Have you ever triggered a red hand flare?

[Crocodile]

Hello All,
On New Years there was a red hand flare set off.

In summary;
It was expiry 2007, ignited immediately
Terrifyingly hot
Glowed white then red hot for a long time after burnout
Dazzlingly bright
Dripped white hot "stuff"
Nasty toxic? fumes
Only burned for about 60 seconds

Recomendations;
Always hold downwind
Never drop it in the boat as the heat is amazing, as in singe the hairs on your arm
With such a short burn time wait until VMR are in sight or at their request.

Summary;
I would not hesitate to use a flare if I had to but man, you need to be careful.

[charleville]

Have you ever triggered a red hand flare?


No, but I have smiled at a crocodile. ;D


Mate, I think that you would get into a lot of trouble setting one off anywhere without official approval and having officialdom publishing a notice to mariners that such was going to happen.

Having made that disclaimer, you made me wonder what colours the flares are. Every few years, I buy the new set, keep the previous set as a back-up and discard the older ones by dropping them off at my local Coastguard.

I put the brand new ones in my safety bag and every time that I see the water police or Fiseries inspectors approach my boat, I get them out ready to show the dates on. I would not have a clue on what colours they are, though, and I hope that if ever I need to use them, that there is enough light available for me to read the instructions.


Hmmm! Perhaps I had better dig them out and have a read of their labels. :-?


'Tis a useful thread, I think.
.

[Mike Delisser]

Often thought about letting off one of my recently out of date flares at midnight on New Years eve just for the practice and experience. Never been somewhere it could be done safely though. I wouldn't really want the first time I have to use a flare to be a life and death situation.

[dnej]

once they are out of date, it is legally not allowable to keep them . You cannot keep them as a back up. I tried that some years back. I even tried to get a supervised field day going, where old flares could be used.
But that also was not legal. Out of date is just that, out of date.
David

[wags on the water]

Hello All,
On New Years there was a red hand flare set off.

In summary;
It was expiry 2007, ignited immediately
Terrifyingly hot
Glowed white then red hot for a long time after burnout
Dazzlingly bright
Dripped white hot "stuff"
Nasty toxic? fumes
Only burned for about 60 seconds

Recomendations;
Always hold downwind
Never drop it in the boat as the heat is amazing, as in singe the hairs on your arm
With such a short burn time wait until VMR are in sight or at their request.

Summary;
I would not hesitate to use a flare if I had to but man, you need to be careful.

Was this set off near Tipplers by chance??

[Richo1]

You have to be having a real bad day to be in distress at 00:01hrs on New Year's Eve and to think someone is going to rescue you by firing some flares 😳
On the bank of a dam one New Years and everyone was letting them go, remembered my flares had recently expired so thought I'd let them off - 2 out of 4 didn't work. Don't buy the cheapest on the shelf anymore.
Have seen a parachute flare burn 6 feet under water.

[Mrs Ronnie H]

Hi

I have seen lots of flares let off at new year on the water. Perhaps ppl out in boats just celebrating.

have never seen one up close but believe they could be very dangerous if not handled correctly and used in the right situation.

We have recently expired flares and will be taking them to VMR to dispose of.

Went in to purchase some and asked the expiry date before purchase. They were already 6 months into use buy date so never got them. if i am going to buy flares then my expiry date should be from time of purchase and not from some date already six months out.

Mrs H

[Apollo]

Many years ago there was a safety day at the yacht club for our offshore requirements. There was permission sought and received to bring out of date flare and for everyone to go through the process of using them. Was a good day and very useful experience.

[EMURUNNER]

Just got a $220 fine today for out of date flares, police pulled me up today at mud island and did a safety check, I had just done a boat clean out before christmas and forgot to put a box of stuff back in the boat as I had a new set of in date flares in there. They didn't like my old flares that had expired in 2004.

[boatboy50]

You have to be having a real bad day to be in distress at 00:01hrs on New Year's Eve and to think someone is going to rescue you by firing some flares ��
On the bank of a dam one New Years and everyone was letting them go, remembered my flares had recently expired so thought I'd let them off - 2 out of 4 didn't work. Don't buy the cheapest on the shelf anymore.
Have seen a parachute flare burn 6 feet under water.

Hey Mate,

Not being a downer on you, but believe it or not, this actually happened about ten years ago off the Gold Coast on New Years. Trawler started taking water about 20 mile out and set off flares.

Everyone ignored it for the obvious reasons, until a couple of guys were found clinging to an icebox.

Details are fuzzy to me but I know it happened.

Darren

[Feral]

When I used to bother with flares the expired ones used to accidentally go off every new years eve. Very unstable.

[NAGG]

Unfortunately - it's illegal to set off expired flares ....... get caught & you'll be fined ( unfortunate because many owners wouldn't know how to or just how dangerous they are)

I've set one off when I couldn't get my motor started & with a howling westerly behind me (plus a ripping tide) was heading straight onto an island (anchor couldn't grab) - with only one boat nearby during a late night session we needed to get their attention or we were probably going to be in trouble .
Anyhoos ..... yes the heat was intense even in a strong wind & was pretty scary knowing that you were using this thing near to 100 lts of fuel .

