View Full Version : Got a question directed at anyone that does fishing.
GreekBoi
03-05-2016, 12:01 PM
So you know those books that AFN sell or websites that give free gps marks..
I gather from what I have seen all those marks are just freebies and local knowledge.
If someone was to sell raw gps marks of islands and areas of moreton bay. What I mean by raw
is someone has gone and taken the effort to scan a big area in detail and fished certain spots and caught fish
then marked that spot would people buy like say a full package as in all the marks found in certain main fishing areas?
I been doing a project since I got my new fishfinder mainly for myself but thought what if people were interested.
As a example I have 20 marks on raby bay of reefs, gravel bottom..etc and all those marks on certain times of the tide ive caught good size snapper on every time I go.
I've only scanned and recorded sonar bottom of shag rock and raby bay and bits of the brisbane river up near the mouth.
I was just wanting feedback if people would be interested in something like this.. I'm doing it all from my Hobie kayak and plane to scan most the main fishing spots over moreton bay down to the gold coast.
I'd also add pictures of sonar, methods on each spot, what you can catch "what i've caught", what lures or bait..etc
I would understand if you have a big ship and massive sonar and scan the whole bay and close offshore 3D and sell of the map but why are you trying to invent the wheel again, all above you mentioned is already done countless time in the past and current.
For an average person to buy your possible fishing spot gps marks, you need to be some sort of fishing guru, credited on publications, tv, etc...
otherwise doesnt make any commercial sense
Most of this info is already available free online.
Facebook is full of fishing community and apps, FishBrain is an example, instead of single person like you with this app you can get updates from whole community.
Keep up to date what everyone is catching, rough area, size, etc..
You can even pay for premium app $2-$3 and show you exact spot where the catch was.
GreekBoi
03-05-2016, 12:26 PM
I see.. Well tell me where on the net and in books that people sell marks that haven't been shared around 100 times and are public knowledge.
As for the prem apps I have had a few and they are more directed to NSW and other states compared to brisbane areas, You look at one of them and then compare that app to another and they
have the same marks.. I've done my research and have yet to see anyone sell what I would be selling, also I am a member of some big kayak fishing grps and they are the same as any fisho..they will not share info.
Which is fine but like I said the ones that are apps are the same thing as AFN books..they share marks that they feel can be shared but they will not share certain marks. I've not seen 20+ marks for raby bay alone..all the apps,
books, websites all show 1 mark.. just 1 silly mark that is the same.
And who says I wouldn't keep it upto date.. Id also show the spot where I caught fish, show the sonar images, methods for both lures and bait..etc
Like I said tell me a proper app that shows Moreton bay marks that isn't the same as other marks on other apps or sites or books.
I wish you all the best with your business venture.
GreekBoi
03-05-2016, 12:38 PM
It's not so much a business venture just a small project.. I am just asking you tell me what app shows allot of "secret or raw marks" of Moreton bay.. There isn't many at all.
And like any site or app its same thing for say a charter boat.. they will not show in videos on youtube the marks they goto..they hide it up.
They will show marks that they feel the community can visit but not the top spots.. It's like if I asked you tell me for free all your top spots in the bay, all the methods to fish those spots..etc
You won't tell me, you may tell me one or 2 spots that are not so great but are fine to share to public eyes.
Bbprory
03-05-2016, 01:04 PM
I myself dont understand why you would want to do this??
You spend time finding a little spot that fishs well, tell people about it..
You try being able to fish that mark again with the same success.
It wont happen.
Thats the glory of finding your own little spots..
Use your hard work for your fun I say, theres enough general marks out there for most ppl to catch a feed.
GreekBoi
03-05-2016, 01:23 PM
Well it does happen. The 2 of the spots at raby bay that isn't listed on any app or site that I found. On 3 sep days I been to that spot and caught legal size snapper.
On certain tide hours you can get fish on the same spot. I understand that people could out fish the spots but all I am doing is putting the effort in finding them, and with a kayak
I go 4-5knots which is the optimal speed for a sonar, you try doing it.. I just hear of so many people not knowing where to go or not getting any fish and then I see all these people that could share knowledge
but they won't..its like a secret society.
aussiebasser
03-05-2016, 01:36 PM
I'm trying to understand this. You found a spot that fishes well, at a certain time of the year, at a certain time of the tide and you wish to sell the location of that spot with the time and tide data to all comers? Or will you just sell the lat/long co-ords and not tell the times and tides that it performs well? How much do you think that information is worth, and how long do you think the information would remain accurate when everybody who'd bought the information started fishing it? Great money if you could get it, but not all fishermen are as crazy as some fishermen.
