fish species (on average weight) in the system, is actually mullet, but their habits very rarely see them venture into any situation where upon they can be viewed on a sounder's display screen. Mullet are usually visually identified with the naked eye on or near the surface in shallow water, in depths where sounders become useless fish finding tools.
Catfish (1 to 3 kg) school in varying sizes from a handful to house sized schools. They are a much smaller fish than that of the common 10-20 kg barra that inhabit Awoonga. Displayed images vary from one sounder to the next because of variations in vertical and horizontal pixel count, depth ranges used, gain settings ,transducer type etc etc etc. Everything is relative at some point as displayed images are shown as representatives to the size of sounded objects. I have noticed that catfish tend to have a short, sharp arch, whilst barra have a much longer, and obviously proportional longer arch length to catfish.
Bony bream schools are common in sizes similar to that of the average car, although bony bream and other wandering type baitfish species can be quite sparse and more loosely packed at times; hence the reason for cloud like formations on your display screen.
Increasing water temps through summer sees the whole lake system warm to temperatures that at times can feel uncomfortable to fish. Awoonga is situated at the southern end of the 'Tropical' region of Queensland, yet it still experiences, (like now,38 d/c, 14/dec/2005), very hot days which reflect strongly and highly influence water temperatures and therefore barra behaviour, (as well as other species)! The deep waters of the lake warm to certain depths which is regulated by the severity of the summer weather.
All animals have 'comfort levels', and barra have a certain 'water temperature zone' in which they feel most comfortable! Barra are not actively on the search for food 24hrs a day, so at times they enjoy a relax in favourable, comforting, soothing water which in this case is deeper/cooler water. Tolerable water on the other hand, is any water that can be located in Awoonga. Barra can tolerate high temps, but just like most animals, will search for cooler areas to rest in when required.(like people and air cons).
Thermoclines lay at varying levels in the depths of Awoonga, and the 30 feet mark you mention sees the convergence of the thermocline in many places in the lake at present time. Below the thermocline is much cooler water, and above it is warmer water layers of varying stages and the temp increases steadily towards the surface. Eg, surface temp 30 d/c, 15 feet down, 27 d/c, 30 feet down 25 d/c, and at 33feet, (3 more feet down, below the t/cline) it quite often drops about 4 or 5 d/c. This is why many barra continually show at the same depths, and also why many other forms of life hold at the same depth.(its a comfortable depth, and temperature). Every animal has a different tolerance, and therfore they all find their happy medium somewhere in the water column.
But in saying all that, comfortable temps and tolerable temps are 2 totally different situations. Many barra are trolled from the depths on 30 ft lures, as well as 10 foot lures in the same locations. Whilst this is happening, 33d/c water temp in shallow water sees wild fishing sessions on hungry and pumped up barra. Big barra trolled in 30 ft mid lake whilst also captured casting to the shoreline at the same time, same day.

Most weed is either attached to the bottom in 5 m or less and thriving, attached and dying, or dead and floating. Mid water weed is not what you are sounding!!
Fine tuning of your sounder is required for max results. Understand what lives in your area,,,,as your post asked????,,,, and your well on your way to interperating what is being displayed.
Common lifeforms and objects which become common images on your sounder are things such as:
barra, catfish, bony bream, planktonic blooms at times, (usually mid water) longtom, banded grunters, gar fish, turtles, diving birds,
trees, weedbanks, logs, rocks, thermoclines, etc etc.
*zoom features help in identifying objects.
*vary gain settings for varying depths for max definition
*target level helps you place emphasis on different levels of target density. ,,,if you are searching for less dense items, and closely looking for any changes in density, lower your target level, and vice versa for harder objects. run it on normal for everyday use, but be careful to change it back when you are finished otherwise future confusion can be had.
I'll stop ravin' on now.
Johnny M
Lake Awoonga Barra Fishing Charters
I hope this is of some help .


