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sooty_mad
26-11-2009, 12:36 PM
Does a small boat (under 5 metres) require a stern light as well as an anchor light?
My old boat (4.2m) has an anchor light only and has been checked out by the water police on several occasions without comment.
I have been told recently however that all boats under 7 metres must have both an anchor light as well as an independant stern light.
I had a look at the Qld Government Maritime Safety web site and the wording is somewhat confusing.
Any comments would be appreciated.
Kind regards... David

Noelm
26-11-2009, 01:46 PM
the stern light (visible 360 degrees) is used as an anchor light with no other nav lights on (when anchored of course) some boats do have a proper stern light that is visible in an arc from behind, as well as the anchor light, but for smaller boats, the stern/anchor light is combined.

sooty_mad
26-11-2009, 03:06 PM
Thanks Noel. That's what I always thought.
David

crab man
26-11-2009, 03:25 PM
Yep and make sure it is ATLEAST 1M higher then you running lights (red and green ) So many boat shops sell those little ones and there not leagle my mate just got stung with that one
Cheers Craig

maccaril
26-11-2009, 04:17 PM
Yep, anchore light must be highest point of the boat, ie if you have a centre console, it must be higher than that, hence most are mounted on the centre console. If you have a bimini, then anchor light must be higher than that also
Rob

Whiplash
26-11-2009, 05:12 PM
If you have a bimini, then anchor light must be higher than that also
Is this right ????

two up
26-11-2009, 05:27 PM
Yep, anchor light must be able to be seen from any direction, thats why yachts have them at the top of the mast.

BaitThrower
26-11-2009, 06:18 PM
Now I guess the question is... was your mate stung at night or during the day? I believe the rules are that you must have lights at night, but these are not required on boats used during daylight hours....

So if you have an anchor light that is not 1m higher than whatever, can you get busted for having that light on board during daylight hours, or can they only bust you at night if you have that??

TheRealAndy
26-11-2009, 07:12 PM
The boat in question (or any power boat under 12m) is required to have an all round white light and port/starboard running lights. No stern light is required by law, however you can still choose to fit on in addition to the all round white light.

You cannot substitute the all round white light with a stern light.

Under anchor, only display the all round white light.

bassfan
26-11-2009, 08:35 PM
The requirement (Rule 20 Collision Regulations) is for a stern light as well as a masthead light which combined give an unobstructed 360 degree white light visible for a minimum distance of 2 nm. Smaller vessels may substitiute a single all round white light for the stern / masthead combination lights. As previously mentioned they must be a minimum 1 metre higher than your side (red & green) lights, and preferably it should be mounted behind or above the master so as not to affect his night vision.

And no you can't get busted for having incorrect lights on your boat if your not using it at night, as the offence is to operate at night time without displaying the required lights.

Axl
26-11-2009, 08:54 PM
This is very a interesting thread

The subject has been spoken about quite frequently over the last month or so.

I have just spent 20k on a new rig and after reading the threads lately I have requested that my white light be at least a meter tall ( I have also changed all my nav lights to LED at my expence).

I am sure that most shops would fit the cheapest avaliable to them which most people wouldnt blame them for they are in it to make money after all.

If the powers that be have a problem with this set up the shops that are selling/setting up these boats should know about it if I was to get done I would simply say this is how I brought it.

However after some of the stories lately this may not be enough so I may get one put on top of the C/C screen as well no doubt this would open up another can of worms.

Two white lights?

White Pointer
26-11-2009, 08:58 PM
G'day,

If the boat is registered compliant lighting is a condition of registration - so you can be busted any time for any non-compliance.

Regards,

White Pointer

oldboot
26-11-2009, 09:23 PM
Now...to clear up a few things we need to go and read the whole passage in the regs.

Consider this...the requirement that the all round white be at least 1 meter higher than the red and green is relatively recent.

If you read the detail a bit further on.....if the keel of the ship was laid before a certain date some of the requirements do not apply.....the regs at the time the keel was laid apply.
But certainly all new boats should be compilant.

This is possibly why the 1m rule isn't inforced heavily.

the one they do inforce is unobstructed and visable all round for 2Nm....I recon less than 50% of boats would be compliant with that one.

get hold of a coppy of the small ships manual its all in there...plain and simple.

But as we all know.....if you have a good read of rule 20.....then look arround....there are heaps of boats out there that are not compliant.

there are even a couple of brands of boat that have mounting plates on the front rails...that are not paralell to the centre line and therefore can not be used to mount the red and green in a compliant manner.

It's just typical of the whole boating thing.......there are a lot of people who think they know... and plainly have not read the rules......plain and simple.... or think they can do as they like.

cheers

cormorant
26-11-2009, 11:28 PM
different states are different as well. NSW doesn't have grandfathering of old boats that I knew of.

Mates in NSW have been told to return to the ramp as they did not have working nav lights in daytime ( one blown globe) . Reasons given were if they are there they must be operational and also they pulled the old - "what if a sea fog comes in" while you are on the water. Guess they can use the "what if dust storm happens " now as well They didn't appreciate the comments about the kayakers and rowers who are exempt or see the humour in "I'll blow this stupid little whistle" (sound making device) I am made to carry.

They have been getting pissy about not having a seperately switch for your anchor light ( all round white) so that at anchor your red green nav lights are off. Hell we leave ours on as we want people to slow down and realis we are there.

