Glass V Graphite Rod

[spears]

Two rods the same length both have a rating for example 10kg and 6 foot long.
Both have the same reel and line.
The question is..
Which rod would snap first?


Which is the stronger rod.
Simple question should be able to get a simple answer,we hope.

[Chamelion]

That's an interesting question and one I don't know the answer to. I guess it would have to come down to a LOT of different factors including quality of manufacture.

Either way, you wouldn't catch me fishing with a glass rod over a graphite rod, ever. Graphite is just so much better to fish with in my opinion.. Along with braid.

Graphite rod + braid = Heaven
Glass rod + mono = May as well fish with an over-cooked spaghetti noodle and some underwear elastic

Just in my opinion, of course...

Wow, went off track there.. Sorry.

[NAGG]

Two rods the same length both have a rating for example 10kg and 6 foot long.
Both have the same reel and line.
The question is..
Which rod would snap first? Impossible question to answer


Which is the stronger rod. Impossible question to answer
Simple question should be able to get a simple answer,we hope. No it's not such a simple question

Sorry as a hypothetical question there are too many variables to deal with & you need to understand how and why graphite is used these days . In a nut shell graphite is used to make rods lighter for the same given strength (plus alter the characteristics) .
The one thing that does stand true is that the higher the modulus graphite that is used & lower the the level of resin used - the more fragile the rod will be ....... not necessarily a case of failing first .


btw - You can make a graphite rod that would easily out pull a glass rod in the same class

Chris

[finga]

At 10kg and 6'..... a broom stick is what you could use I reckon.
Neither of the rods should break as the drag on the reel would be working........That's it's job isn't it.

Either are crap if not made right.
That graphite is shite. (I had to say that because it rhymes)

I like glass for it's durability especially in longer (over 7 foot) rods.
I like glass for 6' rods under 4kgs weight rating for their durability.
I like graphite for 6-7' rods over 4kgs weight rating for their....what-ever. Oh, I know...their ease of getting blanks.
Both of them have their places I will admit. You know.....horses for causes.

So what about composite blanks.... graphite AND fiberglass in the one rod????
If graphite is supposed to be the sensitive bit why do composite rods have the glass bit at the top?

[Horse]

If they weigh the same then I would say the graphite would be "stronger". Chances are that the graphite would have 1/2 the weight though and be more fragile

[NAGG]

So what about composite blanks.... graphite AND fiberglass in the one rod????
If graphite is supposed to be the sensitive bit why do composite rods have the glass bit at the top?

Action ! - & not all rods use glass in the top - some blanks use a composite glass/graphite with a graphite tip
Then you have multi modulus graphite as well

some of the glass graphite blends are really nice ....... you end up with a reasonably crisp rod that is more forgiving

[spears]

The only thing that i can see e.g. boat fishing the rods only have to do a bend .there is no casting involved or required.it’s a very simple action.Be it 5’,6’ or 6’6’’ long,it just bends.The weight in holding the rod in glass at that length i can’t see it being an issue.
If the strengths are very much the same i guess the glass wins out on price.

[Jeremy]

The only thing that i can see e.g. boat fishing the rods only have to do a bend .there is no casting involved or required.it’s a very simple action.Be it 5’,6’ or 6’6’’ long,it just bends.The weight in holding the rod in glass at that length i can’t see it being an issue.
If the strengths are very much the same i guess the glass wins out on price.
That is a very simplistic view of what a rod does. Truth is, a good rod does alot more than 'bend', but if that is all you are after, why not get the cheapest glass rod you can find.

[grave41]

finga,
Those rods are called ugly stiks so you can jam the rod tip ups its butt and not worry about breaking it.There advertising has a lot to anser for when you see people try and put a bend in a rod 2nd or 3rd runner from the tip and it snaps.A composite rod with s or e glass in the tip section makes a good crank bait rod other than that go graphite.
IMO Graham

[NAGG]

That is a very simplistic view of what a rod does. Truth is, a good rod does alot more than 'bend', but if that is all you are after, why not get the cheapest glass rod you can find.

