Wiring the Victory

[Oceanic Dave]

Hi!

Will be wiring the Victory soon. I haven't had a chance yet to have a good look and follow the wires, so in the meantime was hoping maybe someone can explain how these guys wire the toggle switches?

I have posted some pics.

You can see the toggle switch and along the top you can see they are jumping across from switch to switch.

The bottom row seem to be independent.

On the other side there seems to be a fuse block, but only 4 wires run into that.

If anyone can advise on where these go, that would be great, thank you!

[scottar]

From the looks, there are 3 different input feed wires to the switches. This also accounts for only 4 wires at the fuse block - one in, 3 out. The output side of the switches go to the individual devices around the boat. You will probably find by pulling one fuse at a time that multiple devices will cease to function - this is not a desirable outcome and should be changed so that each switch has it's own fuse.

[tenzing]

Absolutely as per previous post.
I found by accident recently that the 12v socket fuse also was used for the bait pump, deck wash and BILGE PUMP . That situation was remedied immediately.
Why not each separately wired and fused.
Cheers
Brendan

[scottar]

Sign of the times unfortunately Brendan. It has really only been in what I would call recent years(the last 10, at best 15), since trailer boats electrical fit outs have gotten more complex that some manufacturers have started installing decent electrical systems. Some still leave an awful lot to be desired. A lot of it is cost driven. I have recently done a full electrical fit out on a similar sized rig - removal and replacement of most of the existing equipment. By the time I have it finished I will have put in excess of 60 hours into it to do it in a manner that I term "done properly" and it was by no means a complex vessel. Courtesy of our price driven consumerism, most manufacturers simply wont put that sort of time and money into an electrical system because the average punter wont pay for it - it is one of the behind the scenes things that generally no one cares about because they can't see it. Until it goes wrong that is.

[Oceanic Dave]

Yes I find this odd how they don't have independent fuses.

I could wire them all individually with inline fuses, that would be easy for me, but I will also try and work out what they did here once I get to it.

Might need some more help long the way.

Thanks guys!

[scottar]

Do yourself a favour and get a distribution block rather than use in line fuses. The Blueseas product is a good one but there are many others. Work out how many devices you need to provide power to and get a block to suit. The one I used the other week had 12 circuits. Your main input goes to the studs on the block. Positive wires then go either from the block to a switch and then to a device from the other side of the switch or if they don't require a switch - direct from the block to the device. Negative wires go from the block to the device. It keeps all the fuses (apart from the main fuse for the input which should be down the back beside the battery switch. There should also be a fuse down there for the 24 hour circuit for the bilge pump if you have a float switch that is always connected) in one place and makes life easy if anything stops.

[Oceanic Dave]

Yes I saw this last night actually while doing some research. I will just need to double check that I have enough room under the dash to fit it.

If this is the case, this is what I am thinking. I will try and explain it as much as I can without doing a diagram for now.

I have a 12V power stud that run +ve and -ve wires to.

Fuse Block
1. Run the positive from +ve Stud > Block +v terminal
2. Run the negative from the -ve Stud > Block -ve terminal

Switch:
Run the positive of the switch straight to the +ve fuse on the block
Run the negative of the switch to the -ve on the fuse block.

Does that sound right?

[scottar]

Nope. The switches don't have any negatives at all unless they are a backlit variety (which yours are not). Essentially the fuse block replaces those studs. From the fuse block there is an independently fused wire goes to each switch. Each devices around the boat has a positive that goes to the switch (they are already there - the wires on the switches that are on the side with no jumpers) and a negative which may or may not be on the current negative post. Any negatives on the negative post need to be connected to the negative points on the block. Any additional positives on the post that do not run through switches (normally things like sounder/GPS/VHF) then need to be moved to an individual positive output point on the block. These devices commonly have an inline fuse as well which can either be left in or totally removed but if you remove them the block must have the correct size fuse fitted for that device.


So

Positives

1. Main positive feed wire to positive post on new block
2. Individual fused output from block to each switch
3. Any device requiring a switch to the other terminal on the relevant switch
4. Any device not requiring a switch - positive goes direct to individually fused output on block


Negatives

1. Main negative feed to negative post on block
2. Any remaining negatives from the negative stud to negative output terminals on block.

[tenzing]

Heres a pic of mine before repowering
I think it is a fair example of what you are referring to.
The bulk of the boats wiring was replaced by a very diligent and well respected AF member
The upper gauges are now NMEA backbone linked
The recent bilge pump issue arises from one of the central joined ( blue ) switches and is now fused separately
All the fuses are clearly marked and grouped together, ( eg vhf, 27 meg, stereo,sounder , gps , bilge etc etc)
The lights circuits are commonly fuse , as are the bait and deckwash pumps at this stage.
Hope this helps
Cheers
Brendan

[Oceanic Dave]

Yes, I have something very similar at the moment. Hoping to get to it by tomorrow!

Thank you for this.

[Crunchy]

I changed all in-line fuses over to a "Blueseas" fuse block and very happy with the results, they are very compact so you shouldn't have any space problems. Adding new equipment is a breeze.

www.bluesea.com/products/5026/ST_Blade_Fuse_Block_-_12_Circuits_with_Negative_Bus_and_Cover

[Oceanic Dave]

Thanks mate, this is the one that I have seen and looking at getting.