The other low act is if they don't think they are bright enough and start talking about them having to be seen 2 miles off - just ask them to turn down the background lights - some cheapos don't comply and some bulbs are just crap. LED replacement bulbs are a mixed bag from great to dim crap.

More and more shore lights and is getting very hard to see some boats

On bimini's do us all a favour and mount ot a foot higher as I have nearly nailed a bloke in a tinny sa it was healed over as both were fishing from one side and teh bimini was tilted with the hull so it obscured the all round white. Scared up but they needed a change of underwear

oldboot
27-11-2009, 12:03 PM
Again there are a number of things the majority of boaties are ignorant off.

You should be able to tell a great deal about a boat by observing the lights IF they are correctly displayed..unfortunately this whole concept seems to be ignored by recreational boaties.......You can bet your boots the pro boaties are examined on this at length.

you must be able to switch your running lights independently of your whites.

if you have only a white on...this means you are at anchor or aground......in short not expected to be moving much.

If you are displaying running lights (red & green) this says you are "under way" either making way ( under power) or drifting.......

by looking the lights as you approach or pass yu can tell how you are in relationship to that boat.....if the lights are displayed properly.

What sort of whites are displayed will tell you how big the boat is.

As for the 2nm....there are a lot of dull lights out there...so what if there is background lighting...that is no excuse for not displaying a proper display of lights.

while there is a "condecention" in the regs to allow us to display one all round white.....I can see good reasons to display the full display........boats with biminis is a good example.....that is why the two light display was set up to start with.....so the light system can cope with a superstructure.

cheers

Noelm
27-11-2009, 01:18 PM
you can have more than one white light (as mentioned by Axl) the law is you need correctly positioned and operating red and green, and a stern/all round , if you have (say) a deck light as well, then no problem, or cabin lights on, it is fine, plenty of people make the mistake (and it is a bad mistake) to leave their nav lights on when anchored, "just to be sure" do not do this, anchored is anchored, and all round is required, NOT red and green as well. The rules get quite complicated when you start getting into larger boats, and towing, trawling, fishing, dredging and a host of others as well, but just remember, anchored, white all round, that way that big trawler than is sneaking up on you knows exactly what you are up to, and can take action to avoid collision.

TheRealAndy
27-11-2009, 07:55 PM
Consider this...the requirement that the all round white be at least 1 meter higher than the red and green is relatively recent.

If you read the detail a bit further on.....if the keel of the ship was laid before a certain date some of the requirements do not apply.....the regs at the time the keel was laid apply.
But certainly all new boats should be compilant.


cheers

IF you call 1972 recent oldboot you are showing your age!!!

bassfan
29-11-2009, 08:32 PM
IF you call 1972 recent oldboot you are showing your age!!!

;D ;D ;D 8-) maybe the boat licencing requirement in NSW was different back then too, I dunno, I was just a kid at the time...!

oldboot
29-11-2009, 08:58 PM
IF you call 1972 recent oldboot you are showing your age!!!

A fair cop.....

I could not find a reference to the actual dates for different regulations.



....but considering the amount of time the law of the sea has been in place 1972 was a short time ago........;D...........truth be told very little will have changed since may grandfather went to sea......( to save time we'll take the 4 Yorkshiremen thing as done).

even back in the days when sail was king......ya still had to show an all round white light at anchor.
And the regs still provide for " non electric light".


And if you know any......project boat enthusiasts...it takes em that long to finish anything;D

cheers

Noelm
30-11-2009, 07:54 AM
I am not to sure about the references such as "in NSW" and so on, the lighting/navigation laws are world wide, there may be small differences in some safety equipment in certain areas, but lights/charts and navigation signs and bouys/beacons are world wide compliant.

Malcolm W
30-11-2009, 10:18 AM
you can have more than one white light (as mentioned by Axl) the law is you need correctly positioned and operating red and green, and a stern/all round , if you have (say) a deck light as well, then no problem, or cabin lights on, it is fine, plenty of people make the mistake (and it is a bad mistake) to leave their nav lights on when anchored, "just to be sure" do not do this, anchored is anchored, and all round is required, NOT red and green as well. The rules get quite complicated when you start getting into larger boats, and towing, trawling, fishing, dredging and a host of others as well, but just remember, anchored, white all round, that way that big trawler than is sneaking up on you knows exactly what you are up to, and can take action to avoid collision.

Yes its important to switch your red/green off at anchor and just have the all round white light on, then other boats know what you are doing.

When I did my coxwain I had to know all of the trawling, dredging, working boat lights as part of the verbal assessment and its hard to remember. One way to take the complication out for most people is simply, " if there is lots of lights" stay away or keep your distance.

iqarus
30-11-2009, 09:51 PM
Yes its important to switch your red/green off at anchor and just have the all round white light on, then other boats know what you are doing.

When I did my coxwain I had to know all of the trawling, dredging, working boat lights as part of the verbal assessment and its hard to remember. One way to take the complication out for most people is simply, " if there is lots of lights" stay away or keep your distance.

the "lots of lights stay away" bit is exactly what the instructor at my boat license theory section said. funny bugger he was.

good thing i saw this thread, i was going to wire up my anchor light tomorrow arvo. was going to plug it into the same switch as the nav lights.

if i wire it through the same switch as my deck lighting (both lights have their own individual switch as well as the main on the switch-gang. will that be fine ?