Absolutely ...... couldn't agree more - A 10kg 6ft boat rod that is built on a nice graphite blank can be much more than a pool cue .... weight , sensitivity - action

Chris

[Stuart]

No such thing as a graphite rod, there is a carbon rod. Graphite is the next stage after carbon. Glass is more forgiving because it stretches more, its able to absorb impacts and rebound more than carbon. However its heavier, somtimes reqiers more resin content = less porosity, air bubbles in the finished part. Carbon is much better in tension and copression than glass wether its S glass or Uni glass. A little fact many dont know is Uni glass has a higher modulus than many carbons. For instance, 1 wrap of carbon is the equivalent to 3 wraps of glass. There are so many variables to what makes a good blank and I couldnt be othered going through them all. Most mass produced blanks are made in such a way to reduce warranty/breakage. There is a saftey margin built in to them. The smaller the diameter a carbon blank is rolled the further it will bend. The bigger the diameter the less it wants to bend. So you cant compare two completly different materials which perform completley different. Combine the two and you have an awsome blank.

[NAGG]

No such thing as a graphite rod, there is a carbon rod. Graphite is the next stage after carbon. Glass is more forgiving because it stretches more, its able to absorb impacts and rebound more than carbon. However its heavier, somtimes reqiers more resin content = less porosity, air bubbles in the finished part. Carbon is much better in tension and copression than glass wether its S glass or Uni glass. A little fact many dont know is Uni glass has a higher modulus than many carbons. For instance, 1 wrap of carbon is the equivalent to 3 wraps of glass. There are so many variables to what makes a good blank and I couldnt be othered going through them all. Most mass produced blanks are made in such a way to reduce warranty/breakage. There is a saftey margin built in to them. The smaller the diameter a carbon blank is rolled the further it will bend. The bigger the diameter the less it wants to bend. So you cant compare two completly different materials which perform completley different. Combine the two and you have an awsome blank.

Other uses

Graphite (carbon) fiber (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbon_%28fiber%29) and carbon nanotubes (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbon_nanotube) are also used in carbon fiber reinforced plastics (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbon_fiber_reinforced_plastic), and in heat-resistant composites such as reinforced carbon-carbon (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reinforced_carbon-carbon) (RCC). Commercial structures made from carbon fiber graphite composites include fishing rods (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fishing_rod), golf club shafts, bicycle frames, sports car body panels, the fuselage of the Boeing 787 Dreamliner and pool (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pool_%28cue_sports%29) cue sticks (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cue_sticks) and have been successfully employed in reinforced concrete (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reinforced_concrete), The mechanical properties of carbon fiber graphite-reinforced plastic composites and grey cast iron (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cast_iron) are strongly influenced by the role of graphite in these materials. In this context, the term "(100%) graphite" is often loosely used to refer to a pure mixture of carbon reinforcement and resin (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Resin), while the term "composite" is used for composite materials (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Composite_materials) with additional ingredients.[29] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graphite#cite_note-28)

[spears]

But how does one distinguish between a quality composite blank and one that is not.
Do you guys go by the name or by the price.

[finga]

But how does one distinguish between a quality composite blank and one that is not.
Do you guys go by the name or by the price.
Neither.
Word of mouth is the best distinguisher.

Oi Graham....I have a couple of the SneiderGlas composites. A lot different to the original Uglies I have to say.

[nigelr]

lol, yep price can definitely a factor.....and sometimes you can see the darker carbon weave incorporated in the blank etc....names, yes prolly' some are proferred over others but really a complex subject.......so many variations available.
If you have a particular blank in mind, put up an enquiry in the rod building section as well; we are truly lucky to have some very knowledgable and experienced builders on there who will no doubt give you some good info.
Cheers.

[MudRiverDan]

If by Glass you mean Glass resin like an Ugly stick, I would bet on a 6ft 10kg ugly stick being stronger than a 10kg 6ft Gloomis.

You would have to put some serious hurt on both rods to get them to snap and If you did you would not be using the rod properly.

