Is 750kg unbraked limit still relevant?

[Matt76]

One of my many random thoughts today had me thinking, with the amazing evolution of the trusty motor car over the last 20 or 30 years in terms of braking ability, especially with the likes of stability control and EBD, is the 750kg weight limit on an unbraked trailer still relevant? What sort of cars were the limits designed for and how long have the current rules been in place? My last boat was not too much under 2 tonne and my car pulled it up just fine on the (often) occasion that I forgot to flick back the reversing tab on the override coupling. Surely a 900 odd kg boat/trailer combo wouldn't give the newer cars and 4wds any grief braking.
What's your thoughts?

[scorpo92]

Ive often wondered this too. I mean I have an 08 4x4 dualcab hilux and they still reckon 750kg. Its crazy

[morphias]

Yes, it is still relevant. No, it is not crazy.

Sure, you may pull up 900kg or more OK in a straight line or when you have plenty of room to do so. Where it becomes a real issue is when you have to do it on repeated downhill runs, in a hurry, in a bend or in the wet. Watch a jack-knife or slalom start or have one happen to you and you might change you way of thinking.

Too many cowboys, and dealers are a big part of the problem; buy BMT's that are JUST under the limit for unbraked but are over as soon as you add fuel, an esky, tackle, etc, just to save a few bucks on the purchase price. Dealers should be educating buyers about the advantages and necessity of brakes.

I welcome the introduction of mobile scales at boat ramps like we see in other states.

It ties in with the whole 3T or 3.5T towing capacity thing. Yeah, you vehicle can tow that weight...as long as your mates and gear is not in the vehicle while you are towing.

Ben.

[Darren Mc]

How well do the brakes with the reverse tab work? (Sorry, not sure of there actual name, are they overrider brakes?)

[bluefin59]

I recon brakes up to a tonne is overkill especially with new car and 4wd braking systems but I guess it's the boofhead head factor that have to be monitored that makes these thing supposedly important . We used to tow a ski boat up to Somerset dam every weekend for 4 years and it had no brakes and we also had emergency situations a couple of times and my old xd falcon never had a problem without trailer brake but I guess it gets down to how you learnt to drive ...Matt 😜😜😜😜

[SatNav]

"Is 750kg unbraked limit still relevant?"

1. Yes very much so and there's no reason why is shouldn't be.

[mutineer]

My boat is over 3 tonne, had a little excel pull up on an orange downhill in the wet , at night in coffs ...after cutting in front of me .....let's just say he's very lucky my trailer brakes worked , pulled up with only inches between us ...@#%&+?

So yes is my answer ..

[bigjimg]

Brakes are necessary, no argument at all from me on that one. They become totally useless when you have to make an evasive manoeuvre and swerve to avoid hitting an object or vehicle in your path.
You then become totally reliant on your driving skills and ability to control your rig. Jim

[rayken1938]

There are plenty of new cars where the unbraked towing capacity is well under 750kg.In qld the 750kg is the arbitrary point where your rego costs escalate significantly.
Cheers
Ray

[mutineer]

Brakes are necessary, no argument at all from me on that one. They become totally useless when you have to make an evasive manoeuvre and swerve to avoid hitting an object or vehicle in your path.
You then become totally reliant on your driving skills and ability to control your rig. Jim



Unless they are electric/ hydraulic then it's the difference of stopping a serious jackknife ..or a big push....life and death really.

Safer to never swerve a big towed anything , but wipeing off speed is a no brainer ...again life or death or that kid that wandered on the road ...how many inches to save a life all be it their fault ..

[Matt76]

My boat is over 3 tonne, had a little excel pull up on an orange downhill in the wet , at night in coffs ...after cutting in front of me .....let's just say he's very lucky my trailer brakes worked , pulled up with only inches between us ...@#%&+?

So yes is my answer ..

On a boat any where near that size yes absolutely, I just reckon we could safely raise it to say 1000kg.

[ozscott]

A tonn up your ginger in the wet? Without brakes - not even in a Dodge Ram would you want that. Certainly not in a normal passenger 4wd of any type

Cheers

[mutineer]

You ever tried an emergency stop with a tonne in a trailer .. not trying to be smart , but you lose so much braking distance it's unreal .not allowing for the jackknifed trailer that in turn , steers your car , brakes keep it in line , it has nothing to do with what your car can do ..750 is a small car , 1000 kg is getting serious when sideways

[deckie]

It could be raised sure...but the 750kg rule isnt really an old rule anyway. Vehicles havent really come THAT far since it was introduced. What good would it do ?

What people never admit to though is that most car accidents, near misses or emergency brakings are their own stupidity, negligence or simple impatience at work.