What I would like to add to this that may or may not have been touched upon in the most imformative topic i have read to date on sounders. It was hard to read every point made by members, but I think a few did get left out that i feel are very important. Apologies if i re-touch on anything.
Firstly,
pixel count- which is the number of 'dots' which make up the display screen. A high resolution sounder will have a high pixel count and is therefore capable of producing a highly defined image quality that will make many viewers go "Wow"! A low resolution, low pixel count will nearly always have a sounder interperator going,,,"hmmmm,,well i wonder what that is?" 240vertical by 240 horizontal pixel count is an average unit. 360 by 360 is a pretty defined sounder, but 480 by 480 is readily available nowadays and therefore will give you great definition of sounded images.
A colour sounder with 240 by 240 for eg, is nowhere near as good as a 480 by 480 black and white unit. A colour 480 by 480, such as lowrance is exceptional for definition and for helping us read into what lays beneath. The varying colour shades(colour bar selection) represented are used to show different density objects. eg..red is mostly used to represent solid and hard return echoes/objects, whilst orange, green, blue, yellow, white etc is used to show less dense objects. The grey line feature on black and white units works the same , although it uses shades of 'grey' to differentiate between different densities. Colour is far more easier on the eye to help distinguish density variations.

Depth ranges need to always stay close to water depths as described in another post. If it is 25 m deep, no point running the unit on a 60 metre range window. bring range and depth as close together as possible for best definition. zoom features help us interperate sounded objects easier especially in instances when fish lay close to the bottom or in extreme deep water when life stays low in the water cloumn. it is really like a magnifying glass that helps us 'see'!

If you are running 'fish symbols', you are really wasting your time! Use your sounder manually for best results. most sounders work best if adjusted by the operator and not just from auto modes! Some sounders may run fine in auto, but most need operator assistance to best 'tune' them in for best results.

Much more to say on this topic, but i feel a few extra points needed to be aired.
Sorry for the length and possible spelling and grammar errors at this time of night.
Johnny M

[snakecatcher]

Thanks Johnny - very useful stuff

[BG]

Here are two photos from awoonga from the past week , intereseted in people ideas on the images,
sorry for about the poor quality, i would say the first photo would be a barra but the second one has got me thinking,

Cheers Ben

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/sounder02.jpg

[BG]

second one ,

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/sounder_o1.jpg

[A_DIFF_PERSPECTIVE]

big school of guppies heading for your transducer,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,o r more like some form of electrical interferance caused by main motor, electric motor, another boat, or battery and transducer cable wiring. It is not life forms Ben,,, it is related to electrics!
johnny

Ben,
The barra school started in 40 feet, and then followed my boat for approx 15 mins whilst my on board anglers were catching them with sinking lures! I took this pic after a while and when the boat was then in about 25 feet. I think 11 fish were caught and then they spooked and vanished into thin air!
Fish varied from 800mm to metre stuff. This sounder loses the plot often, it has a few issues, so as you know it is being replaced by a better unit, different brand name!

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/sharps_041_001.jpg

[BG]

spot on johnny, now that you mention elec interferance i remember turning on the bait tank pump to give it a run.......................had me worried about the guppies though.

good work ,,Ben

[A_DIFF_PERSPECTIVE]

who or what killed this post,,,,,,, i think it can carry on much further!!!!! anybody want to know anything , add anything, or ask any questions. This very informative post was started whole heartedly by a nice bloke with a positive mind! A high 5 to you " iank"!!! I think it should continue! I bet there are a thousand questions wanting to be answered! I'll start with a new one????? i know the answer, but I'm sure someone with great experience would like to describe it to us all.
"what is a double echo?" and why is boat speed critical to understanding displayed images!!!!??????????????
johnny M
Great topic!! Trying to continue this great thread!
anyone????????

[iank]

now you have me going for the refrence books ;D ;D
Cheers Ian

[Owen]

OK, I'll play :)
A double echo is where you see two bottom images, caused by the sound waves bouncing off the bottom, returning to the surface and then bouncing back to the bottom again. SO if you are in say 10m of water, you will see a second less defined return at 20m.
Not sure why it seems to only happen to me sporadically. e.g. I was getting it for a while in awoonga on saturday, but hadn't changed any settings. Bit further on it dissappeared. I usually just adjust the range if it happens rather than back off the gain.

