Viper Boats, No contact [Archive] - Ausfish fishing Australia, Australian Angling Forums

SUPERFORM

10-08-2010, 02:15 PM

Hi all,
I am a fairly new member on here however I have been reading the chat boards for about 12 months.

Basically I have run into a bit of a problem regarding a new boat I am having built. About 12 months ago I was referred to Viper Boats by another member of Ausfish as they were building his boat. I arranged to meet Phil and have a chat regarding construction of a new boat.

To cut a long story short I have run into some significant difficulties trying to maintain contact with Phil from Viper Boats. So far the boat is 95% complete and was looking pretty damn good, but for the life of me I cannot get Phil to get in touch with me.

His phone and email is in the process of being changed to a different supplier (or so I am told), I have sent a letter via registered mail with no reply and even rung business's in the same street in Nambucca Heads and asked them to get him to contact me and I have sent him a pm..... Still NO BLOODY CONTACT from Viper Boats.

If anybody is friends with Phil or have had contact with him in the last 14 days please ask him to contact Ben regarding reaching an agreement to finalise and pay for completion of my boat.

Thanks for any help
BEN

Noelm

10-08-2010, 03:15 PM

hhm lets hope it is all just a simple case of crossed wires hey.

frankgrimes

10-08-2010, 03:17 PM

Hey Ben,

You can try shooting nickstock on ausfish a PM - I recall he had a few issues getting into contact with Viper Boats(But I believe he eventually got onto them).

Worth a shot anyway, and hope you get a good outcome.

Mick

SUPERFORM

10-08-2010, 03:32 PM

Thanks Mick
funny you should say that as Nick is who reccomended Viper to me.....

Nick experienced what I am going through now......

SUPERFORM

10-08-2010, 04:14 PM

Also does anyone live in or close to Nambucca Heads and if so would they be interested to pass on info for me????

TB91

10-08-2010, 07:35 PM

Hi Superform
I am sure I saw something regarding Viper Boats on the local news lately.It had the local council embracing the business.It might pay to ring the Nambucca Council to find a contact for the business if they will give it out.
cheers
mark

Greg P

10-08-2010, 08:03 PM

Ben - sucks mate, hopefully just a glitch. Viper have a facebook page with contact details etc. There has been recent posts on the wall by a Glenn Bishop saying they have had dramas with Telstra.

http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=50742475816#!/group.php?gid=50742475816&v=wall

nickstock

10-08-2010, 08:12 PM

Viper Boats in my opinion should NOT be allowed to continue trading.

I was told nothing but lies for over 12 months and on handover, I was given a half arsed, half finished, boat that I spent a lot of cash to get it up to scratch. I then cracked the hard top on my first trip out to sea and had to limp home with my tail between my legs with my anchor ropes holding my hard top together.

The boat was then freighted back 2100kms to Viper's Gold Coast shed to be repaired with an agreed build time of 2 weeks. 9 weeks later I had not heard from Phil and his shed phone was disconnected.

Alarm bells were well and truly ringing so I flew down from Cooktown on two connecting flights to see W.T.F was going on with the boat that I had paid for in full over 6 months ago. On arrival to the Gold Coast I found out that his landlord had locked him out of his shed as he was months behind on the rent. I then found out that he had towed my boat to NSW without my knowledge and I was absolutely wild.

After seeking legal advice I found out how little pull I actually had on the situation and decided to take alternative methods to get my boat back. Phil came to the party and personally towed my boat back from N.S.W that afternoon and although the marine radio aerial was snapped and very little work had been done I at least had my boat back in my possession.

I then outlaid more money to get the boat finished properly and after a 14 month saga, I finally had a good riding, handling and finished plate boat which I decided to sell on principal of not supporting Viper Boats after the dicked me around for over 12 months after we signed a quote stating 6 weeks from deposit to handover.

I then took the boat to a boat yard on the Gold Coast to sell it on my behalf, however it sat unmoved for a further 9 weeks. I pulled the boat out and towed to to a place on the Sunshine Coast and they sold it after about 2 weeks in their possession.

Viper Boats do not have the finances to safely and securely build plate alloy boats to an appropriate standard and I cannot believe that they are allowed to continued to run (or try to) a business.