It's not so much a business venture just a small project.. I am just asking you tell me what app shows allot of "secret or raw marks" of Moreton bay.. There isn't many at all.
And like any site or app its same thing for say a charter boat.. they will not show in videos on youtube the marks they goto..they hide it up.
They will show marks that they feel the community can visit but not the top spots.. It's like if I asked you tell me for free all your top spots in the bay, all the methods to fish those spots..etc
You won't tell me, you may tell me one or 2 spots that are not so great but are fine to share to public eyes.
when money is involved people naturally and rightfully look for credibility for any purchase.
without meaning any negativity, I naturally ask to my self why would I purchase your knowledge, and do a basic seach of your catch reports on this site
my findings are;
- only 3 reports over the last 3 years
- one of the report is consisting of no catch, donut report
- one of the report, looks like you cant remember the name of the fish spiecies
I dont doubt your skills and knowledge, however doesnt get me very excited mate.
You might not share your catches on this forum, if so this is against the logic of your post anyways
You might be an ace fisherman on a kayak forum, no idea. I dont do kayaks
I might be using the forum search function incorrectly; quite possible
I see the reports from the Wicked Fishing all the time, his photos and consistent reports gets me very excited to a point that I would easily buy both his DVDs without any hesitation.
Dignity
03-05-2016, 05:33 PM
I admire anybody who wants to promulgate info to fishing groups. I will let you into a secret, I have heaps of secret marks on 9 and 12 mile reefs off caloundra but somehow 3 out 4 times I go there and someone is sitting right on them. I think you will find that there are no secret spots but spots that fish really well in certain conditions. It all depends on time of year, direction of swell even the wind direction and offshore whether the set is running south or north,the moon phase and whether my missus is in happy mood or otherwise, the same reef will fish totally differently and perform or not perform. For instance Spanish Mackerel move between 12 mile and the Barwon Banks depending on whether the tide is coming in or going out, now 15 km out to sea you wouldn't think this was the case but spend some time watching the professionals and those who always catch plenty you will soon ascertain the pattern and I'm not about to give it away just yet. I guess what I'm saying is what Pros and others above (I do apologize but I can't see the other respondents on my phone) are trying to say is that it is not that simple otherwise everyone who went out would catch shit loads all the time.
At the end of the day, would I pay for your spots, no as I continuously look for my own, I don't even have the gps on when heading for a mark as it often leads me into new grounds, but I still think you should try with your proposal as great things have often come out of odd ideas.
Sheik
03-05-2016, 05:42 PM
I tend to agree with dignity. There are people who would spend coin to get access to something that has at least worked some of the time. Some people don't have time to search through or even join chat rooms and such and are after a nice quick and easy way to catch a fish or two.
I also agree with the suggestion that there are no secret spots. But the people who would pay for this information aren't the sort of people who would have a log of secret spots.
So I would say go for it, but the devil is in the detail. What are people paying for and what do they expect.
scottar
03-05-2016, 07:34 PM
A gentleman with the surname of Palermo tried this many years ago. Ultimately once your "secret spots" (LOL) are no longer secrets the information is not worth a jatz cracker and every person who shells out to purchase your info and then turns up at a spot to find 5 other boats there thinks they have been ripped off. Go for it by all means but don't be overly surprised by the lack of uptake or the repercussions.
Almako
03-05-2016, 08:59 PM
Once you sell them they will end up on the net for free anyway.
Pointless
wags on the water
03-05-2016, 09:19 PM
[QUOTE=GreekBoi;1614090]I see.. Well tell me where on the net and in books that people sell marks that haven't been shared around 100 times and are public knowledge.
As for the prem apps I have had a few and they are more directed to NSW and other states compared to brisbane areas, You look at one of them and then compare that app to another and they
have the same marks.. I've done my research and have yet to see anyone sell what I would be selling, also I am a member of some big kayak fishing grps and they are the same as any fisho..they will not share info.
Which is fine but like I said the ones that are apps are the same thing as AFN books..they share marks that they feel can be shared but they will not share certain marks. I've not seen 20+ marks for raby bay alone..all the apps,
books, websites all show 1 mark.. just 1 silly mark that is the same.
QUOTE]
..................Ebay................