Speed affects the returns because the display is a constant speed graph, whereas yuor boat speed can vary dramatically. Thus two identically sized fish will display differently at different speeds.

Do I get an elephant stamp? ;D

cheers,
Owen

[A_DIFF_PERSPECTIVE]

yep,
elephant stamp alright as there is so much to talk about in reference to how we should interpret displayed images. The boat speed issue needs close scrutiny for many when looking for fish or for certain structure. A boat at speed shows a steep slope on a sounder almost vertical, but when a boat travels over the same slope at a lesser speed, the slope is displayed as a less acute angle!
It certainly isn't just a matter of turning on a sounder and going for a drive or a fish!
Go slow, see more detail, speed up, see less!
Lots more to talk about .................................................. ........!
Johnny

[catchy_fishy]

With siginficant confidence several members have posted and actually described what fish are appearing on the screen.

How can one be sure ? Are there any specifics to look for in being able to id different fish ?

Catchy Fishy

[catchy_fishy]

I'm useless when it comes to the sounder

Any advice on what this is would be appreciated

I think I was off Coolum at the time with maybe a school of bait fish under

Angla

Angla - I'm equally not great but for sure there is a school of bait fish under you, that have just been attacked - see the large "hole" mid-bottom left, in the bait.

Not sure what the red means as I use a B/w sounder.

Mike
http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/anglas_sounder_pic.jpg

[BG]

if you hold your hand over the transducer on my boat you can feel a small pulse as the sounder works away sending a signal to the bottom. it isnt painful but it is uncomfortable, can or would this affect the fishing under you boat??? as i reckon the fish would feel it for sure. probably not an issue when trolling but when iam not looking at it to find something i turn it off concerned that it might spook the fish, does any one else have this issue or is it not a problem to worry about??

[ReefKnotII]

Could comeone point me in the right direction????

I have a Lowrance LMS320 and am having trouble picking up the bottom when in water deeper than 30m. The unit works fine a speed and when at rest in anything under 30m.
I was at the 36's saturday in about 67m and the bottom was showing as just dots(i don't have a pic) as soon as I started the motor it would loose the bottom alltogether and just flash the depth. I have turned off all auto settings and still have this problem. It's driving me nuts. The only thing I didn't try was the depth range and also the noise reduction but I thought that noise would be showing at all depths.

Could anyone help?

Cheers
Justin

[BG]

sounds like you need to adjust the depth range setting, maybe set it to auto depth range and see if you can track the bottom then

cheers Ben

[Leo_N.]

Could comeone point me in the right direction????

I have a Lowrance LMS320 and am having trouble picking up the bottom when in water deeper than 30m. #The unit works fine a speed and when at rest in anything under 30m.
I was at the 36's saturday in about 67m and the bottom was showing as just dots(i don't have a pic) as soon as I started the motor it would loose the bottom alltogether and just flash the depth. #I have turned off all auto settings and still have this problem. #It's driving me nuts. #The only thing I didn't try was the depth range and also the noise reduction but I thought that noise would be showing at all depths.

Could anyone help?

Cheers
Justin

Maybe. This is what I would try:

1. Check your battery connections (a multimeter would be the go if at all possible)
2. Turn the gain up (sorry, but not sure what it is called in the Lowrance sounders)
3. Check the transducer position. Has it kicked up? Probably not, but might be worth a shot
4. Check your transducer connection/leads

It sounds like you do not have enough power being transmitted through the sounder. If all above are OK, it may be that the transducer itself is acting up.

[Burley_Boy]

First time I've checked this post in 6months and cool that its still going strong. It's a fine reference frequented by the legends... ;)

I'm with Leo on that one Justin, crank the sounder sensitivity up until you see stuff all if that is possible, then pull it back, at 67M you might very well use full gain but I'm not experienced with your unit.

