Over Priced Used Boats

[mikeaus]

Hi all,

I am a new paid member after reading this forum for some time. It has to be said, this forum is a wealth of information and a credit to all that contribute.

Anyway, to my first post. I am in the market for a new boat and I am leaning toward a Cruise Craft 530 or 575. Now, new prices can vary on these boat from dealer to dealer. The retail is about 55k and 75k respectively.

We are in a competitive market these days and I think the Australian boat business has had it good for some time getting top dollar. Some dealer realise this and the two above models can now be obtained for about $46k and 58k from several dealers. These boat would come with an ETEC 115 on both. This would be fine for the 530, however the 575 may be under powered, but nothing a few grand power upgrade could not fix. So lets say 60k for arguments sake.

So, with this in mind why is that used 575s that are 5 years old advertised for 55-65k? Bear in mind the new boats have a GST component on them 5.8k as well. This means the price of the used boat is greater than a new one, not to mention its out of warranty and five years old.

This is not a rant, so please forgive me if it sounds like one. However I am very interested as to why this is.

Its a no brainer to buy new based on the above math. However when I make an offer in the low to mid forties for a 575 sellers they think I am being insulting?

58k - gst = $52200. Take off at least 7k depreciation = 45k right.

Any thoughts?

[Steeler]

Is there no GST payable on a used item through a dealer ?.

If buying used through a dealer you will have components such as load and over allowance perhaps and finally who would ever pay the listed price on such an item new or used ?.

Just guessing of course but will be interesting to hear from others also.

[BM]

I don't think the boating industry has 'had it good' for quite some time actually. It has been poor for several years and getting worse.

The anomaly you are seeing is no doubt caused by the drastic price cutting that you are seeing. 75K down to 58 is a massive drop but in my opinion some Aus built boats are overpriced anyway. Particularly the boutique boats. Not sure what the new Edencraft owner wants but under previous owners a Formula 233 bare hull was 45K!! Ridiculous!!

65K for a used boat when new is 75K makes sense. There will be some disappointed recent buyers looking to sell but they will be stuck with their boats if they don't shift their price accordingly.

I am quite shocked at that price drop for a new 575. The manufacturer must be slashing profit on the hull to move boats. There's less than 10% margin in an outboard and the trailers have stuff all in them also.

Cheers

[mikeaus]

Yes thats my point. Since there is no GST on a used craft why are private sellers and used dealers pricing their craft like there is.

Sure, private buyers had to pay it, but thats the nature of the beast. When you drive out of the dealers yard, bang goes your gst and your boat is worth that much less from that moment on.

New boats have the GST included in the price. they don't get to keep it when they sell a boat. It goes into the governments kitty. So when comparing a new vs used boat your should first minus the gst from the new one then talk turkey. Right?

Happy for others to bring other points to the table here.

[Triple]

Maybe its the wfs effect (wife forcing sale)..
"Wife - Get rid of that boat it just sits in the driveway all year costing us money"
"Husband - OK honey Ive advertised it but its not selling.. the economy is dead and nobody is buying boats at the moment"
(and if by chance husband gets the overpriced amount he put on it so it wouldn't sell then he's laughing cause he can upgrade to a newer boat and still buy her new shoes with the change to keep her happy")

So then people that want to really sell there boat then check boatsales trading post etc for current sale prices and see all these "wife forced sales" and think the market is doing great and also ask top dollar which causes the neverending cycle.. ;)

[Argle]

The other thing to look at is that a lot of the used boats will be quite well fitted out with electronics, power winches, deck washes live bait tank pumps rocket launchers, lights stereos etc etc etc. Compare then what you get with most new boats and they are basically bare bones, to bring them up to a comparable level of fit out would blow the cost of the new boat sky high.

Also factor in a lot of them will be carrying more than the minimum recommended horsepower which some dealers are putting on boats to lower the ticket price.

Cheers
Scott

[mal555]

This means the price of the used boat is greater than a new one,

A similar situation occurs in the car industry, particuarly when a brand is trying to dump excess stock of preceded models.

[Noelm]

I think it is just a fact of life that new boats are cheaper now than they ever where, and for a lot of reasons, NOT the dealer dropping prices, the boat industry has been on its knees as far as profit on new boats go for years, most dealers would be selling at near cost, in the hope to pick up service and accessories later (believe me it's true) used boats can be a mixed bag, some paid a high price when purchased because it was "loaded" with goodies, whereas the new boat being cpmp[ared is a bare bones, cheap as you can package it deal (as mentioned by argle) it just comes down to personal deal making and research.

