Ice makers, and ice boxes

[Cav(J.C.)]

Hi guys and Girls,
Some of you may have seen my thread about the excellent warrenty service I received from Techni Ice. I also mentioned an Ice machine, and said "Watch this space".
We all know an Ice box, no matter how excellent, is useless without ice.
About two years ago, at the time of the purchase of the excellent ice box, I decided to go all out and buy an Ice maker. After much consultation with a fridgee mate, I purchased what had the reputation of the "King of ice makers"--Manitowok. Lesson one---If you can't pronounce it, don't buy it.
Product of the good old USA, Made in China. Only found that out when the troubles began.
Paid my 1500 smackeroos, piped it in, wired in, drains etc--Whoopee, ripper, and other exclamations of bliss. Great for fishing, and the occasional booze up.
I DONT THINK SO.
Excess water usage, excess power usage, and minimal ice. Standard bucket full over 12 hours---at night. Would not produce during the day---this is in winter.
The supplier says--"It's the wrong Ice machine for the job. Should be nicely wrapped in the security of an airconditioned boardroom somewhere in case someone wanted a few cubes of ice in their scotch"---I kid you not.
After much toing and froing, and me buying Ice, a local contractor was engaged by the agent, to troubleshoot and fix the problem.
Diagnosis---low refrigerant charge.
Repaired, works for one month (I only use it intermittantly) still uses excess water--overflowing down the drain--and the agency changes hands.
I am now in the clutches of AJBaker and sons---Australian distributors, who should be on the wing for the "Maroons" they can duck and weave so well.
Seems that if the agency changes, all warrentys are off.
Contact Manitowok in the Good old USA, and magically I have an appointment with a serviceman.
Nice bloke, works hard, lots of tests in situe---just in case the installation is wrong orout of spec.Bad luck fellas, all OK.--machine taken away. Over a year trying to get this far. Still buying ice.
Machine backwards and forwards, lot of "It should never have been sold" "Don't sell them any more"
Final diagnosis--Water pressure not suitable--installation of a pressure regulating valve.
Defrost cycle not regulated properly---installation of a timer.
Under charge caused by a leak where aluminium tubing meets copper--connected with epoxy. ---All good. Just before Xmas--You beauty. I don't think so. Buying ice for Xmas, everyone on holidays.
Now we are into the second year of ownership---All the refrigerant is gone, ask for help, and AJ Bakers solution is to try and sell me a new machine for another lazy $2000.
Otherwise --no speakies.
C#@$#t---all I wanted was an easy retirement. A few fish, a couple of drinks, and some ice readily available.
I know you can't help, but a rant relieves the pressure.
Cheers and good health,
John Cav.

[wirlybird]

woh have you looked on grays online some of the commercial ice makers go for $500 dosent fix your problem but its a solution none the less. I feel your pain i was going to go down this path as i thought the same thing. i have yet to buy one but i will be a bit more cautious now

[Stuart]

One word mate...ACCC. My wife has just finished commercial law and her last subject was warranty such as yours. I will ask her tonight when she gets home and then PM you. In a nut shell thats crap and no they cant wash there hands of it, take it further mate.

[The Woo]

That's dreadful mate, and I really do feel for you, having been led along the garden path by importers/agents who assure you they know what they're on about, but in reality have no clue and will do/say anything for aa sale.

It won't make you feel better at all, but in my years fluffing with boats, nothing, I repeat, nothing, gives as much drama on pleasure boats as;
#1 - Air conditioning
#2 - Ice makers

At least you're not alone!

[PinHead]

