Scammed!!!

[mozzie1957]

I have to let all be aware of the antics of the following boat dealer/mechanic.

Before I go further I'd like all to know that I am not after sympathy, but am kicking myself for being trusting of a supposedly reputable dealer.

Some time back I was diagnosed as terminal, pensioned off, and moved the family from Brisbane up to the Far North to enjoy what we have left. Always dreamed of living near, and fishing on, the reef. Part of the dream was THE boat.

Found what we thought was THE boat at Boats 'R' Us, in Stratford, Cairns. The business owned by one Rupert Morgan. Put a $5000 deposit on THE boat, and left it with him to complete the work that needed doing prior to us taking delivery. The major part of which was replacing the existing knackered donk with a later model. Supposedly a '99 200hp Merc. Batteries had to be replaced, storage door hinges fixed and the entire wheel and brake assemblies on the trailer replaced with all new parts.

The motor he fitted was a 90 model, the batteries truck and not marine, the hinges brass (on an aluminium boat) and the wheels only had the bearings greased. The brake assemblies untouched. After some consultation I spat it and canned the sale. Requested the return of my refund as NONE of the work was as promised, of particular concern the motor. He told me to call back the following week. This I did and was told that as he'd done work to the boat I'd have to wait for it to sell before he'd give me back anything.

The boat was sold 'bout September. Numerous visits, and phone calls, to this character amounted to little. I was advised to contact the Queensland Civil & Administrative Tribunal which I did do. They requested mediation which he refused. It was then set down for a hearing before a magistrate. Had that Wednesday. He never fronted but sent a letter to the court telling them that he's gone bankrupt November 22nd. I'd given him the deposit early December, last year. Turns out that he's done the same thing back in 1997.

How is it that someone can so falsely misrepresent something, get a deposit, when caught out refuse to return same and then get to hang onto it?

Please be aware, fellows, that this isn't the first time this character has managed to walk away, and may not be the last.

So much for the dream, it's turned into a bloody nightmare. We had hoped, and in fact were counting on, being returned something in time for Christmas. Great time for us, this year. >:(

[Dan5]

Mate sorry to hear whats happened to you.......You can never be to carefull these days you just never know.
For what its worth the Guys at Bill's marine were good to deal with while i was living in Cairns......not cheap but atleast honest.

Dan

[mozzie1957]

Yeah. But aren't you supposed to be able to trust an established business? Can't afford the loss. Thinking 'bout packing up and moving. Buggered me trust and caused us a heap of grief.

[nigelr]

Very sorry to hear that mozzie.
Sincerely hope it all picks up from here.

[Jarrah Jack]

Thanks for putting the warning on here Mozzie. Not a nice situation to read about at all. Hope things can turn around for you quickly.

Cheers

JJ

[waterbouy]

Plenty of them around mate. Dunno how they sleep at night. They leagal system allows it. Very sorry to hear. I believe in Karma, so he'll have a good xmas!!!!

[googarra]

Welcome to the north!!! General rules up is is as follows: You must adhere or it will give you no end of pain

1) If you want to buy it, it has to be there, exactly as wanted, ready to pick up by you (not delivery) there and then, pay and leave with it or you will live to regret it
2) Never ever order anything or listen to promises from any business about availability or delivery
3) Do not ever believe anything someone at a business tells you.
4) Do not ever lend anything to anyone anywhere because they then own it and you will never see it again
5) Everyone up here is an expert and has gained experience from at least 3 lifetimes of experiences. Believe a small percentage of what they say.
6) If they dont know, and are going to ring you back on that one, this is crypic Nth Speak for way to hard, get rid of him, still waiting on a thousand or two calls myself.

Learnt the hard way many many times myself on numerous issues and still belting my head on brick walls
Now spend 1.4 mil a year in goods anywhere in the world but up here, and they are all going for the 'buy local' nonsense.

Best/worst boat story I have heard come from a large boat dealer still operating up this was. I have had one dealing with them and near sank my boat also.

Newbie ordered/purchased a new big plate boat for about $115,000.00
Picked it up and the electric flush toilet was not fitted during construction (down south in the normal world) as ordered and paid for.
Many other things not as ordered but this is the best one. After constant complaints they took the boat back and they retro fitted the toilet and he thought that part of the problem was solved.

After a few months someone, myself included, looked at the installation. They dry fitted brass inlet and outlet flush mounts for the water intakes and outlet straight onto the aluminium plate hull under the waterline, not real smart, doomed to eat into the hull and fall out causing major sinking problem.

