surtees 650 workmate or bar crusher 670c or bar crusher 615c

[chuss]

I'm in a predicament on which boat to buy.
I have driven both, they are pretty much the same in the water. It comes to these final observations:

Bar Crusher 670:
Better finish on welds, refinements, dash layout, ergonomics, bunks, seats.
Feels much narrower and cramped with the wider gunnels and large seat boxes and longer bunks. Costs more

Surtees 650:
Feels huge! Like the nyalic finish, a tiny bit cheaper to buy ($5K), a bit more simple. Bunks are shorter, feel cheaper, seats are poo, dash is cramped.

Bar crusher 615
Feels nice, easier to handle, tow/park/store. Better in the shallow water. Cheaper to buy.
Feels small and restrictive and could probably only fish 2-3 people.

So what do I buy?
I fish anywhere along the coastal waters from inshore to 40kms out. 80% of the time I fish solo. 70% of the time I target whiting, snapper and then seasonly I crack at the tuna maybe 5 times for the year.
When I have company, it's my son that joins me or a couple mates. Bar crushers seem to have better resale to.

[Noelm]

Why would you pay more for a Barcrusher? Plenty of boats in that size range to choose from, don't be fooled by TV fishing shows....

[mitc69]

yes bar crusher 615 would be the way to go if u wanna resell later if u find it abit... hehe 40k offshore? i just grab any 4.5m boat.. cuz it not wroth the extra fuel burn.. something you find painful later...

[pubic1]

I looked over both the Surtees and Bar crushers at one of the sydney shows this year.

The thing that caught my eye wasn't what I could see on the outside, but more so the welding on the inside of the hull where it really matters.

The surtees boats were fully welded along their internal stringers.
The bar crushers were only stitch welded.

I wouldn't base my decision on the seating.
For a $5k saving, you can add a decent sounder package and upgrade the seating to whatever you like.

Either way, i'm sure any of thse boats will put a huge smile on your face when you launch it.

Good luck with your decision mate.

[chuss]

So what's a better boat for the money?
I'm looking 6.1-6.8m

[Chimo]

Heaps of second hand glass boats IMHO

[Moonlighter]

I'm in a predicament on which boat to buy.
I have driven both, they are pretty much the same in the water. It comes to these final observations:

Bar Crusher 670:
Better finish on welds, refinements, dash layout, ergonomics, bunks, seats.
Feels much narrower and cramped with the wider gunnels and large seat boxes and longer bunks. Costs more

Surtees 650:
Feels huge! Like the nyalic finish, a tiny bit cheaper to buy ($5K), a bit more simple. Bunks are shorter, feel cheaper, seats are poo, dash is cramped.

Bar crusher 615
Feels nice, easier to handle, tow/park/store. Better in the shallow water. Cheaper to buy.
Feels small and restrictive and could probably only fish 2-3 people.

So what do I buy?
I fish anywhere along the coastal waters from inshore to 40kms out. 80% of the time I fish solo. 70% of the time I target whiting, snapper and then seasonly I crack at the tuna maybe 5 times for the year.
When I have company, it's my son that joins me or a couple mates. Bar crushers seem to have better resale to.

Chuss

Surtees will upgrade the seats to pretty well whatever you want - the main difference I found with Surtees when I ordered my boat was that they would allow you to customise it how you wanted, to include options you want and exclude those you don't. And they would, if possible, do things like bigger fuel tanks.

Whereas BC it was the standard package only, virtually no choices.

The Surtees 650 hull is available as the Workmate (folding roof), Hardtop, or Game Fisher (longer cabin and bunks)

Bit surprised by your comment re the Surtees welds - maybe it was just that the BC paint over their welds in some areas whereas Surtees doesn't - I must say that I had a mate who is a qualified boilermaker look at the welds on my boat and he was seriously impressed. We felt that there was more care shown with their workmanship - probably because 1 person builds and is responsible for each Surtees boat, no production-line mentality there - look under the starboard duckboard and you'll see the person who built your boat's initials welded there.

Dont ignore the Surtees 610 in your calculations either. Available in few of versions: Workmate Hardtop, Workmate (folding roof), or the Game Fisher (hardtop plus bigger cabin/loger bunks).

I've had mine for 5 years now and still very impressed with it.

[pubic1]

I would look at the 6.1m hardtop with removable sun shade.

6.1 will be easier to handle with one bloke
Being able to remove the sun shade will make it easier to flick lures because fo the extra deck space - if you're into that sort of thing.

As mentioned by moonlighter, surtees will spec up your boat to anything you like.

