Boat sinks off Gladstone, three men rescued.

[rumy1]

It in the local paper this morning, three men where 8 miles off Facing Island when their transom and motor hit something, there was a loud noise and then the boat started sinking. They set off their epirb at abut 8pm and spent 4 hours in the water. A local boat called Bagged Out was approx 10km's away, the rescue helicopter called it for assistance. Bagged Out arrived and got the men on board.
The crew had all the safety gear, notified VMR and told their family when and where they were going. The size of the boat was not mentioned but I know the weather was pretty good at that stage.

In that time they had floated 5 km's as they clung to a esky with their life jackets on. They said they were trying not to think of sharks ...... how could you not !!!
All men are safe and well.

Well done to Bagged Out crew, rescue helicopter and VMR .... also well done to the guys who were rescued as they did everything right by the sounds of it.

Hope this doesn't put a black mark against the Hook Up competition ........

[Fed]

It's good they're all safe but 4 hours in the water, WHY?

[marvin]

I may be able to shed some light on this one, I'm the rescue paramedic that was on the chopper who spotted the guys & epirb in the water and communicated with baggedout and vmr to coordinate their rescue down on the water. Beacon detected at at approx 2020hrs by ausar, rescue helicopter in bundy notified and airborne at 2040hrs, survivors located by chopper at 2128hrs, direct flight in line to initial satelite gps mark from bundy showed they had drifted nearly 5 kms from initial detection site, we picked up the epirb signal on the chopper homer at turkey beach area and flew directly to the guys from some 25 miles away still, we are unable to winch at night or drop life rafts into the darkness, so assistance from bagged out was undertaken, bagged out was directed to location by helicopter crew and onscene at survivors at 2155hrs. Total time from initial beacon detection to onboard bagged out was approx 1hr 35 minutes, flight time from bundy to scene was 48 minutes, then 27minutes to direct rescue vessel to guys in the ocean. that is one of the best rescue times we have done in my 12yrs on the chopper. The time of 4hours in the water, may have been to the alledged inability of the guys not being able to activate their epirb correctly. This Was stated to me by the vmr controller who had spoken with the 3 guys, that it took over an hours for them to work out how to activate it instead of putting it in test mode. Luckiest guys around, I've been to many many with worse outcomes than this one, some one was watching over them, and that was not only us in the chopper above them either! cheers Kev.

[FNQCairns]

It's good they're all safe but 4 hours in the water, WHY?


I have a sneaking suspicion that this is more or less the norm even if everything goes perfectly they will still make sure every I is dotted before launching the chopper just incase they waste some money, have voiced this here before.

Even the new system has not inspired me in the past as the authorities let it down.

As a result I believe the commercial system to be a safer bet for any individual...you will be able to get family to ring up the authorities with their exact destination, with that logged they would be forced to launch the chopper even hours early as the timeline (cat) would be out of the bag and all of a sudden in the interest of potentially saving their own necks.

[the gecko]

I may be able to shed some light on this one, I'm the rescue paramedic that was on the chopper who spotted the guys & epirb in the water and communicated with baggedout and vmr to coordinate their rescue down on the water. Beacon detected at at approx 2020hrs by ausar, rescue helicopter in bundy notified and airborne at 2040hrs, survivors located by chopper at 2128hrs, direct flight in line to initial satelite gps mark from bundy showed they had drifted nearly 5 kms from initial detection site, we picked up the epirb signal on the chopper homer at turkey beach area and flew directly to the guys from some 25 miles away still, we are unable to winch at night or drop life rafts into the darkness, so assistance from bagged out was undertaken, bagged out was directed to location by helicopter crew and onscene at survivors at 2155hrs. Total time from initial beacon detection to onboard bagged out was approx 1hr 35 minutes, flight time from bundy to scene was 48 minutes, then 27minutes to direct rescue vessel to guys in the ocean. that is one of the best rescue times we have done in my 12yrs on the chopper. The time of 4hours in the water, may have been to the alledged inability of the guys not being able to activate their epirb correctly. This Was stated to me by the vmr controller who had spoken with the 3 guys, that it took over an hours for them to work out how to activate it instead of putting it in test mode. Luckiest guys around, I've been to many many with worse outcomes than this one, some one was watching over them, and that was not only us in the chopper above them either! cheers Kev.