Now they might have got away with this and the owner would have taken on a lot of water way out to sea, but get this:::

They used a huge holesaw and drilled straight through the flotation chambers on each side, one for the inlet, the other side for the outlet, so they could run the flex pipes through it.

Dohhh!!!!! Now what we have here is a big expensive boat that is going to sink in about 6 months A) The brass will eat very nicely throught the plate hull B) Guess what is going to keep the boat afloat NOTHING, both chambers have been breached and will flood.

For those that dont know what I am on about, smaller boats have bouyancy foam under the seats ect ect, but larger models rely on long sealed floatation chambers that keep you from going down the gurgler way out to sea when the sh&^t hits the fan.

The plate hull was about 90% eaten through after 4 months and quickly explained to him about what was going to happen

I am sorry for what you have experiences up here but be assured, this is mostly normal behaviour for most up here.

After 8 years up here I am past the scream and yell stage, they just give you dumb looks and dont know what you are on about.

Remember the rules as above






This is a true story:

[cormorant]

Terrible and hope Karma does catch up with him. Can only hope he has crossed the sort of folk that will sort him out.

Always worth checking that the bloke really did go bankrupt. I've seen blokes dumb or smart enough to send false stuff in and get away with it.

[Stuart]

I do believe that if he has taken a deposit with in a certain time frame from declaring bankrupt he can be charged with fraud. I would certainly be pursuing this a bit further mate. I think the small cost of a lawyer might actually help. If anything it will make his life a bit un comfortable. Don’t ever trust any business no matter how long they have been going or how many praise’s people give them. It’s your money and if it’s not on the lot then walk away. A person’s word isn’t what it used to be and it seems with more regularity that these guys are burning the average Joe. I have been burnt by friends so what will a person do who you don’t know, friggen joke these days. I do however hope you and your family enjoy the time you have mate, I really do.

[mozzie1957]

Forgive me if I'm wrong but I always thought that obtaining financial advantage by deception or, let's call a spade a spade, fraud was an offence?

Thanks for all the wishes, good to know that there are still a few around that care.

[mozzie1957]

Terrible and hope Karma does catch up with him. Can only hope he has crossed teh sort of folk that will sort him out.

Always worth checking that the bloke really did go bankrupt. I've seen blokes dumb or smart enough to send false stuff in and get away with it.

Yeah, I had a check done, that's how I found out he'd done the same caper in '97. Great system, ours, that let's these low-lifes rip off whoever and then use the system to avoid repaying. Then a few years later do it all over again.

Then if someone 'sorts' 'im out they're in the s#*t for taking the 'law' into their own hands. The law protects him, where the hell's the 'justice' in any of that?

[johncar]

Sorry to hear of your bad experiences there, but please don't put blind faith in anyone. We all need to do our dilegent homework and check out peoples busnesses references and background before handing cash to them. Yes in an ideal world you should be able to but I would have thought that in a world of scams, cheats, and all sorts of criminals, opportunists, con men, we need to be more careful and be suspicious at all times.
Also if you are new to boating please get used to spending money and through my own change of plan I done over $10 in the last year that I couldn't really afford but it's part of the interest I guess and I just had to write it off and move on. But try and get your deposit back by all means but please don't make your life any worse over it, it's not worth it.
For the future I don't know if you have a lot of experience in boating but if not it is wise to either find a mate who can help you safely through the minefield or buy exactly what you want from a long term reputable dealer and even then have it checked out independently before handing any cash over always!.
Good luck with it and I wish you the best outcome..

[Jarrah Jack]

Also if you are new to boating please get used to spending money and through my own change of plan I done over $10 in the last year that I couldn't really afford but.


:o:o Must've been hard.....;D;D

[scuttlebutt]

Shame you got burnt. I've never liked the look of that end of town. Though really I haven't been impressed by any of the bigger boat dealers in Cairns either. Even for maintenance work there are a couple of good blokes but a lot of dunces mixed in.

That's why I only buy or sell boats privately. You don't get any benefit from buying used through a dealer. NONE, plus buying privately is much cheaper. Don't worry about their warranty, it's rubbish. And unlike cars, there's no guarantee the boat your buying isn't stolen. And buying privately you get to see where the owner lives.

Buy privately, do your revs checks, get someone to check it out, google the sellers name etc. Even then, nothing to stop you getting a lemon but that's the chance you take either way buying used.