Ben, the signal transmitted from the transducer is a high frequency audio signal in pulse form transmitted and then the transducer listens for the bounce and there are plenty of people who will insist on switching the sounder off if at anchor and they will definitely make a point of it spooking the fish. Makes sense to me but I've not seen a Scientific study on the subject. Others will say that it doesn't spook the fish. At anchor once you've located your spot there seems no reason to leave the sounder on though.

The depth would make a difference too so it would be interesting to know if Greg (reefmaster) switches the sounder off after locating the reds??
cheers
BB

[dolphin_diver]

THANKSFOT THE INFO :D

[dolphin_diver]

THANKS FOR THE INFORMATION :D

[john_laura]

Great post everyone

Has given me renewed interest in working out my fishfinder.

Great stuff!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Fitzy]

Here's a screen shot from a Matrix 97 taken at Wivenhoe.

It shows a mixture of bass & catfish on a submerged hilltop. Fish are very thick from 10 feet down to the bottom. The color allows you to pick the difference from the 2 species (bass & catfish) by the strength of the return; the bass being deeper in the body a giving the red returns, catfish & smaller bass are in blue & green.
I did find schools showing up only as blue/green & they were all catfish, & a couple showing up with lots of red, all fish caugt off these were bass.

Note the barometric pressure. The baro had just risen 2mb & the fish rose off the bottom as well. Coincidence??

Cheers,

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/00010.jpeg

Fitzy..

[Fisher4life]

excellent post guys :D
i have an old matrix 10, never shows up any fish arches, but does show up the different types of bottom, ie rock weed coral sand, and also shows up bait fish balls... will post some pictures next time i hit the water

[BG]

why do most fishos talk in feet and farenheight ( spelling??) when everything else is meters and celcius??

just curious

cheers Ben

[Fitzy]

why do most fishos talk in feet and farenheight ( spelling??) #when everything else is meters and celcius??

just curious

cheers Ben
I use them becuae they are in smaller gradients. I'd rather see 24 feet as opposed to 8 meters. Can see smaller variations in temp/depth using imerial.

Some do it because thats what they grewup using & want to keep using it.

Its quite simple to convert to metric in your head if you need to.


Cheers,

Fitzy..

[A_DIFF_PERSPECTIVE]

Old school I think Ben, and as Fitzy said, the imperial measurements will give greater accuracy and show a more gradual fluctuation in temp and depth.
Nautical measurements are more the old sea dog way,,,,,,,,its like 10 miles to the reef, not 18km. Nautical measurements follow boating habits!
Go roof some houses,
Johhny M

[BG]

no worries sinbad,

i will stick to roofs and pipes and you to boats and barra,,,,,,,,,,,

found some lures that should work great on those mullet,

cheers ben

[Sean]

I have actually found the Hummingbird Matrix catalogue quite informative with regards to cone angles etc. for Relative Novices anyway....still can not understand why after owning a $20 000 boat for 5 years, I only ever had a $150 sounder on it......what a DICK!!! ;D ;D

[A_DIFF_PERSPECTIVE]

A top quality sounder is a gift from god. It makes your older and less effective models of sounders look like a complete waste of money.
There is no going back when we go forward with sounders,,,,although paper sounders where pretty dam flash!!
Sean, That is a good point. Why own an expensive boat and end up fishing up the creek with $20 outfits etc. All gear should be bought to be used to its standard. It's a package deal type thing, good boat, good sounder, good tackle etc. It is also a bit sad to see $40,000 boats in backyards that get used once or twice a year for whatever reason.

Ben G,,,,,Mullet hey??!??!,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,you could cast a barra lure all day at a swirl, ripple and a bow wave and still not get a strike. Funny That!!

[Burley_Boy]

Ben,
A simple reason why guys chat fahrenheit would likely be they bought a sounder from the US. Cheaper but you miss out on the local warranty.