From that moment on I learned never to pull the anchor prior to starting the boat & if I had to use a flare again where I would be on the boat when I let one off .

Chris

[cormorant]

Don't any of you go to the soccer. You could sell your old flares at the gate!

Can't wait till laser flares are approved.

[LittleSkipper]

Hello All,
On New Years there was a red hand flare set off.

In summary;
It was expiry 2007, ignited immediately
Terrifyingly hot
Glowed white then red hot for a long time after burnout
Dazzlingly bright
Dripped white hot "stuff"
Nasty toxic? fumes
Only burned for about 60 seconds

Recomendations;
Always hold downwind
Never drop it in the boat as the heat is amazing, as in singe the hairs on your arm
With such a short burn time wait until VMR are in sight or at their request.

Summary;
I would not hesitate to use a flare if I had to but man, you need to be careful.

That red hand flare set-off on new years wouldn't of been at Somerset Dam by any chance now would it?

[Richo1]

Hey Mate,

Not being a downer on you, but believe it or not, this actually happened about ten years ago off the Gold Coast on New Years. Trawler started taking water about 20 mile out and set off flares.

Everyone ignored it for the obvious reasons, until a couple of guys were found clinging to an icebox.

Details are fuzzy to me but I know it happened.

Darren

Poor buggers....
I would never let one off at sea. But guilty as charged one NYE on Tinnaroo dam - searchers wouldn't have known where to look as they were going off all around the lake!

Have fired plenty doing safety courses etc.

[dnej]

Apollo, I tried the same thing, but there is no way they would allow the idea of letting off out of date flares. The company would have been held responsible, by approving same.
David

[charleville]

once they are out of date, it is legally not allowable to keep them . You cannot keep them as a back up. I tried that some years back. I even tried to get a supervised field day going, where old flares could be used.
But that also was not legal. Out of date is just that, out of date.
David



This topic was discussed in depth in a thread several years ago. My memory tells me that the upshot was that although out-of-date flares are illegal, the relevant legislation was not marine legislation but, instead, mining legislation.

As I recall, the Fisheries inspectors had no authority to enforce mining legislation and either the police also did not or were not inclined to. I think that someone on the forum had researched the topic with the Water Police and were told, unofficially, that as long as there was a set of flares on board with dates still current, the immediate past out-of-date set would be ignored by the police. Their interest was simply that a current set of flares was kept on the boat.

I have never heard of anyone being pinched for keeping an out-of-date set of flares as long as they have a current set. Indeed, when rummaging around my safety grab bag to get the current flares in front of the Fisheries inspectors when inspected in the Bay, I have brought out the old ones to check the date and the Fisheries inspectors did not raise an eyebrow.


All of the usual disclaimers apply in relation to my recollection of the situation as discussed in a couple of fairly lengthy threads about this topic but that is the situation as I recall and understand it.


I suspect though that if you were found to have several sets of ancient flares on board, the water police would be showing a particular interest.

[Nicko_Cairns]

couple flare stories, a mate set one of in his backyard as a teenager in Cairns, never got caught despite the amount of smoke in the backyard, still to this day don't know how he got away with it.

in my army days a mate went to fire a para flare during a section attack (at night clearly) against some RMC cadets, he didn't lock his wrist so the flare shot forward towards the "enemy" and hit a tree right near an RMC instructors head, the instructor was less than pleased but after we realised no-one was hurt we all thought it was pretty funny. seriously though if you have to launch a para flare lock your hole arm rigid and face your thumb downwards as this locks the arm better (so thumbs down pose with the arm extended and the thumb not actually down).

[Lancair]

Ive set off a hand held flare that was out of date, late at night in a spot that couldnt be seen from any neighbours or anyone else (in a steep gully on a remote property) but I wouldnt do it anywhere else. When we were kids, a mate somehow got his hands on some US military issued para flares, not much bigger than a nikko marker. We set off a couple of these one night, in a paddock about 50km from the nearest town, in 1983-4 ?

Last year some clowns down the road from my unit, in town, let off a red para flare one night, I called the local constabulary who didnt seem in the least bit concerned!!

[Hagar]

Hey Mate,

Not being a downer on you, but believe it or not, this actually happened about ten years ago off the Gold Coast on New Years. Trawler started taking water about 20 mile out and set off flares.

Everyone ignored it for the obvious reasons, until a couple of guys were found clinging to an icebox.

Details are fuzzy to me but I know it happened.

Darren

Hey Darren

You are quite right . This did happen. I was on the beachside deck at my sisters place at the beach at Tugun for NYE. There was already some fireworks going off and also some coming from the water from boats it appeared . I saw the para flare out wider and pointed out it could be an actual distress flare but was howled down by the others .Should have made the call anyway but what do you reckon the response would be at that time on NYE from anyone .You don't wany to be sinking close to midnight on NYE and relying on flares .

Chris

[ranga7]

I think anyone who lets em off when not in distress is an idiot. They are a distress signal and something that is serious. Go buy some fire crackers. When they get let off the police and vmr have to investigate, silly in my opinion.