[outwide1]

I agree with Argle(Scott)my cruisecraft was $82000 but it was the reelax outriggers,rod holders,10 grands worth of sounders and gps systems,added extras,
etc that pushed it up to $100000 worth of boat.To sell now at 6 years old im pushing to get $65 for it.To go and build that again there isnt much change out of $100000.
So for some one to buy there saving about $35000 which isnt to bad.Plus you add the cost of maintaining the boat,new clears and canopy$2000,new batteries,new parts for the trailer,
bearings etc,deck wash, and the list goes on with a boat that has just hit 6 years old.
At the end of the day its a good sign that the value of the second hand boat is staying up there as it will mean you will get good money for your new cruisecraft when you decide to sell.
Cheers Mick

[Chimo]

Hi mikeaus

you are not comparing apples with apples when you talk about new and second hand.

As others have said and IMHO you invariably get a better overall deal if you buy a well kitted out, well maintained, second hand boat which has usually got more than a base motor etc fit out.

Also choose your motor based on who you have in mind to service it. Makes life sooooo much easier in the long run esp if you buy second hand and you get your service guy to check the motor that he will have to look after before you buy.

Cheers
Chimo

[rowanda]

you say there is no GST on second hand boats from dealers....????
I thought everything had GST...(except those things with exemptions of course and I'm sure nothing in the boating industry has that)

[Qlder1]

I went through the new vs 2nd hand thing in the last couple of months. While its true there seem to be some overpriced 2nd hand boats around, especially online , the advertised prices for a lot of new boats online is very deceiving. Most of the packages listed are pretty much unworkable , with way underpowered motors, crap trailers etc. A lot of new boats I looked at @ 65k mark were up to 20k more with a reasonable power, better trailer, and electronics and safety gear that you could actually go fishing with.

I ended up buying a 1 yr old Tournament 2100WA for 64k that would have cost me over 80k to buy new.

[jason p]

if its sold by any business holding an abn and there gross is over 75k pa, legally, they have to put a gst on it. he is referring to the private seller not required to charge gst, so it shouldnt be in the price.

jp

[mikeaus]

Hi mikeaus

you are not comparing apples with apples when you talk about new and second hand.



Pretty close in my case. CC 575 with 115 ETEC is 58K upgrade to 130 for less than 60K also get $700 cash back bonus current special. CC come with plenty of options a standard check it out. http://www.cruisecraft.com.au/showroom/cuddy_cabins/cruisecraft_explorer_530.php

Options. As a buyer I don't even consider options such as boat cover, ski pole, cup holders, hydraulic steering or a a $499 fish finder from BCF options to excite me into a purchase. Especially with an engine with zero warranty. It would be interesting to see how many forum members would choose a few cheap options over a new engine with 5 years warranty.

As for serious options such as 20K worth of audio and navigation, well this too is not too appealing. First, most people do not want, nor require 20K worth of gizmos. Especially as they are likely to be 5 years old and outdated. What was 20K back then is worth nothing today. Unfortunately sellers refuse to see it this way. Not only do they want to sell you a boat, they want to sell you a load of outdated electrical gear for 2K less than they bought it for. If its worth that kind of money whack it on Ebay and see how it goes.

As a boat buyer I just want a boat that is priced accordingly based on todays new price, not the price 5 years ago. I just had to ditch some CND stocks that I purchased 3 years ago for 20K. I just checked out at 4.5K. Not much I could do thats all they are worth and they are not going to recover anytime soon, they may even get worse. What do you do? The buyer set the market.

Seems in the boat world this is not true. Many people have advised me NOT to purchase a boat. Your hand is never out of your pocket and you will loose lots of money, I was warned. Not true it would seem. Purchase a CC 575 for 60K, chuck a few cup holders and fish finder on it from BCF and sell in in 5 years with no warranty for 55K. Seems like a good deal to me.

[death_ship]

GST or not makes no difference because thats what the price was when new, so that was the cost. I think your logic is flawed.

[TopBhoy]

Used prices reflects a lot more than new price but they will invariably be perceived by most people to be linked to new prices, therefore GST is considered.

I'm not sure that having a load of extras on a 6yo boat should value the boat that much greater than the basic. Now for my reasoning!! After 6 years the equipment will have depreciated to the extent that it will have been 'lifed' with a far greater degree of failure expected so why would a buyer pay a premium for old stuff? It would be a different story on a 2yo boat with the same extras, there would still be some value in those extras.

