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View Full Version : Something is rotten in Denmark



stevemid
19-02-2014, 04:38 PM
Thanks to Grand_Marlin who posted the Yamaha performance data sheets http://www.ausfish.com.au/vforum/showthread.php?197262-Boat-amp-Motor-Performance-Sheets I was able to pick a boat similar to the one I'm building with the Yammie 70's that I am buying and do a little dreaming about what kind of performance I am going to get.

The boat I chose to compare was the Sailfish Reef Runner 5.8M which is the same displacement as me, same twin Yammie 70's etc etc. but 1.2M shorter. http://www.yamaha-motor.com.au/sites/yamaha-motor/files/Sailfish_5.8%20Reef%20Runner_F70AETX.pdf

HOWEVER, when I shared the above with my friend, George, the communist mathematician, he vomited all over the top speed claims for this boat. He said, "This is simple arithmetic:
6300 rev/2.33gear = 2703 RPM at the prop
Now, theoretically, a 14" prop produces 14" of forward motion for each revolution. So....
Multiply 2703 * 14" * 60 minutes and you get 2703*14*60=2,270,520 inches traveled per hour
Divide by 12 and that's 189,210 feet per hour. Now there's 6000 feet in a nautical mile so 189,210/12=31.54 NM/hr

They say they got 31 knots and the absolute best that could be gotten with that setup is 31.54 leaving only a figure of 1.7% to account for prop slip (the inefficiency of the prop.)

From my research, 10% slip is very efficient, 15% is probably more average and less than 10% is rare. Given that, the boat in question, with average 15% slip was probably actually doing 26.8 knots (.85 * 31.54= 26.8)

The moral of the story? All fishermen are liars.

Steve
Boatbuilder, not yet a fisherman)

PS George's way of accounting for this is comparing it to his trusty Trabant (all communists compare everything mechanical to their experience with the Trabant.) "Back in Hungary I used have a very good mechanic who serviced my trusty Trabant. I complained to him that my Trabant uses too much petrol, and my friends say their Trabants use significantly less. His answer was, "Why don't I claim better economy too!"

gofishin
19-02-2014, 08:16 PM
....Now, theoretically, a 14" prop produces 14" of forward motion... Hi Steve, the answer is right there, as you wrote it... sometimes practice doesn't follow theory, and especially with prop pitch!

Haven't checked the sums but the logic is sound - and I know you would have double/triple checked them anyway;D. Assuming that the published speed stats are correct, if the prop is actually bit taller than 14" you could easily get 1.4% slip. Put the same prop & motor(s) on a similar, but different boat, and the slip would be different.

How do I know this? Well on one particular prop testing occasion, after multiple direction GPS speed trials (at WOT), the stats averaged out at something like 0.7% slip. Not theoretically possible, and all it means is the prop is bigger than the 'rated' pitch. Same prop on different boats produced low slip figures, but not this low. This prop was ~1.5" bigger than the rated pitch from memory.
Cheers
Brendon

PS. Not that I would always assume 'manufacturer published' motor/prop trials are documented accurately, as sometimes they do get things quite wrong!

aussiebasser
20-02-2014, 07:33 AM
Does the cupping on the blade of the prop increase the distance a prop will travel per revolution? Some props have a small cup and some have a super cup, (I guess like a bra) so that could change the actual distance travelled.

Fed
20-02-2014, 07:35 AM
Add an inch for cupping makes it look better.
100791

BTW, 6076 Feet in a NM.

NM/hr? I thought you were an old salty seadog, obviously knot.:D

Divide by 12 and that's 189,210 feet per hour. Now there's 6000 feet in a nautical mile so 189,210/12=31.54 NM/hr
Now get back to work & finish that boat off!

aussiebasser
20-02-2014, 07:43 AM
Have a read here:

http://www.thepropellerspecialist.com.au/services/propellers101/

RayLamp
20-02-2014, 12:24 PM
Did good ol' George's calculations include the fact that there were two props providing thrust?

manta man
20-02-2014, 04:16 PM
Well it"s sure not the Danish Women.