150 etec fuel figures please?

[Skusto]

he all just want some fuel figures for the 150 etec got a good deal on one yesturday so couldnt go past it, nornally a 4 stroke fan but 7 year full manufacture warrenty who can complain, was looking at the 130 but for 1k more decided on the 150 maybe a little bit to much for the barcrusher but least the engine wont have to work as hard.

p.s please no etec vs 4 stroke bashing.

[rodneyk]

hi skusto just bought a boat with one on 570 haines champion 150 etec it wasnt my chioce of motor but has 50 hours and 1 year old according to the fuel flow meter was using 24/to 27 ltr per hour @3800 revs seemed a touch high but re fueling found to have used about 38 ltr for 55klms so i was happy with that like i said im really a 4stroke fan but if this keeps going like that ill be happy

[Angla]

I think 1.0 nautical mile or 1.8 Kilometres per litre should be more like a good figure. Not bashing but my Optimax 135 gets around these figures at 4000 rpm. Better on a smooth day and worse on a lumpy day

Cheers
Chris

[Jabba_]

hi skusto just bought a boat with one on 570 haines champion 150 etec it wasnt my chioce of motor but has 50 hours and 1 year old according to the fuel flow meter was using 24/to 27 ltr per hour @3800 revs seemed a touch high but re fueling found to have used about 38 ltr for 55klms so i was happy with that like i said im really a 4stroke fan but if this keeps going like that ill be happy

You need to check your set up, as im getting better milage from my 250 E-tec... 3500rpm = 56kph using 32ltr/hour..

My guess is either your over propped.. You should be getting 5600rpm WOT (No less) or your motor is too low in the water...

If your motor is over propped, your labouring your engine and your going to use more fuel and oil..... You will also send your motor to an early grave...

[Jabba_]

he all just want some fuel figures for the 150 etec got a good deal on one yesturday so couldnt go past it, nornally a 4 stroke fan but 7 year full manufacture warrenty who can complain, was looking at the 130 but for 1k more decided on the 150 maybe a little bit to much for the barcrusher but least the engine wont have to work as hard.

p.s please no etec vs 4 stroke bashing.

You should be able to get around 1.8km/ltr, in smooth conditions...

A good prop for your rig if your doing mostly off-shore work is the Rebel... Pending on how your motor is rigged (high or low on the transom) you should be able to spin a 17" if your motor is rigged high,, or a 15" if rigged low..... It would be preferable too rig your motor high... The E-tec gear housing allows you to run high in the water and the Rebel has an awesome bite.... So no cavitation...

[Skusto]

You should be able to get around 1.8km/ltr, in smooth conditions...

A good prop for your rig if your doing mostly off-shore work is the Rebel... Pending on how your motor is rigged (high or low on the transom) you should be able to spin a 17" if your motor is rigged high,, or a 15" if rigged low..... It would be preferable too rig your motor high... The E-tec gear housing allows you to run high in the water and the Rebel has an awesome bite.... So no cavitation...


cheers mate for that, yeah the dealer said he will test a few props i will try and get the rebel then have heard they are a better prop for crusing.. will let him know as i would rather try and get the right prop straight up instead of mucking around with them later..

[Jabba_]

cheers mate for that, yeah the dealer said he will test a few props i will try and get the rebel then have heard they are a better prop for crusing.. will let him know as i would rather try and get the right prop straight up instead of mucking around with them later..
Yes there exellent for cruising and even better for off-shore boating... They can hold a plane at a slower speed, good for when conditions sour.....

I cant stress enough the fact that you need to prop your motor to the upper end off the optimum rev range.. That being 5500 - 5600, and you should be able to pull those rpms with a full load... If you get your rpms up to 5600, your going to a very responsive, reliable and economical motor.... And as I said earlier, a 15"-17" pitch will get you there pending on the height off your motor, 3rd hole down from the top is usually a winner (transom bolts)....
Ensure your dealer gets it right,,, as most don't....

[Skusto]

Yes there exellent for cruising and even better for off-shore boating... They can hold a plane at a slower speed, good for when conditions sour.....

I cant stress enough the fact that you need to prop your motor to the upper end off the optimum rev range.. That being 5500 - 5600, and you should be able to pull those rpms with a full load... If you get your rpms up to 5600, your going to a very responsive, reliable and economical motor.... And as I said earlier, a 15"-17" pitch will get you there pending on the height off your motor, 3rd hole down from the top is usually a winner (transom bolts)....
Ensure your dealer gets it right,,, as most don't....


yeah will be trying my best to get it done right first as it is getting fitted at noosa.. have been reading alot about getting it right so 5600 was what i was goin to be aiming for thanks mate.

as for the 3rd hole down the yamaha thats on it atm is on the 2nd, 3rd would be a little bit to higher wouldnt it?

[Jabba_]

Not really, that should be OK for the E-tec and Rebel combo.. I have my cav plate 40mm above the bottom off the V, and no cavitation... I am considering lifting up another hole to see if it improves performance and fuel economy again... My boat runs a 21deg dead rise, which is same or similar to your Barcrusher.....

[samson]

Mate i've got the 150 etec and the economy is 1.2km to the litre or sometimes a little better under load. But the oil is murder i've used nearly a 44 gallon drum in around 800hrs which is not good the local dealers say thats too much but when checking settings they seem right for the xd 100 which they can't explain and i've got two of the most experienced guy's on the coast as my mechanics.

As far as rpms i've had four etec's and the first got around 5500rpm tops on a old hull but since the boat and motor changes i can't get over 5300rpm no matter which prop i change to bar going to too smaller ones at the moment i run a viper which is as good as i've found getting around 5300rpm but the rebels i tried were rubbish only producing around 5000rpm and slipping a lot and i'm definately not running too low as i can't trim up as much as i would like or risk cavitation so have to deal with the ditching and diving in a following sea which get's sketchy at times but i think the the hull seems to dictate how the economy is rather than the prop as changing props does your head in.

And don't put any faith in the i command guages they are very in accurate which can get frustrating.

[Jabba_]

Mate i've got the 150 etec and the economy is 1.2km to the litre or sometimes a little better under load. But the oil is murder i've used nearly a 44 gallon drum in around 800hrs which is not good the local dealers say thats too much but when checking settings they seem right for the xd 100 which they can't explain and i've got two of the most experienced guy's on the coast as my mechanics.

