PDA

View Full Version : Looking for New Suzuki 4stroke



strobe1970
12-02-2013, 10:57 AM
Hi All,

I've decided to try and upgrade my Caribbean Concorde with a shiny new Suzuki 140Hp 4 stroke. Budget I can afford is about $11K-$12K changeover. Current motor is a 2002 115HP Mercury 2 stroke (non-efi) with 85hours on the clock (25").

Boat is stored at Batemans Bay but willing to travel (Sydney ??). Is this achievable or am I on drugs ?

Maybe wait for the Sydney Boat show later this year and see what specials are around?

Regards,

Paul

Chimo
12-02-2013, 11:19 AM
Hi Paul

85 hrs!!!! Considering the change over cost and the "fuel savings" less the increased servicing costs IMHO even though you may not now be on drugs you appear to have been affected by them!

Cheers
Chimo

strobe1970
12-02-2013, 02:24 PM
Yes if I was looking to make some sort of saving based on fuel and servicing then drugs would be right. Thats not what is driving the purchasing consideration ($11K is a lot of fuel). More about comfort for the family - wife and daughter both get a little sea-sick and the smell of the 2-stroke exhaust tends to make it worse. I've been told that four strokes are much more friendly from that perspective.

Paul

Noelm
12-02-2013, 02:27 PM
I have found the boat show to be a bit of a fizzer when it comes to "deals", far better to see what you can find when you want the motor. 85 hours in 10 years is not a lot, but, you are still trading a 10 year old 2 stroke! That being said, a new EFI 4 stroke will be a dream to own after trying to start the old Merc after it has been sitting a while.

Chimo
12-02-2013, 02:36 PM
hi Paul

What 2 stroke oil are you using?

Some are a lot stinkier than others.

Also has your mechanic had a look at the pump settings?

Do you thrash your motor a bit or do you just idle around? My older (than yours) 2 strokes blow heaps of smoke at start up and thats supposed to be good from a lack of wear point of view. They do smell as you idle along, best to always travel into the wind!

Cheers
Chimo

patrol50
12-02-2013, 02:40 PM
paul i just went thru a similar exercise for a new 4 s ob which was admittedly half your size and the suz dealers honestly just blew my budget off the map - the merc dealers came in best on the change over then yam and then suz a fair way behind - i think you may need the luck of the irish with that quest as a quick look shows not too much competition to the suz in that hp range

but good luck - and all you can do is give it a go
cheers rob

FisHard
12-02-2013, 03:05 PM
You won't look back going 4 stroke mate. I bet you don't use the boat as much now, due to the 2 stroke "characteristics" its only money ;)

strobe1970
12-02-2013, 03:08 PM
G'day Chimo,

I use quicksilver 2 stroke - more than happy to try different brands. Most of the time I'm in low revs however moving from spot to spot about 14-17 knots (usually a bit lumpy around Broulee/mossy pt - well at least when I have time to take the family out for some fishing). Given it can be over a month between trips I usually use Stabil to try and keep the fuel in good condition. The transition between 2 and 4 cylinders can be a rough experience until it warms up a bit.

Paul

strobe1970
12-02-2013, 03:44 PM
G'day Rob,
First couple of enquiries have not been encouraging. I guess another option is to drop to 115HP but that doesn't seem to make much difference to the price (based on RRP anyway). I've been looking at Honda 4st (135HP) as well - the new mercury 4st doesn't excite me too much as it seems to not necessarily be a step in the right direction as far as technology goes. My initial quote on a Yamaha was quite a bit more than suzuki (150HP though).

I can see why some are tempted by the foriegn import path - despite the lack of warranty etc etc.

CATchin'Em
12-02-2013, 03:52 PM
140hp suzi should be right down your alley I thought $15kish new well boat is around that say $3k trade in I think around $12k is somewhere in the ball park give or take $1k

Swanie1975
12-02-2013, 04:36 PM
A new suzi 140 will cost you a touch over $16k fitted and if the boat show deals are the same as last year they will offer you garmin gmi 10 gauges - well worth the wait. The boat show prices aren't usually any different from everyday ones.

I replaced my old two smoke and my 2 little girls now love coming out on the boat with me cos the noise is a fair bit less with no fumes or smoke and they now also use the two back seats, again because of the difference the suzi has made to the boat. I myself haven't been sick either since upgrading. I can now troll wherever and just cruise the canals with my family whereas before i was limited in the way I could use the boat.

