Making ice

[Spiderpig]

Upgraded the fishing freezer today, got myself a 700L westinghouse.

Just wondering what innovative ways you guys make you ice?

I'm not really interested in purchased re-freezable ice packs. I usually take about 80 - 100kg of ice for drinks and fish.

[shaungonemad]

I just got a couple of heavy plastic containers about ten litre capacity when they are frozen pop them out and stack them in the freezer they last heaps longer than bought stuff.

[Schulzy]

Ice cream containers for ice ice and milk/soft drink bottles for drinks and mixing with your slurry lasts longer and saves time :)

[jtpython]

I have been using a plastic heat sealer bag holds about 5 litres then use the sealer on the crevac machine seal it and bob's ur uncle nice thick bag frozen ice blocks
JT

[Noelm]

I just use plastic buckets, nothing flash, but I have three square ones that are a nice size.

[Chimo]

3 litre milk bottles filled with sea water freeze slower but last lots longer. Also use 5 litre pool acid containers with sea water. Last well.

[Noelm]

I guess I might add, I have made some salt water ice as a test (from sea water) and regardless of the science of it all, it lasts just the same as tap water ice! The advantage being, if you are a slurry person, it does not dilute the salt slurry.

[Spiderpig]

I have been using milk bottles (sh!tloads of them), seawater is a good idea. They don't last long, but they're not in short supply either. I like the fact that you can easily cut them apart too.

I like the sound of these bags JT, where do you get them?. I think one of the biggest problems with making ice is water floating around the freezer and sticking everything together. This would possibly stop this.

[jtpython]

Pacfood Brisbane I also get my Crevac pre cut bags from them these I got by mistake thinking they were crevac bags but they are a 300mm x 400mm 100 micron Vac Pouch I can drop ya 50 or so to give a try out if u like mate I think I got 500 for 98$
JT
http://www.pacfood.com.au/vacuum.html

[jtpython]

I use to make in Alloy backs of street lights but yes same thing they'd stick together in freezer so I started putting in shopping bags but this works quiet good. If I could paste pics I could show u the end results
JT

[Dan5]

Mate those stainless steel hot food trays are the shit........They are cheap as to buy and the ice just pops out as the sides are tapered and the corners have a radius.......I freeze the big ones and cut it to size with the power saw so they fit perfectly in the esky.........nice big slabs 65mm thick.Dan

[Volvo]

Pac Plus Brisbane I also get my Crevac pre cut bags from them these I got by mistake thinking they were crevac bags but they are a 300mm x 400mm 100 micron Vac Pouch I can drop ya 50 or so to give a try out if u like mate I think I got 500 for 98$
JT

First off you mind uploading some pics of these bags and where you purchased them from please mate..
Secondly i used to make my own ice in old ice cream containers or whatever small tubs i had but found after breaking the ice to spread around my fish the thumping of the boat if the weather came out a tad on the lumpy side would bruise some of the fish.
Now i just buy ten to fifteen kilo bags of cured Ice and spread around my fish as i load them into the main esky, also take enough for a ice slurry brine to place the fish into as we catch them..

[jtpython]

Pacfood Its called mate go to sealer bags and there
http://www.pacfood.com.au/vacuum.html

[Spaniard_King]

Find a good local ice cream shop, they throw out hundreds of plastic 5 litre containers.I get them in batches of 40. best ice blocks gettin around.

I stack them in my freezer with a 5mm bit of ply in between the layers

[Schulzy]

Also forgot to add butter containers as well as for the breaking off the ice break it before you go in a grain bag or similar before you go out.( same bags as you get bulk ice)

[Chimo]

Maybe the saltwater blocks stay frozen long time due to good thermal insulation of the esky being used?

However never done a trial Noel so cannot dispute your trial.

Works for me tho.

Cheers
Chimo

[thelump]

My mrs used to work at an outdoor education centre (school camp type place) anyhoo, she used to bring home a heap of commercial margarine containers (5L) and ice cream containers (10L). We also go through a truckload of yogurt in this house and they come in handy little 1L buckets. When using these I get the ice out and put the block in a brattice bag and swing into the concrete exploding the ice then into the esky. Lasts heaps longer than party ice and makes an awesome slurry. Only issue is that it will freeze your coke bottles.