Dignity
03-05-2016, 09:37 PM
One point I didn't spell out but alluded to was that the mark might not be on the Internet but guaranteed that it's unknown. I have a huge amount of marks that I found over the years that have lots of people fishing them. GreekBoi, my sounder allows me to download my tracks and the depth and location is there to review. I often find points of interest this way and sometimes they produce and sometimes they don't, no different to any other spot. Good luck if you proceed.
robfish 1
04-05-2016, 02:24 PM
I don't want to appear unfriendly or uncooperative here, Greekboi - just making an observation.
After reading all the replies to your OP, and your somewhat 'hostile' responses, it's pretty clear that you didn't get the answers you were expecting, and so have been on the defensive ever since the first reply.
And I don't know whether it's just me, or the larger audience, but I'm still at a loss to know EXACTLY what it is we'd be getting for our hard-earned dollars. Rather than be defensive, how about being more open to constructive criticism, and also letting us know more about what we'd receive?
Personally, I'd be happy to buy, (and have done so in the past), books on new areas that I intend to fish. Hitting a new locale is fraught with a whole host of difficulties - the least is finding fish!
However - that remark also comes with a caveat.
I'd certainly NOT buy from anyone without a reputation as a recognized and knowledgeable fisho. One who is known throughout the fishing media as someone whose info is both reliable and accurate.
If you were a Steve Starling, or a Rod Harrison, or a Nigel Webster, or one of a hundred other well-known entities, then yes...I'd buy your marks - in a heartbeat!
But a lesser-known person, one who I personally have never heard of? Nah. Seems like a waste of money.(And quite possibly, a rip off!).
All the above may or may not be true, but credibility is something that's earned - not given.
This exercise may well be a nice little money earner for your yak community, where you may be known, but not for the wider fishing community - who are quite rightly, skeptics.
the gecko
04-05-2016, 04:06 PM
I bought a book of gps marks for Hervey Bay when I moved there, it cost me $6 and was a good deal.
it was pamphlet sized and fits in the tackle box.
Yes they were well known marks that were also on the net, but it saved me heaps of time searching new ground in a new area.
Id be happy to pay for a similar book if I was going to fish Raby Bay or Moreton Bay.
It wouldnt bother me if I didnt know your reputation. Id take a punt for a few bucks.
How much did you think you were gonna ask for your marks?
It all comes down to price and perceived value.
As long as it is just a hobby, and you dont expect to make hundreds of dollars.
castlemaine
04-05-2016, 04:47 PM
I bought a book with locations landbased fishing SEQ. From being continually borrowed and copied by my mates. I no longer have the book, I suspect one of my mates lent it to friend. Not that anyone of them have caught a fish as yet, (apart from toadies), let alone bagged out at any of the spots.
Put it out there and someone will buy it. Don't expect to retire on the income, though.
GreekBoi
04-05-2016, 09:00 PM
It's just a hobby from my new scanner and off my kayak. I can see all the negative responses but I also have seen allot of positive ones off other grps.
And no i'm not wanting to get hundreds of $$ off it.
And the responses about I would need to be some well known fishing person.. well that makes me laugh as when you goto a tackle store to ask your local fisho where is a good stop or if they post spots on a board you prob end up going to them
and the person that wrote them was prob some kid or a "unknown fisho" Another thing is the amount of people that buy the phone apps that are from not well known community fisho's.. well you pay for those ones...makes no logical sense now does it.
All those afn and starlo..etc those books are just general knowledge of the area. I spoke to geoff wilson who is known in fishing and has wrote books and been in books with afn members.. He wote a old book all about whiting.. I asked him was
there much on whiting up in moreton bay.. His answer was no, majority of it was for NSW which the state is known for being a top fishing spot and they do allot of comps with fishing in the area compared to moreton bay.
I think any of your would buy a book in a fishing shop that you prob wouldn't know who the person was who wrote it but it had good info in it.. So me selling the marks+ best tides hrs to fish on, whats the best baits, rigs, lures and pictures of donar recording of the bottom is just as the same as any book but more detail.
I do a offshore kayak fishing comp each year and this year I recorded all around Shag Rock near north straddie where the comp is located and told some the yakkers who are pretty darn pro at what they do in offshore fishing "some of the coff's guys beat boaties at a easter comp each year in spanish macks" I also recorded all the way from adder rock to boat rock and back and made allot of good waypoints for spots for comps in the future. A few of the top guys said how unique it was and pretty darn cool.
Thing is with scanning the bottom to get a optimal picture you want to go 4knots which a kayak "well my one" goes just normally.. If you do that on a boat it would take ages and you would get sick of traveling 4knots for 20km for some spots..
Like if I do all around peel island that's 21km at 4knots would be like a full day from 4am to 5pm.. I'm taking my time to get every little piece of detail and fishing each spot I find is good. Then going back every now and then to check if the spot if the same on the same tides and using both bait and plastics.