I also get a mobile mechanic to do the work on my boat. Got burnt a while back by one of the bigger shops. I prefer to have just one mechanic do all the work on my boat so if anything goes wrong I know who to ask about it.

Sorry mate, none of this helps you 'cause the horse has bolted. Hope you can turn the other cheek and still manage a merry christmas.

[wirlybird]

Hi Mozzie,
I bought an engine from Rupert it had a few issues so he sent his mechanic to fix them. it was a hassle at the time but he said if i were to brake down anywhere he would tow me back he seemed genuine at the time. He is a backyard dealer and you will get a bargain price but if you take a look around his shop it isn't state of the art so its always hard to tell.
I feel for your situation its a big deposit to lose i hope you can get some form of resolution

I use to play soccer with one of the boys at bills marine those guys are always willing to help but pricy

[Roughasguts]

I hope you paid the deposit buy credit card!!!! cause if you did you could ring the bank and reverse the tranaction.
Then you can argue it out! with the money returned to your account, it puts the shoe back on the foot where it belongs.
This would be credit card fraud a much easier situation to resolve with you having the upper hand.

Cheers.

[The Woo]

Terrible mate, I really feel for you. Low life's like this exist and we're bound to run into a few during our lifetime.

I hope you get some satisfaction soon.

All the best and Merry Christmas to you.

[mozzie1957]

Nah! I gave him a grand, in cash. Then he rang after more, supposedly to help have the boat ready in a week. Like a goose I gave him an extra 4g. Bloody shock when I saw the skunky donk he'd installed, nothing as promised. Then 12 months of bulls#*t, angst, and now this crap.

[mozzie1957]

Hi Mozzie,
I bought an engine from Rupert it had a few issues so he sent his mechanic to fix them. it was a hassle at the time but he said if i were to brake down anywhere he would tow me back he seemed genuine at the time. He is a backyard dealer and you will get a bargain price but if you take a look around his shop it isn't state of the art so its always hard to tell.
I feel for your situation its a big deposit to lose i hope you can get some form of resolution

I use to play soccer with one of the boys at bills marine those guys are always willing to help but pricy

'Cause he seemed genuine, boatyard and workshop. The boat in question was there on consignment. Even after he'd sold it I still never got me dollars back. Makes me wonder if he's done the dirty on the boat owners as well. And how many others?

[Roughasguts]

Sorry to hear all the bad luck your having mozzie, I got me credit card skimmed the other week bloody 711 servos with dodgy staff.
Probably serves the banks right using these people in there call centres, teach them a bit about banking, next minute there milking everyones account one way or another.

Cheers

[garman1]

This so sucks, you can't tell me he didn't know he was going under.............. do people nowadays have suck low scrupals that they think this is ok, simply by going bankrupt you make it ok.......boats r us, now gone, so what will the name be of the next boat business????????? The law sucks, it's there to protect the guilty at times.

[stevel3]

as others have said mate its shitty what was done to you, but in your situation you need to move on and spend what time you have left with your loved ones. I doubt from what you have said that you will get any money back, dont let this spoil what time you have left. If I were up that way you would be more than welcome to come out in my boat, Steve.

[MudRiverDan]

I do believe that if he has taken a deposit with in a certain time frame from declaring bankrupt he can be charged with fraud. I would certainly be pursuing this a bit further mate. I think the small cost of a lawyer might actually help. If anything it will make his life a bit un comfortable. Don’t ever trust any business no matter how long they have been going or how many praise’s people give them. It’s your money and if it’s not on the lot then walk away. A person’s word isn’t what it used to be and it seems with more regularity that these guys are burning the average Joe. I have been burnt by friends so what will a person do who you don’t know, friggen joke these days. I do however hope you and your family enjoy the time you have mate, I really do.

Yes exactly, his business would be unable to trade after his bankruptcy had gone through.
He may have simply signed the receipts under his own name and not business name, claiming it was a private sale.

It pays to make sure all your receipts supplied are stated for the business name, it seems common practice to often get a supervisor or manager to sign off receipts or to use a bank account under their own name.
I am not 100% but if there is no business name on the receipts or account deposit name supplied then it opens up all sorts of loopholes on who and what you are actually dealing with.

$5000.00 should require a contact signing regarding the further work to be done.

[Stuart]

But even if it was in his name they can still go him. Fraud has many faces and angles and and if anyone askes for more coin on top of what has been already payed then alarm bells should start ringing. Its much like progress payments, got me stuffed why people agree to pay these amounts. If someone cant carry the cost of a build then it would worry the hell out of me.