Its a rare man these days that actually allows for the added weight of their rig...its a rare man that deliberately sits way way back from the vehicle in front and allows even more in the wet...its a rare man that is watching the car in front of the car in front of the car in front...its a rare man that now seems happy to drop speed wayyy low according to conditions. Or so it seems.

I hear so many stories of 'emergency" braking and "near misses" etc...why is it that some drivers never seem to have these circumstances with the same or even much more towing time on our roads ? Are the OTHER drivers just so much better in different places we live ?

Wouldnt matter if its 750kg or 1000kg...98% of all trailering issues will still happen, mainly due to the drivers head being out on the water hauling in 6kg snapper....or explaining to the poor bored bastard next to him how his incredlbly super amazing 4.4l turbo overheadcam, intercooled with recycled fragrant air, diesel masterpiece of modern engineering saves him 0.7l per 1000km...whilst driving along on our roads as a mobile accident waiting to happen.

Next time you hear about an 'emergency" braking...explain that you;re really not listening and he should've simply been an extra 5 or 6 more lengths back from the car in front...most problems solved. Seems that margin of safety is a very rubbery figure...and the better the brakes on the trailer can simply mean a driver starts to assume things.

Would much rather see them enforce the REAL rule that actually achieves a LOT....if you;re trailering a boat/van etc you must maintain a set distance from the vehicle in front, regardless of what you think is "ok"...whateva that number is add even more lengths to that...afterall you;re still doing the same speed arnt you ? Rules based solely on trailer weights dont work when we all know its not the tools we use that are the real problem. Forget the weights and concentrate on what truly makes a difference.

[tunaticer]

My bet is the 750 will get dropped to 500kg to accomodate all of the smaller cars these days carting stuff in 6x4 trailers. Even at 500kg a little corolla or similar will be hard to control.

[rayken1938]

Towing capacity corolla



Note: Kerb, tare & payload weights are nominal and will vary depending on options and tray/body type. Gross Vehicle Mass (GVM) is the total permissible combined weight of the vehicle, including occupants, fuel and cargo. Weights

- Kerb weight (kg) 1310



- Gross Vehicle Mass (kg) 1785



- Gross trailer weight braked (kg) 1300



- Gross trailer weight unbraked (kg) 450



Note: Towing capacity subject to regulatory requirements, towbar design, vehicle design and towing equipment limitations. Ask your Dealer for details of Toyota Genuine Towbar capacity and availability.

Car that weighs the same as its trailer scary stuff hopo its not sitting up my bum when a fast stop required.
Cheers
Ray

[Dave_H]

Some good discussion points raised but (in plain language) a point often ignored is that the better a vehicle can stop the bigger a pendulum an unbraked trailer becomes. No amount of ESP system electrickery will keep an unbraked heavy trailer from wagging the tail of the dog if it gets serious enough.

In todays climate of (city dwelling drivers especially) all clamouring for that 20 feet of bitumen six inches off your front bumper bar - the faster the pace the more frenetic they compete for it, there is no way I'd consider dragging either of my trailers anywhere near the posted limit until well clear of the city areas. I use motorways to go the 40km each way to/from work everyday and some of the stupidity I've seen in the last 12 months defies belief. Many drivers don't give tow vehicles enough room to stop or just use their distance altering left mirror to pull back into the laft lane in front of someone. My father (73 years old and a heavy vehicle driver all his life), in his Isuzu ute towing an empty car trailer (fitted with well adjusted and functioning brakes) was recently stopping behind traffic in the centre lane of busy Pennant Hills Road (a 6 lane wide arterial Sydney road) early this year when two cars (one either side) went around him while he was stopping behind traffic and both vehicles pulled into the lane front of my father. You guess the rest...

We could probably get away with higher unbraked trailers weights if we were not exposed to some drivers on a deathwish, blissfully darting around like a squid all the while unaware the effect of their actions have upon other users on the road. But to educate and bring all drivers to the standard we really all should be will cost votes and a lot of dollars, something no current polititian has the "balls" to do in this day and age, so they keep to the Nanny State philosophy all around the country and nothing ever changes...

[ozscott]

There are many emergency braking situations that do not arise from following too close. Dont worry the legislators wont increase unbraked braking limits even for people who think modern vehicles can take up the slack. ..because in truth the vehicles cannot do so.

Cheers

Sent from my GT-I9300T using Tapatalk

[mod5]

Have deleted a few posts that were starting as personal attacks. Please desist in the personal stuff.