Thats fantastic feedback Kev. Ive always wondered how the systems worked and how long things take, since I fish in Hervey Bay. I had a chat with HB Water Police, who assured me that if I ever setoff an epirb at night, that bundy chopper would be over me pretty quickly. Thanks for all your dedicated work, we fishos rely on you guys.

Water cops did tell me the first thing epirb monitor man will do, is ring you guys, then second, he will ring my wife and say 'the alarm went off, is he really out fishing, or are there kids playing in the boat?' Nice to see they rule out false alarms quickly too, so guys, make sure your registration of epribs is up to date if you move house.

I know the chopper pilot on the gold coast, and he also confirms he has a response time of 20 mins to be airborne. I helped him move house to be closer to work.

great stuff, and awesome response time. If Im ever drifting clinging to an esky, its reassuring to know roughly how long the response time is.

Why no winching at night? Dont you have a spotlight?

Andrew

[marvin]

Andrew, We have an autopilot computer and night sun spot light onboard which help keep the chopper at a constant altitude and shows some reference to the surface below us, but no emergency service helicopters in our our area are permitted under the Civil aviation safety authority (casa) laws to winch or deploy objects such as rafts at night. Water surface level can be misconcived at night time, and most times the spot light will give a white out effect due to sea mist aswell. If it was daylight, or they were stuck in the bush on land at night, we would have had the guys out of the water/location and in the chopper with in the hour, we have lowest safe minimum altitude flight heights as well to abide by and these have been put in place following the helicopter crashes up north and around Australia to keep the rescuers safe too. We were lucky we had our twin engine BK117 machine that night, as it is due for a service this Wednesday and will be replaced by the companies smaller single engine helicopter that is not permitted to fly at night, :-( if the incident occured next week, the next closest suitable helciopter would have came from Maroochydore or Brisy, as the Rocky twin engine BK is not fully equiped for night work either. As I said, all the luck fell their way that night. The strobe light on their epirb was all we could see, and we could just make out the reflective tape on the epirb and life jackets using our big spotty, that was from 1500 feet above the water deck.
Would have been torture for the guys having us circling them for half an hour without being picked up on the winch, but rules are rules, and it would be a bad bad thing if the chopper flew into the ocean trying to do an unsafe and not authorised procedure, struth it was black out there that night too, no moon!
The average time to get conformation of a 406 eprib location now is much better than the older 121.5 epirbs, that are now illegal to have in your posession, and if you can afford the extra $150 to get the new 406 one that sends out its current GPS location, I would suggest to get that style too, we found these guys easily by monitoring the 121.5 dual output frequency that the new epirbs transmit out, and the original 406 transmitted location was picked up by the satelite and was within a couple of kms of the confirmed initial location. Brilliant pieces of gear the 406 epirb, you just need to know how to use them correctly, and give the instructions on how and when to turn them on to every person that steps foot onboard your boat, day or night. Don't turn off your epirb until you are told too by the rescuers either, as we will continually track you until we know your all 100% safe. Safe boating guys.

[Marlin_Mike]

It's good they're all safe but 4 hours in the water, WHY?


Theres more to Search and Rescue than meets the eye Fed.................. not so easy for people to understand how it all works.

Mike

[Apollo]

I may be able to shed some light on this one, I'm the rescue paramedic that was on the chopper who spotted the guys & epirb in the water and communicated with baggedout and vmr to coordinate their rescue down on the water. Beacon detected at at approx 2020hrs by ausar, rescue helicopter in bundy notified and airborne at 2040hrs, survivors located by chopper at 2128hrs, direct flight in line to initial satelite gps mark from bundy showed they had drifted nearly 5 kms from initial detection site, we picked up the epirb signal on the chopper homer at turkey beach area and flew directly to the guys from some 25 miles away still, we are unable to winch at night or drop life rafts into the darkness, so assistance from bagged out was undertaken, bagged out was directed to location by helicopter crew and onscene at survivors at 2155hrs. Total time from initial beacon detection to onboard bagged out was approx 1hr 35 minutes, flight time from bundy to scene was 48 minutes, then 27minutes to direct rescue vessel to guys in the ocean. that is one of the best rescue times we have done in my 12yrs on the chopper. The time of 4hours in the water, may have been to the alledged inability of the guys not being able to activate their epirb correctly. This Was stated to me by the vmr controller who had spoken with the 3 guys, that it took over an hours for them to work out how to activate it instead of putting it in test mode. Luckiest guys around, I've been to many many with worse outcomes than this one, some one was watching over them, and that was not only us in the chopper above them either! cheers Kev.