Lesser quality Graphite rods like a Berkley drop-shot IMO do not have the true strength possible because of the materials used.

Glass resin rods are great when you want cheap strength, I use them all the time when bait fishing in the river and don't have to be so careful with them, yet
bait fishing is not as dynamic as lure or plastic fishing, so it does not matter so much when the rod is sitting dormant soaking a bait for most of the time.

Dan

[NAGG]

But how does one distinguish between a quality composite blank and one that is not.
Do you guys go by the name or by the price.

Pretty hard to just look at a blank & say if it is a quality made one or not ......... specially if it is completed rod .
blank manufacture is a really complicated subject where various terms are used IM6 ,IM8 - bias construction , helical wound , high modulus , multi modulus etc etc ......... There are brands of blanks that you can bank on though Calstar , Samurai , Pacific composites , Composite developments , North fork composites , CTS , seeker , United Composites & Sabre are all mid to higher end manufacturers .
It is complicated though & if you wanted a specific rod built ...... talk to several rod builders & see if you can see / feel / try the blanks that they would use ( rod builders often align themselves to a certain manufacturer).

Chris

[spears]

Still with the main question being which one would be stronger and having a understanding what is gained or lost between the two materials on such a short rod.
The main use is going to be floating out from shore after sharks/jew so the glass will suffice.
Don’t know why someone had said you get more feel.I’ll get a pretty good feel when the rod is bent to the max.LOL
Thanks for the replies

[Stuart]

What you seek is unobtanium. If all things being equal then the carbon would or at least should be stronger. Carbon stretches around 1.3% over its given lenght, glass stretches around 3-4% over the same lenght. The ID and OD of both play a massive roll in how far that material reacts t both comression and tension. What your asking is a simplistic veiw point and which I think has been covered. To go into the nit grity would take hours, I have a life man.

[Stuart]

Name brands dont = quality. Mass produced blanks are markeed to the masses.

[finga]

Why do you need to know which one would break first?
The outfit is only as strong as the weakest link. The weakest link should be the drag on the reel.

[MudRiverDan]

Though in saying what I mentioned I have to say I took me new 10 ft GLoomis to the surf today.
A ten foot glass could not cast like that.

Sweet rod, not a huge distance, but can smash a bait/slugg into the gutter no worrys, I'm using 50lb braid, 30 would go a lot further.

I think Graphite holds more potential energy and releases more kinetic force because of this. Where as glass resin is soggy and does not exert as much, in saying that the size of the rod would make a difference as you need some soggy absorption on big casts.

I think resin glass has more stretch than graphite as graphite is a very rigid in its atomic structure.
It can probably absorb more energy than Graphite but does not exert as much.

So if you are just pulling weight then a glass resin will do the task.

(But will you be just pulling weight? what about when the fish pulls back?)

Hence we get composites, high modulus, etc etc.. rods that give us the strength quality's as well as the stretch, (I got no idea on these, but do own a high modulus Graphite, it has less rigid qualitys).

Horses for courses. I would still be checking out the Glass resins first, even they have new materials these days.


Dan

[Si]

Other uses

Graphite (carbon) fiber (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbon_%28fiber%29) and carbon nanotubes (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbon_nanotube) are also used in carbon fiber reinforced plastics (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbon_fiber_reinforced_plastic), and in heat-resistant composites such as reinforced carbon-carbon (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reinforced_carbon-carbon) (RCC). Commercial structures made from carbon fiber graphite composites include fishing rods (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fishing_rod), golf club shafts, bicycle frames, sports car body panels, the fuselage of the Boeing 787 Dreamliner and pool (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pool_%28cue_sports%29) cue sticks (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cue_sticks) and have been successfully employed in reinforced concrete (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reinforced_concrete), The mechanical properties of carbon fiber graphite-reinforced plastic composites and grey cast iron (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cast_iron) are strongly influenced by the role of graphite in these materials. In this context, the term "(100%) graphite" is often loosely used to refer to a pure mixture of carbon reinforcement and resin (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Resin), while the term "composite" is used for composite materials (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Composite_materials) with additional ingredients.[29] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graphite#cite_note-28)