As far as rpms i've had four etec's and the first got around 5500rpm tops on a old hull but since the boat and motor changes i can't get over 5300rpm no matter which prop i change to bar going to too smaller ones at the moment i run a viper which is as good as i've found getting around 5300rpm but the rebels i tried were rubbish only producing around 5000rpm and slipping a lot and i'm definately not running too low as i can't trim up as much as i would like or risk cavitation so have to deal with the ditching and diving in a following sea which get's sketchy at times but i think the the hull seems to dictate how the economy is rather than the prop as changing props does your head in.

And don't put any faith in the i command guages they are very in accurate which can get frustrating.
What sort off boat do you have Samsom, your figures are woefull.. As for oil, in 210hrs have used 50lt off XD100, and i'm running a 250hp and I am allways sticking the boot into it....

Whats the inside of your prop hub like?.. Is it clean or very sutty... If you have a dirty prop hub, you can be sure you have a fouled injector... That will cause your lack off rpm and high use off oil, and fuel...

When you fit up a Rebel, you need to drop 1-2" in pitch for it to spin the same rpm as a Viper or Raker.. Example, I dropped from a 21 Viper to 19" Rebel.. I hitting the exact same rpm and speed at WOT (5900rpm @ 57mph, light load), but with the Rebel, it holds on a lot better and I can plane slower with out dropping off the plane...

[samson]

Jabba i've got a tabs 5.5m teritory pro which is maxed out with a 150hp as for figures i'm actually getting better than outsider skip who had a 150 also with worse figures as for oil it sounds i'm using about the same as you seeing how a 44 gallon drum is 206 litres which is too thirsty for my liking as far as injectors their no different to how it was when i bought it new 6 months ago and i've had my fair share of injector probs before with the last engine doing 5 to be exact, i just think that the figures seem normal for these engines and if it wasn't for the fact that i get wholesale prices and upgrade every year i'd probably be inclined to try something different.

[ozbee]

have a15.5 x17 stainless going cheap if its the ideal and also a ally if you wish they were spares for mine but alas they don't fit a 300 Suzuki

[Skusto]

these are the figures from someone down south that has a etec on the back of there barcrusher same as ours.. so u would say that this prop would be to big the rebel that is jabba?

RPM VIPER 17"
SPEED
3000 wont stay on plane

3500 23 knots 22LTR/HR

3800 24 knots 25LTR/HR

4200 26 knots 31LTR/HR

4500 28 knots 33LTR/HR

5600 39.8 knots 60LTR/HR


REBEL 17"
SPEED
3000 18.50 knots 19LTR/HR

3500 23 knots 23.5LTR/HR

3800 27 knots 29LTR/HR



4200 31 knots 36LTR/HR

4500 33 knots 42LTR/HR



WOT 5300 rpm 40.5knots 59LTR/HR

[Skusto]

i am pretty sure he is running the 15.5" x 17" prop would the 15 x 21 be better or worse?

AVAILABLE SIZES: Rebel Prop Diameter x Pitch and Part Numbers:
RH P/N # 763984 (763658) - LH # 763659 15.75" x 15"
RH P/N # 763568 - LH (left hand) # 763569 15.5" x 17"
RH P/N # 763990 (763570) - LH # 763571 15.25" x 19"
RH P/N # 763994 (763572) - LH # 763995 (763573) 15" x 21"
RH P/N # 763998 (763574) - LH # 763575 14.75" x 23"
RH P/N # 764000 (763576) - LH # 764001 (763577) 14.5" x 25"

[Skusto]

sorry to wouldnt it be better say if u had one prop hitting 5300 but the other hittin say 5900 6000 to go for the one that revs to high? its not like we would be sitting flat chat all the time nor would i take it over 5600 any way would the be a really noticable fuel consumption?

[cormorant]

Hi mate

You motor doesn't have gears like a car so on boats it is a compromise like the old speedwell bike with one gear compared to a 10 speed.

Basically the compromise is that a outboard is tuned and designed from the factory to perform at a set load at a set rev range and anything not pretty close will give horrible ecconomy and cause other issues which will reduce teh life of your engine.

The manufacture sets a WOT ( wide open throttle) range and the motor needs a prop fitted so on your boat at a bit heavier than normal it woyld reach that rev range. They know that unless racing that most folk will have acceptable speed at mid range throttle and teh motor won't be lugging ( like going uphill in acar in 5th gear)


Especially with injected motors it is really important as the fuel and oil map in teh ECU ( computer onboard) maks changes to the mixture and oil raio hundreds of time a second.

If your motor has too larger prop on it and it doesn't reach full revs this is what happens

Computer asumes it has correct prop.
Assumes that at mid range throttle setting with correct prop it should be doing lets say 3700rpm.
Computer sees throttle setting and recognises that it is only getting 3200rpm. Assumes there is an issue so injects extra fuel and oil to try and get motor to accelerate to correct rev range for throttle setting.

Can't do it

More fuel more oil - that leads to carbon deposits, smoke , crap fuel consumption and bearing wear along with extra heat on all components. Lesser life or failure

The motor and it's computer doesn't know boat speed or prop effeciency and can't as there is no input but it can tell or assume how muh load is on th motor by the motors respons to throttle position sensor and revs and adjusts fuel to geet those numbers in line with preprogrammed map of RPM.

That's why you need to prop a injected 2 stroke properly or you will kill it , use fuel and burn oil.

Some hull and mtor combinations are hard to prop right but if you have found numbers from a sister boat and yours is not performing close to that I would be getting teh shop to be switching , computer and injectors , ignition, fuel deliver an dchecking setup till it is fixed. If they have a dyno it is easy to prove it is the motor not teh hull or set up. Something doesný smell right but they should be able to fix it.


In the old days with a straight 2 stroke you propped to max revs as the motors were ported and jetted to give reasonable ecconomy at midge range revs and if you overloaded them they dies due to carbon in ports and exhaust as they overloaded and not breathing properly.

[Skusto]

we havent got it yet and thanks for the post i know it cant be overpropped and thats why im trying to do it right as soon as i get it the figures on the other page are from someone else that has the same boat and motor the viper prop gets correct revs but cant plan at 3000rpm which is no good for us as we fish offshore in it .. but the rebel seams as it is to big as its only revving to 5300 so was wondering from the list on the other page which might be a better prop?

[Jabba_]

we havent got it yet and thanks for the post i know it cant be overpropped and thats why im trying to do it right as soon as i get it the figures on the other page are from someone else that has the same boat and motor the viper prop gets correct revs but cant plan at 3000rpm which is no good for us as we fish offshore in it .. but the rebel seams as it is to big as its only revving to 5300 so was wondering from the list on the other page which might be a better prop?