[jtpython]

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I had to type lnk in by hand lol

[robsue]

i use 5 litre containers, put cup or so of pool salt in, dissolve in bit of hot water, then fill to 5 litre mark, put lid on and freeze....
when I go fishing/crabbing I put a couple in esky, few buckets of salt water, and doesn't take long to have icy cold water .....a soon as crabs hit the water they go to sleep, no fighting/loosing claws
when I cook crabs they go straight back into cold water, stops the cooking process and also meat doesn't stick to shell

then I refreeze the 5 litre containers for next trip

[thrillseeker1]

This subject has appeared before,"saltwater ice" is no more effective than "freshwater ice".
"Saltwater ice", when it freezes to -18c, makes freshwater ice with brine pockets. Lots of ice(any type) and adding normal sea water lowers the freezing point slightly from fresh water, not much point because the fish doesn't need to be frozen.
Salt water slurry helps with osmosis, the fish doesn't draw in water.

[robsue]

I put the 5 litre containers in the esky keeping he screwon tops on, ADDING sea water to the esky which then becomes very cold water

I know from experience that with ice and salt you can freeze things

if you want to freeze things or prolong the life of ice, scatter a liberal amount of pool salt over the ice, but not too much, I have frozen beer camping over straddie in the past.....

my point with salt being, you will never get freezing water just adding ice to water, add salt and must be a chemical reaction, the water will have a lower temp depending on how much salt is added whether you will have freezing water

[thrillseeker1]

I put the 5 litre containers in the esky keeping he screwon tops on, ADDING sea water to the esky which then becomes very cold water

I know from experience that with ice and salt you can freeze things

if you want to freeze things or prolong the life of ice, scatter a liberal amount of pool salt over the ice, but not too much, I have frozen beer camping over straddie in the past.....

my point with salt being, you will never get freezing water just adding ice to water, add salt and must be a chemical reaction, the water will have a lower temp depending on how much salt is added whether you will have freezing water

I'll explain it this way,,
In a perfect esky, water will reach 0°C along with the remaining ice. Molecules of water are still escaping from the solid ice into the liquid water (melting), and molecules of water in the liquid are still being captured on the surface of the ice (freezing). The rate of freezing is the same as the rate of melting, and the amount of ice and the amount of water won't change. The ice and water are in dynamic equilibrium with each other. The ice is melting, and the water is freezing, but both are occurring at the same rate, so there is no net change in either quantity.

This balance will be maintained as long as the container stays insulated or unless something else happens to favor one of the processes over the other.

Adding more salt, or anything other than water, disrupts that equilibrium.

When salt(sugar, alcohol) is added to water, the salt and water molecules stick together, in combination they can't freeze, heat then must be removed to slow down and separate the combined salt and water molecules. The removal of the additional heat is required to freeze the salt-water combination. The ice heats up, pure water freezes out and the remaining brine(saltier water) stays liquid below freezing. In the extreme, more salt and given enough refrigeration the temp of the brine can drop to -21C.

[Chimo]

Increase impurities increase boiling point

Increase impurities ........... freezing point. (longer time to melt)



Impurities in your ice take energy to heat up too, there for you need to supply more energy to heat up the ice and impurities. i
https://s.yimg.com/dg/users/1r2gLAFuYAAEBPwFFkIul8TQA.medium.jpg (http://answers.yahoo.com/activity?show=SPJWHH27KTX7MPC2MIARJ3ERGQ&t=g)
Dr. Tamer Lokman (http://answers.yahoo.com/activity?show=SPJWHH27KTX7MPC2MIARJ3ERGQ&t=g) answered 7 years ago
Impurities in ice will make the time it takes to melt longer. Ice particles find something to stick to that does not melt instead of sticking to a fellow ice particle that will melt at the same time.

There are some studies and researches around the issue. A building brick composed of ice and wood particles can keep its strength and shape for a long time in cold weather, its even stronger than common building bricks.

Hope this was sufficient.
https://s.yimg.com/dg/users/1uFSm-avTAAEBBKKaQDFVxgbPIw==.medium.jpg (http://answers.yahoo.com/activity?show=5UEQFOQPJE235D53SXCV3ZZ5EI&t=g)
brightnsunny_ray (http://answers.yahoo.com/activity?show=5UEQFOQPJE235D53SXCV3ZZ5EI&t=g) answered 7 years ago
Impurities will raise the melting point of ice. Thus the temperature at which ice melts will become higher. The time taken will depend on the power = energy/time that you are giving to the ice. The higher the power supplied the lesser time it will take.