A Matrix from the US will not convert to C and Metres but reamins in ft and Fahrenheit.
BB

[BG]

its easy to change the units of measure on your sounder as you all know , it just seems strange to me to

catch a 900mm barra in 10 feet of water for eg.

all good, Ben

[A_DIFF_PERSPECTIVE]

Yes Ben,
I was in my 4.4 metre tinny, using 50 pound line on a 6 foot, 10 kg rod casting a 6 inch lure tied to about a metre of leader fishing in 15 feet of water. The wind was from the North at about 18 knots, the water temperature was 28 degrees celcius and my 50hp outboard was turned off whilst the 55 lb electric motor was ticking over quietly. I hooked a barra about 40 lb, it measured 104 cm, or you could also say 1040 mm and on close inspection I reckoned it was about an 18kg fish!!
I returned to the ramp at 22 knots, hopped in my ute that top speed does about 140km, reversed down the ramp and winched on the boat with the wire rope that has a breaking strain of over 2000kg, then I drove home in my one tonne ute which gets about only 20 miles to the gallon, or about 7km to the litre in the other talk. Got home, shifted some half pound reef fishing leads, packed some 3 lb dive weights into the bag for tomorrow's free dive trip, then went to sleep in my 6 foot 7 inch long home made bed, packed the 20 kg bag of ice and the 2 kg bag of pilchards and then drove an hour in the boat, or is it steered the boat about 11 miles out to a isolate reef and dropped anchor in 21 metres of water!!!!!!!

Go figure!!?!?!?!?!?!
Talk about using all types of measurements.
I'm still not sure on what talk to use for mullet luring tho!!?????
Johnny

[agnes_jack]

LOL Johnny ;D
Funniest part is that I didn't find it at all confusing :-? all made sense ;D ;D ;D

Regards, Tony

[Burley_Boy]

its easy to change the units of measure on your sounder as you all know ,Ben


Nah mate we don't all know how to change a US purchased Matrix to Celcius and Metres but you're welcome to fill us in.
cheers.

Johhny. you're a crackup dude!

[BG]

BB i dont know about the matrix i assumed it would be able to be changed like the lowrance i have, wouldnt the same unit be sold in Aus as in the US

Has to read that twice Johnny,,,,, you know what they say about plumbers, anyway its all starting to make sense

Cheers Ben

[btsah]

Top job iank
I might do something similar (take a few pix of the sounder showing the bottom & what’s above it) next time I’m catching fish to analyse the next day and put in the memory bank.

[Burley_Boy]

Ben
I have a Matrix 37X the US unit would be a Matrix 37.
The difference is the ability to run Celcius and Metres.
Obviously a ploy to ensure local sales instead of internet imports. More important though is the warranty as the local dealer will shun the import I believe.

[BG]

Roger that BB , I purchased my lowrance locally for about $200 more that I would have paid on an ebay shop,
Its good to have warranty support at the shop you buy any expensive item as well as buying locally is important in my book,

cheers Ben

[Fitzy]

Here's a screen shot from a 987SI a mate sent me this week of the Goori in Hervey Bay.

Fitzy..

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/Goori.jpg

[Owen]

Fitzy,
That's pretty amazing :o
I take it those are fish you can see around the wreck and the dark patch at right is the water?
How do you determine bottom type?
Is that a sandy bottom we're looking at?
The shadow effect is pretty incredible too. What happens when you go over the same spot in the afternoon ;D ;D :-X

Please don't post any more pics.
It'll end up in divorce ;)
cheers,
Owen

[Gbanger]

how on earth does a sounder pick up a shadow!?? is it an underwater camera or something?

is the shadow something it does to simulate depth sounding?

[HORTO]

i have only been studying hydroacoustics this semester and most likely don't know as much as some of you blokes.
but i would say that the shadows are formed from the lack of returning sound due to the fact that it is being reflected by the wreck. it gives an insight into the orientation and position of the wreck on the bottom, and also the depression into the bottom ie is it half buried.
the dark patch on the right is the water column.


great technology, its only going to get better. ;)

[Meat]

Spot on Horto.

http://www.humminbird.com/generic2.asp?ID=514

Explanation of the shadows just under the first image.