Im all for Australian fabrication, but looking at the 2 different builders side by side, my mind wandered to the Surtees.

I think I read somewhere that surtees head office came out to Aus to investigate a cracked hull too?? can anyone confirm that?

If so, that is awesome after sales support.

[Luke G]

Do you want a 'real' 6.1 to 6.8' boat? a 6.1 bar crusher is more like 5.7m in the plate boat world. For value for money, moda marine could probably give you a quote on a real 6.5m boat for not much more cost

[stang69]

Just get a good glass boat. Leave the banging to Ricky Martin.
Is this pile of turd better than this pile of turd? My pile of turd is better than that pile of turd.......
But tinnies do make good river boats, until they corrode into thin air.

[rodneyk]

Just get a good glass boat. Leave the banging to Ricky Martin.
Is this pile of turd better than this pile of turd? My pile of turd is better than that pile of turd.......
But tinnies do make good river boats, until they corrode into thin air.
So what glass boat do you own and fish out of i am looking atm and finding a lot of overpriced crap in glass also around 50k Rod

[The Black Unicorn]

Mate before you commit to one of those brands check Extreme boats out. Waaay bigger boat than the other two.

[hainsofast]

How much coin you got to spend, I just spent some time in a stabicraft 2100 supercap, I love glass, but this thing was unreal, granted it is close to 100K if not more new, but I tell you we went through some rough sea and this thing rode very very well.

[chuss]

Budget is up to $80k.
Must fit in a shed with limits of 8.2m depth x 2.4m height.
No fibreglass as i do a lot of beach parking.

I looked at a surtees 5.8, 575 & 610. They are all similar. Its so damn confusing!!

[koastal]

Its a good problem you have. One of the best days of your life, buying a new boat.

I like old hulls and new motors.

[reelally]

Out of the 2 brands I'd have to say that the Surtees is my pick, they are slightly larger in size compared to Barcrusher and better looking cabin shapes. The Barcrusher however i think is finished off better with full paint option instead of that Nyalic clear which is hard work keeping clean, especially after fuel spills or sunscreen finger prints....Easily stains and chips.

The back up service for these brands often comes from their dealers instead of the builder directly. If you're looking at a Surtees in Qld I highly recommend Northside Marine as I believe they are Australia's biggest Surtees dealer and have a good relationship with the Surtees crew.

Cheers Dave

[Lordspink]

I think they are both great boats, for get what all those weak kneed fiberglass lovers say.

I have a 490c BarCrusher, I wont go into why I decided on that size and type but I will mention why I chose it over the 495 workmate Surtees.

Firstly I have been to BarCrushers factory in Melbourne (The father in-law spent a fair bit of money on a bigger hard top model so wanted to check the workman ship before he purchased). We got to walk through all stages of the build and it was mighty impressive, the amount of customization you can do to these boats is actually huge when you get into it (side note: what surtees call options BarCrusher calls standard). That said I'm sure a surtees boat will last just as long and I'm sure my hull will out last me.

Second in the size I was looking at, I got extra on the BC (options on the surtees); In floor full tank, tackle storage under the seats, price included a bimini, decent sounder, painted hull and a few other bits and bobs and was about a grand cheaper.

Looking now surtees has addressed these and come to the same price point. Both are cracking boats for no nonsense fishing, so I think it comes down to narrowing down what you personally want and having a look at the best options, personal preference is what its all about.

[Dogtoooth]

If you are looking to do a lot of offshore work don't pick a hull less then a 20 degree dead rise, and a 5mm bottom.If you plan to keep it, go max HP.

[Moonlighter]

Out of the 2 brands I'd have to say that the Surtees is my pick, they are slightly larger in size compared to Barcrusher and better looking cabin shapes. The Barcrusher however i think is finished off better with full paint option instead of that Nyalic clear which is hard work keeping clean, especially after fuel spills or sunscreen finger prints....Easily stains and chips.

The back up service for these brands often comes from their dealers instead of the builder directly. If you're looking at a Surtees in Qld I highly recommend Northside Marine as I believe they are Australia's biggest Surtees dealer and have a good relationship with the Surtees crew.

Cheers Dave

Dave, just to let you know that Surtees have a full paint option if that is what you want. Their options start at base alloy, nyalic all over, painte sides and nyalic everywhere else, painted sides and cabin and nyalic, and all paint. You can get whatever you want or can afford.

