Anyone have a 20' Panga, Banana Boat, Longboat?

[Nicko_Cairns]

if so would you mind measuring the transom height for me? Looking at an old hull I found and want to check the transom height is correct, I don't think it's been rebuilt but it looks a little low.

from what I understand they are all based off the same moulds, so the transom heights should be pretty similar.

thanks.

[myusernam]

there are heaps of moulds. every man and his dog modifies. if you are talking the skinny yamaha ones then it would be 20 inch.
then there is the world health 22ft which was like the southwind ub22. they are also a bit lower than extra long but an extra long outboard is better because of the delta pad and u can get more trim. ela motors used to have a brochure on the website but now they just ahve this
http://www.elamotors.com.pg/page/Product_Showroom/Yamaha/Boats/Complete_Range_Listing/

[Crunchy]

I just went outside and measured, 520mm (20 1/2 inch's) from the flat part of the delta pad to the top of the transom. Boat is orginal UB580 with no modificatons. The gelcoat is quite thick and would account for a 3 or 4 mm.

[Nicko_Cairns]

I just went outside and measured, 520mm (20 1/2 inch's) from the flat part of the delta pad to the top of the transom. Boat is orginal UB580 with no modificatons. The gelcoat is quite thick and would account for a 3 or 4 mm.

Thanks heaps Crunchy, I'm completely gutting this one and re-doing it with a custom floor etc. I've read that some people have water on the floor quite often and others have made some mods so they are dryer. I'm guessing they mean the scuppers, but any advice would be great, thanks!

I'm making mine an open boat with a tiller steer, 200L long mack esky in the middle near the front, with glassed brackets to hold it in place when it's rough, so I get some weight forward. Fuel tank up the front somewhere. 60hp 4-stroke tiller steer, from what I've read that won't be fast but I'll easily get 20-odd knots. I travel about an hour at the most to my spots, often a lot less, and the boat will be all about fishing room and diving room, so a tiller made sense.

I'm looking at making a bench at the back which keeps the batteries dry, and also a couple of flushable bait boxes. I'll have a removable live bait tank so I don't always have to take it. Rod storage will be in a bimini style cover made form tube aluminium which will also have some LED lighting in it and will hold the radio antenna.

Sounder etc will be in a box sort of to my left when driving, with a removable perspex screen so when there's spray it won't get wet, but when it's flat I can press buttons to my hearts content.

Still considering storage up near the bow, life jackets will probably be stored behind a cargo net near the anchor well so they're easily accessible and don't take up much room.

Probably three underfloor hatches, not sure yet exactly how many.

Still deciding how large a fuel tank to put in, 4-stroke should be pretty economical though.

Cheers.

p.s. any idea on your hull weight?

[Crunchy]

Take some photo's along the way mate, be keen to see it progress.

Yes the deck is wet when stopped as the scuppers are large and only just above the waterline...you do get used to it, I wear rubber shoes in summer and dive booties in winter! The water purges out as soon as you move forawrd. It happens when there is a bit of extra weight at the rear, e.g. when the livie tank is full or another adult down the back. The original boats came with screw in bungs for the scuppers and there was a post on here years ago when someone managed to track them down, apparently they are still available if ordered from Yamaha O/S. Not sure what modifications to make with the suppers, to be honest they don't bother me and on one occasion when I took a monster greenie into the boat crossing a bar I was very thankful they work as well as they do, the water purged very quickly even though I was dead in the water with all the extra weight!

I took my fixed bait board off and replaced with removable, wish I'd done it years ago as it was always getting in the way when fighting a fish round the back of the boat, now I just use a bait board on top of the rear hatch. I have a CC configeration so can't offer much advice on the layout for a tiller steer but storage will be a pain.

The 60 will be a bit sluggish top end (I have a 90 2-Stk) but you will be able to get up on the plane easy enough in most situations and it will be super economical. I have a top spped around 26 knots and cruise around 20 knots @ 3800 RPM. I get about 1.7Km / L on average, would love to re-powder with a 100HP 4-stk but $$$ and extra weight in the arse has me living with my 90A for a while yet.

Hull weight round 600Kg.

Good luck with it and let me know if you need anything else.