Thanks Kev. There are some good lessons in your feedback. Need to ensure everyone on board is 100% ok with how to operate the EPIRB. Years ago a guy I know went overboard in a Hobart race. He was 6+hrs before he found in a real needle in a haystack situation. If he had a personal GPS or a strobe on, he would have been out in an hour or two.

Steve

[SatNav]

"As a result I believe the commercial system to be a safer bet for any individual...'

1. Which "commercial" system would you be referring?

2. If it is what I beleive you might be indicating you are totally out of line with such a recommendation.

[Fed]

Total time from initial beacon detection to onboard bagged out was approx 1hr 35 minutes, flight time from bundy to scene was 48 minutes, then 27minutes to direct rescue vessel to guys in the ocean. that is one of the best rescue times we have done in my 12yrs on the chopper.
Thanks Marvin you've restored a bit of faith in me.
1 hr 35 mins is a lot better than 4 hrs.

[fishing111]

I get why they can't winch at night, but don't understand why a raft could not be dropped, otherwise don't really see the reason to go out there in the first instance? Or am I'm missing something obvious?
I can understand a pilot not taking on seas like the the Sydney to Hobart, but if the pilot and crew are in conditions that they can handle, then shouldn't it be up to the pilot and crew to make the call? Don't take what i'm saying out of context, as there is no way i support a member of any rescue organisation putting there life in danger,but if able and within abilities, then why not help.I'd hate to be in the water with sharks and the like to see a helicopter do nothing more than being a locator.

[Fish_gutz]

not being able to operate an epirb might be something that needs some after thought. it`s all good having plenty of safety gear but if you don`t know how to use it it`s a bit like an ashtray on a motorbike....... useless.
Has anyone tried to put on one of those cheap yellow with the blue trim PFD`s while at home on solid ground....... give it a go then think how hard it would be to get one on under crap conditions. well done to the rescue folk to a job well done.
Andrew

[rumy1]

I spoke to the water police today (while they put the breatherlizer on my mate) and they said they were in the water for over an hour taking it in turn holding the toggle switch over in test mode on the epirb before they realised they had it wrong.
They also said that it was an 1989 model boat which probably had a rotten transom by looking at the damage and the way it come apart.

Still not sure how big the boat was but they were heading to Masthead according to the water police.

All was quoted by the water police today not me.

[Flex]

Does anyone know what they hit? is it still out there floating?

[Rodpal]

marvin, not only are you guys unsung hero's and pillars of the community but you guys are legends mate. that is just unbelievable feedback man

many thanks rod

[Angla]

I checked the epirb yesterday when I added the new registration label. All is tickety boo and I hope I never need it. If I do though then I will have some ideas of the timeline it will take.

Many thanks Marvin

Cheers
Chris

[Mister]

That would have to be a cardinal sin, having safety equipment and not knowing how to use it!

[MyEscape]

Reading this has been a very interesting read. Particularly having someone that was actually on board the chopper, not a mate who knew a mate who knows someone etc.

Yes not knowing how to activiate the epirb is certainly a sin. When I had my cruisecraft I used to make sure everyone knew how to operate the epirb, plus also I once made sure that my wife practiced how to put on a life jacket.

Then, as was said earlier, how difficult would it be trying to get one on in the water.

There's a lot to be said on wearing one at all times.

Steve

[marvin]

I get why they can't winch at night, but don't understand why a raft could not be dropped, otherwise don't really see the reason to go out there in the first instance? Or am I'm missing something obvious?
I can understand a pilot not taking on seas like the the Sydney to Hobart, but if the pilot and crew are in conditions that they can handle, then shouldn't it be up to the pilot and crew to make the call? Don't take what i'm saying out of context, as there is no way i support a member of any rescue organisation putting there life in danger,but if able and within abilities, then why not help.I'd hate to be in the water with sharks and the like to see a helicopter do nothing more than being a locator.