I am all for giving a little custom builder a turn in the game however my honesty and trust with Viper Alloy Boats left me bent over the barrel with my hands tied behind my back..................

gleeeza

10-08-2010, 10:17 PM

Thanks Mick
funny you should say that as Nick is who reccomended Viper to me.....

Nick experienced what I am going through now......

Way to go nick!!

I am guessing you went through all your drama after you sold the dump to The Super.

I know how it feels when you are trying to convince yourself that the boaty you signed on with is the right choice, you tell every one about the win you've had because you wanna believe it yourself. Mine is a Fisher and I am well happy with it but when and before I signed on I was warned about builders who shouldnt be, you just cant help wondering until the 11th hour.

If I get my last few shits and bits of warranty sorted without any drama then I am counting myself very lucky indeed. It can all go so very wrong very quickly.

Thanks for the heads up on Viper, I have heard a few mates mentioning them and if they don't already know I will see that they do. I was 12 months behind when I found out about Fisher Boats and the great mystery. Picked them from this forum as well.

Gleeeza

Damned67

10-08-2010, 11:10 PM

nickstock

11-08-2010, 08:21 AM

Way to go nick!!

I am guessing you went through all your drama after you sold the dump to The Super.

Gleeeza

Gleeeza,

I tried my hardest to talk Ben (Superform) out of signing any sort of deal with Viper Boats long before he had outlaid a single cent with this poor excuse of a company.

When I put Ben onto Viper, I was happy with the price that they quoted me, after I drove over 2000 kms to pick up my finished Viper and found out that I had a hull tacked together, alarm bells began to ring after I relised Phil is full of shit.

I personally spoke to Phil on the Friday were he assured me he would have my boat finished by the Monday. I was stoked and left Cooktown in my car to pick up my FINISHED BMT package. On arrival to his Gold Coast shed, I assumed that someone must be water testing my hull as there were no boats that within a month of being finished.

I warned Ben NOT to put a deposit on any product of Vipers yet Phil smoothed him over and smiled whilst he took his deposit.

I will NEVER EVER recommend Viper Alloy Boats to anyone as there is a very high chance that you will not get the boat that you paid for.

Ben is in the same situation as I was as Phil does not have enough money to pay for the materials , trailer and motor to finish the boat. Both Ben and I had to pay Phil 100% of the B.M.T for him to afford to get the materials & goods to finish the build.

I also forgot to mention that my hull would not plane when I picked up the boat as it had 185 liters of water under the "sealed" floor.
The boat was painted the wrong colour and not prepared properly and as such needed to be repainted.
The transom pod had a hole in it which allowed water into the hull
The fuel sensor was not installed correctly
The fuel tank and filler was set up incorrectly and took over 20 minutes to fill.
The motor needed to be lifted up a hole and be re propped in order for it to plane
The canopy cracked with a massive 3 hours on the motor to which Phil replied "you are fishing in adverse conditions"
I then found out that Phil had NEVER EVER had this hull in the water F.F.S!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Like I stated, my Viper was an absolute piece of crap in every way and it cost me thousands to get it up to a sea worthy , decent handling vessel.

SUPERFORM

11-08-2010, 09:38 AM

Contrary to Nick's final product, I am so far very happy with the quality of my build, however I havn't had it in the water as yet. But from what I can see so far all looks good.

My major problem is the lack of communication I am experiencing and the major delays in completion. As said my boat is 95% complete and is having the finishing touchs put on it by a marine dealer in Brisbane, who are doing a great job by the way......

But I have paid 95% of the total price to Phil and the Brisbane dealer will not release the boat to me until the work they have done on it has been paid for (fair enough).

As I cant get in contact with Phil and neither can they, it looks as though I am going to have to outlay the extra $4 000 ontop of the quoted price to get my boat out of the Brisbane dealers yard and then chase Phil to repay the money to me.

A bit unfair in my opinion, as I have been very understanding and patient throughout this whole process........

Noelm

11-08-2010, 10:06 AM

even though you want your boat ASAP, I kind of doubt I would be paying the other guy and then try to get the cash from the builder, if you did that I reckon you could kiss your 4 grand good bye, well for a very long time anyway.

SUPERFORM

11-08-2010, 10:30 AM

Yeah I agree Noel, but its now 10 months since I paid my deposit and I am not interested in waiting any longer, hence this thread....I am paying interest on a boat I dont have.........