[myusernam]

16 years ago i did the same with a UB22. I had the same idea re tiller but I ended up putting on a console etc. also had a 14 foot longboat as well. I would centre or only slighty forward the weight of the esky and the tank. the cut away stern longboats like the 22 and the older 580's dont like weight in the back but you can have too much up the front, especially if you have the skinny old yamaha style. I have seen a lot of them with very high floors (particulary the skinny ones) like goodwin used to make. I think its a trade off with stability. when I think making the floor just above the rib height is the go. the 14' i had used to self drain so well i didnt even use a bung. the 22 not so. I think a good thing would be a sump at the back, so you still have a sealed deck, but with a cutaway that houses a bilge pump. float switch and grill over the top. that way all the water that comes in when you are ina nd out of the water gets pumped out and u dont have to mess around with bungs. also if you cop a wave over the side it's gone quick. you can still get good economy out of a bigger tiller too, and the extra speed and not having to ring it's neck is always nice. id consider bigger. much is made of load carrying capability etc but at the end of the day if you load up there is a lot more boat in the water and its a lot harder to push. my 2c
I hear gavin goodwin is doing repairs again out of cardwell. He used to own, build and fit out longboats. maybe you could ask him

[Crunchy]

I think a good thing would be a sump at the back, so you still have a sealed deck, but with a cutaway that houses a bilge pump. float switch and grill over the top. that way all the water that comes in when you are ina nd out of the water gets pumped out and u dont have to mess around with bungs.

Struggling to picture this and why it would be needed as the amount of water that comes on board is pretty minimal, there is already a bilge so would seem over kill to have one for the deck as well.

[Nicko_Cairns]

thanks guys, looking at the transom on this one and it had screw bungs, no scuppers. But it did have an opening into the floor up the front so must have had a bilge/drain style system, I won't know exactly until I remove the current floor.

I wonder if a combination of duckbill bungs and bilges would be best? I'm not sure if I'd want the wet floor, or if I'd get used to it. I'm planning on doing some sleeping in the boat too, so a dry floor would be nice (obviously it will probably get wet underway).

Thanks myusernam, I'll track down Gavin, good to know.

Cheers.

[Crunchy]

I just can't picture having to set up a bilge to drain the deck, sounds like way more trouble then its worth, more stuff to go wrong. We're only talking about a small amount of water - 500ml's - 1Lt?? Will take some pics next time I'm out.

Yeh mate if your going to sleep on board you will need a solution, bungs would be perfect IMHO. I throw a mattress up front for the kids to sleep on after a day out and it does get a little wet at the back end.

[Nicko_Cairns]

there are heaps of moulds. every man and his dog modifies. if you are talking the skinny yamaha ones then it would be 20 inch.
then there is the world health 22ft which was like the southwind ub22. they are also a bit lower than extra long but an extra long outboard is better because of the delta pad and u can get more trim. ela motors used to have a brochure on the website but now they just ahve this
http://www.elamotors.com.pg/page/Product_Showroom/Yamaha/Boats/Complete_Range_Listing/

Ive read they all came from the inital mould though, yep they'd be modified to hell now!

its called a scorpion 6.17, never heard of them but looks fairly 'panga 18'ish, haven't been in a UB580 for years though, went on a charter on one once years ago, wasn't into boats at the time so just thought it was skinny lol, similar width.

[Nicko_Cairns]

I just can't picture having to set up a bilge to drain the deck, sounds like way more trouble then its worth, more stuff to go wrong. We're only talking about a small amount of water - 500ml's - 1Lt?? Will take some pics next time I'm out.

Yeh mate if your going to sleep on board you will need a solution, bungs would be perfect IMHO. I throw a mattress up front for the kids to sleep on after a day out and it does get a little wet at the back end.

Thanks mate, I'll look into those style scuppers, can you close your scuppers at rest?!?

appreciate the advice.

[myusernam]

Four blokes getting in and out spearing with wetties full of water and gear it adds up. Several liters per person per entry really. And I have a sealed deck, so there is no bilge below. In my boat if I let the bungs out there's too much water on deck. Anyway just an opinion. My dory I have a bilge for same reason

[Badone]

My ub670 has a Honda 100 and top speed of 31k. Spear with 4 blokes all day and water isn't a problem. Undo the bungs and it's gone in seconds. I sleep 2 people easily one either side of the Mackerral box which runs the length of the boat in front of the console. I think a 60 4 st would be very sluggish with more than 2 especially with dive gear on board.

[Nicko_Cairns]

My ub670 has a Honda 100 and top speed of 31k. Spear with 4 blokes all day and water isn't a problem. Undo the bungs and it's gone in seconds. I sleep 2 people easily one either side of the Mackerral box which runs the length of the boat in front of the console. I think a 60 4 st would be very sluggish with more than 2 especially with dive gear on board.