[fairpractice]

Hi.Agree No flares or smoke should be discharged anywhere near the water.
However inland with a strong wind in the correct direction one of my smoke flares went well, the other started and then proceeded to burn, quite useless. Perhaps that is why there is an expiry date.
The true flares were really bright and generated a red hot metal tube at the end of the burn, easy to drop into water but extermely dangerous if dropped near petrol vapour. they should be labelled an incendary device.
Demo days should be available to all boaties. NOTHING like hands-on experience.
cheers john

[TheRealAndy]

I think anyone who lets em off when not in distress is an idiot. They are a distress signal and something that is serious. Go buy some fire crackers. When they get let off the police and vmr have to investigate, silly in my opinion.

This.

Find out when a flare demo is happening at your local rescue mob, then just sneak in the side entrance and have a go. They wont let you light out of date flares, but have a go at it anyway. Just dont let the friggin things off in anywhere near the water if you are not in danger, or not hanging of a permit to demonstrate, including dams because it will mask a real emergency.

[Homebrewpig]

couple flare stories, a mate set one of in his backyard as a teenager in Cairns, never got caught despite the amount of smoke in the backyard, still to this day don't know how he got away with it.

in my army days a mate went to fire a para flare during a section attack (at night clearly) against some RMC cadets, he didn't lock his wrist so the flare shot forward towards the "enemy" and hit a tree right near an RMC instructors head, the instructor was less than pleased but after we realised no-one was hurt we all thought it was pretty funny. seriously though if you have to launch a para flare lock your hole arm rigid and face your thumb downwards as this locks the arm better (so thumbs down pose with the arm extended and the thumb not actually down).

Use to love an exercise were trip and para flares could be stockpiled for rec. use. It was hard to make the declaration "i have no live ammunition or brass in my possession" with a straight face! when leaving the range.

[Richo1]

Disclaimer: You should never ever let off a Distress Flare because it is illegal (unless your in real distress)

Location, time & place needs to be considered whether near the water/sea or inland. Land or sea it is still a distress flare.

There is a big difference to setting of a flare/s at a fireworks display compared to just letting a few rip for the hell of it at some random place and time. So if you let off a number of flares at and during a fire works display can't see any problems with that. Yes it is still illegal and shouldn't do it (but its fun and a training exercise), if VMR or the coppers decide to send a search party to that location then I guess they will know better next time hey? There is a big difference to a flare being deployed at the scene of a fire works display compared to a flare being set off a few miles away.

For those that have seen a distress flare you will know it gives a pretty accurate indication of the location of the signal eg. that flare just came from the beach where the fireworks are going off - very unlikely it going to be a real distress.

Some random flare info;


Red Hand Flare - Burn for 1 minute & Visible for 9km by day, 18 km by night in good conditions.
Orange Smoke hand held - Designed for day use only, more easily seen by Aircraft than from boats, even in good conditions may not be visible beyond 3 or 4 km
Red Parachute distress rocket - visible for up to 32km in favourable conditions. The time taken for the red flare to drift down on its parachute allows ships or aircraft to obtain a bearing or heading. Visibilty greatly reduced during daylight hours and may not even be seen by aircraft flying overhead, however leaves a trail of smoke which is more visible to ships.

cheers


Richo


PS: Am I an idiot? Yes sometimes.

[cormorant]

VMR should sell flares or do a deal with a retailer.
They should buy a batch with the same expiry and plan a flare day annually a month before expiry day. Or you could buy flares on the day to get the experience.
Just like smoke alarm batteries day ( whenever the crap that it - apart from the week 9v batteries double in price)
That way VMR gets money , buy flares and you get a ticket to let off your old ones while they are still a month in date . Better money and regular income rather than raffle tickets and we all get a reminder our flares will be out of date by email if we register. Oh yeah and the BBQ sanger sambos always bring in a dollar or 2.
Boaties get experience ( which we all need) without being illegal as I haven't let one off legally for 10 years now. Can't remember the braile for which is which now but have a luminious stick attached to the pack for if it is pitch black and a heavy duty glove.
Crap weather - even better as it is more like real life and as richo has said disply just how useless or effective they can be when let off at the right time etc etc. 90% of boaties possibly wouldn't respond or call it in if on the water and yet if one gets let off at the end of the street 20 miles inland the coppers get a call - sheesh. Flares or radio I'll choose a waterproof handheld radio and a strobe rather than 1 minute of glory and dreaming someone will react unless they are already aware you are in distress. You can always direct a boat or plane on to you and you should have a idea where you are.

Old flares disposed of safely- burnt up. Will make people aware they fail, burn the hairs off your arm, choke you silly on fume and blind you all at once.

Boating shops who want a bit of the action can either help or get nothing from it.

Screw the nanny state work around them.

Coppers and fire brigade happy and the soccer clubs as no old flares lying around or being handed in.

Bound to be a stupid reason something so sensible can't be arranged.

Any flaw in this?

[cobiaman]

We were offshore bundy last year and after we left around 9pm we saw a boat light up their red flare near where we were. It was certainly very bright and by my dodgy memory i remember the guy saying it got really hot holding onto it...