Phil personally has had some issues and Viper also has had some unfortunate incidents, however business is business and its about time this build was completed.

I have gone out of my way to help Viper and even arranged a meeting and drove the 5hrs to Nambucca to have a chat with Phil to come up with a cheaper solution for him, only for Phil to do a no show.

Like I said I have tried everything except facebook as I dont have a facebook account, if anyone is friends with Viper on facebook, could they send them a message and ask Phil to contact me and arrange payment to the Brisbane dealer for completion......

Salad Fingers

11-08-2010, 10:45 AM

Sounds like you have been more than patient with this circumstance, i know i woudnt have been.

Dept. of Fair Trading (or whatever equivilent might exist in QLD) might be interested in this?

Noelm

11-08-2010, 10:52 AM

kind of think anyone who needs to be contacted through Facebook needs to either get a life, get out of the business he is in, or, sort out his affairs to save what may be left of his business.

SUPERFORM

11-08-2010, 10:54 AM

Salad fingers.

Not a bad idea, but I would prefer him to do the right thing and contact me and then make the required payment to finish the job on his own accord........

Obviously if all else fails, which it appears to be. Fair trading or the Queensland Civil and Administrative Tribunal will need to get involved.......

SUPERFORM

11-08-2010, 11:03 AM

Damn sorry to head about everyone's dramas with Viper.
They built my 4.2, and I love it. I'm very happy with it. It took a little longer than originally stated (probably 9-10 weeks, as opposed to 6, but I can live with that for a custom built boat). But he truly went out of his way to get it finished for a long weekend for me. I was there in the last hours of him getting it finished, and he was sick as a dog, and working solo on a public holiday.
I hope they get their act back together, because if I was ever going to upgrade, they would have been my first choice by far.

I remeber seeing your boat get started and finished while mine sat there with little to no work done on it. I am at 10 months, would be stoked with 9-10 weeks build time......

Nice little boat though, definately looked the goods and by the sound of it is the goods.

This is whats so frustrating, they build good boats but this situation and others like it is unacceptable....

boatie_72

11-08-2010, 11:28 AM

I know phil quite well, he was a employee of ours for a number of years.

Try this number, this is the guy working with him. On their facebook site it says to call him.

Quote:

Glenn Bishop (http://www.facebook.com/djbisho) After an ongoing battle with telstra Viper has decided to change telcos. In the interum please call bisho on 0418 868 580

Hope that works out for you.

SUPERFORM

11-08-2010, 11:37 AM

thanks

But I have texted Glen and left 2 voice messages, although that was about a week ago.....

Mr__Bean

11-08-2010, 01:37 PM

Geez you are a lot calmer than I would be in a similar circumstance.

I would be chasing him down and in his face until the plan forward was agreed.

- Darren

Smithy

11-08-2010, 01:47 PM

Well Nick I guess it is good you can finally tell the truth about your boat now it is sold. Russell filled me in early on and I could see you biting your tongue each time you posted something on Vipers on here. Anyway onwards and upwards after this little episode.

SUPERFORM

11-08-2010, 02:21 PM

Geez you are a lot calmer than I would be in a similar circumstance.

I would be chasing him down and in his face until the plan forward was agreed.

- Darren

His last contact was a text message from a computer on the 29-7, a short convo via sms was had and a guarantee given that he would make contact again on the 1-8. Surprise surprise no bloody contact and no bloody payment to the Brisbane dealer.......

What makes this even worse is Im trying to do Phil a favour, the quote from the Brisbane dealer to finsh the fit out was actually 7k. I am/was actually prepared to cut him a deal and leave out some inclusions from the original quote and get the final cost down to 4k to make it a bit easier on him.

Like I said all he has to do is call me and agree to this option and then make the payment for the cheaper amount.....done deal and it saves him 3k......

Going by the amount of views this thread has had, hes gonna find things pretty tough for a while, at least until he improves his communication skills......

surveyor

11-08-2010, 09:43 PM

i feel for you superform,got similar issues on a far smaller scale fortunately ,i have bent over backwards to get my work completed but am at the point where enough is enough while i applaud your trying to help out ,it sounds like your guy could easily sort this out with you but atg the end of the day why should this guy whos made no effort and sounds like a serial offender make an extra four grand out of you. its unfortunate but it seems nice guys finish last .
anyway i hope it works out and you get to the point where you can show of the pics of your pride and joy :-?