[FNQCairns]

I will tow the boat on a trip trip to lake Tinaroo tomorrow for a family and friends tubing day out...I need to travel the Gillies highway up the range to get there (fnq) ...this range is the exact reason why they will never increase the 750kg limit...and rightly so....the limit is sorta kinda ok driving even a little less than sensibly in perfect conditions but when the weather changes or there is a driving debacle situation the tow vehicle needs to be x6 the weight minimum to accommodate the towed load...and even then if traveling over 70km/h only luck might get you out of it scott free.

Some (many) of these modern light cars are flat out reaching 1tonne alone over a weight bridge.

and interestingly a good modern way a good way to assume the robustness of the vehicle the manufacture understands very well it sells is to look at it's braked limit...if low they secretly understand it's built to a rubbish standard for the crop of equivalents it competes with.

[Matt76]

Some very good points raised, thanks guys.

[Boat Hog]

I view trailer brakes in exactly the same way as I look at bilge pumps:

When you truly need them, you will wish you had installed bigger and better!

[morphias]

I've driven the Gillies countless times and I would opt to go the Kuranda road if I was towing anything. Not just for my own sanity and safety, but also for that of all the people that would be stuck behind me with very few overtaking opportunities.

To a degree, I guess it's where your start point is, but from Cairns, the travel time is about the same, but the Kuranda road make the drive 20-30km longer.

Ben.

[morphias]

We used to tow a ski boat up to Somerset dam every weekend for 4 years and it had no brakes and we also had emergency situations a couple of times and my old xd falcon never had a problem without trailer brake but I guess it gets down to how you learnt to drive ...Matt 😜😜😜😜

No offence intended, but if you compared the stopping distance of your XD with the same load braked versus unbraked, the stopping distance would be almost half with brakes in the trailer.

You obviously drove conscious of the fact you load was unbraked, drove at an appropriate speed and stayed an appropriate distance to the vehicle in front.

No matter how you well you are taught how to drive, there is no substitute for brakes. You simply cannot 'will' a load to stop.

Ben.

[Jarrah Jack]

I view trailer brakes in exactly the same way as I look at bilge pumps:

When you truly need them, you will wish you had installed bigger and better!

Thats because you've got a Verado......................

[FNQCairns]

I've driven the Gillies countless times and I would opt to go the Kuranda road if I was towing anything. Not just for my own sanity and safety, but also for that of all the people that would be stuck behind me with very few overtaking opportunities.

To a degree, I guess it's where your start point is, but from Cairns, the travel time is about the same, but the Kuranda road make the drive 20-30km longer.

Ben.

Hi Ben yes the other way is best overall but we live to the side of the Gillies highway anyway so any other way is not an option, was a good trip still only needed to let 4 cars past the entire way up and about 10 on the way down...the trip down is poor with pulling over options compared to the trip up.... I can only do the same speed either direction too.

Windy road but lovely and smooth.

[morphias]

I'd love to take my Buell up and down it one day...

[Knotpretty]

It is the law in NSW. In the world of what ifs, have an accident when towing an illegal trailer and watch your insurance claim be rejected. KP

[SatNav]

1. Australian National Towing Regulations have been in place for quite some time and are agreed upon by all the states.

[Matt76]

I know the rules are the rules, it's black and white. But I wonder what year the 750kg limit was introduced and what sort of vehicles were we driving when the 750kg limit was perceived as safe? Is 750kg behind say a brand new HQ Holden (for example, I don't know what year the rules were set) any safer than 1000kg behind a new 4wd with abs etc etc?

[Alchemy]

I know the rules are the rules, it's black and white. But I wonder what year the 750kg limit was introduced and what sort of vehicles were we driving when the 750kg limit was perceived as safe? Is 750kg behind say a brand new HQ Holden (for example, I don't know what year the rules were set) any safer than 1000kg behind a new 4wd with abs etc etc?

Matt, my Dad bought a new V16C Haines in late 1979 and towed it with a Valiant. The Haines had hydrailic over-ride brakes which were a pain to keep working. I remember Dad saying it didn't really need them as it weighed just under 1000kg. I think it was 1983 when Dad traded the Valiant on an XD Falcon and I recall sometime during the Falcon's life the law changed to the current 750kg limit so Dad had the Haines trailer retro-fitted with cable over-ride brakes by Wynnum Marine. I'm guessing the 750kg limit came in mid 80's as the XD was kept until about 1994.

Regards,
Dave.

[Gon Fishun]

Ninety percent of the drivers today can't stop at a stop sign, no nothing about driving country roads, have no common sense, are rude and belligerent and couldn't organise a fart in a chilli contest, let alone tow a trailer.
Just saying. ;D

[Matt76]

Excellent thanks mate, I havent been able to find any timeframe on how long its been in place.