(Damn long time since H S science!)

C
C

[ifishcq1]

I am surprised that no one uses fish bins because they have the perfect taper to slip out and they don't split in -20 like normal plastic containers do
I freeze half deep fish bins and just like JT I use pacplus bags (we use them at work for asbestos desposal)
for our boys trips I just freeze twenty or thirty pacplus 5kg crushed ice bags just fill them and zippy the tops, they hold 8kg solid
they lay mostly flat or will shape to fit gaps in your freezer and will last easy a week if they are old ice
pacplus is at 57 Alexandra St, North Rocky
cheers

[jtpython]

http://i371.photobucket.com/albums/oo159/jtpython/IMG_51901_zps86393e6c.jpg (http://s371.photobucket.com/user/jtpython/media/IMG_51901_zps86393e6c.jpg.html)
http://i371.photobucket.com/albums/oo159/jtpython/GOPR0087_zps5ba72364.jpg (http://s371.photobucket.com/user/jtpython/media/GOPR0087_zps5ba72364.jpg.html)
http://i371.photobucket.com/albums/oo159/jtpython/IMG_51881_zpsaff2d56a.jpg (http://s371.photobucket.com/user/jtpython/media/IMG_51881_zpsaff2d56a.jpg.html)
Ok stated running with google chrome has fixed the paste problem

[mudcrab3]

sams warehouse or waynes world or one of those cheap shops sell 9 litre containers cheap as chips

[Cheech]

Thanks JT. I had a look at the prices for the normal domestic bags and they are way cheaper than I have been paying, so looks like I have a new supplier.

Cheech

[perko]

I use 15L flexi buckets to make ice. Give them a smack with the mackerel donger to break u the ice, add a couple of buckets of sea water and it will last a couple of days easy. I put a row of buckets on the bottom of the chest freezer, then put a piece of plywood on top of the buckets, then another row of buckets.

[Spiderpig]

I am surprised that no one uses fish bins because they have the perfect taper to slip out and they don't split in -20 like normal plastic containers do
I freeze half deep fish bins and just like JT I use pacplus bags (we use them at work for asbestos desposal)
for our boys trips I just freeze twenty or thirty pacplus 5kg crushed ice bags just fill them and zippy the tops, they hold 8kg solid
they lay mostly flat or will shape to fit gaps in your freezer and will last easy a week if they are old ice
pacplus is at 57 Alexandra St, North Rocky
cheers



I was thinking the same thing about the kill bins Scotty. I was even thinking of plastic welding some removable dividers so that when you drop it out you get smaller blocks.

I also like the look of those bags JT, the ones in the freezer that is.

[jtpython]

Do u want to drop in and grab some to give a try out mate
JT

[bannana]

I use nelly bins (fish bins). Big blocks of ice that takes for ever to melt. Once we have a decent catch in the box we use the fish spike like an ice pick and break up the block over the fish. Extended trips we take a couple blocks or just buy a couple of bags and leave them in the box to spread over the catch at the end of the day.

A mate uses kitty litter trays and they work excellent.

[Noelm]

Geese never thought making ice was so involved, as mentioned, I just have a couple of square 10l plastic buckets, I fill them with water, freeze them, when frozen, tip them upside down and give them a tap, the ice falls out, I then put it in an old plastic shopping bag and put it back in the freezer, when I need ice, I just grab a bag and away I go. I do also have a couple of big plastic drinking water bottles that I keep frozen for the food esky, these also double as "emergency" drinking water

[thrillseeker1]

This might be a little different to the way others think, but the ice, for me, is my backup water supply in case of emergency,,,, and it's also a very useful way to keep fish fresh.
I freeze very clean 3 litre fruit juice bottles with screw on caps, as many as I need.
A lot simpler to stack in the freezer and they can be arranged all round and over the fish in the esky.
They're robust enough not to puncture with fin spikes, they don't pollute with salt water/ fish slime and they don't dilute the brine. Plastic milk bottles have proven to be not up to the job, with the milk fat very hard to clean out, very easy to get a gut ache.
A simple wash off and they're ready to refreeze for use again.
If the worst happens I've got 30/40 litres of clean drinking water packed in discrete 3 litre lots with any possible damage to one, not a total disaster.