The nyalic is good on the exterior, mine after 5 years is barely marked. It's actually easy to keep clean. But fuel, as you note, will rip it off almost instantly, as will anything with alcohol in it. The nice thing is that nyalic can be easily repaired with a spray can, although a can is quite expensive. I have noticed that it has got grubby on handrails and seat boxes where sweaty arms and legs touch, I will tidy that up sometime with the touch-up spray, which blends in very nicely.

The other comments about things being options on Surteees that are standard on BC really just reflect different philosophical approaches taken by the two manufacturers as to how they package things.

Surtees approach is that they customise every boat to suit the owner, which of course means that the starting position is a core, basic fitout, and you simply add the things you want and don't add the things you don't want. Whereas BC basically starts with more things included as the core option and less options are then available to add/delete.

Both are good hulls and well built. One is just the original, and one is not.

[chuss]

Yeh tell me about confusion! Do i need a 6.7/6.5 m boat over a 5.7/5.8/6.1 m boat is the other burning question. There's a huge price difference!
I like to be safe when the weather is bad, but is that 500-700mm gonna make a huge difference?
When its blowing 25-35k and swell is 1-3m, will the bigger boat have a huge benefit? Or is it just a burden having a tank sized boat?
I found that surtees just feels way bigger on each boat, but it could just be that there seating boxes/position just give that impression.

[scottar]

Size does matter. Ride quality in average conditions is the principle difference. Feeling "safe" is down to the individual. I have fished offshore and felt safe in pretty average conditions in small centre consoles when bigger boats were heading home. Was I comfortable - not in a pink fit, but I didn't feel in danger. For comfort when it gets crappy, nothing beats a full hardtop set up. Staying warm and dry when water is coming over the front in bucket full size amounts goes a long way toward getting the maximum enjoyment out of a blue water trailer boat. Ultimately though, it's a decision that only you can make. Do you "need" it. Definitely not. Short of the potential to carry more fuel a 6 metre boat will go anywhere a 7 metre boat will. Will you want to upgrade or regret the smaller boat after you have taken an absolute pasting getting home one day - that may be a definite possibility. Unfortunately no boat is the "complete" package if you like to mix up your fishing. After upgrading my medium sized console to a 6 metre glass rig, I ended up buying a cheap barra punt to cover the end of the fishing spectrum that the glass rig just doesn't do at all well. You just have to sort out your priorities.

[chuss]

well, I went the 670 bra crusher in the end.. crushed my wallet alright!
The extra freeboard and cab space is so huge when you jump in each boat.
I went max HP to, 200 honda. Should be sweet.
Hardtop was great, but my house doesn't cater for such a setup (unless its on the front lawn).

[lippa]

get your deposit back and go grab a Mclay

[The Black Unicorn]

So how do you get a 670 in an 8.4m shed?

[chuss]

Measured it as 8m overall engine down to towball.

I owned a mclay once upon a time (551). Believe it or not, the 671 mclay came out at over $100k, well beyond what I paid for the BC

[The Black Unicorn]

Measured it as 8m overall engine down to towball.

I owned a mclay once upon a time (551). Believe it or not, the 671 mclay came out at over $100k, well beyond what I paid for the BC

But was it 671 long? The bar crusher mustn't be.

[chuss]

But was it 671 long? The bar crusher mustn't be.

Mclay is measured the same as the Bar crusher. Surtees, Mclay, BC, Stabi, Ramco, etc.. all now measure as per international standard which is the end of the welded part of the bow sprit to back of transom where motor is mounted.

[airlock]

sounds like you more or less answered the question, you don't fish wide regularly enough or with people enough to spend the extra on the bigger boat that will be less capable for much of your fishing (shallow water whiting stuff.)
I would go with bar crusher right now as they are a good boat, over priced yes but they hold their value well, if this remains the case is any ones guess.

As a side note check out these http://watsonsmarine.com.au/our-boats/5-80-metre-vindicator-half-cabin/ Not bad option if you have the cash, nice riding things.

Whatever it is you buy don't put your fishing buddies comfort on 10% of your trips above usability and ability to handle it solo for the rest of the time.

[chuss]

Well, the pricing is interesting.
Take a look at the Yellowfin, Stacer, Formosa, Trailcraft, etc.. they are actually more expensive when you add all the options and features. Sure they are beamier, but welding quality and finish is well below the barcrusher from my EYE observation.
I priced an Offshore Marine Master 6.1 which is about 6.4 overall but has the 2.45 beam. Sure there is a lot more boat, but you're looking at over $94K for the same features.
The bar crusher was actually priced very very well and I couldn't pass up the offer. And true with your reference to re-sale. They seem to go quite quickly on the market without a huge hit in depreciation compared to other vessels