Meat

[Gbanger]

amazing, just cant wait for 5-10 years time when this sort of gear is standard issue...

hard to imagine what the future holds with fishing/sounder gear...

[Jekyll]

OK, I'll play :)
A double echo is where you see two bottom images, caused by the sound waves bouncing off the bottom, returning to the surface and then bouncing back to the bottom again. SO if you are in say 10m of water, you will see a second less defined return at 20m.
Not sure why it seems to only happen to me sporadically. e.g. I was getting it for a while in awoonga on saturday, but hadn't changed any settings. Bit further on it dissappeared. I usually just adjust the range if it happens rather than back off the gain.


Dunno whether anyone else has answered this (haven't read the whole thread yet), but I'd guess that the reason the second return is dropping in and out would be due to changing bottom conditions.

Hard bottom .... strong return so a more clearly defined second echo
Soft bottom .... weak return so more chance of a very weak or no second echo

[Clint06]

tip for anyone else trying to figure out that screen shot from Fitzy - turning your head to the side does not help, all it does is give you a crook neck ::)
I had to have a look at the humminbird website to figure out how to read it, problem is now i really, really want one!

[Daniel_Trenfield]

Great topic boys....

Am I to assune that my 'Bird displays fish, not arcs, that I need a better sounder????

Please say yes....

Dan.

[skippa]

Err sorry Dan NO...

All you need to do is turn off the fish symbols. Displaying fish is just a warm fuzzy feeling, a marketing gimmick by the manufacturers. Turn it off and keep it off.

Sorry mate, but if you want a better one and your wife is reading this then ..... YES YES ;) ;D

Cheers,
Tony # 8-)

[cyclone]

Got a couple of screen shot of the new furuno fvc 620. these fish are nannygai and red emperor sitting very close to the bottom. very impressed with this unit first time out.

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/sounder_1_003.jpg

[cyclone]

White background.

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/sounder_3_002.jpg

[Volcano]

Heres a photo of my sounder out at Shallow Tempest. It's a Lowrance LMS337

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/lms337_shallow_tempest.jpg

[iank]

What were the big fish that was harrassing the bait school.
Ian

[Volcano]

snapper/squirey snapper and a few wrasse. Well, thats what we pulled up from that show anyway lol.

[stalker]

I've a lowerance 332 and learning how 2 drive it as iv'e never had a sounder before. looking at yours VOLCANO should i zoom in more like you did aka 4x. Any advice would help. ...Paul...

[Smithy]

JRC Plot 500F off Rainbow.

Normal sorts of fishing depths.

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/plot_500F.jpg

[Smithy]

Shallow.

Just outside Scarborough when it was blowing 25 knots hence the ripples on the bottom and the clutter which is probably just from wave action.

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/104-0438_IMG.jpg

[Smithy]

Pearlies on a 585 Furuno sitting way up off the bottom.

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/pearlys585_002.jpg

[Smithy]

Bass sitting on the bottom at BP Dam on a Zercom LPG2000. #$%@^Awesome B&W units.

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/zercomshow_002.JPG

[Smithy]

X65 Lowrance on some bait. #$%@^A few Sails came off this show.

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/x65onbait3_001.jpg

[Smithy]

X-19C on some bait. #$%@^One Sail and a million Tuna both Longtails and Macks came off this bait.

Wish I took a picture of Mick's Mountain on a 3kW Furuno. 200 Fathom seamount (actually looks like a volcano with a core) up from 800 fathoms.

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/x19arch2_002.jpg

[Fisher4life]

here is a pic i took last time i was out at my fav snapper/squire spot in the bay. This shot shows all sorts of fish, both bait and some larger fish holding around about 1M above the bottom.

the bottom is rubble, with spots of coral and wire weed in between.

on this particular day, the bigger ones weren't biting >:(, i only pulled a large squid and a squire going at 11cm's long

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/Depth_sounder_reading.JPG

[Murks]

;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D i just love the way you blotted out the gps marks F4L
BRETT

[Fisher4life]

;D ;D ;DI did try to colour co-ordinate....