Hi guys and Girls,
Some of you may have seen my thread about the excellent warrenty service I received from Techni Ice. I also mentioned an Ice machine, and said "Watch this space".
We all know an Ice box, no matter how excellent, is useless without ice.
About two years ago, at the time of the purchase of the excellent ice box, I decided to go all out and buy an Ice maker. After much consultation with a fridgee mate, I purchased what had the reputation of the "King of ice makers"--Manitowok. Lesson one---If you can't pronounce it, don't buy it.
Product of the good old USA, Made in China. Only found that out when the troubles began.
Paid my 1500 smackeroos, piped it in, wired in, drains etc--Whoopee, ripper, and other exclamations of bliss. Great for fishing, and the occasional booze up.
I DONT THINK SO.
Excess water usage, excess power usage, and minimal ice. Standard bucket full over 12 hours---at night. Would not produce during the day---this is in winter.
The supplier says--"It's the wrong Ice machine for the job. Should be nicely wrapped in the security of an airconditioned boardroom somewhere in case someone wanted a few cubes of ice in their scotch"---I kid you not.
After much toing and froing, and me buying Ice, a local contractor was engaged by the agent, to troubleshoot and fix the problem.
Diagnosis---low refrigerant charge.
Repaired, works for one month (I only use it intermittantly) still uses excess water--overflowing down the drain--and the agency changes hands.
I am now in the clutches of AJBaker and sons---Australian distributors, who should be on the wing for the "Maroons" they can duck and weave so well.
Seems that if the agency changes, all warrentys are off.
Contact Manitowok in the Good old USA, and magically I have an appointment with a serviceman.
Nice bloke, works hard, lots of tests in situe---just in case the installation is wrong orout of spec.Bad luck fellas, all OK.--machine taken away. Over a year trying to get this far. Still buying ice.
Machine backwards and forwards, lot of "It should never have been sold" "Don't sell them any more"
Final diagnosis--Water pressure not suitable--installation of a pressure regulating valve.
Defrost cycle not regulated properly---installation of a timer.
Under charge caused by a leak where aluminium tubing meets copper--connected with epoxy. ---All good. Just before Xmas--You beauty. I don't think so. Buying ice for Xmas, everyone on holidays.
Now we are into the second year of ownership---All the refrigerant is gone, ask for help, and AJ Bakers solution is to try and sell me a new machine for another lazy $2000.
Otherwise --no speakies.
C#@$#t---all I wanted was an easy retirement. A few fish, a couple of drinks, and some ice readily available.
I know you can't help, but a rant relieves the pressure.
Cheers and good health,
John Cav.

get rid of it..that epxoy trick never holds for very long. Been there and done that back in the old days...never again. what area do you live in ?

[Cav(J.C.)]

get rid of it..that epxoy trick never holds for very long. Been there and done that back in the old days...never again. what area do you live in ?
Hi PinHead,
Live at Hollywell on the Gold coast.
Have bit the bullet, and a Tech from Thermopro is scheduled to pick the offending article up this arvo. Will advise all of the diagnosis, cost, effectiveness of repair etc.
Cheers,
John Cav

[PinHead]

"The supplier says--"It's the wrong Ice machine for the job. Should be nicely wrapped in the security of an airconditioned boardroom somewhere in case someone wanted a few cubes of ice in their scotch"---I kid you not."

I just had a thought and that comment may not be too far off the money..the cabinet insulation plays a huge part in ice makers..high ambient temp and RH and sub standard insulation and the poor thing will work its ring off for bugger all result.

[Cav(J.C.)]

Hi Stuart,
Thanks for the input.
I am of the belief that the ACCC is a waste of space, like most government bureaucracys, unless of course there is positive publicity, and political advantage.
The little bloke is an inconvenience, and for this little bloke, life is too short for litigation, and the stress of it all.
It's wonderful that your wife has finished commercial law, and I congratulate her. I bet she is a mean fishing partner as well.
Aus. has a long way to catch up on consumer protection laws, so the best thing the customer can do is spread the word, honestly, and give as many accolades as brickbats.
Cheers,
John Cav.

[banksmister]

John what model is it
had a fair bit to do with the larger units [Commercial ones] got 5 at home at the moment
Yours is new and should work but the ones i have are a couple of years old and and do get the odd problem which you expect when u put a circuit board and water close together

Darren

[team_mongo]

I feel for you John.

Can I ask how many kilo a day was it supposed to be? I was looking at getting a ice machine (like yours plumbed in etc), but ended up getting a sh!tb0x ebay one, still working but only makes 20k a day. Just stuff the deep freeze full of ice.

We have probably over 10 commercial ice machines at work and they are always breaking down.

[Offshore 79]

G'day mate I'm a fridgy I have worked on all brands of ice makers and Stewart are the only brand to use I have one set up at home it does about 80 to 100 kg of ice in 24hrs and has never missed a beat mine does the shaved ice like you see at the fish co op I'm on the gold coast if you want one let me know

[Cav(J.C.)]

Hi guys and girls,
A quick reply to questions.
Firstly--The teck could not turn up, pressure of work, but will be here this arvo--promise.
Thanks "PinHead". The machine was sold in Qld, so the agent should know what it's capabilities are for this climate. Saying that, U totally agree with you, and so ahve installed this machine in a large white ply box, with plenty of ventillation, apperture for condenser air in and out, and a forced ventillation fan to scour the box of transferred heat.
The box is at the end of a jetty, in air flow from all directions. I even went to the trouble of painting the water pipe white.
Team Mongo---I only expected about 20 Kg/day, which I accumulate and store in a deep freeze. I went to an ice maker because of the quick cooling of fish with cubes, against the damage done to fish by blocks when the sea was rough.
Darren--It's a Manitowok EC20.
Offshore79
Might be a bit big for me mate.I only use what I have intermittantly when I wish to increase mt ice stocks. Thats part of the problem, I never know if it will work next time.
Thanks to everyone who replied and gave support and ideas.
John Cav

[Mrs Ronnie H]

Hi
I was thinking Small claims as they handle claims up to 10k I think. Costs you about 10 bucks to file.

good luck

Ronnie

[Smithy]

A mate has a commercial one sitting on a bench dropping into a big esky. Production has increased out of sight by pre chilling the water. From the hose it goes in the bung of the esky for a loop then back out again.