Hi Paul251, Thanks everyone for your positive feedback and kind thanks.
There is only one chopper in Qld - Rescue 500 that I am aware of that can deploy any objects from the machine at night, because it has a special auto hover type radar/autopilot that allows the machine when over land or water to hold level and almost stationary for the drop to be accurate and effective without having any object sucked back up into the baldes or hitting the tail rotor.
If it was day time we can see the water surface and then all calls are up to the crew and pilot, night time unfortunately is a whole different ball game, as the minimum speed we need to maintain is 50 kts to keep the auto pilot function enabled which is linked to the altidtude indicators (that are not as snazzy as the one in rescue 500). So the other night we were flying around and around the guys, at 1500 feet, at 120kms per hr, whilst directing the rescue boat to the guys in the water.
If we were not there with the epirb homer onboard the chopper then I feel they would not have been found just by the boats, relying on the satelite rough location signal picked up every 10 minutes at the best. Bagged Out was about 400 mts from them and drove straight past them without seeing them and travelled about a km before I managed to directed them back around and straight to the flashing epirb strobe that they could not see from water height in their boat. I wished I could have thrown the raft out, but with risk of damaging our machine, and travelling at 120kms at that height, could not only hit the guys and kill them, but may land hundreds of meters away from them and then they would have the issues of trying to get to it against the current maybe, knowing how to inflate it, how to get in it, ect. Unfortunately we don't live in the perfect world, and if we had night vision googles like some EMS services do in Australia, then maybe we could have done more for these guys earlier.
I do know though that having a helicopter flying around you would be much better than drifting aimlessly in the ocean praying for one, at least one pray may have been answered for these guys, and that was being located in the big dark wet ocean, the shark prays were obviously also answered. I have jsut writen an article on life jackets and baoting safety in the local Bundaberg Newsmail last Friday, so if you wish to have a look on the net, I have outlined a few of the additional safety things that I have put in place on my boats from my experiences in the rescue world and from my 20 yrs of offshore boating. Thanks again all for your kind wishes. Kev.

[BARRA73]

The owner and driver of the boat is a shunter at callemondah train depot where I work. Hopefully when he gets back I can get the straight from the horses mouth version of how the boat went down. He's pretty experienced with boats and is a regular on the offshore scene. Incidents like this just show the value of an epirb and the value of our search and rescue people. As an ex cop I have been involved in a few of these and results like this don't come any better especially as I know he has 2 very little kids. Cheers

[marvin]

I believe the boat may have been a 1989 cox craft 6 mt, but not confirmed. Got the 6 mt coxcraft info from AUSAR in canberra on the night from the registration details on the epirb Hex code transmitted to the satelites. I believe the boat has now been recovered and the skipper made a public thanks to all at the hook up. I've Just started days off at 1700hrs, and am having a beer for the 3 guys and their families. Cheers fellas, glad your still here.

[fishing111]

Thanks for the reply Marvin, cleared up my concerns and show's how little i know about what you guys do, and how you go about things. Great read and i know lot's of us on here appreciate the time taken to inform.

Cheers

[marvin]

Here is my article from when a couple of public members sms the local paper about 3 pics of my kids not wearing life jackets on a recent dead calm at anchor fishing trip in our 21 ft boat. Has some of the additional safety things I have developed as mentioned in above posts to save you trying to search for the article. cheers Kev.