On high used boat prices, i disagree that prices are now reasonable because they are now less expensive than they were say 2 years ago. They were overpriced then and they are overpriced now. Neglecting inflation, if you had bought a BMT 10 years ago, you could probably get the same money from some mug as you originally paid for it if selling now....thats why they remain expensive.

[Apollo]

GST or not makes no difference because thats what the price was when new, so that was the cost. I think your logic is flawed.

Agree with death ship here. If you forked out $66k ($60k +gst) to buy it new, then the coin that came out of your pocket is $66k, so that is the price. This then becomes your base for determining what reduction in value you wear when selling it second hand.

With the reduction in new price due to discounting, you get the situation that you have observed, where the secondhand price is out of kilter with the new price. I agree that it makes the new boat extremely attractive when compared to a secondhand one, which is why the discounting has occurred.

[Vromme]

I agree in general used boats here are overpriced. In the US a boat issimilar to a car, drive it out of the showroom and lose well over 20%. Sincethe economy turned their, you can expect to lose more like 50%. For some reasonhere it seems people will only take 5%-15% off, particularly with premium orspecialised brands. Even before the economy really turned south in the US amate bought a boat which was 1 yr old, mint condition, loaded with extras,20hrs on motor for over 50% off new price (owner had all receipts etc).

My guess is that it can be attributed to the rising costs in building boats(labour component) over the years. Another friend bought a brand new Aus 5mspecialised boat back in 1990 for low $20s. I have seen the same yr boat/motorwell and truly used asking the same $ now. People believe that due to the pricerises, their boats hold their value. These price rises seem to have settled ifnot dropped (no doubt due to current economy) however the flow on effect on theused market hasnt caught up.

Another factor could possibly be the internet. Dealers used to seem to asksignificantly more second hand than buying from average joe back in the day ofthe 'trading post'. Now it seems average joe is asking more like what thedealers are (ie dealers dont seem to charge much more second hand). Especiallywhen you consider GST that the dealers have to put ontop. I could be wrong butit really seems that sometimes buying 2nd hand from a dealer is not much moreexpensive.

I dont think accessories should add the same value on top of a used boat.With cars/4wd's they seem to make them a little dearer (no where near theactual costs of the accessories new) but more likely just to make them easierto sell.

Really imho unless there is a reasonable discount, why would you buy secondhand. Even dealer 'demo' models seem cheaper than some of the asking prices.The second hand market needs a bit of a shakeup.

[mikeaus]

As a current buyer I consider options to be of no importance. A boat cover, cup holder and a 5 year old $499 fish finder from BCF is not something I an going to pay extra for.

As for serious options such as 20K worth of audio and sat nav. Well same thing, electrical is outdated very quickly, especially audio. Wireless streaming of mp3 from your iphone is much more appealing on a boat then carrying CDs these days. So sellers wanting 15K extra for 20K of outdated electrical that is worth nothing today is silly.

If its worth a fortune, whack it on Ebay and see how it s goes. Buyers just want a boat, having many options may make a sellers boat stand out from the other 50 on sale at best. In my opinion it does not mean you can off load all your outdate gear for a 15% discount as part of the deal.

I guess some mugs still buy it though, thats why people still sell it. Can't blame them for that I guess.

[Jarrah Jack]

At the end of the day the market will decide the price of used boats. I've been watching every Haines that comes up on ebay and Boatpoint for the last 6 months it seems and there are a lot of boats that just don't sell and seem stuck there. Others go in a flash.

Its up to the seller whether they want to off load quickly or not get a sale at all.

[Noelm]

I guess it all comes down to the fact, that if the price is right, it will sell, can't get much easier than that, doesn't matter what it is, houses, cars or boats, if the price represents good value, then it will be sold quick, if you are holding out for an extra few dollars, or value it far above reasonable market value, it may sit for months (or longer) and I still stand by my statement that new boats are cheaper now than they ever where, especially the "family" sorts of packages, I have seen brand new tinnies, cheaper than almost identical years old boats, why is this so?? maybe big companies like (say) Telwater are producing a reasonable quality boat at a fraction of the cost that was possible when individual companies owned the brands (maybe) Second hand is second hand, you are buying a ticket in a lottery, there is probably hundreds of great buys around, but also thousands of people unloading troublesome rubbish, with no warranty or recourse if it craps out in 3 months time, you pay your money, and you take your chances.