Thanks mate,

got pics of your bungs? Just standard or scuppers with bungs? Got pics of your layout? Sounds interesting. Cheers

[Badone]

Hey Nicko, the bungs are just the standard 30mm plastic ones that came with the boat. Wet deck has two scuppers on each side, one amidships and one at the rear and they are accessed from the inside. I have a 90l fuel tank under the floor at the front then a built in box about 2m long x 500 wide x 400 high above the floor ( I had it built in ). Console sits at the rear third of the boat. There is a bit of space under the floor at the rear that doesn't get used. Would post some pics but I am too stupid to figure out how....

[Nicko_Cairns]

Hey Nicko, the bungs are just the standard 30mm plastic ones that came with the boat. Wet deck has two scuppers on each side, one amidships and one at the rear and they are accessed from the inside. I have a 90l fuel tank under the floor at the front then a built in box about 2m long x 500 wide x 400 high above the floor ( I had it built in ). Console sits at the rear third of the boat. There is a bit of space under the floor at the rear that doesn't get used. Would post some pics but I am too stupid to figure out how....

haha fair enough mate.

ok cool, i might just go with scuppers at the rear and see how that goes, plus some extra bungs just in case. i'll try to climb all over someone's southwind to see how they are setup in person.

i'm going to get some 90 angles glassed into the floor to hold an esky but so it's removable for cleaning, and on a snorkelling day I can leave it at home if I want.

checking out the boat again this arvo, should be a really good inshore and occasionally offshore beast by the time I'm done. getting some help from mates that know what they're doing which will help a lot. might end up with two mack eskies down the middle, one for fish and one for dry storage, just to increase the storage room, and i'll put cushions on top for seating too. i've got a plan in mind but i need to think about it for a while and make sure i'll be happy with the finished boat.

cheers mate.

[Crunchy]

I just use a rubber mat under my esky and it doesn't move even in rough conditions, I wouldn't bother glassing in any kind of esky holders as they will be a pain for those times when you want a clear deck. Or consider recessed hook holders and use straps to secure.

[Crunchy]

More I think about it I think 60HP is too small...:-? I seen a 580 with a 50 but it was only used in a lake

[ranmar850]

The original UB19 Yamaha came with 50Hp as standard, or optional 70hp (max). I went for the 70, performance was fine with four on board. Very sensitive to trim,especially fore and aft, fitted a foil which helped a lot, much less need for retrimming. The UB 22's generally had 90hp. We are talking all 2 stroke here, as it was the nineties. Loaded up with dive gear, I think a 60 hp 4 stroke would struggle a bit, as a previous poster opined.
There was space under the deck behind removable panels aft of the console, I glassed a small icebox into there and fitted a hinged flush cover. Fuel tank was under a similar space forward of the console. The lift up hooks just posted are a good idea, I have them in the deck of my Dominator to hold the icebox down, leaves a fairly flush deck when you don't need the box. You really don't want large fixed fittings sticking up from the deck when you don't need the box, they are just a trip hazard/toe breaker, IMO.
I still have a fondness for those boats, loved mine but had to sell when times got tough for a while, damn things are still worth what I sold mine for in 2000 (?)

[Nicko_Cairns]

The original UB19 Yamaha came with 50Hp as standard, or optional 70hp (max). I went for the 70, performance was fine with four on board. Very sensitive to trim,especially fore and aft, fitted a foil which helped a lot, much less need for retrimming. The UB 22's generally had 90hp. We are talking all 2 stroke here, as it was the nineties. Loaded up with dive gear, I think a 60 hp 4 stroke would struggle a bit, as a previous poster opined.
There was space under the deck behind removable panels aft of the console, I glassed a small icebox into there and fitted a hinged flush cover. Fuel tank was under a similar space forward of the console. The lift up hooks just posted are a good idea, I have them in the deck of my Dominator to hold the icebox down, leaves a fairly flush deck when you don't need the box. You really don't want large fixed fittings sticking up from the deck when you don't need the box, they are just a trip hazard/toe breaker, IMO.
I still have a fondness for those boats, loved mine but had to sell when times got tough for a while, damn things are still worth what I sold mine for in 2000 (?)

thanks mate, this is a stinger 6.19, so 20', sounds like a 70 will be a better option, not sure if a 90 would be too much weight on the arse? Dunno.