I know the boat where you got those figures (Joeydee from fishnet ), and I have been talking to Joe to help him lift his revs also...
It seams he has 2 problems,, firstly it appearshis motor is too low,, I advised him to lift his motor by at least 1 hole, then try 2 if it does not cavitate....

How ever if it does cavitate after lifting it 1 hole, he will have to reduce his pitch from a 17" Rebel to a 15" Rebel...
Then if he is still not hitting 5600, I told him to try the 15" Cyclone.... Same performance as the Rebel, but it has 4 blades and is a much smaller diameter so it will spin a bit easier then a Rebel..

So get your height right first, (40mm above the V) then test your props.. If your 17" rebel is getting close to 5600rpm and your not getting and cavitation, then lift the motor one more hole and re-test WOT.. That should get you on the mark...

If you do get slight Cavitation with the 17" Rebel with the motor set at 40mm above the V and not reaching 5600, then try the 15" Rebel..... That wiill also get you on the mark....

And yes the Viper is a crap prop for the Barcrusher, all thoe it's a very good prop on other boats..

[Skusto]

so your saying after getting the hieght right that the bigger diameter prop but 15" pitch would be better on to get higher revs? the 15.75 diameter prop by 15 inch pitch?

is diameter a big factor or is it mainly the pitch?

sorry for all the questions just want to try and get it right the first time thats all.

[Jabba_]

That's exactly what I am saying, The 15" pitch x 15.75" dia may be the choice prop your your boat.

Mainly the pitch is the dominating factor. Diameter plays a part also, but only when were talking big increeases in diameter...
The big Diameter off the Rebel is also why I like the Rebel so much... You get so much down low torque which is the reason these prop will hold a plan at slower speeds.

[kc]

I need to visit this bit of ausfish more often.

I have a e-tec 150 on a Trophy 1903. Heavey glass centre console. (1.7t).

Finding fuel usage best at 3900 revs doing about 28 mph with consumption 23 lts/hr. Up the revs and fuel usuage overtakes speed at about 4200 and 31 MPH so I get a good run at cruising speed.

My problem, and I'm on a second prop type is WOT is only 4950, touching 5000 if I trim right out. Oil usage has been 20 litres in 80 hours but a lot of my time is low rev trolling. Do have some soot deposits inside the prop.

The boat is due back to the dealer next Wednesday for some maintanance work on electrics but what should I ask the dealer to do about revs? Lift the motor? The latest prop has a little ding, courtesy of a poor low tide ramp so changing props again is not really an option. Prop is a smicko Solas and dealer tells me this is THE prop. First prop only got 4700.

A few of you guys seem to really know your stuff so looking for advice.

KC

[cormorant]

your dealer is full of it and shouldn't be setting up boats without water testing it and getting the motor at the correct height and with the correct prop.

The dealer should put a new correct prop on it for you!!! Not sure why he has gone sola sexcept to get a few extra buck in his pocket.

Your situation needs to be fixed or your motor will die prematurely.

Since the dealer has screwed up he should also do a full check of that motor to make sure it doesn't have carbon deposits, new plugs, donate you some oil, donate you some petrol. the motor after compression checks should then have some cans of engine tuner run through it and whatever else BRP says is necessary.

Get the ECU printouts and keep a record of compression at every service so you can identift=y a early possible failure. You have probably done very little damage but worth keeping an eye on it.

BRP and good dealers know all these issues and should be especially vigilant whne some people won't be bringing the motor back till 300hrs.

A prop ding can be repaired by prop works but that prop is probably unable to be fixed and tuned to give the revs you need.

During the run in period the motor will use extra oil

Good luck

PS I don't know your boat and motor combination well but is that quite small HP for that size and weight hull?? Being in the lower HP range for a hull is never the best option ( dealers know this) and you may never get the performance the hull was designed for and have a lesser selection of suitable props.


.

[Noelm]

under 5,000 RPM is way too low, check motor height (cost nothing) and then go for props (could cost lots)

[kc]

Should I touch base with BRP before I take the boat in and get some specific advice to then give to the dealer?

KC

[cormorant]

Yeah but softly softly is always best and speak to other dealers who sell your hull and ask what they have done with set up with your motor. Might save you several trys at gettig it right if someone has already done a sistership and got it right.

[Skusto]

That's exactly what I am saying, The 15" pitch x 15.75" dia may be the choice prop your your boat.

Mainly the pitch is the dominating factor. Diameter plays a part also, but only when were talking big increeases in diameter...
The big Diameter off the Rebel is also why I like the Rebel so much... You get so much down low torque which is the reason these prop will hold a plan at slower speeds.


thanks heaps for the info mate has been very valuable, have spoken to the dealer and said he will try and get as many props as possible even some 4 bladers but i think there solas props. but the prop that performs the best on the day will be the one that we will get..

[Jabba_]

I need to visit this bit of ausfish more often.

I have a e-tec 150 on a Trophy 1903. Heavey glass centre console. (1.7t).

Finding fuel usage best at 3900 revs doing about 28 mph with consumption 23 lts/hr. Up the revs and fuel usuage overtakes speed at about 4200 and 31 MPH so I get a good run at cruising speed.

My problem, and I'm on a second prop type is WOT is only 4950, touching 5000 if I trim right out. Oil usage has been 20 litres in 80 hours but a lot of my time is low rev trolling. Do have some soot deposits inside the prop.

The boat is due back to the dealer next Wednesday for some maintanance work on electrics but what should I ask the dealer to do about revs? Lift the motor? The latest prop has a little ding, courtesy of a poor low tide ramp so changing props again is not really an option. Prop is a smicko Solas and dealer tells me this is THE prop. First prop only got 4700.

A few of you guys seem to really know your stuff so looking for advice.

KC
I take it this is the boat you have http://www.avantemarine.com.au/new_boat_sales/index.php?boat_id=80

If so then I would imagine a 150hp must be the right motor for it....

However, you desperately need to raise your RPM's... Cormorant and Noelm have given you some great advise, and I advise you the same... Follow the advise that has been given in this thread, and do what ever it takes to get those revs up to 5600rpm, or your going to be a very unhappy E-tec owner with piss poor fuel economy and chewing oil like no tomorrow, then to rub salt into the wound your power head blows prematurely...

Regarding the soot inside your prop hub,,, there should be a slight amount off grey sutt,,, and I emphasize slight and grey.... If the sutt is black, you have a problem that needs the dealer to check out ASAP....
Can you post up a clear picture off the inside off your hub..