What's the hp limit on your boat and don't forget to check on the weight of the motor as well. The Suzis need to be propped just right but they are great motor and I think the new 140a will be even better. You might be able to find a run-out of the old model somewhere at a better price.

Cheers Ryan

strobe1970
12-02-2013, 07:04 PM
Gday Ryan,
Max HP for the boat is 150 - not sure about weight (current motor is approx. 183kg). I've been told that the weight of a Honda 135hp should be fine at 220kg. Hopefully I can achieve the same outcome you have :-) .

Paul

thylacene
12-02-2013, 07:21 PM
Strobe,

You will struggle to justify the cost on fuel savings, but if you are of a similar mind to myself, you won't look back once you have a four stroke. They are still noisy, but the pitch/tone is different, no fumes, no oil bottle, just very civilised, and even more so when flushing at camp/home. It is amazing the difference it makes when you can chat with the minister for war and finance while travelling.

Weight should be a consideration, generally they quote dry weight for the engine, so there is another 6-8kg for engine and gearbox oil. Before you choose, try running with the weight difference as ballast at the stern and see how the boat sits on the water. Better to find out before you commit the $.

There are pros and cons to any choice. If you can get a run in the same hull with any of your preferred choices you will learn a lot.

Best of luck with the hunt.

Cheers

Thy

strobe1970
13-02-2013, 03:13 PM
G'day Thy,

Thanks for the advice. Current motor (115HP 2st merc) dry weight is about 179Kgs (according the sticker anyway) and the Suzuki 140 4st is around 182Kg so thats seems pretty similar. I'd have to do some research around the Honda 135HP 4st as its a fait bit heavier - 220Kg's - the Honda seends to be cheaper than the Suzuki at the moment (again based on telephone quotes).

Regards,

Paul

Spaniard_King
13-02-2013, 04:16 PM
The Honda is a 2.35 Litre engine the suzuki is a 2.04 Litre engine.

The Honda has had the same lean burn technology for some years now, the Suzuki has just come out with it

You would be happy with either engine.

thylacene
13-02-2013, 08:04 PM
G'day Thy,

Thanks for the advice. Current motor (115HP 2st merc) dry weight is about 179Kgs (according the sticker anyway) and the Suzuki 140 4st is around 182Kg so thats seems pretty similar. I'd have to do some research around the Honda 135HP 4st as its a fait bit heavier - 220Kg's - the Honda seends to be cheaper than the Suzuki at the moment (again based on telephone quotes).

Regards,

Paul

38kg hanging back off the stern is a consideration worthy of some thought and testing. When we ordered our setup, we chose the 175 over the 200 as the extra 25hp came at a cost of 45kg.

I suppose the question becomes "does the immediate saving outweigh the possible long term niggles with a bum heavy boat?" In saying that, I know nothing about your hull or its behaviour, I still recommend that load up as per normal and then throw 50 litres of water, the extra 10 as it is sitting forward of the transom. Even with the 115 you will notice the difference in "feel".

Yes I bought a Suzuki but am not an evangelist, would also happily own Honda or Yamaha, and had a mercury with no complaints. Our eventual choice came down to best fit for the boat for the purpose we wanted. A couple of grand seems like chump change if you have to "put up with" something rather than thoroughly enjoy it. Our choice came with another type of annoyance, with a 200k round trip for service, I find that still niggles me, only a couple of times a year though, and not every trip.

Cheers

Thy

Spaniard_King
13-02-2013, 08:25 PM
Interestingly Suzuki.com has the 140XL as 191kg and The haines people have them as 184kg

thylacene
13-02-2013, 08:37 PM
Interestingly Suzuki.com has the 140XL as 191kg and The haines people have them as 184kg

According to Suzuki the new 140a is 7kg lighter than the previous model.

http://suzukimarine.com.au/content.aspx?pageID=23&mainID=3

Spaniard_King
13-02-2013, 09:22 PM
Yep Thy I think your right .com havent updated there site

What about this one

125 cu. in. vs. 106 cu. in. There is no replacement for displacement.???

You would think that if they were going to put statements about the oposition they would get them right.. Honda 135 Has a cam chain just like the suzi :)

thylacene
13-02-2013, 09:35 PM
Yep Thy I think your right .com havent updated there site

What about this one

125 cu. in. vs. 106 cu. in. There is no replacement for displacement.???

