Weight of BMT package?

[cala90]

Hey guys,

I'm looking at buying a new 4x4 (soon to be followed by a walkaround!). I was wondering if anyone here could give me a rough estimate of what a 21ft or 23ft walkaround package would weigh? I'm wanting to keep my options open in regards to towing capacity. At the moment i'm looking at a new Patrol which has a braked towing capacity of 3.3T, would this suffice in regards to the weight of these boats?

Cheers

Matt

[chocolatemoose]

only 3.3t? that dosnt seem like enough for a new full size suv?
but i would factor 3 ton for bmt. "when things like fuel gear and stuff" are added. depending if its on an american style alloy trailer or gal steel trailer.

[cala90]

Yeah the Y61 Patrols are only made in a 3.0l now and have a max of 3.3T. The next model up is the new Patrol which has a 3.5T towing capacity but has a 5.6l V8 (around $40,000 more than the 3.0l!)
Thanks for the info. Would that be for a 21ft?

[BGG]

A quick stab with a boat of 21ft weighing about 900KG, a 250 4 stroke @ about 250KG and a trailer @ about 600 KG, you are already up around 1800KG before you think about batteries, 400 KG of fuel, electonics, gear ice, water, etc, etc. Then start thinking about the things you don't usually calculate like rope, chain, anchor and a winch maybe. Also canopies, fishing gear, safety gear.
Help me here. I'm running out of ideas!!!!

[wags on the water]

Had my cruisey weighed the other week - 625 200 opti - no fuel (completely empty tank) no water, no gear ---> 2.26T

[Illusionmirage]

Most of your 23 ft walks in the US will be ok. Just watch the heavy ones like the gradey. The only boat larger that may still be towed (maybe) is the 25 seafox. 21ft should come around the 2.5-2.8 mark full fueled. Just what I found with my research.

[cala90]

Thanks for the help guys. I'd be looking for a Seaswirl, more than likely the 21ft rather than 23 so that comes under the tow rating comfortably. Can anyone suggest any other tow vehicles that they've had experience towing big boats with?

Cheers

[Boat Hog]

Thanks for the help guys. I'd be looking for a Seaswirl, more than likely the 21ft rather than 23 so that comes under the tow rating comfortably. Can anyone suggest any other tow vehicles that they've had experience towing big boats with?

Cheers

The Striper 2101WA comes from the factory suppled with an alloy trailer (EZ Loader) rated at max 2968 Kg. When new, mine went 2.6 Ton on the weighbridge (disconnected from the towball) with 160 L of fuel. Hardtop, 225 Verado (which weighs 288 kg dry) and all the extras (Galley, bed infills, clears, trim tabs, sounders ... ) - but no fishing gear. So it all depends on what motor you've got on it - the striper is rated for 150 to 225 Hp and the Verado is one of the heaviest outboards you can get. So you should get a Striper in under 3 Tons easy.

Cheers,

P.S. The patrol you mentioned should tow it easy.

[wrxhoon]

My old Trophy 2002 went 2500kg on alloy bunk trailer ( tare 480kg, atm 2800 kg), 200 Optimax,full tank (326lts) and all the fishing gear . My Grady White Seafarer 228G, weighs 3000kg, 250 Optimax, full tank 360 lts, water 50lts, on alloy bunk trailer ( tare 520kg, ATM 3180 kg). These are actual weights on a weighbridge , not guessing , but the weight will vary depending on gear you put in the boat, I tend to have heaps .
I hope that gives you an idea how much they weigh, the Grady is a big 22 footer, the Trophy is a small 21 footer , both bats are under 2.5 wide , I tow with a LC 200 TTD, tows like a dream, I never slow down at any hill and we have some up and down the coast in Sydney. The Pooootrol will tow easy but slow up steep hills .

[cala90]

Thanks for the help guys, I appreciate it! I'm sure whichever way I decide to guy i'll be covered with towing capacity!

wrxhoon - I'd love a TTD Cruiser but unfortunately that'd blow the boat budget! Haha bloody nice car though!

[gofishin]

... Can anyone suggest any other tow vehicles that they've had experience towing big boats with?