Stu

[Roughasguts]

I'm actually thinking you still have 5K invested in the boat that got sold on consignment.
Find the new owner and ask him what gives you have a stake in that boat!!!!

Even if he goes halves with you your better off.

Cheers.

[mozzie1957]

I'm actually thinking you still have 5K invested in the boat that got sold on consignment.
Find the new owner and ask him what gives you have a stake in that boat!!!!

Even if he goes halves with you your better off.

Cheers.

Find the new owner? According to Rupert, just after the boat was sold it was 'stolen' from the new owner. Just got dodgier by the day.

[mozzie1957]

This so sucks, you can't tell me he didn't know he was going under.............. do people nowadays have suck low scrupals that they think this is ok, simply by going bankrupt you make it ok.......boats r us, now gone, so what will the name be of the next boat business????????? The law sucks, it's there to protect the guilty at times.
Yeah, I'm wondering what name he'll open up under next time, and what's happened to all the boats that were still in his yard last month? Can't tell me he's sold the lot.

And you're right, the law certainly seems to favour the unscrupulous. Personally, I wouldn't be able to sleep nights.

[Roughasguts]

Find the new owner? According to Rupert, just after the boat was sold it was 'stolen' from the new owner. Just got dodgier by the day.

That's if the new owner even existed, sure is dodgy.

Cheers

[mozzie1957]

as others have said mate its shitty what was done to you, but in your situation you need to move on and spend what time you have left with your loved ones. I doubt from what you have said that you will get any money back, dont let this spoil what time you have left. If I were up that way you would be more than welcome to come out in my boat, Steve.

Thanks for the offer Steve. Great to know that there's still good people around.

[marto78]

But even if it was in his name they can still go him. Fraud has many faces and angles and and if anyone askes for more coin on top of what has been already payed then alarm bells should start ringing. Its much like progress payments, got me stuffed why people agree to pay these amounts. If someone cant carry the cost of a build then it would worry the hell out of me.

Stu

Mate its not just business owners that like ripping people off, there are a lot of customers that do the same thing and as a business owner progress payments are a way of making sure you dont loose more money then you have to. If someone cant meet their first progress payment of $30,000 on a $90,000 job the work stops and you only have to chase them for $30,000 instead of for the full amount a few months down the track.

I'm sorry for your loss Mozzie but there are a lot of scumbags out there and they seem to be able get away with it time after time. I garantee this Rupert wanka would be the same kind of guy that would get the $90g renovation done on his house and not pay at the end.

[Stuart]

Well he will rip the wrong guy off one day and he will find himself in a world of hurt.

Marto78, whats to say that after several progress payments the builder goes walkabout, where is the protection for the consumer????
It happenes all to much in the boat building game.

Stu

[PinHead]

not sure he was planning on going bankrupt when you originally gave him the money a year ago..things do change in a business in that time.

I do feel for you, not a good situation to be in.

[TopBhoy]

Well he will rip the wrong guy off one day and he will find himself in a world of hurt.

Marto78, whats to say that after several progress payments the builder goes walkabout, where is the protection for the consumer????
It happenes all to much in the boat building game.

Stu
I'd imagine the consumer, who could incur some additional costs, would have an asset which is partially completed and wouldn't have to fork out again on that work, to complete. The problem arises where the asset is moveable and can disappear ie a boat.

[Stuart]

Its no wonder QLD is labeled the Cowboy state. It seems crazy that boat builders and for that matter established boat yards can do a runner with your coin. If anyone ripped me like that would find themselves eating steak through a straw for many months.

[wilcara]

I feel for ya, and sorry to hear it too. I got scammed a similar way too but at least ended up with the boat, just had to completely rebuild everything in it.

At least I could say that I found the shonky work while it was in my shed and not 60 km offshore with smoke coming from the wiring, which definitely would have happened from what I saw under my dash.

A guy who will rip you off with crappy work and lies will cover things up - so you ended up better off, alive and well, it may have been the best 5k you ever spent.

[mozzie1957]

not sure he was planning on going bankrupt when you originally gave him the money a year ago..things do change in a business in that time.

I do feel for you, not a good situation to be in.

A year ago he told me I'd have to wait for the boat to sell before I got a refund. The boat sold, still no refund. Must make him feel good that he took down a disabled pensioner. Just a stooge job from day one. I've learnt a very valuable (and expensive) lesson. I'm hoping he tries the same thing on others, like a coupla Hell's Angels.