[wardypig]

Here is a crappy photo from my phone of a big school of bass in Somerset using Piranha Max 20.

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/Picture19.jpg

[wardypig]

.........and another

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/Picture20.jpg

[seatime]

Here's a screen shot from a 987SI a mate sent me this week of the Goori in Hervey Bay.

Fitzy..

Fitzy, Is that side scan sonar, it looks like it, that's the only previous way I've seen shadows before.
what's a 987SI?

rgds

[Fishin_Dan]

This is a picture of a bait school with Squire feeding on them. We pulled a few out of the bottom of this school

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/Squire_and_Bait.JPG

[Spaniard_King]

heres a few of my furuno fcv 620, I think I have just about got it sussed :)

Garry

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/fcv620_A_001.JPG

[Spaniard_King]

next

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/fcv620_B.JPG

[Spaniard_King]

last one

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/fcv620_C.JPG

[davez104]

Hmmm, not real fussed on the white background, do you find there is any advantage or just personal preference? I run mine with the black background most of the time.

Dave.

[Spaniard_King]

Personal preference I guess Dave

cheers

Garry

[davez104]

Have you tried switching between the colours on the run? Could be just me, but it looks like you lose a little definition with the white screen, not as easy to see the lighter colours. Maybe my eyes are RS ;D

Dave.

[Grunter71]

Did you pull out of those schools Garry?

[Spaniard_King]

Pulled a few snapper and Trag on the 83m pic... stuff all out of the rest ::)

Garry

[Tony_N]

Garry

Was the 83M pic taken while the boat was travelling? Trying to suss the gaps in the readout from the bottom

[Spaniard_King]

Garry

Was the 83M pic taken while the boat was travelling? #Trying to suss the gaps in the readout from the bottom

Tony we were on the drift... a slow one at that.. 1 - 1.5klm/hr my guess its wire weed as that spot seems to hold pearlies

Garry

[stewywrx]

my x107

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/Image02727.jpg

[stewywrx]

my x107

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/Image02525.jpg

[stewywrx]

my x107

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/Image333331.jpg

[stewywrx]

From the three photo's,i'm not sure if they are fish or not. can any one help please.. ;)

[ScottB]

Raymarine DS600X

http://www.ausfish.com.au/chat/uploads/Sounder_cropped.jpg

[Glenn_Woods]

Hi Fellars. A new person to this site as a member, but have followed your discusions regularly. This is by far the best thread i have ever read and is very relevant to my situation. I have a Garmin 172c chart plotter and a Garmin FF250 b&w. I have allways ran the fish finder in auto and after reading your stories, i am now aware i should be more hands on and tweaking the dials. I have looked for the sensitivity link but can not see one. This function is posibbly under a different heading. I am hesitant on tweaking too much in case i upset the hole lot and cant get back. If any one out there own's a Garmin 250 fish finder, could you please give me some direction for proper manual set up.

Cheers and tight lines. #Woodsy (Gladstone QLD) :)

[Heath]

Try looking for gain. Same thing as sensativity.

[davo]

On the Garmin's you can increase or decrease from the auto setting e.g. +5 to -5

[Glenn_Woods]

Thanks Davo. The weather looks like it might be okay to get the old man out for a fish this weekend, so i'll give it a tweak while im out there.

Woodsy

[Duyz72]

I Love coming back to this thread!

And thanks for the interpretations of each pic (for those who do).
The pic on it's own is interesting but the explanations of what we are seeing is invaluable!

If more of the lower end models can be shown would be great!
I am sure many of us do not have the top end gear and deciphering the monochrome would be a common event for most.

Keep up the great work!
When I sort out mine I will surely contribute and attempt an expanation (even if it is wrong lol)