[Noelm]

Just to add to what Jarrah Jack has mentioned, looking for a specific brand/model/colour/motor second hand is a real headache, there seems to one for sale everyday, untill you want one, then there is none! or one will pop up on the other end of the country/state, and you deliberate on whether you take the punt and pay to go and have a look! in a way, we (on Ausfish) are somewhat a bit luckeir in this respect, there is usually always someone who can go and have a first look and see if it is at least worth further negotiations, don't know how mnay times I have travelled for hours to have a look at a complete piece of shit!

[deckie]

A second hand buyer should treat any 'extra's" such as electronics etc as worthless. Try selling any even slightly outdated piece of electrical equipment...all worthless. If he's calling u a dreamer or talking about what he added, then just say you're only interested in the boat, not in second hand worthless eletricals etc that you;re happy to purchase new. He can sell them himself if he thinks they're worth good money.
Some people ask silly prices and never sell till the reality comes home.
Just walk away.
Boats are ALWAYS a buyers market, never assume there are few about or you somehow need to rush to get this particular one.
Ignore listed prices...totally irrelevant.

[propdinger]

i just sold a boat in the 6.5mtr older haines style (weighed min 2.3tonne) and my biggest problem was everyone that was coming out looked at the boat then said would my flacon or hilux etc tow it(6 in 1 week). it got really annoying not one of them knew what they were coming to look at, when i buy a boat i do my research before having a sticky beak. i have been looking for a old v17 that needs work but they all go for far more than i want to pay so will just wait till one pops up at the right money. We all want to sell for the most we can get and buy for the least :)

edit: the guy who bought it is towing it with a hilux in sydney::) but least he knows its wrong :-?

[NAGG]

The price of second hand boats has always astounded me ...... it is certainly not like the second hand car market.
boats loose a little initially with only a slight annual decrease - I've seen it time and time again where 5 YO boats sell for maybe only 10-15% under what the current new price is .......... you think "tell them their dreamin!"
Realistically though ..... a lot has to do with fitout (after market) eg electronics where a $500 sounder is replaced with a $3500 Combo , wet wells are plumbed , a 24 Volt leccy is added + plus 2 decent batteries & on board charger - On a $35,000 stock boat - you have just added $7500 - So hey that $35,000 boat could still sell for $35,000 3 years later.
today you can pay more for a Seafarer V sea that is 25 Years old than what it cost new ( with a late model motor).
I know I sold my 9YO Quintrex Reef raider ...... which had done a lot of work for about 60% of what I paid for it (new) ------- and I had people clambering over themselves to buy it!

Yes it is amazing

Chris

[ozscott]

Mike it is what it is. You buy new or old whatever you want. It's not just the cost of the accessories it's the labour to put them in and for a lot of people buying new and then decking out is not worth the heartache to get someone who you hope will get it right and the hassle and the time. Cheers

[finga]

If people thought they were expensive they would not buy. Obviously people are thinking second hand boats are not dear. Simple as that.

As with cars, some brands and styles of boats hold their value better then others. Very common boats like 3.7m or smaller pressed tinnies lose their value quickly whereas boats built by the Haines family and kept well hold their value exceptionally well..

If you compare boat prices compare apples to apples. You can't really compare prices of the same boat in America to the same boat in Australia. For one...what taxes are paid on new boats, motors and accessories in America as compared to Australia? Second hand has to be cheaper if the cost of new products are also much, much cheaper.
If you want a cheap second hand big boat research the Japanese boat market. Better value then America....by far.

[mikeaus]

Mike it is what it is.

Very true Scott.

I guess I am mildly ranting at the buyers more than the sellers really. You can't blame a seller for putting top dollar on a product.

I just finished watching the Evolution Boats DVD and I had to smile at the end when this chap pops up banging on about resale. He says his mate sold his several year old EVO with over 300 hours on it for 4K less than he bought it.

Before I get shot down here, this is not a crack at Evo boats. These boats are absolutely magic.

Point being I guess there is one born every minute. If some people are silly enough to send 50 large to Africa, because some junkie pretending to be Yasaf Arafats widow asks them to. Then I guess I similar mined person would part with 50K to buy a boat thats had its day.