BayHunter01

11-08-2010, 09:52 PM

Is it just me or does this mob sound like another Sea Storm boats??

SUPERFORM

12-08-2010, 01:54 PM

Just spoke to the Brisbane dealer and he informed me that Phil actually made the drive up from Nambucca to bring some parts for the boat. This is a good thing as he also confirmed verbally that he can make the payment. However still very poor form as he totally ignored me and made no effort to make contact.

I still doubt wether payment will be made by next weekend so I can pick it up. So I guess I better make the visit to the bank for the remaining funds.

PinHead

12-08-2010, 02:14 PM

Maybe there should be some LD clauses in boat building contracts

SUPERFORM

12-08-2010, 02:29 PM

LD????? Long delay???

mull dog

12-08-2010, 02:51 PM

get yourself a .333 locked and loaded and then see how quickly he moves on your boat;D

PinHead

12-08-2010, 03:04 PM

LD????? Long delay???

Liquidiated damages..same as in the building game..most contracts have a LD clause..ifyou are late there is a clause stating how much per day the penalty is.
Get that on a boat building contract and see how they perform.

We have worked on a job where the LD's were 1 mill per day if you were late..we weren't..LOL

SUPERFORM

12-08-2010, 03:18 PM

Liquidiated damages..same as in the building game..most contracts have a LD clause..ifyou are late there is a clause stating how much per day the penalty is.
Get that on a boat building contract and see how they perform.

We have worked on a job where the LD's were 1 mill per day if you were late..we weren't..LOL

I did that already, when the move to Nambucca took place I was starting to get impatient, so I drew up an agreement that the boat would be fully completed by May 15th, every day after that $15 was deducted from the amount oweing, I now owe him about $400.

This is my major problem at the moment, I only owe $400 but theres 7k still left to do on the boat if its to be done to the agreed standard.

Mind you I got the boat for a steal, which is why I am prepared to cut him some slack and leave out some inclusions so he doesnt burn a hole in his back pocket.....

cormorant

12-08-2010, 03:47 PM

I still doubt wether payment will be made by next weekend so I can pick it up. So I guess I better make the visit to the bank for the remaining funds.

Last thing on earth I'd be doing. Dealer and boatbuilder need to sort this debarcle out.

Edit- Hope it works out for you and good on ya for telling everyone. Hopefully stories like this will help others not get stung by boatbuilders not doing the right thing.

Dantren

12-08-2010, 04:18 PM

SUPERFORM

12-08-2010, 04:36 PM

Is this guy's word worth anything ???????

Exactly,
Far too many broken promises and lies, thats why I'm going to the bank, ive waited 10 months for this boat. Im pretty keen to get it on the water and dont want to be waiting any longer. Queensland Civil Administrative Tribunal paper work has been filled out, so basically I will pay for it and chase him for the amount oweing to finish the boat.

At least I will have my boat and still for a bloody good price......

Dantren

12-08-2010, 05:12 PM

I hope everything works out for you Super....

Rodpal

12-08-2010, 05:37 PM

it a shame but i hope all works out for you and your on the water wakin away your woos sooner then later man

cheers rod

STUIE63

12-08-2010, 07:52 PM

I hope there are a lot of people that read this thread in years to come because I don't want to be reading threads like this any more

geoffmck

15-08-2010, 07:25 AM

Superform, a nasty story and I feel for you mate. Hope it all gets sorted out in the end.

Above all else, I commend you on the respectful and dignified way you have told your story on this forum. You appear to have just stated the facts and gone way out of your way to try and get your boat in your posession whilst also being considerate of the position that the company has found itself in, at it's own fault by the look of it.

Good outcomes generally happen to people with your attitude and I am sure Karma will play a part.

All the best.

dogsbody

15-08-2010, 09:52 AM

Exactly,
Far too many broken promises and lies, thats why I'm going to the bank, ive waited 10 months for this boat. Im pretty keen to get it on the water and dont want to be waiting any longer. Queensland Civil Administrative Tribunal paper work has been filled out, so basically I will pay for it and chase him for the amount oweing to finish the boat.

At least I will have my boat and still for a bloody good price......

:o :o Just add this to the bloody good price.

Geez I hope I'm wrong as the sour taste of this is already very strong.