[gofishin]

Generally the switches/gangs will always be higher than/above the fuse blocks in trailer boats. Whatever switches and fuse blocks you choose Dave, make sure you run ALL wires down below the fuse block, then up into it!

Why? For one reason or another, things on boats tend to leak at some time or another, especially things around the helm. When this happens, salt water tracks down the wires and straight into the fuse block - unless the wires go down below and the back up into the fuse block.

Why don't all boat builders do this simple task? FiIK! Well other than as Scottar mentioned above ($), maybe they think their boats/fittings/fit outs don't leak... or maybe they don't understand gravity!!

Sorry, rant over :) .

Cheers
Brendon

[scottar]

Generally the switches/gangs will always be higher than/above the fuse blocks in trailer boats. Whatever switches and fuse blocks you choose Dave, make sure you run ALL wires down below the fuse block, then up into it!

Why? For one reason or another, things on boats tend to leak at some time or another, especially things around the helm. When this happens, salt water tracks down the wires and straight into the fuse block - unless the wires go down below and the back up into the fuse block.

Why don't all boat builders do this simple task? FiIK! Well other than as Scottar mentioned above ($), maybe they think their boats/fittings/fit outs don't leak... or maybe they don't understand gravity!!

Sorry, rant over :) .

Cheers
Brendon

Good point Brendon. It is a good idea to seal all your switch panels, gauges etc that are above your electrics in with some standard silicone. Don't use sika or similar - one day you might want to get them out - preferably without an angle grinder. As for why the builders don't bother - definitely comes down to time and money. It is a sh*t of a job to do neatly and the clean up is time consuming.

I have spent considerable amounts of time trying to get my windscreen to keep the water out with varying degrees of success. Due to the Victory's moulding design where the side windows lowest point is not at the very back, the side window frames will fill with water which then, due to the fact the window leans in toward the centreline, runs over onto the surface where the helmsman (or at least me) rests their arm whilst driving with a hand on the throttle. This involved complete removal of the side window glass and frame and extensive amounts of silicone under, around and inside the frame with the glass being bedded into it so there is no gap for water to sit in. I pretty much exhausted my 4 letter word vocabulary and may have invented a couple of new ones in the process.

The point to my waffling is this - In the midst of the process, I required some new sealing rubber so I went to the screen manufacturers and when the guy behind the counter asked how he could help, I informed him that if he could advise me as to how to stop the screen leaking like a sieve, that would be great. His response was to comment on a conversation he had with a well respected vessel manufacturer (Not Seafarer) who had advised him that when people complained, he informed them it was a "windscreen", not a "waterscreen" and that is just the way it is. So the long and short of it is things like that simply go into the "too hard" basket for a lot of manufacturers.

[tenzing]

Good point Brendon. It is a good idea to seal all your switch panels, gauges etc that are above your electrics in with some standard silicone. Don't use sika or similar - one day you might want to get them out - preferably without an angle grinder. As for why the builders don't bother - definitely comes down to time and money. It is a sh*t of a job to do neatly and the clean up is time consuming.

I have spent considerable amounts of time trying to get my windscreen to keep the water out with varying degrees of success. Due to the Victory's moulding design where the side windows lowest point is not at the very back, the side window frames will fill with water which then, due to the fact the window leans in toward the centreline, runs over onto the surface where the helmsman (or at least me) rests their arm whilst driving with a hand on the throttle. This involved complete removal of the side window glass and frame and extensive amounts of silicone under, around and inside the frame with the glass being bedded into it so there is no gap for water to sit in. I pretty much exhausted my 4 letter word vocabulary and may have invented a couple of new ones in the process.

The point to my waffling is this - In the midst of the process, I required some new sealing rubber so I went to the screen manufacturers and when the guy behind the counter asked how he could help, I informed him that if he could advise me as to how to stop the screen leaking like a sieve, that would be great. His response was to comment on a conversation he had with a well respected vessel manufacturer (Not Seafarer) who had advised him that when people complained, he informed them it was a "windscreen", not a "waterscreen" and that is just the way it is. So the long and short of it is things like that simply go into the "too hard" basket for a lot of manufacturers.

I had my screen seals "improved" at Australian Marine Windscreens a year or more back. They cut around all the rubber seals, masked up and did a heavy black seal ( sika I am guessing) and tested with the firehose.
Its pretty good and was about 300 bucks total.
At the time they were concentrating on making window and door units by the thousands for dongas for the mining industry.
I was also advised that they were not going to be 100% successful.
Honestly they are not bad at all, also having sailtracked the clears.
Any small amounts of water runs around to the sill directly above the binnacle area, so I have sealed a backing plate behind the binnacle mount in the top HALF only to stop water running in too much in heavy stuff.
After each trip I spray from the hose fairly generously up behind the area and it drains out thru the unsealed bottom half of the backing plate.
If I ever get around to it I am going to make a small slot drain at the low point of the sill ( probs drivers only at first)and drain it out above the drainage groove on the gunwhale. These days though theres hardly any to worry about.
Cheers
Brendan

[scottar]

Sounds Good Brendan. My Front screen has never leaked too badly - not to the point that a towel thrown up the front won't soak up the little bit that gets in - it was just the sides which are pretty much sorted. I have simply used adhesive Velcro between the press studs at this point as I still not sure whether I am going to go down the road of a custom hardtop when time comes for renewal. The Velcro actually does a pretty good job when you manage to roll one up the bow on the bar - of course the open zip out - not so much but thems the breaks.