What sort off prop do you have on your rig? Brand, model and pitch.... Do you have your motor trimmed all the way out or to where it just starts to get prop slip at WOT???.

How high it your motor sitting on your transom??? It is very common for dealers to rig then too low on the transom... They do this so they don't get complaints about cavitation,,, because believe it or not, 85% off boat owners don't now how to trim there boat properly..
Most don't even trim there motors to suit condition and speed, they treat the trim as a set and forget item.... Thats totally wrong....

Try and answer those Question as accurately as possible,and we can steer you in the righ direction to get your motor running the way it's ment too...

[kc]

Thanks mate,

I come back to you and discuss this further when I have some answers. Really appreciate your help and can't believe, having spent over 40 years "messing around in boats" how little I actually know about them!!

I have had a couple of chats with the dealer today.....better informed...and will have the boat back in next Monday for repositioning and reproping if need be.

Will certainly be back on this post for an update and yes, this is the boat. Avante marine are the Australian distributor. Beautiful boats and I have been happy with the etec except the rev issue, which, up until today, I was going to live with.

KCsum

50769

[suzygs1000]

Sorry, I can't believe what woeful figures you guys are getting out of 150 etecs. I thought they were economical motors?

Dave.

[cormorant]

Woefull is correct and it isn't the motor ( probably 90% sure of that but still could be) but is it's installation and set up

The problem with strokes and injected strokes that they have torque from lower down and will often pull a bigger prop and unless people check the WOT revs they will think it is all OK. It is especially prominent in injected 2 strokes like etecs as they don't actually have a airflow meter in the induction so they just keep loading up more fuel into the cylinder trying to get the motor to rev out to the expected range set out in the fuel map for the TPS ( throttle position setting) .

Injected 4 strokes can have the same issues but some have oxygen senors in the exhaust.

Old carby 2 strokes didn't suffer the same fate as bad as they required airflow over the jets to get the fuel in so just wouldn't perform but instead would run lean ( lean oil and fuel) and hot - well we now where that ends up- hence why so many people were turned off 2 strokes at different times. A overloaded 2 stroke needed the extra oil but the oil injection systems assumed that motor was set up right for correct load at wot

As usual a hell of a lot of failures could be traced back to original setup and 90% of others to lack of maintainance and a very few to actual design or mechanical failure.

Overload any motor and it will use more fuel and shorten it's life be it bearings failing early , overheating , stress etc You just don't see the majority of damage until it failes

[Jabba_]

For the best result from your E-tec, set your motor to run at the high end off the optimum rev range.... Or a bit over....

Model Optimum rev Range
40 HP 5400-5600
50 HP 5600-5750
60 HP 5600-5750

75 HP 5000-5200
90 HP 5000-5200

115 HP (60°) 5500-5600

150 HP (60°) 5500-5600
175 HP (60°) 5500-5600
200 HP (60°) 5600-5850

200 H.O.(3.3 90°) 5500-5600
225 HP(3.3 90°) 5500-5600
225 H.O.(3.3 90°) 5500-5600
250 HP(3.3 90°) 5500-5600

250 H.O.(3.4 90°) 5500-5600
300 HP(3.4 90°) 5500-5600
2008 Evinrude® E-TEC® Models

[rodneyk]

Hi All checked my boat today haines 570/580 classic cav plate 20mm above plank
running 17 inch viper think from memory 5400 wot also have tabs when req150hp max rating for hull from my experiance with planked hulls thought it was to low in water engine has only done 50 hrs should ilift or run a 15 inch should pick up 200rpm with smaller prop ?????????what do you think can probably borrow some props

[Skusto]

if u havent read this its a must on knowing if your motor is to low very easy to understand.

http://www.veradoclub.com/smf/index.php?topic=137.0

[Getout]

Hey Fellas,
If my 175 Etec is running at 5250rpmWOT but I can trim it out for another 300rpm without a blowout, am I within the rev range?

[Jabba_]

Hey Fellas,
If my 175 Etec is running at 5250rpmWOT but I can trim it out for another 300rpm without a blowout, am I within the rev range?

Perfect 8-)

[Jabba_]

Hi All checked my boat today haines 570/580 classic cav plate 20mm above plank
running 17 inch viper think from memory 5400 wot also have tabs when req150hp max rating for hull from my experiance with planked hulls thought it was to low in water engine has only done 50 hrs should ilift or run a 15 inch should pick up 200rpm with smaller prop ?????????what do you think can probably borrow some props

It is cheaper to raise your motor then it is to buy another stainless steel prop.... Buy raise ing your motor another hole, your cav-plate should be 45mm above the bottom off your hull, which is ideal (most off the time)... So raise your motor first, then if that does not lift your rpm's then try the 15" Viper...

Certified BRP E-tec dealers have a prop exchange program... It cost your $25 to try a prop, and once you find te right prop, I think the $25 comes off the price of the new prop..

Note: there is every chance your motor can be raise up another 2 holes.. You just have to try and see if it works at those hieghts or not...

[kc]

Hi Jabba,

Been having a maintenance day today and noticed the motor is already on the top hole so no real option to raise it. May be a hull issue as I know these are usually matvhed with mercs in the USA.

Will get some pics of the motor at speed ion the water to see where the cav plates site and will see what prop options exit. I will touch base with the us Propgods site and see what they have to say.

KC

[Skusto]

Hi Jabba,

Been having a maintenance day today and noticed the motor is already on the top hole so no real option to raise it. May be a hull issue as I know these are usually matvhed with mercs in the USA.

Will get some pics of the motor at speed ion the water to see where the cav plates site and will see what prop options exit. I will touch base with the us Propgods site and see what they have to say.

KC

if the motor is on the top hole then it is most likely to be to low, if its in the top hole then that is the lowest position for your motor to sit. the more holes u go down the higher the motor will be lifted up.

[Jabba_]

Hi Jabba,

Been having a maintenance day today and noticed the motor is already on the top hole so no real option to raise it. May be a hull issue as I know these are usually matvhed with mercs in the USA.

Will get some pics of the motor at speed ion the water to see where the cav plates site and will see what prop options exit. I will touch base with the us Propgods site and see what they have to say.

KC
Pic's would be good, the more the better, otherwise were toying with assumptions...

Don't worrie if your on the top hole already, there is technology out there that can still correct your engine height if it needs lifting... I was in the same boat with my motor... It was as high as it could go so Ian Purden suggested he would make me up a off set transom plate.. Worked a treat and only cost $350 including lifting the motor....

