Catch and release of Bass During Closed Season.

[rayken1938]

This subject was recently raised on another forum with the statement it was ok.
I had previously sought a ruling from Deedi on this subject on 2009 and they stated it was not allowed.
As a result of this thread on the other forum I once again referred the matter to Deedi .
I have just been speaking to Tony Ham re this subject after emailing Deedi re this issue. He has also sent me a reply in writing that is is nor legal to target bass during closed even if it is only for catch and release purposes.He has given me permission to publish this email.
Here is his response.
Cheers
Ray
From:
"Ham, Tony" < Tony.Ham@deedi.qld.gov.au>
Add sender to Contacts
To:
rayke1938@yahoo.com.au

Ray,
I am replying to your enquiry regarding fishing for bass during the closed season.
The original definition that was sent from Anita Ramage is still correct regarding take and I have pasted it here…

This is the definition of “take” as stated in the Fisheries Act 1994

take fisheries resources includes—

(a) catch, gather, kill or obtain from water or land; and

(b) attempt to catch, gather, kill or obtain from water or land; and

(c) land (from a boat or in another way), bring ashore or tranship.

You will notice that attempting to catch fish is included in the definition of take and therefore my understanding is that if someone is attempting to take a species of fish during a closed season they would be in breech of the regulation.

There is no restriction on fishing for other species during any closed season, however incidental catches of bass (in this instance) must be immediately returned to the water, unharmed.

The closed season for bass does not apply in certain impoundments and bass from these waters may be taken and retained as per usual.

I hope this is of some assistance and should you have any further questions please don't hesitate to contact me.

Regards,
Tony Ham
Manager Recreational Fisheries, SIPS and Fishcare
Industry Development
Fisheries Queensland
a service of the Department of Employment, Economic Development and Innovation
Telephone: 07 3405 6805 Fax: 07 3224 2805
Mobile 0467785787
Email: Tony.Ham@deedi.qld.gov.au

[Si]

This subject was recently raised on another forum with the statement it was ok.
I had previously sought a ruling from Deedi on this subject on 2009 and they stated it was not allowed.
As a result of this thread on the other forum I once again referred the matter to Deedi .
I have just been speaking to Tony Ham re this subject after emailing Deedi re this issue. He has also sent me a reply in writing that is is nor legal to target bass during closed even if it is only for catch and release purposes.He has given me permission to publish this email.
Here is his response.
Cheers
Ray
From:
"Ham, Tony" < Tony.Ham@deedi.qld.gov.au>
Add sender to Contacts
To:
rayke1938@yahoo.com.au

Ray,
I am replying to your enquiry regarding fishing for bass during the closed season.
The original definition that was sent from Anita Ramage is still correct regarding take and I have pasted it here…

This is the definition of “take” as stated in the Fisheries Act 1994

take fisheries resources includes—

(a) catch, gather, kill or obtain from water or land; and

(b) attempt to catch, gather, kill or obtain from water or land; and

(c) land (from a boat or in another way), bring ashore or tranship.

You will notice that attempting to catch fish is included in the definition of take and therefore my understanding is that if someone is attempting to take a species of fish during a closed season they would be in breech of the regulation.

There is no restriction on fishing for other species during any closed season, however incidental catches of bass (in this instance) must be immediately returned to the water, unharmed.

The closed season for bass does not apply in certain impoundments and bass from these waters may be taken and retained as per usual.

I hope this is of some assistance and should you have any further questions please don't hesitate to contact me.

Regards,
Tony Ham
Manager Recreational Fisheries, SIPS and Fishcare
Industry Development
Fisheries Queensland
a service of the Department of Employment, Economic Development and Innovation
Telephone: 07 3405 6805 Fax: 07 3224 2805
Mobile 0467785787
Email: Tony.Ham@deedi.qld.gov.au

i have wondered about this. must admit it would be extemely hard to police. How would they distinguish between someone truly targeting say another species but catching bass accidently and someone who says they are targeting another species but are really targeting bass and any bass catches are said to be 'incidental'. And as all would have to be released anyway during the closed season they would have to Johnny on the spot to enforce such legislation.