Cheers
Can’t help with the 21 Striper BMT, but I have a CC 685Outsider (22.5ft walkaround) with a 250 3.3L yam + alloy skid trailer and a bit of extra gear. Bone dry, but with safety gear incl 7kg anch, 22kg chain and 100m rope is 2.47t. Diff b/w HDG and alloy skid trailer would be approx 200 – 250kg, maybe300kg in a 23 footer depending on who’s trailers (and what type) you arecomparing. Fully fueled and loaded very close to 3t BMT.

Have towed it previously with a 2.5 TD Navara manual, and now an NT 3.2 TD Pajero Auto, incl many long trips in both. Both towed fine once moving but the clutch will be your worry, even in any of the new generation dual cabs that are manual – I believe anyway. Go Auto! Pajero tows very well (I use WDH on long trips). New V6 TD Jeep would be better again, and very reasonable with the strong dollar. Landy’s and Rangy’s are an option too, butmore $’s. And yes the king would be theLC200. Personally would not touch the Pootrol because of common problems with the 3.0 TD letting go – maybe they have sorted this, but too much past history for me.

Happy hunting.
Cheers
Brendon

[chocolatemoose]

my vote would be the v8 tdi touareg but i might be bias :P

[mutineer]

Ranger , Colorado , disco,patrol , cruiser all have the bigger tow rating .with my last patrol ( gu ) it towed great and could put the 2800 kevlacat in the water no worries ( not legally though ) I have a prado now and just bought boat in avatar which exceeds the pissy tow rating given to it ( would take cruiser sales if lifted ) so my choices are another gu or cruiser ...( cruiser :) ) as that new y62 patrol is useless with that stupid motor in it . 8 weeks and its cruiser time ...

[mustang5]

2601 26ft Seaswirl Striper with single outboard goes 3.4 tonne. With twins it goes 3.6t which of course is a limitation for me. So Im stuck with a slightly underpowered rig, but its propped to suit and I couldnt be happier.

Towed it with a workmate v8 cruiser, and also my new 200 series TTV8. I however have found that power has not been an issue at this weight, its more so the suspension.

The 200 cruiser tows it at 100 @1800rpm with Air-con cranking and you dont even know its there.


I had a 21ft Haines Signature 1950R with a 200hp 2 stroke on it and that came in at 1960kg loaded.. For me, that was just far too light for a boat that size. Weight is important in handling.

You should be able to get 95% of 23ft boats below 3t.

[SatNav]

"The 200 cruiser tows it at 100 @1800rpm with Air-con cranking and you dont even know its there."

1. 100km/h exceeds the legal maximum 90km/h or as signed if less than 90km/h

[Boat Hog]

"The 200 cruiser tows it at 100 @1800rpm with Air-con cranking and you dont even know its there."

1. 100km/h exceeds the legal maximum 90km/h or as signed if less than 90km/h

Mustang forgot to add:

1. On a private racetrack under supervised conditions.

[wrxhoon]

"The 200 cruiser tows it at 100 @1800rpm with Air-con cranking and you dont even know its there."

1. 100km/h exceeds the legal maximum 90km/h or as signed if less than 90km/h

You can legally drive at the posted speed limit in both QLD and NSW when towing trailers under 4.5 ATM.
QLD check section 24A

[SatNav]

"You can legally drive at the posted speed limit in both QLD and NSW when towing trailers under 4.5 ATM. QLD check section 24A"

1. In Qld if under 4.5 yes and not overwidth but NOT when over width (> 2.5metres < 2.90 metres) under class permit No. 220-TH-12am1 section 10.3 which definately applies to the 2601 Seaswirl Striper which was the subject of that comment.


10.3 The maximum speed limit applying to a person driving a vehicle or combination transporting an oversize boat is 90km/h outside built up areas, except where official traffic signs indicate a lower speed limit.

2. Quite plainly many here do not understand their legal requirements with regard the class permit they are operating under when towing over width boats less than 2.90m.

[wrxhoon]

This is a copy of the act and nowhere it says there is a special speed limit for oversize trailers unless they require a pilot or escort vehicle .
Are you sure you are not looking at an old act? The one below is current as 5/4/2013 and came in 2009.