Here is what it looks like....
It is a 30mm plate off powder coated Aluminium bolted too the transom.. 4 more hole are drilled so that the outboard can be fitted higher on the transom....
Ian use to do the same for the Gold Coast Police boats to get them motors running at the correct height..
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y159/jabba1/Transomoff-setplate003.jpg

[BM]

Yep, that method (minus the powdercoating) has been used by me for the last 5 yrs and by a good mate of mine for the past 25 yrs.

Makes any XL shaft engine (25 inch) fit a longshaft (20 inch) transom. Strong, stable and attractive.

cheers

[noboatyet]

Hi Guys,
Just thought I share my experinces. I have a 6m Edencraft running a small block 200 etec. With a normal load I can spin 5500rpm at 50% trim with no cavitation. I have a 17" Viper as you can see from the photos my cav plate is nearly 60mm above the hull. Heavily load I can only get 5350rpm so I will have a play with another prop at some stage.
The sort of threads are becoming fairly common, which P*&^es me off, to think that there are some really useless or F^&*ing lazy dealers that couldn't be bothered setting these boats up properly in the first place!!
Maybe BRP need to be made more aware of the ability of some of their dealers to fit up their product? Why should a customer who's just forked out a shit load of cash for their boat have to prop the thing? WTF!!!! Our local dealer has just had a couple of boats come in, the owners weren't happy with there performance. First was a Sailfish Cat with twin 90 etecs max revs were 4900 rpm, needless to say one motor is a bit sad. The second example was a Mustang 1950 with a 150ho max rpm 4800!!!!.
Sorry about the rant, I've had a couple, its just this sort of thing really shits me!!
Cheers
Muzz

[cormorant]

Hey Fellas,
If my 175 Etec is running at 5250rpmWOT but I can trim it out for another 300rpm without a blowout, am I within the rev range?

That same block is good for 5850. Rev limited much higher in the ECU

I always check the GPS when doing WOT tests as no point in trimming out to get the extra revs with no real extra speed ( ie huge prop slip just before prop blowout) for the sake of it isf it is just partially airating the prop. I like to see WOT revs set before that slip happens when you trinm too fat out especially as some props are so good at hanging on.

I know with older motors people like to do it by trimming out but all the modern motors have a rev limiter and are better balanced so are unlikely to handgrenade in a couple of seconds over WOT setting.

I also like them to get there on normal trim not extreme so with extra weight on board and full tanks the motor will still get to WOT so that means it shouldn't be overloaded especially after a bit of wear on the prop

I think you are slightly overpropped or if it was perfect when new then the edge is slightly off that prop

Happy to be corrected as it is just the way I do my setups.

[BM]

Does your Edencraft have a stepped pod? Most Edencraft (at least when EC was in Corowa NSW) were sold as hull only and fitted out from there by the owner, or those carrying out work for the owner.

Hence, no 2 of the same boats will be the same so propping will be impossible. AND, stepped pods make propping boats a bit of an issue also. Thats not an excuse to let people off the hook, just an explanation. If boats were water tested prior to delivery these issues would not arise, but I only see that happening in a perfect world.

The rule of thumb for a stepped pod is that for every 300mm aft, the engine gets raised an inch. This is only a guideline (bit like when Barbossa said "the pirates code is more of a guideline....." :)) and numerous factors affect it.

If you do not have a stepped pod then the info relating to stepped pods is not relevant. Propping should be a bit easier in such a case.

Unfortunately, no-one is experienced in the setup of every boat which makes setup a bit of a black art and a trial and error experience. What works with "x" motor with x gear ration and torque patterns may be a pig with "y" motor and y gear ratio.

cheers

[boney-leg]

For the best result from your E-tec, set your motor to run at the high end off the optimum rev range.... Or a bit over....



75 HP 5000-5200
90 HP 5000-5200




Just out of interest - why are the 75 & 90 a lot lower for recommended WOT??

[noboatyet]

[quote=BM;1067892]Does your Edencraft have a stepped pod? Most Edencraft (at least when EC was in Corowa NSW) were sold as hull only and fitted out from there by the owner, or those carrying out work for the owner.

BM,

Mines got the full depth pod, the motor was fitted by a BRP dealer in Brissy and water tested. It achieved 5850 when they tested, it its just the extra stuff I've put in thats weighed it down. Don't get me wrong I'm very happy with my setup. From what I've read , yes I understand propping a boat can be challenging. But some of the stories, show that some of the dealers aren't doing the right thing by their customers. Its obvious that they don't water test the boats pre-delivery or they don't give a stuff about the manufactures specifications!!
Cheers
Muzz

[cormorant]

Just out of interest - why are the 75 & 90 a lot lower for recommended WOT??

With the CC and computer maping that is as far as they have to rev to get that HP. with the same block and same revs and a different fuel map ( in the motors computer) it produces different HP.

If they reved more they would produde more HP see the 175HP as the example of this. Same block just more revs

It's a way of manufacturers using the electronics and same blocks to keep production costs down ( manufacture of fewer parts) but still fill every competitive sales spot for each HP in the marketplace. Used to do the same with old 2 strokes by using restrictor plates or different pistons or portying etc


Hi Noboatyet

Some dealers don't turn over enough boats and don't stock enough props so just slap one on - someone should slap those dealers and it is not as if they don't realise that people will load their boat up and props will loose their polished edge. Yes BRP should get off their bums and kick some heads and do some training.

With package hulls dealers should get it right and one offs should be water tested and the client given choices according to his circumstances.

Some dealers find it hard to get off the old honey trail of upselling props as now good motors come with stainless so teh dealers are losing margin.

[BM]

[quote=BM;1067892]Does your Edencraft have a stepped pod? Most Edencraft (at least when EC was in Corowa NSW) were sold as hull only and fitted out from there by the owner, or those carrying out work for the owner.

BM,

Mines got the full depth pod, the motor was fitted by a BRP dealer in Brissy and water tested. It achieved 5850 when they tested, it its just the extra stuff I've put in thats weighed it down. Don't get me wrong I'm very happy with my setup. From what I've read , yes I understand propping a boat can be challenging. But some of the stories, show that some of the dealers aren't doing the right thing by their customers. Its obvious that they don't water test the boats pre-delivery or they don't give a stuff about the manufactures specifications!!
Cheers
Muzz

You are dead right. There are dealers out there that do not have a clue. They had money and that money got them a franchise. Doesn't mean there was experience to back that up..... Doesn't usually happen in large city centre environments but can very easliy occur in outer areas.