The buyer has the upper hand, I guess I will just keep looking. Dealers have budgets and jobs to maintain too. You never know when special will pop up, or a 3% finance offer like the cars. ;)

[ShaneC]

I personally believe the second hand market is so expensive because people pay too much when they buy new. I bought my 625 CC Explorer new in 08 for not much more than you have been quoted for a 575. It certainly wasn't a bare boat, 585 Furuno w/ 1kw tranny, 5008 Garmin, Reelax outriggers, premium stereo, deck wash pumps etc etc. I knew what I wanted, hit the ground running, had the cash in my hand and put the screws in hard. I did my sums when it was time to sell it, worked out what it owed me, priced it accordingly and it sold within a week. The boat was 18 months old with 600hrs on the donk and I factored that in to the asking price. The buyer was happy, I was happy, and had cash in my hand to go and put the screws in and buy a decent boat....

Same thing with cars, been contemplating a new Ranger/ BT50/Hilux and it still shocks me that people are asking more for a 2nd hand one than you can get one new with the same options by buying smart.

[TopBhoy]

If people thought they were expensive they would not buy. Obviously people are thinking second hand boats are not dear. Simple as that.


An opinion of course!! ::)

For the statement to be factually based, I think you need to provide some more details of the turnover of used boats selling (at or near the original advertised price) and not simply advertised and either sitting there or being removed from the market unsold several weeks later.

Having tracked several boats on ebay (simply to gauge prices), I find most rarely sell before the boat is re-advertised shortly after at the same price it failed to reach a bid or reserve on first time around. Unsurprisingly, it fails to sell second time around....lol

Its not factual but its my personal anecdotal evidence that the second hand boat market is overpriced :P

[Steeler]

Just buy what you think represents best value to you, new or used.Trying to work it out will only do your head in.

[BM]

An opinion of course!! ::)

For the statement to be factually based, I think you need to provide some more details of the turnover of used boats selling (at or near the original advertised price) and not simply advertised and either sitting there or being removed from the market unsold several weeks later.

Having tracked several boats on ebay (simply to gauge prices), I find most rarely sell before the boat is re-advertised shortly after at the same price it failed to reach a bid or reserve on first time around. Unsurprisingly, it fails to sell second time around....lol

Its not factual but its my personal anecdotal evidence that the second hand boat market is overpriced :P

I don't think that eBay is a 'real' source to rely on for proper boat prices. The likes of Boatpoint/boatsales and other retail type sites are more accurate indicators of real pricing. eBay often sees items go for fire sale or desperation type prices.

In my experience anything on eBay that's priced as it should be priced will not sell.

Cheers

[TopBhoy]

I don't think that eBay is a 'real' source to rely on for proper boat prices. The likes of Boatpoint/boatsales and other retail type sites are more accurate indicators of real pricing. eBay often sees items go for fire sale or desperation type prices.

In my experience anything on eBay that's priced as it should be priced will not sell.

Cheers

I don't think ebay can be dismissed, at least there is some transparency on the prices boats fetch. Agreed though it does seem to be the lower priced boats which tend to sell on there (and for good reason IMO). I'm not knocking Boatpoint/boatsales etc but ultimately if you go by them, as far as I can see, no sort of assessment can be made between the asking price and actual selling price.

[BM]

Yes, that aspect is true but irrespective of that eBay still gives a distorted/skewed perspective on pricing so having the transparency is in effect pointless if inaccurate?

[scuttlebutt]

As others have said, forget about the GST thing. If it was in the price new, then that was the new price.

I think there are a lot of dreamers out there who get stuck thinking about how much money they've poured into their pride and joy over the years and want some return. For these guys it's simple. Either ignore or make an offer.

When doing your sums make sure you're comparing similar rigs. Check the difference in price between a standard 2 stroke, an Etec/Opti and a 4 stroke. BMT packages are often quoted with minimum HP, and a lot of the Cruisecrafts seemed to end up with Yammy 2 strokes.

Also a lot of BMT packages don't include electronics. You might think used electronics are worthless but good quality stuff does retain some value. I recently bought a second-hand boat and while the electronics were superseded, I was happy not to have to shell out another 4k for a similar unit.

Once you know what you want and what you're prepared to pay, be ready. When a boat is priced well it sells quickly. That's probably why it seems the prices are unreasonable - you only see the ones that aren't selling!

[mikeaus]

A few fair points Scuttle. That said, If I was to ask what would you prefer. A few accessories that most used boats have, or a 7 year warranty on the boat and 5 year warranty on the engine for a similar price.

It would be an interesting poll to vote on.

[Chimo]

Hi mikeaus

What do want a warranty to cover?

If you buy a painted tinny and the paint bubbles, thats due to a lot issues such as dissimilar metal or electric current etc. If its scratched or it leaks around the front hatch etc that too is common. If welds let go and the tee top moves as a result they will probably re weld / fix it. Not sure about the other points tho.