Dave

gawby

15-08-2010, 10:14 PM

Come on Phil what is wrong with you.
You know this post is on here bagging you from pillar to post.
I know you and thought better of you than this. At least give
the man a reply so as he knows what is going on.
If you already have i take this back if you have not then get you
f******* act together
Graeme

the gecko

16-08-2010, 09:11 AM

When will people realise that when you order a new boat, you are actually extending CREDIT to a guy that you know nothing about?

You are giving him a large chunk of money for your dream boat, and he is using your money to pay off his old bills, cos he hasnt run at a profit for some time. He thinks he can trade out of the problem, and he isnt gonna knock your business back. If only you could get a credit check done on him first, but you cant do that either.

liquidated damages and progress payments are only as good as the assetts behind the company, and that is gonna be just $2.

The real answer is to buy a near new boat, and only hand over money for a finished boat, so that means second hand.

Anyone who pays for a boat to be built is playing russian roulette.

Perhaps the industry should setup an insurance scheme, so unfinished boats got taken over by a builder who had the funds. Then the industry could publish a list of 'insured builders' who voluntarily adopt the scheme? Id pay more to be with an insured builder....sort like the Gold Card scheme for house builders.

cheers
Andrew

trueblue

16-08-2010, 09:26 AM

If I ever got a boat built, it would be on a cash for boat basis. If a boat builder cannot afford to outlay the materials and carry them for the duration of the construction, the business is crap and shouldn't be trading..........

on a very big boat then at the very most, I would only agree to a progress payment schedule based on milestones where at every stage of payment everything was secured in my name, and wrapped up very tightly in a contract (legal fees would be well worth the peace of mind)

all the rogue builders out there are screwing up the industry for the decent builders

Angla

16-08-2010, 09:35 AM

When I bought my brand new Cruise Craft from Tweed Marine, I laid down $500.00 and gave them the rest on delivery. Over $50,000. What is wrong with that being the norm. They were more than helpful and knew they could sell the boat out of the yard quite easily to the next guy. It could be different for a complete custom vessel. Maybe just a larger deposit but I would never go for progress payments because he may have multiple customers watching the same boat build.

Cheers
Chris

Cheers
Chris

Greg P

16-08-2010, 09:39 AM

Well I have had 3 boats built via progress payments and have never had an issue. Lots of people go down this track and get exactly what they want. It is a shame that one or two bad eggs tarnish an industry that is already struggling.

trueblue

16-08-2010, 09:46 AM

It is a shame that one or two bad eggs tarnish an industry that is already struggling.

precisely............

Cootac

17-08-2010, 09:07 AM

Guys, I am a small boat builder from Victoria. We build just about each boat to each customers requests.

We buy all the materials up front and just as I apply the colours in the mold I send the customer digital photos every day of the build process, so the customer can see exactly what is happening to his boat each day. So far we have over a hundred happy customers, and each customer has become a good friend. We only build 12 boats a year, and yes we do take deposit after we have started the boat. Why? Just put yourselves in my shoes, imagine if I get stuck with an odd colour that no body else likes. We are all different, so far I have had a really good run and had all good customers, and if there is a problem they are the first ones to know. Communication with your customer is very important, in this age of technology and forums like this, it can really make your business or it can go the other way as well. I hope that the boat builder will get in touch with you soon and it will all work out the best for the both of you. Regards Mark

Jarrah Jack

17-08-2010, 10:31 AM

[quote=Cootacraft;1197433]Guys, I am a small boat builder from Victoria. We build just about each boat to each customers requests.

We buy all the materials up front and just as I apply the colours in the mold I send the customer digital photos every day of the build process, so the customer can see exactly what is happening to his boat each day. So far we have over a hundred happy customers, and each customer has become a good friend. We only build 12 boats a year, and yes we do take deposit after we have started the boat. Why? Just put yourselves in my shoes, imagine if I get stuck with an odd colour that no body else likes. We are all different, so far I have had a really good run and had all good customers, and if there is a problem they are the first ones to know. Communication with your customer is very important, in this age of technology and forums like this, it can really make your business or it can go the other way as well. I hope that the boat builder will get in touch with you soon and it will all work out the best for the both of you. Regards Mark[/quote

Must be a hard place to live work and party in, Mallacoota..

The business model you describe is I think the best for a small boat building business. You don't have to be the cheapest or take on more than you can chew.