Good to see you have a full depth pod. I know the Edencraft (Corowa, NSW) operation had issues particularly with full depth podding the 233. Thats why they stuck with their abortion of a stepped pod setup.

cheers

[rodneyk]

Back my motor is on 2nd last hole can only go up 1 boat was pre drilled factory 2000 model by bruce at yatala HH they were all factory fitted with OMC before they fell over is it possible trunk lengths may have changed slightly with brp??????

[Jabba_]

It's unlikely that BRP changed the leg heights,, There allways been 20" 25" and 30" legs.. 25" is the most common, and the measurments are taken from the lowest (top) bolt hole to the cav plate...

do you get much prop slip when you trim all the way out at WOT?..

If you don't, the first thing I would do is lift your motor up to the last hole and try it out...

[Jabba_]

hi skusto just bought a boat with one on 570 haines champion 150 etec it wasnt my chioce of motor but has 50 hours and 1 year old according to the fuel flow meter was using 24/to 27 ltr per hour @3800 revs seemed a touch high but re fueling found to have used about 38 ltr for 55klms so i was happy with that like i said im really a 4stroke fan but if this keeps going like that ill be happy

Just did a search on your boat Hains Hunter Champion and read a few revues both had 150's on them.. One a Johnson 2st and the other a Merc 2st...

Going off the Johnson which was a bit slower, at 3500rpm it was doing 26kn (44kph)... Assume your doing 26.5kn (49kph) at 3800rpm using an average of 25.5l/ph, that works out to 1.9klm/1ltr....

Assume your only doing 44kph @ 3800,, it still works out to 1.7klm/1ltr... And that pritty good, altho, 1.9 is better.. Never the less they don't equall your milage figures, so we need to look into your driving habits, location and water conditions....

Water conditions, driving styles and different speeds all have a affect on your milage... So, how are/do you driving your boat?

#1, Do you driving it with the correct amount off trim? (I am assuming you do)
#2, Do you go through a lot off 6kn zones, if so are you pushing it a bit quicker then 6kn's...
#3, Are you jumping from spot to spot?
#4, When you hole shot,, do you floor the throttle untill you get on a plane, then back off?
#5, what sort off conditions was it when you recorded your milage..

[rodneyk]

hi jabba pretty smooth water driving not jumping from spot to spot 3/4to 7/8throttle trimmed right in as it comes out which is very quick trimming out to correct position p/s ive owned 50 boats yes you read right this rig has heaps of mumbo will have a run this weekend see if i can get missus to steer full bore and look where cav plate is first i think also would not be unhappy to see oil being used @ 4000 rpm talk next week:)

[death_ship]

i hope your checking out ausfish during smoko rodney, the boss will crack the shits

[Jabba_]

hi jabba pretty smooth water driving not jumping from spot to spot 3/4to 7/8throttle trimmed right in as it comes out which is very quick trimming out to correct position p/s ive owned 50 boats yes you read right this rig has heaps of mumbo will have a run this weekend see if i can get missus to steer full bore and look where cav plate is first i think also would not be unhappy to see oil being used @ 4000 rpm talk next week:)

50 boat's, holy cow, that's a few...

As for the missus steering the the boat at full bore. Thats not necessary... Bring your boat up to a comfortable cruising speed, ie, 3800rpm... Trim the motor to suit the speed, and then check the cav plate, it should be easerly visable... Being splashed with water is OK, but under water, no good... Check link
http://www.veradoclub.com/smf/index.php?topic=137.0

Have a great weekend...

[Skusto]

Well just got back from Noosa and i tell u what i could not be happyier with Laguna Boating Centre that installed our new pride an joy the 150 etec.
I have to give these guys a big rap.;D
For a start they had to go to kawana early this morning due to the engine not getting delivered on time so that he could still install it today, listened to everything that we had to say especially about the props and getting the height right, very well natured and from the day we meet them at the boatshow to till today he always kept his word on everything, so if anyone is around the noosa area u would be nuts not using these guys. ;D

So after the countless hours of reading this last week about props we settles with the 15 inch rebel which reaches a top speed of 41 knots at 5700 rpm with 3 onboard and full tank of fuel which is exactly were we need to be. I will post more info tommorow after we go and have some fun, our and also it cruises at 41kph for 21 L/HR. so pretty good fuel economy.

Have to give a big thanks to Jabba and a few others on here for responding to my questions. And anyone interested hear is our new pride and joy. ;D ;D ;D ;D

http://i354.photobucket.com/albums/r406/skusto/SDC10045.jpg
http://i354.photobucket.com/albums/r406/skusto/SDC10046.jpg
http://i354.photobucket.com/albums/r406/skusto/SDC10047.jpg

[Skusto]

oh and the other thing couldnt believe that the etec come with there own gps for getting the speed right.!

[Jabba_]

Mate that's fantastic, I am absolutely stoked for you...

Just wait for the double oil period finishes, you will properly pick up another 100rpm....

Enjoy

[MyWay]

Skusto
that in one very serious BC mate :thumbup:

I got 130 Honda on my BC and use only 1l per 2 km in most time and sometimes better whit solas prop and max revs are 6100 top speed 65km/h
i m very happy with

myway

[kc]

Hi Shutso,

I have just done a bit of converting because the etec gauges on mine register in MPH rather than k's.

I have a 17 inch Solas and as discussed I'm not getting past 4950 WOT. Fuel figues at cruising however seem the goods.

Comparing numbers my cruise is 44.8k's at 23 litres/hr.

Have you done, or can you please do a fuel burn through the rev range and post it here.

I will be doing one on the water Monday before the boat goes to the dealer and then be able to do some proper comparitive analysis.

KC

[Skusto]

hey mate didnt really get to do a great test today as its been pretty shitty here.. but its cruises at 3400 revs for 41 kph at 22L/HR, could stay on the plane at 3000 revs for 35 kph for 18 L/HR and i did try to take it to wide open throttle and trim out but couldnt trim out to far as was a little bit to rough. when i do get a good run mate ill send you a pm of the fuel figures. oh and the throttle is so touchy isnt it.

[John_R]

Hi Skusto,

Am I right in assuming the 560C came with a Yammie 115 4 Stroke?

I am considering a 560C at the moment, but was concerned that the 115 might be a tad short. Maybe a Suzuki 140 would be the go - other than an ETEC 150 of course.

[Jabba_]

From what I have read on the forums, the 140 Suzuki is a weak motor... Other then a E-tec I would go for a Honda..

[Skusto]

Hi Skusto,

Am I right in assuming the 560C came with a Yammie 115 4 Stroke?