You would think that if they were going to put statements about the oposition they would get them right.. Honda 135 Has a cam chain just like the suzi :)

Garry,

No argument the Hondas are a fine product. Initially shopped for Honda, but weight ruled them out, same as the 200 suzi, Honda didn't have a 175 in the range. Would certainly have Honda on the list if buying another boat.

Wasn't knocking Honda, just recommending testing hull with the extra weight. Regardless of how good the tech is, if it doesn't work with the hull you end up with an unhappy owner who will then speak poorly of a good product.

You could always make him an offer he can't refuse?

I just got curious about the different stated weights so I looked it up.

No offence meant and not down selling the Hondas.

Spaniard_King
14-02-2013, 06:12 AM
Thy, If he was in this area I would offer one of those :)

strobe1970
15-02-2013, 12:29 PM
I found a web-site that indicated that max motor weight for a Cribbean Concord was 225Kg. I've placed a call with international Marine to see what they say is the max weight (might be worth a call to the insurance company as well). I like the idea of adding the extra weight in water down the back and see how it performs.

strobe1970
18-02-2013, 03:52 PM
The Caribbean hull makers reckon the hull is rated to 239kg for motor which applies to 2006 and later. Given the hull has not changed significantly since mine (2001) the same weight limit applies.

LittleSkipper
19-02-2013, 08:45 AM
Hi Paul

Why a Suzuki 4 & not a Mercury 4?

There is an Ausfish member (see link below) who recently had an issue with his Suzuki outboard which blew a hole on the side of the casing, whether this was a one off problem I don't know but get the facts first before buying?

http://www.ausfish.com.au/vforum/showthread.php?189269-More-Suzuki-corrossion-issues-on-DF150-K7-series/page6

Noelm
19-02-2013, 08:48 AM
Merc 4 strokes weigh a ton! good motors, but very heavy for the HP

LittleSkipper
19-02-2013, 09:15 AM
Merc 4 strokes weigh a ton! good motors, but very heavy for the HP

You are right Noelm. Good Motors. Ashame there too much like a FAT LADY! ;D

Noelm
19-02-2013, 09:19 AM
OH, I forgot to add, the Suzuki problem mentioned is not a one off, however, it is not a problem in the later models (from about 2007?) the offending steel plug has been removed from the casting altogether.

Spaniard_King
19-02-2013, 09:44 AM
Hi Paul

Why a Suzuki 4 & not a Mercury 4?

There is an Ausfish member (see link below) who recently had an issue with his Suzuki outboard which blew a hole on the side of the casing, whether this was a one off problem I don't know but get the facts first before buying?

http://www.ausfish.com.au/vforum/showthread.php?189269-More-Suzuki-corrossion-issues-on-DF150-K7-series/page6


OH, I forgot to add, the Suzuki problem mentioned is not a one off, however, it is not a problem in the later models (from about 2007?) the offending steel plug has been removed from the casting altogether.

You guys need to get your facts straight, this problem mentioned above was from a casting fault not from corrosion!! noel the plug you mentioned was from a 140 not the 150 in the post above

LittleSkipper
19-02-2013, 11:03 AM
You guys need to get your facts straight, this problem mentioned above was from a casting fault not from corrosion!! noel the plug you mentioned was from a 140 not the 150 in the post above

Thanks for clarification Garry! I didn't use the words casting fault nor corrosion, only blew a hole because it would appear the hole appeared when the motor was running under pressure but anyway....how did that hole appear? when the motor was not operating, idle or running under pressure?

Noelm
19-02-2013, 11:32 AM
ooopsy daisey, I must have mis read it, I "thought" the post referred to the 90/115/140 steel plug issue, but anyway, regardless, the problem is corrected, the one mentioned (150HP) is, or at least seems to be a one off.

honda900
19-02-2013, 03:06 PM
Noelm,

you read it partially correct, the owner thought it was the same problem that the 140 had but as it turns out it was completely different.

Regards
Honda.

Spaniard_King
19-02-2013, 03:24 PM
Thanks for clarification Garry! I didn't use the words casting fault nor corrosion, only blew a hole because it would appear the hole appeared when the motor was running under pressure but anyway....how did that hole appear? when the motor was not operating, idle or running under pressure?

No Idea, dosnt really matter as it was a fault