Stu is kind of correct in saying graphite and carbon fibre are different although i wouldnt say graphite is the next stage. Calling our fishing rods graphite is a bit of misnomer. Would you like to have a rod made of pencil graphite...no.. It comes down to their moleculer structure. While being the same element, the arrangment of their molecules is completely different. Graphite is flaky due to its laminar (sheet like) arrangement or bonding of molecules giving very limited tensile and shear strengths whereas carbon fibre have molecules manufactured to be in long chains providing much greater strength. We actually should be saying carbon fibre..anyway sorry to go off track a bit.

[Stuart]

Thats right, what he said. When we used to orer a roll of carbon it was called just that, Carbon and what ever name the manufacturer gave it. Never ordered a roll of graphite. There is also other types of carbon that are derived from pitch or pan based, the pan is much better. But now we are getting into crap that bugger all people understand or simply dont care. I like to keep that stuff in my head and make it very simple for the average joe to understand. If I started down the molecule road of rod building I think I would take a drive to the hospital and admit myself to the insain ward. In having said that some American rod building sites like to go down to the molecule level of building a whitting rod. I love to watch rockets and the shuttle get of the launch pad, dont care about all the small stuff thats going on just the engines, the noise and the smoke. Much like waching the drags.

[NAGG]

Raw graphite or raw carbon is not used in the manufacture of rods

We are talking semantics here but - Carbon fibres that contain 99% elemental carbon is known as "graphite" The textile used to make rods are based on a 99% carbon content fibre
This is why rods are referred to as Graphite rods & not Carbon rods

If you do a google search of rod / blank manufactures - you will see the term graphite used continually - Graphite is the generally accepted terminology

Chris

[Stuart]

Um ok. The material used in my own blanks is purchased in the roll labelled Carbon with what ever grade and name. So while this is straying from the main topic point we will have to humbly agree to disagree on some points.

[MudRiverDan]

After all I said, I have to say, there are plenty of "Graphite rods" out there that are made to heave big fish from a boat, and most probably do it very well.

G. Loomis Pelagic Saltwater Rod HLBR72-50C Halibut

Doubt you would snap that too easily.

Mind you I like G loomis, and it is just an example.

Everyone has their favorites (I don't own a halibut rod). Probably a bit different to your needs but made not to snap.

My 2c, not trying to make out anything is better.


Dan

[Si]

Raw graphite or raw carbon is not used in the manufacture of rods

We are talking semantics here but - Carbon fibres that contain 99% elemental carbon is known as "graphite" The textile used to make rods are based on a 99% carbon content fibre
This is why rods are referred to as Graphite rods & not Carbon rods

If you do a google search of rod / blank manufactures - you will see the term graphite used continually - Graphite is the generally accepted terminology

Chris

what?? sounds like you just agreed with me? i dont get it..

i know they call it graphite but what I'm saying is the terminology is technically wrong!

At the end of the day graphite is weak as piss and no-one uses pure graphite to make rods from it as we both agree. All 'graphite' fishing rods are made from carbon fibres sheet preimpregnated with resin generally... the carbon molecules in carbon fibre are arranged in a long chain which allows for long fibres orientation and gives good strength. If you used actual graphite it would turn to dust. Thats all I'm saying. i believe polyacrylonitrile is the primary source for making carbon fibre.

Also rod manufacturers use both graphite and carbon terminology, not just graphite as you inferred. my shimano t-curve and lox rods say carbon on the blank. my pflueger says graphite. I know of others that say carbon also.

If you do a google search of graphite vs carbon fibre you will see what I'm saying. molecule chains Nagg.