I am considering a 560C at the moment, but was concerned that the 115 might be a tad short. Maybe a Suzuki 140 would be the go - other than an ETEC 150 of course.


yeah mate it came with the 115 yamaha 4 stroke.. have heard that the 140 suzi go alright on these but havent been in one to campare the good thing about the etec is that its the same weight as the yamaha.. but has to us changed the boat for the better it just seams to handle better in our opinion any way.. we still we get good fuel economy curising at 3400 revs for about 1.9klm to the litre. the 150 suzuki might be the go but we werent to sure about more weight on the transom as well as there about 3k dearer.

and for jabba played around with again this morning after the runs yesturday the cav plate was still buried so we decided to put the motor up another hole its know as high as it can go and we can see the cav plate.. but in saying that to i put the level onto the cav plate and leveld across it know sits 90mm from the keel to were the cav plate is.. it seamed to run alright could still trim down and held onto the plane just as good.. so i think it should be ok but was thinking that 90mm high would be to high.. maybe not?

[Jabba_]

yeah mate it came with the 115 yamaha 4 stroke.. have heard that the 140 suzi go alright on these but havent been in one to campare the good thing about the etec is that its the same weight as the yamaha.. but has to us changed the boat for the better it just seams to handle better in our opinion any way.. we still we get good fuel economy curising at 3400 revs for about 1.9klm to the litre. the 150 suzuki might be the go but we werent to sure about more weight on the transom as well as there about 3k dearer.

and for jabba played around with again this morning after the runs yesturday the cav plate was still buried so we decided to put the motor up another hole its know as high as it can go and we can see the cav plate.. but in saying that to i put the level onto the cav plate and leveld across it know sits 90mm from the keel to were the cav plate is.. it seamed to run alright could still trim down and held onto the plane just as good.. so i think it should be ok but was thinking that 90mm high would be to high.. maybe not?

As long as the prop is still gripping and your getting good water preasure to your motor, then it's not to low...

[John_R]

The 140 Suzuki is also the same weight (bit lighter) as the Yamaha F115. It is also about a grand cheaper than the Yamaha going by the F&B engine listing of RRPs.

I understand the Suzuki only develops about 128 Hp, but it must still be an advantage over the 115. I have heard 560C's are getting 37Kts+ with the Suzuki. Fast enough for me.

The 150s other than the ETEC and Opti all add an extra 20Kg+. They are also a few thousands dearer.

So rather than accept the packaged motor, wouldn't it be an advantage to fit the Suzuki from the outset if that is feasible?

Skusto that motor does sound high, but if you still have room for some trim out without blowing it should be all good.

[Skusto]

As long as the prop is still gripping and your getting good water preasure to your motor, then it's not to low...

got trim still.. what sort of pressure should we be getting do u know will have a look next time we take it for a spin?

[Jabba_]

Not sure with the 150hp.. Ask the question on the E-tec Owners Forum. http://forums.etecownersgroup.com/mb/barnaclebill

Also, did your dealer set the motor up to run on XD100.. It's a dearer oil to buy, but a cheaper oil to use....

Did you get to spend much time on the water for Fathers day...

[Skusto]

cheers mate just asked and yeah were running it on xd100 got a fair bit so should us a while hopefully. and nah not to much only this morning once we lifted it. but still not to sure really need to take it to a creek were its open limit the bay is to hard to really test it atm to much crappy wind.

[Skusto]

also with the i command gauges with the calibrating with the fuel tank figures we dont empty our tank is there a way of it just recording how much fuel it has used? atm its just reading the tank as full but blinking which it is full but yeah dont really know when it is at half and have never run it dry?

[Jabba_]

also with the i command gauges with the calibrating with the fuel tank figures we dont empty our tank is there a way of it just recording how much fuel it has used? atm its just reading the tank as full but blinking which it is full but yeah dont really know when it is at half and have never run it dry?
Again, I am not familiar with the I-command gauges, so best to throw the question to the E-tec forum...

[Jabba_]

cheers mate just asked and yeah were running it on xd100 got a fair bit so should us a while hopefully. and nah not to much only this morning once we lifted it. but still not to sure really need to take it to a creek were its open limit the bay is to hard to really test it atm to much crappy wind.

Thats good... As you would know, you will use double the amount off oil during the break-in period, which is 2hrs off running above 2500rpm.... After that your oil ratio will automatically set to its normal ratio for XD100, and due to setting up your rig correctly, you'll use bugger all oil....

[MyWay]

The 140 Suzuki is also the same weight (bit lighter) as the Yamaha F115. It is also about a grand cheaper than the Yamaha going by the F&B engine listing of RRPs.

I understand the Suzuki only develops about 128 Hp, but it must still be an advantage over the 115. I have heard 560C's are getting 37Kts+ with the Suzuki. Fast enough for me.

The 150s other than the ETEC and Opti all add an extra 20Kg+. They are also a few thousands dearer.

So rather than accept the packaged motor, wouldn't it be an advantage to fit the Suzuki from the outset if that is feasible?

Skusto that motor does sound high, but if you still have room for some trim out without blowing it should be all good.

my 1st BC had 115 Yamaha and i never felt was under power in any weather was still doing 60km/h as top speed only it takes same time to get there
now i got BC with 130 Honda if you looking for sped go with etec 150 like skusto or Honda 135 hp

if i ever going to upgrade my it will be Honda 135hp

myway

[John_R]

Not so much looking for outright speed, more to optimise agility - quicker holeshot in bar conditons etc. Plus it might be cheaper, and the Zuk has a chain drive - no belt.

[MyWay]

Not so much looking for outright speed, more to optimise agility - quicker holeshot in bar conditons etc. Plus it might be cheaper, and the Zuk has a chain drive - no belt.

95% cars out there got timing belt not the chain

noting wrong with belt more power , more economical, and more quaet too
it is just design of engine

myway

[Skusto]

Not so much looking for outright speed, more to optimise agility - quicker holeshot in bar conditons etc. Plus it might be cheaper, and the Zuk has a chain drive - no belt.

to be honest mate if u want good hole shot i think the 115 etec or 130 etec would be more suited to u plus they would chew probable the same as the 4 stroke. this 150 just craps all over the 115 for holeshot and power but it is 35hp more so it should. or just ggo the 140 zuk alot of people have them with them and say there great so. i dont think u would be dissapointed.. plus to me the zuks come with a 5 year warrenty.. compared to yamaha 4, either one will be a great engine.