[PB]

I brought a second hand machine last year and its the best thing iv ever done. Ive got it sitting out side at the factory and the boys from the local game club come and help them self on a Friday night after work.

It will make 500kg of flake ice a day and from what we have noticed it uses stuff all power.
http://i638.photobucket.com/albums/uu109/Hemo1984_album/icemachine001.jpg
http://i638.photobucket.com/albums/uu109/Hemo1984_album/icemachine002.jpg

[banksmister]

They are kidding who has a room that is 21deg and 10deg water in Queensland


Ice Cube Machine

Make: Manitowoc USA

Model: EC-20




Capacity: 20 Kgs / 24 Hrs


* Capacities are based on ambient temperature of 21˚C & incoming water temperature of 10˚C.

[Cav(J.C.)]

That's great PB.
Can you tell me what make it is, and what I would expect to pay.
I think a lot of the cost of ice machines is because of the clear cubes of a certain size demanded, for use in cocktail bars etc. Never thought of a flake ice machine, and wasn't offered the option.
I'm still learning, but the education is proving costly.
For anyone who has been watching this saga, I am still waiting for the tech from Thermopro to turn up---promises-promises.
John Cav.

[Chimo]

Hi John

Its late now but did you ever consider just buying a big chest freezer and freezing plastic 2 or 3 lt milk containers of salt water out of your canal in milk container crates.

You can swap these in and out as you need the ice. Six of the 3 lt containers fit in each so you get 18lt of long lasting ice that you can add salt water to and chill whatever you want of just keep whatever cold and dry.

Seems to work and the boss still gets a little room for food etc so some brownie points are possible. I take it that you are still as happy as ..... with you boat!

Cheers
Chimo

[Cav(J.C.)]

Hi Chimo,
good to hear from you. Yes, still in love with Grumbles.
Used to freeze bottles, but found if they were put on the bottom of the box, they did not chill the fish quickly enough, and if you put them on the fish for a quick cool down, in rough water they would beat the crap out of the fish.
Best low cost thing I found was wine casks. Bit of patience filling them with salt water, but were really good until the fish spikes found them.
Then the wife went up-market, and found bottles so casks became a thing of the past.
How come the older wives get, the more expensive they become?
I don't expect an answer.
Cheers,
John Cav.

[Chimo]

Hi John

As I understand it its about quality not quantity.

I'm sure you understand, if not your wife or even mine will explain.

Glad to hear that Grumbles is still doing right by you. Suppose the name is a GOM thing?

Cheers
Chimo

[PinHead]

They are kidding who has a room that is 21deg and 10deg water in Queensland


Ice Cube Machine

Make: Manitowoc USA

Model: EC-20




Capacity: 20 Kgs / 24 Hrs

* Capacities are based on ambient temperature of 21˚C & incoming water temperature of 10˚C.

you haven't been to my place..21C is warm in the igloo.

[banksmister]

Look out the do gooders will be blaming u for global warming running the ac at that temp
Hey and don’t bother posting pics of u showering at 10 deg that could be a bit embarrassing
It may not be pinhead it may be pin---k

[PB]

That's great PB.
Can you tell me what make it is, and what I would expect to pay.
I think a lot of the cost of ice machines is because of the clear cubes of a certain size demanded, for use in cocktail bars etc. Never thought of a flake ice machine, and wasn't offered the option.
I'm still learning, but the education is proving costly.
For anyone who has been watching this saga, I am still waiting for the tech from Thermopro to turn up---promises-promises.
John Cav.


I brought it from one of my customers that deals & installs them. its a Japanese machine (Hoshizaki). I got mine very cheap as i helped him out with a few things on his boat. but I think he sells a few reconditioned ones for around the 2K mark. I think my machine was over 10K when it was brand new but they are all commercial grade machines of the likes of Coles/Woolworths and fish shops. Im now looking at getting a second machine for doing Cubes for drinks. But for fishing and keeping ice in the eski flaked is the way to go it will last twice as long as cubed ice and will freeze a bottle of water in the eski.

Cheers Pelagic Boats

[Cav(J.C.)]

A mate has a commercial one sitting on a bench dropping into a big esky. Production has increased out of sight by pre chilling the water. From the hose it goes in the bung of the esky for a loop then back out again.

Thanks Smithy. Gives me an idea to put a trough or such under the wasre water outlet, and run some copper tube back and forth through it before entering the ice machine.
John Cav.