[finga]

The strongest one is the one that hasn't been smashed in a car door
The strongest one is the one that hasn't been dropped onto the ground, rocks or gunnel
The strongest one is the one that hasn't been abused
The strongest one is the one that hasn't been high sticked (in the case of graphite)
The strongest one is the one that hasn't been grabbed by your idiot mate and bent to see how strong it is
The strongest one is the one that hasn't been left up against the roof in the shed for 12 months in 38 degree centigrade temperatures
The strongest one is the one that hasn't been left to sit in the rocket launchers of the boat for their entire shortened life
The strongest one is the one that hasn't been matched up to a reel that has a drag 4 times stronger then the rod rating
The strongest one is the one that hasn't been pushed into some trees to try and get that lure out of the branch
The strongest one is the one that hasn't been used to poke that jelly fish that's hanging about under the boat
The strongest one is the one that hasn't been left outside against the fence for 12 months
The strongest one is the one that hasn't been made to suit an overhead but you use it for an Alvey.

The strongest one is the one that been looked after and used appropriately according to it's line rating, rod rating, style and configuration.

How many people have actually broken a rod by just having a fish on if they're used appropriately (correct fishing style and drag been just a couple of major considerations) and have not been damaged previously?

[spears]

Before you comment with a whole heap of assumptions diawa replaced it,no fault of the user.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MfpZeS6zNtA

[Stuart]

You get that when you have all the load at the join. At least they replaced it.

[grave41]

finga,
I too also have some synderglass composite blanks still sitting in the rack. Does that say something HMMMMMM.
Graham

[Si]

Before you comment with a whole heap of assumptions diawa replaced it,no fault of the user.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MfpZeS6zNtA


bugger! looked like a nice fish too...did they replace the reel too

[finga]

finga,
I too also have some synderglass composite blanks still sitting in the rack. Does that say something HMMMMMM.
Graham
It means I know where to find some when needed??? ;)

[spears]

bugger! looked like a nice fish too...did they replace the reel too
Only the rod not the stella

[MudRiverDan]

No wonder it snapped the boat was going quite fast.
The setup did not look anywhere heavy enough for what he was doing.

And if he spent well over $800.00 on a Stella, why did he spend $200.00 on a rod?


Sure, I am far from the luxury at throwing big money at all my gear, but I think he might have to up the budget a bit if he is going to use it like that.


Dan

[spears]

Diawa’s words

Monster Mesh Max
The Monster Mesh Max series set the heavy duty jigging and offshore sport fishing scene on fire since their introduction two years ago. Since then they have built an enviable reputation for incredible strength and reliability.

Built on the latest ultra slim carbon blank, the new Monster Mesh max series is one of the strongest lightest jigging blanks ever developed. The enormous hoop strength comes from combining the latest carbon technology with old style weaving under incredible pressure to produce the most incredibly strong blank. High performance blanks need the right components and MM Max uses Fuji’s best alconite M style guides, Fuji reel seats and quality aluminium custom components. All guides are triple bound for ultimate strength, so to make these the most reliable jigging rods available.



incredible strength and reliability
the strongest lightest jigging blanks ever developed
the most incredibly strong blank
triple bound for ultimate strength
most reliable jigging rods available

When they replaced it ,it means what ???..they had too after those statements.
nothing wrong on how that rod was being used

[diabolical]

That is not the same rod!

[Si]

Only the rod not the stella

I can almost feel your pain. I have heard the same deafening crack on a $500 rod except mine was bent over way more than that in rod holder. Yours kind of just snapped (well obviously...yes) but what i mean is it didnt seem to really really bend over, reach a crazy curve and then snap. I wonder how a cheapie fibreglass rod would have handled that........:-)

[MudRiverDan]

Diawa’s words


When they replaced it ,it means what ???..they had too after those statements.
nothing wrong on how that rod was being used


The guy was practically leaning back on the rod with his full weight, rod high in the air, boat going one way, fish going another.

I am not having a crack at his ability, with what was probably a good fish anything can happen.

You can pin point the spot where he leans right back (probably putting another 50kg on the rod), just before it snaps, the fish probably went the other way fast adding to the weight.

I think he overestimated the true strength of the "monster mesh" rod.

Dan

[spears]

http://fishwrecked.com/forum/heres-vid-daiwa-monster-mesh-snapping-taking-it-my-stella-8000

[MudRiverDan]

To me it appears the rod did not break near the join but well below the join, on the butt section, which is meant to be where the power comes from.
I would think it might have taken a bit of force to break a rod well into the butt section.