[pojo]

I use 4lit. Wine ask bladders to make ice ,just drink the wine then rinse the bladder out then fill with water and put in the freezer ,can be used as a block or smashed up for crushed ice. Des

[NothinSuss]

Bought an Ice machine for the shed, has never let me down, flick of the switch makes about 300-350L of ice overnight. Got it off a fridgy mate for nicks.

[Chimo]

Thrillseeker

When I worked in a dairy bottling plant years ago I learned that when you wash out a milk bottle you always use cold water first so as to avoid setting the milk fat which is the issue you allude to in you post no 33. After that wash them out as you would any potable water container and I'm safer to drink defrosted water from this source than I would be drinking the water in say Bali.

I still use 3 lt milk bottles for my ice and leave a inch or so for expansion in both the sea water ones and the potable water ones and freeze them in 9s in their milk crates.

Cheers
Chimo

[thrillseeker1]

Thrillseeker

When I worked in a dairy bottling plant years ago I learned that when you wash out a milk bottle you always use cold water first so as to avoid setting the milk fat which is the issue you allude to in you post no 33. After that wash them out as you would any potable water container and I'm safer to drink defrosted water from this source than I would be drinking the water in say Bali.

I still use 3 lt milk bottles for my ice and leave a inch or so for expansion in both the sea water ones and the potable water ones and freeze them in 9s in their milk crates.

Cheers
Chimo
Fair enough, frosted against clear(to see contamination), fruit juice containers are far stronger. I wouldn't take the risk.

I'll put this myth to bed as well, sea water and fresh, the same volume containers frozen to the same temperature. Fresh water has more cooling capacity than salt water.

[Noelm]

Fair enough, frosted against clear(to see contamination), fruit juice containers are far stronger. I wouldn't take the risk.

I'll put this myth to bed as well, sea water and fresh, the same volume containers frozen to the same temperature. Fresh water has more cooling capacity than salt water.
While I do not disagree in any way shape or form, and my experience salt and fresh ice lasts the same amount of time, but....... Why is it so?

[Spiderpig]

Do u want to drop in and grab some to give a try out mate
JT

Thanks for the offer mate but I just checked my cryovac machine and its only 200mm wide so it's not big enough.

I might have to see if they sell smaller ones.

[jtpython]

They sell Crevac machines for $250 awesome price for the size of it
http://i371.photobucket.com/albums/oo159/jtpython/GOPR0083_zps9ea3272a.jpg (http://s371.photobucket.com/user/jtpython/media/GOPR0083_zps9ea3272a.jpg.html)

[thrillseeker1]

While I do not disagree in any way shape or form, and my experience salt and fresh ice lasts the same amount of time, but....... Why is it so?

Noel, it's a thing called specific heat.

The specific heat of water is 1 calorie/gram °C = 4.186 joule/gram °C which is higher than any other common substance. Which means that it takes 4.186 joules of energy to heat one gram of water 1 degree C.
Adding salt to fresh water reduces its specific heat which means it takes less energy to heat salt water than it does fresh.

I'll try and put a graph here that shows how specific heat is reduced as the salt content increases,
99685
The salt ice effectiveness is reduced by the 3.5% of NaCl, there is less water in the container and its ultimately less effective.

[odes20]

This is exactly what I use. Can't understand why you use bags or any thing hat perferates easily? As you have to totally start from scratch every time u make ice! With the juice containers fully sealed, you can just wash off thoroughly and place in the freezer again. No extra handling, and they rarely get busted spiked or cracked. I don't make a brine or slurry , I just kept the fish amongst 8-9 of these containers. t
This might be a little different to the way others think, but the ice, for me, is my backup water supply in case of emergency,,,, and it's also a very useful way to keep fish fresh.
I freeze very clean 3 litre fruit juice bottles with screw on caps, as many as I need.
A lot simpler to stack in the freezer and they can be arranged all round and over the fish in the esky.
They're robust enough not to puncture with fin spikes, they don't pollute with salt water/ fish slime and they don't dilute the brine. Plastic milk bottles have proven to be not up to the job, with the milk fat very hard to clean out, very easy to get a gut ache.
A simple wash off and they're ready to refreeze for use again.
If the worst happens I've got 30/40 litres of clean drinking water packed in discrete 3 litre lots with any possible damage to one, not a total disaster.