24A Speed limit for certain vehicles
(1) This section applies to a driver
despite a higher speed limit
that would otherwise apply to
the driver under this part.
(2) The speed limit applying to the
e following drivers for a length
of road where the driver is driving is—
(a) for a driver driving a
tractor towing a sugar cane
trailer—50km/h;
(b) for a driver driving an overs
ize vehicle that is required to
travel with a pilot or escort vehicle—80km/h;
(c) for a driver driving a road train—90km/h;
(d) for a driver driving a bus
with a GVM over 5t, or another
vehicle with a GVM over 12t—100km/h.
(3) In this section—
sugar cane trailer
has the meaning given
in the Standards and
Safety Regulation.
tractor

does not include a motor vehicle built to tow a
semitrailer

[fisho64]

CC685 with minimal fuel twin DF115, bare essentials on board such as anchor etc 2.56T on weighbridge including tongue weight.

[ozynorts]

I think the confusion regarding the rules for speed limits regarding towing are because there is no mention in the normal road rules however when you read the class permit for oversize boats it clearly states the speed limits that apply.
http://www.tmr.qld.gov.au/~/media/busind/Heavyvehicles/guidepermits/Pdf_class_permit_220_th_12.pdf

[wrxhoon]

Thanks for that Ozy, I wonder why it's not listed on the speed limits, they only say vehicles with escorts!! Typical government I guess.
Another reason not to have a wide boat..

[ozynorts]

Or they could just reference them with a link to the relevant documents.

[SatNav]

1. There is absolutely no confusion with this requirement as when operating under the conditions of the class permit a copy of the permit must be carried by the driver at all times and produced when requested by an authorized officer.

2. Maybe some drivers need to review what the legal requirements are? NO need to link anything as this document is supposed to be carried by the driver at all times.

3. The reason for this permit is specifically wide boats which simplifies things greatly but apparently some do not appreciate the importance of this.

[Boat Hog]

1. There is absolutely no confusion with this requirement as when operating under the conditions of the class permit a copy of the permit must be carried by the driver at all times and produced when requested by an authorized officer.

2. Maybe some drivers need to review what the legal requirements are? NO need to link anything as this document is supposed to be carried by the driver at all times.

3. The reason for this permit is specifically wide boats which simplifies things greatly but apparently some do not appreciate the importance of this.





SatNav, you seem to have a vested interest in this topic (towing oversize boats). Care to share why ??

[SatNav]

1. There is no vested interest but there are some who are flaunting this special concession in either a knowing way or they have absolutely no idea. Wouldn't like to see this permit retracted (not renewed), how about you?

2. Obviously raising this is a bit of a heads up for many who do not comply or fully understand the requirements or maybe not even aware there are requirements.

[Boat Hog]

Me? I think it's a pretty good class permit. Yes, there are probably those out there who flaunt the rules or have absolutely no idea. There's probably a lot of people who don't realise that their imported boat is 2.59 M wide - we are talking 45 mm either side! Also there are those who have been sold a boat here in Australia and have been told by the seller that it's not oversize - it's okay to tow anywhere.

Do I want to see the permit retracted (not renewed). Most definitely not!! Education and compliance/enforcement should occur. Not throwing the baby out with the bathwater because some people aren't complying with the law.

Why are you raising this issue as a 'heads up for many who do not comply'?

Also, the tone of your posts on this thread and others is doing nothing for getting the message across.

Cheers,

[SatNav]

1. Tone has nothing to do with it, neither has ignorance of any requirements but simply being on the top of the page gives a better chance of being viewed by more readers and those that might need to know this information and be better prepared.

2. Claiming such things and comments as only 45mm each side is exactly where much of the misunderstanding comes from. It's a very simple question? Is 2.59m greater then 2.50m?

3. The seller is not the responsible person and has no on road liability and highlights exactly why this subject needs to be raised.

[fisho64]

exactly why this subject needs to be raised.

and your the man (woman?) to do it!
Thanks for your factually correct but (some would say) rather irritating lecture! Are you a retired Headmaster?

[SatNav]

1. Now that's probably not a bad approach, lecture by repetition, make a comment, ask what the comment was, then repeat the comment, maybe at this point the message starts to sink in? Annoying maybe? effective obviously.

2. Then again the best ads are always the irritating ones, the ones people just can't help repeating for no other reason. Spreads the message.

3. So is there anybody now that doesn't know their legal obligations re this class permit? travel restrictions, city restrictions, speed limits, signage etc etc?

[thelump]

Sat Nav do you do a lot of powerpoint presentations in your line of work?

[cobiaman]

Sat Nav do you do a lot of powerpoint presentations in your line of work?

Cant figure out why you would think that...

[Boat Hog]

1. Cant figure out why you would think that...

Fixed your post for you mate!