So it's not just some small little effort that anyone can do.. cause if anyone can do it then go do it and post up your findings for free.. cause trust me it would take allot of time when you rather would want to be out fishing.
Plus All the info isn't so much directed at you so called "pro's" it's directed at the people that complain they go out and catch nothing or catch small fish or no fish.. It's directed at beginners or possibly the more advanced that want to know a bit more without thinking they are better then others.
My dad does marine welding and been into fishing all his life and so as his uncles who are greek and I first told him about the idea and he thought it was great, told a friend of mine who loves fishing and he loved the idea, both said who cares what some people will think which i don't care now what you guys thing with your platnium member on ausfish or your pro status. I catch fish off my kayak and allot of them sometimes most I release even if they are a good size for others to catch.
I love the sport I just am a lil sick of this so called community when its hardly a community at all.
scottar
04-05-2016, 09:34 PM
Settle down cupcake........you asked. Do you want everyone to basically lie about their opinion to make you feel all warm and fuzzy. It's been done before for offshore by guy's with a profile in the industry - and has failed miserably in the end but who knows, maybe yours will be different.
...guy keeps digging a bigger hole....
why not someone scan the whole bay in high definition and sell off the maps.
I would be more than happy to pay $500+ just for the northern bay area, not even off shore.
Dont care about gps marks, baits, tides, time of the day and all the rest of the crap
robfish 1
06-05-2016, 01:17 PM
There you go gettin' all uppity and defensive again! You wanted feedback...you got it!
We're sorry that we are not saying what you want to hear...perhaps if you don't want constructive criticism, don't put it out there for comment - and each and every one of your latest accusations is purely supposition, without any substantiation.
And I really think you'll find that very few books/DVD's/magazines are published by lesser-known authors. The publishing companies have way too much to lose otherwise...both financially and in their credibility! To believe anything else is just confirmation bias..
And of course family and friends will pat you on your head and tell you what a good boy you are - that's what family and friends do!
The acid test is what other fishos think of your efforts.
So please - feel free to go ahead and produce your book/booklet/pamphlet/electronically delivered marks, (we still don't know the actual format or costs, btw) - the sales will speak for themselves. There's an old saying - "the proof of the pudding is in the eating".
Who knows - some of us may even eat crow and buy one...if it's any good. I've already admitted that I tend to buy books on new areas I intend to fish - one of my latest was an AFN publication on Gold Coast landbased, by Nigel Webster - did it work, and did I catch fish? You betcha! That was followed by one on Merimbula - same result.
Would I have bought them from an unknown author? Probably not.
So when can we expect to see yours for sale?
aussiebasser
06-05-2016, 02:16 PM
This comp off Straddie, where have you finished in the last 4 years? How many first and second places since you've had the new sounder/gps?
astro66
06-05-2016, 05:16 PM
what sounder do you have ?
Jeremy
06-05-2016, 05:52 PM
Here is positive response for you - I'll give you a dollar and a pack of tissues thrown in for free!
TheRealPoMo
06-05-2016, 06:00 PM
Gunna go out on a limb here and say go for it....as long as we are talking a few dollars. ...never get back your time...better stacking shelves at Woolies.
I just think if those random spots of structure and gravel are more well known, places like Harries and Curtin might not be so crowded.
Disclaimer - I don't know many spots aside the well known ones, I rarely catch much and I don't care. Also, on those all too rare perfect Moreton Bay days, the Missus and I don't want to waste our time motoring around watching the sounder....we go out to enjoy the day. I realise I am in the minority on this site.
the gecko
11-05-2016, 04:06 PM
Greek Boy, I think you have a good idea. Go and produce the booklet and it will sell well in the local tackle shops around the area.
As long as your retail price is good value and you give the shop some margin, there is no reason why this wont sell.
Im pleased to hear that its more of a hobby than a money spinner. It sounds like the advice is very specialised, so the demand wont be huge, but it will still be selling in 5 or 10 years if it is good.
Oh and ausfish is an excellent community. Your gonna have to lose the attitude if your gonna be a businessman.
Asking questions and dealing with answers you dont like is just part of market research, get used to it.
Do up a draft copy and try it out on some beginners to intermediate fisherman, and adjust your product to the feedback from them.
Show your draft copy to the local tackle shops.
Lighten up and go for it.
cheers
Andrew
Sprinter1
15-05-2016, 06:42 PM
IF you are so sure its a winner why even ask? Just go ahead and do it. Let us know you go.
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