If it a glass boat from the Aust builders that are still around there is probably not much to worry about on the glass side of things with Haines etc

If the electronics etc fail then it usually back to the electronics manufacturer anyhow.

If the trailer brakes don't work its probably your fault for drowning them in the sea. If you get them repaired then your warranty for non ss and true marine brakes is voided the first time they get immersed in sea water anyhow. True I can show you the paperwork provided by an honest brake mob!

So IMHO if your buying new because of warranty your probably spending extra for little return. Mind you maybe you do get peace of mind; at least until you test it. Its not all doom and gloom. A new boat I bought was supplied with a new trailer not fit for purpose. After the dealer tried to hours to adjust it he finally gave in and I got another new trailer, I just had to drive nearly 800kms to take the trailer to the trailer builder (Mackay) who were very helpful and craned the boat up and dropped it onto the correct trailer. No cost to me except 800kms and time?

On the other with hand second hand possible issues have been identified and maybe fixed you just need to be able to identify what the history has been. A second hand boat I later bought and still have needed a few minor broken bits replaced (that would not be covered by warranty); they were supplied at no cost by the boat builder.

So maybe its just a matter of going in to boating with your eyes open and buy what you want and expect some issues that probably wont be the end of the world particularly if you work on the basis that only you and I are perfect!


Cheers
Chimo

[mikeaus]

Hi mikeaus

What do want a warranty to cover?



Yea, you could be right Chimo.

I guess I would see the warranty as insurance against the motor failing. Or if the boat had a leak. But then whats the chances of that happening, really.

If I was unfortunate enough for this to happen to, I am sure the dealer would just patch it up anyway rather than replace.

It would interesting to hear anyone has ever had a new boat fail or an engine blow fresh out of the packet?

The thing that is swaying me to new is the fact that the used 2007/8 CC models have older engines that are pretty thirsty. I know its not big deal now, however in another few years when fuel prices go into orbit it could pose a problem.

[Chimo]

Mikeaus

Your older motors are more forgiving of the crap fuel being sold to us now and much cheaper to service and there are a lot less bits in them to fail too! Balance that against fuel cost.

Also if you are looking to protect yourself against a crook motor (and buying second hand) get your chosen marine tech to check the motor he's going to have to keep running if you buy the rig. Having trusted service people is at least as good protection (probably better) than a so called warranty.

So, pick your service guy before you buy your boat if you want to avoid stress. Its very similar to "happy wife, happy life".8-)

C
C

[TheSaint]

In my time of buying three boats I did find that people out there have overpriced price on there boats because of a few things..

The trailer is normally in poor/unroadworthly condition as well the boat is poor condition & in most case the whole package is 10 years old & they ask about $500 less than new boat/ trailer package.

They think any extras like electric motors, batteries, Sounder/gps add more value but in reality most times that gear old & ready to pack in at any moment..

They list the model wrong by saying it the top of the range but when you get there it base model with some add on's & overpriced for that model..

People that put a fair price on their boat move them quick & get genuine buyers so you need to be looking every day to get them. I just found my current boat on car hoon website & it was listed wrong, well unpriced & it was at least 3 hour drive southwest from gold coast.

[marto78]

Not all new boats have come down in price. The exact same boat in the 2011 basic BMT model from the same dealer is what mine cost all up 3years ago with the $5,000 worth of extras added on ($32k). How are you meant to gage a 2nd hand price when the new price has gone up that much?
6 months ago I would have settled for $22,000 but after looking at the price increase in the new boats I think it is fair to say that I could realisticly get $25k or maybe $26k if I held firm on my price.
Boat is an Aquamaster Abalone 5.1m CC.

Marto

[ozscott]

Chimo makes a very good point. NoT everyone wants a new tech motor. If you use the boat all the time then sure they are the bees but for people who use their boats less regularly they old and well set up 2 strokes (ie really well sorted and VERY reliable in all conditions and with questionable fuel) are still very worthwile (an for me the only way to go).

Cheers

[robothefisho]

New boat prices havent come down at all. If you look at the big reputable boats there prices have gone up. Most of them for sale want what they cost brand new 10 years ago. Its stupid. Boats are one of those weird things where you are far better off buying brand new then sell at the 10 year mark. They have a realistic life span of 20 years before they are stuffed. The first 10 years is when you want to own them for reliability. I have no idea why they hold value so much as 90% of boats arn't maintained anywhere near properly.