How do I start this weeks’ article off? Do I thank a couple of anonymous members of the public for their SMS texts to the News mail last week expressing their concern and interest in other people’s lives? Or do I decide that these two can make all the judgement they like about how I care for and protect my children when on board my 20 and a half foot or 6.2 meter half cabin boat, whilst at anchor having an enjoyable day on the water as a family, because I know I do everything possible to keep my children safe every time we venture out in the boats together.
For those interested in boating safety including regulations for young anglers, I thought it would be timely to outline the current Queensland legislation regarding children under 12 years and the compulsory wearing of life jackets. I have also outlined some additional safety procedures that I have adopted on my vessels and I hope that other boaties may find this article of use and hopefully improve the safety of all persons onboard your marine craft.
It is compulsory for children from 12 months up to but not including 12 years of age to wear a life jacket when in an open vessel, (that does not have a permanent rigid deckhouse, cabin or other enclosed space suitable for a person to occupy), that is under 4.8 meters, while it is under way (a boat not at anchor, made fast to the shore or ground). It is also compulsory for all persons to wear a PFD type 1 when crossing designated coastal bars in open boats less than 4.8 meters.
I adhere to and often go beyond the safety legislation requirements in many regards when I am boating. Not only for my own family, but also, for any other person that steps foot aboard a vessel that I am the skipper of.
Before we leave the harbour, I give all persons onboard a safety brief on when and how to activate the EPIRB, how to use the flares, how to use the emergency radio channels and the compass bearing to head home on should I be rendered incapable of driving the boat or operating the navigation equipment. I have a laminated safety brief chart that I show newcomers to my vessel, and just like the airlines, I give a safety brief to all my passengers.
I have onboard my boat 6 adult vest type PFD’s of various sizes and every person onboard the boat wears a jacket, day or night, when my vessel travels above trolling speed of 8 knots.
The kids have the appropriate PFD type 1’s and they use them for estuary, impoundment and offshore trips. Most days they leave their jackets on at all times, especially if I have any concern about the river or sea conditions.
They also wear them (even though not required by law) in our bigger vessel every time the boat is moving and whilst fishing when the seas are anything but glassy calm. (As was the case on the day the pictures were taken that were published on the 28th May brag board). The kids know about may day may day may day and how to activate the 406 Epirb and use the marine radio.
I log on with VMR each time I am on the open water, and write the GPS marks of our fishing destinations either on the fridge at home or I ring a family member that is not coming with us to let them know where we are going and when we expect to return home. We have installed an extension offshore aerial on the boat for the mobile phone as a backup form of communication should the VHF radio fail.
We carry extra water and food supplies over and above what we plan to consume just in case something goes wrong and our time on the water is extended. Extra fuel is always taken, and I have performed several vessel recoveries and searches for missing persons whilst out at sea in my boat.
The kids have all taken swimming classes since their first few months after birth, and have all gone through life jacket training and sea survival techniques in local pools (my kids are 10, 7 and 4 yrs old). Most adults may not even know what it is like to be in a life jacket in the water, my family all do.
We have snap-light cyalume lumo night safety sticks on each life jacket and a floating waterproof torch on the safety grab bag kit, 2 sea marker dye kits, whistles, a mouth activated fog/distress horn, the required day and night flares, a fire extinguisher, V sheet, signal mirror and of course a well equipped first aid kit. We also have a hand held waterproof GPS unit with portable batteries as a safety backup should the main GPS unit fail and we get a mechanical breakdown or a main power failure occurs. A fixed bilge pump is fitted in each boat and a spare one is carried in the offshore boat.
I am always open to more ideas, advice, suggestions and new methods of improving safety to offer a safer environment for my family and friends that come aboard my vessel.
As one of the anonymous members of the public alluded to in their SMS, our profession is about saving lives, and I certainly have done enough sea searches, attended many marine incidents and performed countless life saving procedures over the last 21 years in the job as a Paramedic to be given the credit deserved when it comes to matters of preventing accidents, saving and preserving human life of all ages both on and off the water.
So in closing this week’s article, I thank you for your concern for the safety of children onboard vessels, and your concern on kids not wearing life jackets when offshore. Please be reassured that I have not and never will at anytime put my children’s lives at risk by not providing a safe environment and the appropriate safety equipment for them when they need it.
Please feel free to call me on 0408 848 564 if I can assist any persons with regard to kids and adult safety at sea. Hopefully the information within this column has clarified the Queensland legislation on life jackets for kids less than 12 years of age for everyone. More information on this topic is available on the net at www.msq.qld.gov.au (http://www.msq.qld.gov.au/) which is the Marine Safety Queensland site.
I hope that other skippers and crew members reading this article can take onboard some of the additional safety procedures I have adopted into our recreational family boating practices that have been gained from my 20 years of offshore boating. Safe Boating to all.

[sleepygreg]

What a great read Marvin. Hats off to you guys for the job you do.

It is great to hear from 'the horses mouth' what goes on in these sort of SAR operations. I for one am extremely interested in the resources available to our rescue agencies, also the limitations of those resources, and what resources are in existence but NOT available to them for various reasons (financial, political, legislative, etc).