But honestly, just bad luck, boat moving too fast, fish too big.

The whole video is no great reflection on graphite rods in general.

The rod is not flawed, it's just a $200.00 dollar rod.

Dan

[NAGG]

Have a look at what happens immediately prior to the break - The angler rocks back fractionally

The way I see it - the rod was maxed out (& slighly high sticked) - and that little rock back added that accelerated force to break the rod ( just like snapping a stick).

a lesson to be learned from that footage - particularly if you have someone at the helm driving like that ! ..... the rod should not have been above horizontal in that situation (IMHO)

Chris

[deepfried]

Damn that was as bad as watching some guy get nutted on funniest home videos. I can feel his pain.
I would like to know the actual drag setting. I didn't think the mm rods were rated that high for drags settings. It's not the only monster mesh I have heard of breaking though although the others I know of are the older models.

[finga]

I wonder how a cheapie fibreglass rod would have handled that........:-)
Just fine if the drag was set right on the reel.

[spears]

Damn that was as bad as watching some guy get nutted on funniest home videos. I can feel his pain.
I would like to know the actual drag setting. I didn't think the mm rods were rated that high for drags settings. It's not the only monster mesh I have heard of breaking though although the others I know of are the older models.
You can ask him right here
http://fishwrecked.com/forum/heres-v...my-stella-8000 (http://fishwrecked.com/forum/heres-vid-daiwa-monster-mesh-snapping-taking-it-my-stella-8000)

[MudRiverDan]

Still on an autopsy, though I have to say I think those kind of graphite rods with the extended section below the lower grips are well flawed.

For heavy work when the rod is fully loaded, it relys on the butt section strength to give the rod its full power.

With those extended rods, they have moved the grips quite high on the rod, with a great length of unused rod extending below the lower grips.

So when loaded up the rod bends from the point of resistance which is most probably your upper hand and some on the lower grip, but mostly the section just above the upper grip will take the full brunt of the force at that small point.

Hence the rod never loads up to its full potential.

Correct me if I am wrong in my observations.

Dan

[diabolical]

I think you are pretty close to mark Dan. The butt section is way more rigid than the top section causing more problems at the join.

I have a overhead pe6-8 of the same rod . I had the whole butt section rebuilt, shortened from the gimble end 3", did away with the split grips adding new grips and heavy duty reel seat. The rod feels so much better and has moved the pressure to the rod and away from the join.

[Stuart]

Got to love advertising BS. Monster mesh, super strong, incrediable strenght and all the other crap. I have been building jig and popper tossing rods since the early 90s from 30lb to 130lb and the technology back then wasnt even close to that as it is today. Some of them even had the join at the top of the grip for guys flying to Christmass Island , seems all must have that today. Whats even more surpirssing is the ones of today measure exactly the same lenght as mine did. Its a good idea to have the join that low, more material and thicker diameter = strenght. However if you miss match the rod to the drag and fast driving such as this video showed then that will be the end result. There is no such thing as a super blank, there is in advertising world. You know the one. Its the blank that you can pry the rusted old 9 inch ford brake drum off with. The tip is light enough to cast 50 grams but also cast 400gram popper if need be. You can use 32kg of drag and if you snap it, you pay $120 and you get a whole new rod that we charged you $1800 for, even if its a lagit warranty claim= illegal. If the join is done right they do offer great strenght, keep reducing the OD of the blank and is will happen. Some say my blanks are to radical, a bit to heavy, but none will cast as far, work a popper as easy or move fish as fast as what mine do. There are very defined limits as to what a blank can do, you can design it for potential problams, misuse, high sticking, drag to high and so on. But to expect a blank/rod to be as fin as a pencile and expect it to perform all those just mentioned is BS. The marketing is also getting to the point of insainity, who in there right mind belives half of that crap anyway. I was speaking with a Diawa rep last year about a new range of rods. He didnt know who I was, what I do so it was good for me to listen to. He said they take a titanium mandral, heat untill its white hot, he said around 5000C. Titanium melts at around 2900c from memory. They then roll the cloth on the mandral, dont know who tacs the cloth on by hand, must be a robot. The cloth is rolled under extrem pressure, he said around 3500 PSI, I said FAAARK they have a rolling press that can that heavy? The blank is then baked at 500c again to form a solid wall blank. His words not mine, and by the way its mostly actually all bullsh!t. Once I rattled a few things off to him he relised maybe what he was told was BS, I said it was BS. But thats the story he gave the tackle shop. Believe .0000001 % of what you read and even less of what you hear. In this day and age where compatition is cut throat anyone and everyone will do and say anything to sell stuff. Buyer beware!.