[myusernam]

well a stinger is nothing like a ub 580/670. dpont know why u think they come out of the same mould.
They are smaller boats. a 50 is common on the smaller ones. (the made a 619 and a 723 from memory) if you look on boatpoint you should find a few might give you some ideas on setup, bungs, floor height and power

[Nicko_Cairns]

well a stinger is nothing like a ub 580/670. dpont know why u think they come out of the same mould.
They are smaller boats. a 50 is common on the smaller ones. (the made a 619 and a 723 from memory) if you look on boatpoint you should find a few might give you some ideas on setup, bungs, floor height and power

Just what I've heard mate, the inital panga/longboat design was created for third world countries, and the molds were shipped around to a heap of different countries, some were later acquired by companies far and wide which were the basis for longboats/pangas around the world. The southwind is a flasher looking version of the same hull, Imemsa is Yamaha in Mexico and they still produce the original panga type design, I'm guessing (and it's a guess without comparing the hulls) that the outer shell of those hulls is exactly the same as the Southwind, however the Southwind would have a much nicer/better finish.

talking about the bottom part of the hull, not the fitout etc. Some companies then changed their own moulds slightly apparently, but the outer hull was initially the same.

The yanks changed some of their panga/longboat molds, making them a wider boat which then required more horsepower and negated much of the original design. don't get me wrong they are beautiful boats and probably handle very well, but they need a lot more horsepower and function less as a skipping on top of the waves hull as they were designed...

There's only one 6.19 that I can find anywhere... so that's why I'm looking at Southwinds for ideas, the hull weight should be reasonably similar, I'll measure up mine v's a southwind and post the results... just need to find someone locally with a 580.. should be pretty close I reckon. I'll take a photo of both underneath too, should be interesting.

[Master4Med2]

Nick, there's a UB 580 for sale at Caravonica.
It's on Cairns Gumtree, go have a look.

Cheers
Con

[Crunchy]

Good to see what not to do by the looks..:-X

[Nicko_Cairns]

Nick, there's a UB 580 for sale at Caravonica.
It's on Cairns Gumtree, go have a look.

Cheers
Con

Thanks mate!

[lee8sec]

Here a few photos of a stinger. Side on it looks different to a UB.
http://www.gumtree.com.au/s-ad/maryborough/motorboats-powerboats/stinger-longboat-6-19m/1076180576

[Nicko_Cairns]

Here a few photos of a stinger. Side on it looks different to a UB.
http://www.gumtree.com.au/s-ad/maryborough/motorboats-powerboats/stinger-longboat-6-19m/1076180576

Yes mate, bit different, wonder what the funny little bit near the bow is on the stringer, it is like they were going to make a thicker top layer then just said '#### it'. ;D

Its official that I'm getting it, will put some restoration photos up over the next few months.

I messgaed the the guy on gumtree about that stinger but didn't hear back, I was keen to know about fuel tanks and performance...

[lee8sec]

Did you see this review ?http://www.fishingmonthly.com.au/Articles/Display/4952-Stinger-580-Rampage


thanks mate, this is a stinger 6.19, so 20', sounds like a 70 will be a better option, not sure if a 90 would be too much weight on the arse? Dunno.

[Nicko_Cairns]

Did you see this review ?http://www.fishingmonthly.com.au/Articles/Display/4952-Stinger-580-Rampage

Yeah mate, I've googled the hell out of Stinger boats. I would be interested to see the rampage but there were no pics, max hp of 100 was interesting, I'm guessing the hull would be similar to the one I'm looking at, except 30cm longer, maybe on the nose? Not sure. I think mine is an older version but it's hard to tell.. no rego numbers have survived enough to tell the former rego and try to work it out that way. I'll have to phone DTMR actually and find out what to do, no HIN or anything lol.

[The Mad Cat]

(There's only one 6.19 that I can find anywhere... so that's why I'm looking at Southwinds for ideas, the hull weight should be reasonably similar, I'll measure up mine v's a southwind and post the results... just need to find someone locally with a 580.. should be pretty close I reckon. I'll take a photo of both underneath too, should be interesting.)

Hey Nick,
I'm around this weekend if you want to come down and check out our Southwind. My number is on the email I sent you a couple of weeks ago.

TMC

[Nicko_Cairns]

(There's only one 6.19 that I can find anywhere... so that's why I'm looking at Southwinds for ideas, the hull weight should be reasonably similar, I'll measure up mine v's a southwind and post the results... just need to find someone locally with a 580.. should be pretty close I reckon. I'll take a photo of both underneath too, should be interesting.)

Hey Nick,
I'm around this weekend if you want to come down and check out our Southwind. My number is on the email I sent you a couple of weeks ago.

TMC

Mate I'd love to and good chance to finally catch up. I'll call you, probably tomorrow arvo as the missus has a list of jobs for me to do tomorrow morning.