[NAGG]

It's one of those difficult ones - by catch vs targeted ..... how would anyone be able to prosecute a fishoe , even if you video taped them catching bass one after another on topwater lures ( putting them back) - if they were targeting say Saratoga. What would make it harder is that bass move into brackish water where catches of bream would be common.

Chris

[rayken1938]

Here is an opinion given by the Manager of recreational fisheries.
Deedi Qld.
Take and attempt to take are one and the same in term of thw law......the intent is the issue..and of course intent is the issue to be proven....for most enforcement officers, if they found you with a bass in a bucket..then you are probably about to experience some difficulty I would suggest...On the other hand if you are casting a lure and a bass is landed as an incidental catch, you have an obligation to immediately release the fish...and I would suggest that you would not have any problems as a result.

In terms of attempt to take, given that the legislations intent is to protect spawning fish, I would suggest that if you were to hook two bass in a row in the same spot, then you have an obligation to either stop fishing, or move to somewhere else to avoid catching bass. or at least take some action to avoid catching them at least in that spot....The law generally applies as though a reasonable person with no knowledge was looking at the situation...I am of course acutely aware that not every fisher adheres to this type of moral code....that said..I would argue that if I observed someone in a river, continually catching bass and continuing with no change in their behaviour, I could possibly mount a case for targeting bass (or attempting to take)...I say possibly!! ..it all boils down to what convinces a magistrate http://www.sweetwaterfishing.com.au/Forum/Smileys/default/police.gif

The real question is ... How serious are you about complying with the law....it becomes an ethical question for rec fishers to address...and fishing ethics are the things that we do when we are unobserved by others!!.

The last paragraph re ethics is the most important thing as there will always be smart@rses who choose to try and interpret the laws to justify their own selfish practices.
I am NOT including Chris in this group but voicing an opinion.
I also find it a bit strange that out Northern brothers do not squeal about the closed barra season or our southern brothers re the closed trout ,cod and bass seasons.
Are we a selfish uncaring mob in SEQ
Cheers
Ray

[NAGG]

Here is an opinion given by the Manager of recreational fisheries.
Deedi Qld.
Take and attempt to take are one and the same in term of thw law......the intent is the issue..and of course intent is the issue to be proven....for most enforcement officers, if they found you with a bass in a bucket..then you are probably about to experience some difficulty I would suggest...On the other hand if you are casting a lure and a bass is landed as an incidental catch, you have an obligation to immediately release the fish...and I would suggest that you would not have any problems as a result.

In terms of attempt to take, given that the legislations intent is to protect spawning fish, I would suggest that if you were to hook two bass in a row in the same spot, then you have an obligation to either stop fishing, or move to somewhere else to avoid catching bass. or at least take some action to avoid catching them at least in that spot....The law generally applies as though a reasonable person with no knowledge was looking at the situation...I am of course acutely aware that not every fisher adheres to this type of moral code....that said..I would argue that if I observed someone in a river, continually catching bass and continuing with no change in their behaviour, I could possibly mount a case for targeting bass (or attempting to take)...I say possibly!! ..it all boils down to what convinces a magistrate http://www.sweetwaterfishing.com.au/Forum/Smileys/default/police.gif

The real question is ... How serious are you about complying with the law....it becomes an ethical question for rec fishers to address...and fishing ethics are the things that we do when we are unobserved by others!!.

The last paragraph re ethics is the most important thing as there will always be smart@rses who choose to try and interpret the laws to justify their own selfish practices.
I am NOT including Chris in this group but voicing an opinion.
I also find it a bit strange that out Northern brothers do not squeal about the closed barra season or our southern brothers re the closed trout ,cod and bass seasons.
Are we a selfish uncaring mob in SEQ
Cheers
Ray

Hi Ray

Several years back a monthly fishing publication would include information on targeting spawning bass on a well known NSW river ...... Eventually a hoo haa was raised as the legislation was vague in its wording - From memory it just stated that you were not allowed to keep any bass during the closed season ...... So people fished for them with the sole intention of C&R - After that the wording was changed .
Clearly it is still a subject that boils down to fishing ethics .... & I cant claim the moral high ground because I will fish an area with lures that give me just as much chance of catching a barra as it does a jack during the barra closed season ....... Its just that the barra get returned.
But back on the bass ...... some waterways below stocked dams during flooding loose barra & bass - bass , yellas , cod & toga etc - these waterways are now fish rich and offer some sensational fishing but the bass bycatch rate could be high - so what do you do ? fish or not fish them :-? Lures that would be great for a barra could be just as appealing to a large bass.
This is the dilema ....... only prosecute those that keep bass - because it would be hard to prove someone is targeting them if they have none in possession - or close sections of rivers to fishing during the spawn period. :'(
btw ...... my bass fishing is limited to the impoundments .

