Older Model Johnno's...Opinions please

[Marlin_Mike]

Greetings:

Looking at a boat with this model Johnno on the back., Any opinions on the earlier models reliability, performance etc? I realise if you have a lower budget means you get older stuff instead of shiny new stuff. just after some opinions, don't want to buy old piece of junk. Its attached to a V Sea.

Thanks in Advance for your comments.

Mike

[Chimo]

Hi Mike

I have two old 115HP Evinrudes and I am still happy with them. They do blow smoke on cold start up and are surprisingly frugal IMHO if you run them at their sweet revs which seem to be somewhere between 3000 and 4200. As Ive mentioned before I've complained to my marine tech about the smoke but he keeps telling me that the smoke is a good thing as it avoids wear on startup which is the worst time.

Also being carby motors they dont seem to mind the crap fuel we get these days and nor do they appear to object to old crap fuel.

Old Etecs did not like old or crap fuel but its been suggested that the newer injectors are getting better. I guess after my motors have done several more thousand hours I will have to consider that issue.

In the mean time get a good OMC Marine Tech who will service the motor to check it for you.

Cheers
Chimo

[Aussie123]

I had a 1986 VRO which I bought brand new at the time.
Best motor I have ever owned over the years.
Those mid 80's Johnsons were fantastic motors and bullet proof.

[ozscott]

The old v4's were great motors.

Cheers

[Steeler]

Its a two stroke , would be more worried if it were not a little puffy on start.

Not hard to pick a neglected type of this model. There the ones that look totally decrepid under the cowl and particular the heads.

[MrNanks]

I have a 140 hp VRO Johnson and it doesn't miss a beat. I had the compression check along with everything else on the motor and it is top notch.
It is certainly noisier than a 4 stroke or the modern 2's but it is very reliable, and I don't need to spend $18k to get a new one yet.
From what the mechanic told me the powerhead has been replaced and that is the expensive thing, so that was good for me apparantly.

Make sure you get someone competent to check it out. Don't just trust anyone.
Good luck mate

[Malcolm W]

Had a 78 115 johno for a few years. It never let me down although I did have a bit of trouble with the trim tilt system. Found a second hand one to replace it with no worries.

I think Chimo is right, it did seem to use less fuel than my current 2003 V4 Yamaha 2 stroke. Different boat, but I think the weight would about be the same.

[davo]

One issue is that the hull was only rated to 115HP? The second is from a bloke I work with. This guy was an outboard mechanic and particularly worked with Johnson's. He has a V Sea with a V4 90HP but the boat originally had a 70HP Johnson. Basically he finds the V4 much heavier on fuel compared to the 70HP. So much so that he is looking for a Yammy 90HP 2 stroke. Just something to consider.

[Fed]

I've had mine about seven years and only had to do the water deflectors and the outer ram seals.
They're easy to pull start too.

[Gon Fishun]

Like the other guys 1983 115 Evinrude 2 st. Only minor problems like electrical connectors aging. But always goes from point A to B and back to point A. Just need to keep on top of maintenance and servicing. And as Chimo said between 3000- 4300 rpm they can sit there and hum away all day.
PS mines on a HH V16C. :D

[Dantren]

Mike, 140 is a lot of hp for a v-sea. Typically these hulls were powered with 70-90 hp singles, or twin 35's.
I'm assuming it is a 5m hull??
Maybe the vendor used for waterskiing.....

[mutineer]

Old johnos would have to be the most bullet proof motor ever made , had my tinny 14 years 91 model 40 hp on a 4.1 Clark , 6 month breaks couple pumps hit the key and its running , I had fear when it broke down on me in the floods 18 months ago , hasn't gone since till today , found a broken wire , rejoined it ...couple pumps and away it went on the fuel from 18 months ago ...never heard a bad thing about em and always funny turning up at the ramp with people pulling on their new merc / yammy whatever and I back the old girl down hit the key and gone ..good on juice , only smoke on idle ...a good motor is a good motor , other than people knocking em for noise and two stroke smoke..it will serve you for a long time

[Marlin_Mike]

Mike, 140 is a lot of hp for a v-sea. Typically these hulls were powered with 70-90 hp singles, or twin 35's.
I'm assuming it is a 5m hull??
Maybe the vendor used for waterskiing.....

Thats my only point I am not ssure of. Seems a big heavy motor for a sleek 5.0mt hull, Weight and HP wise.Never the less, never hurts to drive down the coast and have a look at a boat. :)

[Chimo]

Mike

An old OMC 90 v4 weighs much the same as a v4 115, 167kg from memory, so it might be worthwhile looking up the 140 weight which as its a v4 too, is probably not much different but a little more. See below.

Anyhoo cant hurt to check and look. Good luck with the hunt.

Cheers
Chimo

PS A little extra weight
V4 1632 cc platform, 85/88/90/100/115 HP
20 inch shaft, elec. start, man. tilt -- 288 lbs
20 inch shaft, elec. start, trim/tilt -- 301 lbs
25 inch shaft, elec. start, trim/tilt -- 311 lbs
Often hanging on the transoms of 17 Montauks(85-100 HP), 17/18 Outrage (115 HP), 22 Outrage/Revenge as twins (90-115 HP).
V4 2000 cc (loop charge) platform, 120/130/140 HP
20 inch shaft, elect. start, trim/tilt -- 365 lbs
25 inch shaft, elect. start, trim/tilt -- 370 lbs

[Noelm]

Depending on the year model, the 140 could be the 2 liter V4 if so, it is way heavier than any 90/115 back in the "old days" a mate of mine bought a VC new with a 140, very low inthe stern, but he used to ski with it as well.