[Noelm]

I guess in a "theory" sort of way, the most pressure/strain is on a rod right where your hand is on the foregrip, just try it, get a length of anything (even polystyrene) and have someone hold one end (the tip) and you pull up, it will always break where you lift it from, so I guess any join in a rod should be below or above this point, (lets assume we are talking a decent thickness/strength walled blank) and as mentioned, almost anything can and will break, (regardless of what the advertising will have you believe) if it is abused or misused in some way, I have broken an "unbreakable" Sabre jig stick` quite a few years ago.

[Noelm]

I might add, it seems to be some sort of ego thing to have a reel that can exhert the most amount of drag, reels these days are measured in the Kg's of drag available to the angler, right or wrong is anyone's guess, but I personally don't think 50KG of drag is the be all and end all to stop and land a big fish. The pre-requisites of a new reel is 50+ bearings, 50KG of drag and a high price tag, and be made out of some sort of thermo nuclear material, if it meets these criteria, it must be good, and to a point it may well be too.

[Stuart]

Thats pretty much it mate. There is an unsaid comp going on betwen reel manufacturers to reach the highest drag rating.
The thing that p!sses me off is that most of these reels main body would crack and fail long before that effectivedrag was reached. I do a lot of heavy stand up fishing and Im a big guy, I can tell you for sure that after 15 minutes of hanging on to a 37kg outfitt with 22kg of drag. And thats with a harness and gimble belt. I have tried to hang on to one of my 80-100lb popper tossing rods with 21kg of drag for 6 minutes and almost went for a swim. I have been game fishing for many years and while technique amounts for nearly 99% a stuck drag or seized reel will result in your potential drowning. You may laugh but there has been many deaths due to this very resone. Other other side note that many dont seem to consider is lever drag reels. Many advertise x amount of drag. Ok lets assume 15kg at sunset. Now work out that this reels lever has a movement of 4 inches, some less than this. Now 4 inches of travel means you have a drag from free spool to locked up at 15kg over 4 inches. Thats 4kg per inch of travel, thats a hell of a lot and next to useless if your trying to increase the drag smoothly. I have used reels with this very drag and it was a pain in the arse trying to bump the drag up smoothly and softley. I often direct this question to reel manufacurers an d suppliers with no reply or response or even a shrug of the shoulders. So the knock on effect is often for rod companies to try and buidl rods that can handle these drag settings. I wonder what would happen if someone decided to take legal action against the reel manufacturer for injury, its a very real posibility. Lets see, that guy's rod snapped. Lets say for round figures at 80lb. He was running 20kg of drag, the reel is rated to 30kg of drag. So all that is well under the spec. He falls over hits hs head and dies, or left brain damaged. I know this may sound like BS but I know of cases in the states and hence why I took insurence when selling rods over that way. I dont think they think about the real dangers of this much drag and how guys who may very well be wet behind the ears go out and try it only to instanly relise they are about to go finding nemo. When I build unlimited stand up rods they each come with clear intructions and warnings. I also give all this to the customer well before any money changes hands. I have seen the dangers first hand of high drags and while spin outfitts arent fished with a harness the chances of going head first into the drink is still there. I watched my mate go head first into the drink trying heavy drag in the rolling and pitching boat, friggen funny to watch but the boat came down on his head as he as comeing up. He was almost knocked out from the blow.