Chris

[Si]

legislation thats vaque - no never! keeps the lawyers well paid!!
Thanks for the legislation clarification Ray. good on you for making the effort to get clarification on poorly worded restrictions. I would have thought this information would have been made available when the closed season was introduced. Must have been an after thought but you got to wonder how it could be. Surely they look at every angle before implementing such a restriction.

Sorry to go off track, i do support a closed season on one species, but i must say it is a bit of a band aid approach thrown at those 'dirty fisher people'. as you guys know the real killer to Bass is loss of habitat through reduced environmental flows, bankside degradation, loss of riparian vegetation, physical barriers and urban and agricultural run-off. fishing is way down the list imo. fish need the habitat first and foremost to support this recruitment we are trying to protect in a closed season.

[blackjew]

Well this is great info ,im sure there will allways be some sneaky people that target Bass whenever they want ,I have often heard of people ,through other people ,oH i know this guy thats got 2 Big bass in his fridge ,bUT THE SEASONS CLOSED hes got his own patch of river ,Oh thats ok then i answer sarcasticly.its wrong but with anything that is law theres always someone that dodges it.
It beats the heck out of me how when the season is closed ,we the recos well most of us respect that and cant wait foe the season to open,researching new methods .and cant wait to get back to the excitment of fishing our local upper reaches of our amazing river systems.
It was only 2 weeks ago when a friend of mine told me of a guy that spent 4 days emptying his nets ,that were full of Bass ,how can this pathetic government allow this sought of slaughter,
I was nearly in tears when he told me that alot of them were so fat obviosly ready to drop .He then went on to tell me this happens every year.What with this slaughter happening in the wee hours its a wonder we can catch anything.
Cheers Rob

[Shawn 66]

Well this is great info ,im sure there will allways be some sneaky people that target Bass whenever they want ,I have often heard of people ,through other people ,oH i know this guy thats got 2 Big bass in his fridge ,bUT THE SEASONS CLOSED hes got his own patch of river ,Oh thats ok then i answer sarcasticly.its wrong but with anything that is law theres always someone that dodges it.
It beats the heck out of me how when the season is closed ,we the recos well most of us respect that and cant wait foe the season to open,researching new methods .and cant wait to get back to the excitment of fishing our local upper reaches of our amazing river systems.
It was only 2 weeks ago when a friend of mine told me of a guy that spent 4 days emptying his nets ,that were full of Bass ,how can this pathetic government allow this sought of slaughter,
I was nearly in tears when he told me that alot of them were so fat obviosly ready to drop .He then went on to tell me this happens every year.What with this slaughter happening in the wee hours its a wonder we can catch anything.
Cheers Rob
Rob ,
Not having a go at your mate , however could he have not reported this occurance to fisheries.
Shawn

[blackjew]

Yep no probs Shawn , thats what i said to him,he didnt seemed to fussed as he fishes outwide.Prety crap attitude he has imo.

Cheers Rob

[Horse]

Another factor to be considered is the fact that many species of fish when caught and released around spawning time will not spawn that season.

[NAGG]

Another factor to be considered is the fact that many species of fish when caught and released around spawning time will not spawn that season.

Yes - they say that about bass and cod ........

Chris

[Apollo]

For me it is about the intent of the rule. If it is to allow a fish to spawn a produce lots of new fish, then I respect what it trying to be achieved. This means I don't target or fish country where they are likely to be taken (even as by catch).. I don't care if the fishing for them is easy, great or challenging. Don't care if they are there because of a flood or some other act. For me, there are plenty of other fish to target in other areas that aren't affected, so I change to them which is good for variety.

Re bass, I generally don't fish the fresh during winter. If I do, it is an impoundment dam.

Steve