Many people place expectations on our SAR crews that are based on the exploits they see on TV shows....this is NOT the real world. In the ideal world we would have a 'rescue 500' chopper on call 24/7 in every major rescue area around our coastline...is this ever going to happen? NO.....not because we dont want it to...but becasue of hard cold financial reality..we dont have the population and economy as a ratio of our land area to ever make this happen. Instead we rely on the dedication of our volounteer organisations, the generosity of the public and local busineses, the odd grant from the government, and help from fellow boaties and fishermen when a situation arises.

What expectations does everyone have of our rescue services, if they get into a 'situation'. Are those expectations based on reality/knowledge of resources, or some romantic notion of what they saw on a tv show?

Once again Thanks Marvin for firstly your efforts in your role, and secondly for bringing to us the realities of what you are able to do in your role.

I am thinking of putting uup a thread to explore this a lot further....if any one would be interested in a thread of that ilk let me know and i will post it.

Cheers
Greg

[hakuna]

Thanks Marvin, you blokes do an incredible job,

Many do not know how important it is for your crew, especially kids know what to do, let be elaborate:

My son was 12 at the time, was never allowed to go to sea until he swam the cans in Surf lifesaving. He had achieved that and I was over the next few years going to sea of Evans head day and night teaching him the use of the radio, crossing the bar in all conditions, even had to make him a stool to see over the screen.

One night we were out off the patch when I dragged over a big cod, threw him in the box. Some 40 mins later I stuck my hand in the box to get a softdrink and the spine of the cod went into my hand. within 10 mins could not feel my hand, somthing felt real wrong.
Up anchor, very hard to breath lying on floor, told my son to do what I had taught him, radio coatguard told them the situation and brought the boat back through the bar / white water no problems, as he was taught.

Think how many crew you have had that could get your boat home?

cheers

[Bear001]

Thanks Marvin for taking the time to give us all an insight into what procedures are followed and your own personal 'learnings'.

Very informative and certainly gets you thinking of your own boat/captain responsibilies/capabilities etc.

We are bringing our reasonably small (14ft) tinny's to Gladstone later in the year and although we dont anticipate heading very far offshore, (in the right conditions of course) we are in the process of arranging to hire a 406 EPIRB and a handheld Icom VHF radio - but upon reading this, I think we might upgrade to the EPIRB with the extra gps reading capability....

thanks again for the wonderful job all search and rescue people do.

Cindy

[yowie3]

Marvin is spot on with his advice. It takes approximatley 7 seconds once you turn on your EPIRB until a computer screen flashes in Canberra that records an EPIRB activation. They then contact the numbers that are registered to the EPIRB to identify if this is a genuine distress call.

Once a genuine distress is confirmed then Search & Rescue Assets will be launched via water police within the area of the EPIRB activation or via AusSAR in Canberra. The responsibility and co ordination of this SAR event then lies with the Water Police within the area and can involve Coast Guard, VMR and rescue helicopters as well as police vessels and commercial/recreational ships within the area..

I am absolutely astounded at FnqCairns comments in relation to costs and delayed response of rescue personnel. Once the Distress is confirmed as genuine and if this can't be confirmed, then it is deemed to be genuine. There is no different system for recreational or commercial vessels. If you are a person in distress then it makes no difference what your occupation is. Rest assured Qld & Australia have one of the best SAR systems in the world.

Register your 406mhz EPIRB and if you can afford it purchase the one that sends a lat & long with the distress signal and make sure you test it every time you go out and know how to activate it in the dark. Try it and see. The best piece of kit to save you is a functioning EPIRB.

Cheers

[SatNav]

"There is no different system for recreational or commercial vessels."

1. Fnqcairns I don't believe was distinguishing between recreational or commercial vessels but between "commercial subscription" type systems that are inferior in many ways to Cospas/Sarsat in the marine environment.

"Register your 406mhz EPIRB"

2. Yes in any case it is illegal not to register it.

"and know how to activate it in the dark."

3. More directly knowing how to activate it period, day or night. This lack of understanding in this case obviously was a primary case of extending the alert time. This was completely of the users own making.

[yowie3]

I will not pretend to know everything, however i have been in the commercial marine industry for a number of years now and would love to here more about this 'commercial subscription' you speak of?? my commercial EPIRB is registered in exactly the same fashion as my recreational EPIRB. And it is monitored by the same organization with the same response assets. Can you elaborate on this anymore?? am i missing something?