[Marlin_Mike]

Thank you for all the advice and info. Brings me to my other point. Looking at another 5.0mt V Sea, which may be under powered with only a 60HP ( 4 Stroke) Mercury on the back. Not quite enough HP????? Decisions decisions...........

[Dantren]

Mike, I think the best thing about looking for a v-sea is there are thousands of them out there & fresh ones come on the market regularly. Not saying they are all good buys(many are overpriced IMO) but at least one doesn't have to rush in and buy, particularly if the setup, condition & power combination aren't to your liking.
Good fun looking though isn't it!!!!!!

[Fed]

Mike if you're looking at the original V-Seas with the 'ski jump' front deck then they are only 4.74 Metres according to the Jeff Webster book.
They look identical to the 5.2 Metre Viking below.

[Jarrah Jack]

If its the 5 mtr hull Mike, which is what the old VC was upgraded to then 60hp is at the bottom end of the power scale. My mate has a 5 mtr vamp and found his 70hp motor to be underpowered. He just repowered to a 90 Zuk.

[Marlin_Mike]

Certainly is fun looking. I am in no hurry, I can wait till the right boat at the right price comes along.

And yes, some people have way over inflated perceptions of what their boat is worth.

[Fed]

Go for the holy grail, a pristine boat on a clapped out trailer with a seized motor that's been in a shed for 25 years.

[FisHard]

If you can find the last of that shape (about early 90s I think) they came from the factory with a half pod and gave much more deck space. I had one years ago with a 75 Mariner and it was a great boat! I would rate it higher than the current, larger version, which I've also owned. The series 3s as they are known, are hard to find, but I've seen 2 up for sale in the last 6 months. As you say, they can be over valued. Good luck with your search.

[Dutchtech]

As per Mike's original request I would value the forums view on the following - I am looking to purchase a secondhand Cruise Craft Rustler 15 with a Johnson 70Hp outboard motor. Model number of the outboard is 70EL77S. The boat and trailer are in good condition and listening to the motor and feeling the exhaust "blow" it appears that the motor is still in good condition internally.
I would value the forums input on the following:
1) Given the age of the motor would there be anything to be aware of/look for when inspecting. As I would like to use the boat to explore Morton Bay would the motor, which is of vintage, be reliable for such a task.
2) What would the forums view be of the Cruise Craft Rustler 15?

The rig is available for $7500 and, given the age, does it constitute value.

As a newbee to the Ausfish forum I am grateful for the guidance offered.

Thank you and regards

Theo

[Marlin_Mike]

As per Mike's original request I would value the forums view on the following - I am looking to purchase a secondhand Cruise Craft Rustler 15 with a Johnson 70Hp outboard motor. Model number of the outboard is 70EL77S. The boat and trailer are in good condition and listening to the motor and feeling the exhaust "blow" it appears that the motor is still in good condition internally.
I would value the forums input on the following:
1) Given the age of the motor would there be anything to be aware of/look for when inspecting. As I would like to use the boat to explore Morton Bay would the motor, which is of vintage, be reliable for such a task.
2) What would the forums view be of the Cruise Craft Rustler 15?

The rig is available for $7500 and, given the age, does it constitute value.

As a newbee to the Ausfish forum I am grateful for the guidance offered.

Thank you and regards

Theo

Mate is that a boat called Gypsy III youre talking about? Tidy little unit by the looks of the ad if its the one im thinking of.

cheers
Mike

[Dutchtech]

Hello Mike,

Yes it is however the concerns I have is the old adage that the value of the boat is in the motor. The old Johnson does not have power trim and tilt and has done quite a few hours - replacing the unit with 70Hp Suzuki is going to be an additional $10500.00 which puts the rig outside my budget. I suppose the main question I have will the old Johnson be worth the gamble?

Thank you for yourvadvise

Regards
Theo

[Chimo]

Theo

In IMHO there are plenty of boats out there with must haves like power trim and tilt. There is probably nothing to worry about with an old 70 Johno, just do the usual checks ie get the marine tech who is going to service it for you to check it over first. He's not going to advise you to buy a hunk of junk if he is going to have to service it.

Keep looking and find a boat with with a motor with tilt and trim and get that motor checked over. Move on.

Cheers
Chimo

[Fed]

Way too much money in my opinion Dutchtech.

[SummerTrance]

I agree. I recently spent a few months looking at boats up to 7k, so got to know the market pretty well. IMO That price of that boat would be suitable if the motor was mid 90's, but too expensive for a 77 model motor. Keep looking and something will come up sooner or later.

[Dutchtech]

Thank you all for the advice given - it confirms my thoughts.

Best regards.

Theo

[SummerTrance]

whats your budget dutchy ? Are you specially after a cabin boat ? seen this haines ?

http://www.boatsales.com.au/boats-for-sale/boatdetails.aspx?R=15454434&Silo=Stock&Vertical=Boat&Ridx=19&eapi=2

Also make you get someone who knows what the're doing to fully check the hull as well, not just the motor. Trust me whatever it costs is worth it.

[Dutchtech]

Mate, I have looked at this boat - trailer is stuffed and would require replacement, transom has had some holes drilled into it which been filled, the gelcoat is powdery and would require polishing and the ETEC motor, even though low in operational hours, does not have a good reputation. I checked with the outboard mechanic that I use and he had advised me to steer clear of the ETEC's. I would be stretching my budget at $10k.

[Dutchtech]

Mike, I thought i would share that I have purchased the Cruise Craft Rustler 15 - ended up offering 2k less than was advertised. I am looking forward to picking her up and putting her on the water and seeing how she behaves. Now I have to sell my Seajay 4.0 to make space for her! Again thanks to all for the advise given - very much appreciated. Regards, Theo