[jtpython]

This is exactly what I use. Can't understand why you use bags or any thing hat perferates easily? As you have to totally start from scratch every time u make ice! With the juice containers fully sealed, you can just wash off thoroughly and place in the freezer again. No extra handling, and they rarely get busted spiked or cracked. I don't make a brine or slurry , I just kept the fish amongst 8-9 of these containers. t
I used bottles too for years but these bags don t get easily perforated maybe one or two does but I utilise the busted ones to use in my ice slurry when filleting so nothing lost . Same wash with warm soapy water drain and back in freezer . What ever works well for everyone s personal use I guess, this has been good or me lately they last even better in the esky or over time and lay flat when frozen. Nothing bets 10 kg bags of crushed ice but to expensive . I had heaps of stainless trays at one stage to but they kept freezing in block s when left to long then I done them separately in shopping bags but i guess got lazy .

[thrillseeker1]

There is a very good reason to add water to the esky. Heat tranfer difference between still air and still water is about 25X. i.e. water is 25X more effective in removing heat from the fish and because it is sloshing around it is even more effective.
Using sea water gives a slight advantage, provided there is enough ice, for a few degrees colder than fresh and it reduces osmosis(fish drawing in water through their skin)
Adding extra salt to reduce the temp further is pointless because
1: It's very difficult to get into solution at 0 degrees c.
2:Freezing the fish is not useful, below 4C is fine.

This graph shows how much salt is needed for the slurry to remain liquid at a certain temperature.
99716

[Horse]

I have about 10 large flat freezer blocks I picked up at Bunnings at $2 each. They are filled with salt brine so defrost at about -2oC. I sometimes add a bit of saltwater to make a slurry but normally just bury the fish under the freezer blocks. I also make 4L icecream containers of salt water for bigger trips. These take over a week to get nice and cold. When they melt they don't dilute the slurry

[thrillseeker1]

I have about 10 large flat freezer blocks I picked up at Bunnings at $2 each. They are filled with salt brine so defrost at about -2oC. I sometimes add a bit of saltwater to make a slurry but normally just bury the fish under the freezer blocks. I also make 4L icecream containers of salt water for bigger trips. These take over a week to get nice and cold. When they melt they don't dilute the slurry

That would be true if the salt ice froze homogeniously but that's not actually what happens.

Salt water(3.5% NaCl) starts to freeze at roughly -2C and in a container, freezes from the outside in. The ice is fresh water(it's one method of desalination)with the residual, a more concentrated brine liquid pushed to the inside of the block.
As the temperature drops, the brine gives up more fresh ice and becomes more concentrated until -21C where everything freezes.
Below -2C, the brine is held in liquid pockets inside the fresh water ice, the exterior of the ice block is fresh water with a melting point of 0C.
The block has to completely melt to release all the salt.

[thrillseeker1]

To summarize,
Salt water frozen in sealed bottles is inferior to fresh water, as a coolant and a big pain in the'A' if it's spilled.
Sea water added to the esky along with frozen bottles(of any ice) will almost never go below 0C.
The killer slurry is made with sea water with added salt, mixed when it's hot, and then adding a large mass of smashed ice because the freezing process has to start again , as I explained earlier, the dynamic equilibrium has to be tipped in favour of freezing rather than melting. Not enough ice, the brine will never go below freezing and the salt water is diluted.

Freezing salt water is a waste of time.

[Marlin_Mike]

Who woulda thunk it???????????? I been putting water in old plastic drink bottles and ice cream containers and putting it in the freezer. In the morning its this hard cold solid block thing. To think there are a billion other ways to make ice. Put some water in something and freeze it.............aint rocket science is it?????????????????????????

[Volvo]

Dunno!!??, bought three aprox 25 kilo bags of good hard crushed ice for $7.50 per bag late this arvo and unless one has ample space about the house , shed or garage n unless your out regular and hard to get to good Ice I still cant justify makingn storing Ice.. and have been there , done that..Just my thoughts at present..
Mind you , had I the extra space an ice making machine might be a thought but one would want a few trips out a year to warrent one??..

[timddo]

Question. Where the he'll do you get 25kg of ice for $7.50. I want to know.