[Goldfinch]

Geez...my Yammy 200 4 stroke gets as good a fuel economy as that 150 etec. And that's fully loaded. Glad I went the 4 stroke instead of the hype!!!

[kc]

Had my 1903 Trophy/etec 150 back to the dealer this morning and he has determined that the issue is motor height, not prop:-/

Now talking a $500 riser plate to lift the motor. I have not committed to this yet as I want to do some testing on Thursday armed with info gleened here and take some photos.

I will also post some fuel flow/rev rage/speed figures for comparisons.

Don't know how he can just blanket say "motor height" without seeing it in the water and without testing more props.

The big pointer will be to see where the cav plate sits at speed.

KC

[cormorant]

Nice of him to donate it and the labor to fix up a problem that shouldn't exist if it was set up right to start with??

Take a photo of it on the trailer with the motor cav plate the same angle as the bottom of the hull.

If you can tape a bit of wood to the underside of the cav plate it will make it very clear.

Must be other trophy owners here or on the USA sites that will put you onto the correct setup combination.

[Jabba_]

Geez...my Yammy 200 4 stroke gets as good a fuel economy as that 150 etec. And that's fully loaded. Glad I went the 4 stroke instead of the hype!!!
Great post, very informitive..

By the way, I get as good as fuel economy with my 250 E-tec as you get from your 200 yammie, but I get the added avantage off better high performance from a 2st..

Glad I went 2 stroke...

[finding_time]

Hey Jabba

Mate you always have better fuel figures than anyone else i know of who run big block e-tecs;) , now that is either the lightest Vermount going round or theres another reason!:o How good is your math!:-/ You have made mistakes before haven't you!;)

Ian

[Jabba_]

Hey Jabba

Mate you always have better fuel figures than anyone else i know of who run big block e-tecs;) , now that is either the lightest Vermount going round or theres another reason!:o How good is your math!:-/ You have made mistakes before haven't you!;)

Ian

Yes Ian, I did make a mistake 2 years ago with my milage, and that was due to my fuel meter being out off calibration.. But since my calibration has been corrected and is check every time I fill the tank, it is now spot spot on...

My Vermont is probably heavier then most, I also have anti-foul (hate the stuff).. How are your maths?,, at 3500rpm, I cruise at 35mph using 31ltr/hr. That is with a 19" Rebel WOT = 5850 at 57mph... With a 22" Raker @ 3500, I get 37-38mph using 32lt, WOT = 5600 at 60mph... Love the Raker, but it is a pig in the ocean at low revs....

Another thing, (And this is not directed at you Ian).. Most well set up DI 2st will have similar fuel economy to a 4st off the same HP.. However the the DI 2st will be lighter, in most cases better hole shot, accelerate faster across the rev range and they usually have a faster top speed... But over the period off a days fishing or just spending the day on the water with friends and family the DI 2st will probably used a little more juice then a comparative 4st...

But if owning a lighter motor that is quicker, faster and uses 10-15 bucks more in petrol for a whole day is wrong, then what is right.... A motor that weighs more and is slower to hop to a plane, slower top speed but is 10-15 bucks cheaper to fuel for a days boating????

It's the owners call...

[kc]

Hi cormarant. Have tried US sites, evem the bayliners owners club forum but it seems the seppos are all mad keen Merc men. I can't find anyone with an etec on a trophy. The dealer did let on yesterday that the etec leg is a comple of cm longer than the merc??

I will be taking some pics on Thursday.

KC

[honda900]

Zuke 140 Horse power, borrowed from another site.

According to the emission data the Suzuki 140 is 138hp.
http://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/offroad/cert/cert.php?eng_id=SIME&year=2007

Some others:
135 Optimax = 133hp
130 Honda = 130hp (from year 2005 list)
135 Evinrude DI = 135hp (from 2006 list)

Regards
Honda.

[kc]

Finally got a chance to get the boat in the water and sure enough the cav plate is buried a good 4 to 5cm underwater at speed. Dealer tells me the etec has a longer leg (by about 5cm) than the optimax (which seems the motor of choice for Trophy boats) and even set on the top hole the etec runs too deep.

Now working towards fitting a riser plate to bring the motor up to optimum level.

Will post some pics and reviewed compaitive fuel/rev/speed figures in due course.

KC

[kc]

Back to an old posting but I finally got organised.

I have had the riser plate fitted (quick $800) and now cav plate is clear of the water. Effect on fuel consumption is dramatic but not on RPM or speed.

Old number were (about) WOT 4800 with fuel

26 mph 26 lph
28 mph 31 lph
30 mph 34 lph
32 mph 39lhp
34 mph 44lph
Above that wot 41mph 53lph

Now

WOT 5050 and 42mph

Big difference is

26mph 21lph
28mph 25 lph
30 mph 28lph
32 mph 32lph
34 mph 37lph
above that wot 42 mph 52 lph

Happy with improved fuel consumption as it has increased range at normal cruise speed by 20%. Still believe WOT revs are too low but is it worth worrying about (and spending more $$ on a new prop (as the old one has a couple of chips and can't be swapped).

KC

[Skusto]

hi those figures are heaps better we also lifted engine one hole on 150 etec 560 bar crusher cav plate runs above water now fuel figures also alot better we are now running 15.5 * 17 rebel prop
2500 revs 18kmph
2800revs 34kmph
3000revs 39kph
3300revs 45kph
3800revs 55kph
wot revs 5500 73kph
fuel useage on plane now is 1.8 to 2.0 km per litre
keeping revs below 4000

trolling 10kph 3litres per hr fuel
oil useage improved about 80:1 on plane
very little oil used trolling.
so far we are very happy with etec but you have to set them up right for your boat.

bevan

[Jabba_]

KC,, I would get your prop sorted to get your revs up to where they belong...

You know the benefits, and even though your milage has improved heaps, with the right prop seeing the optimium rpms, you going to get better milage (fuel and oil) and a longer life from your motor.....

Give us some details about your boat, motor and prop...

Skusto.... Far out, those figures are great... So far the fastest suzuki powered 140 that I have heard off, is 61kph, and he is getting the same milage as you 1.9km/lt.....

Any gripes about the motor???

[Skusto]

hi jabba the motor is running great and now we have right motor height and prop oil useage is heaps better at both trolling and planing speeds .

the boat performs much better now with the 150 then with the 115 yam 4 banger
much quieter at trolling and planing speeds
with a softer ride as the 150 pushes the boat into the sea better
on a good day can do 30 knots triming motor out getting 1.9k per litre at 3800 revs.
bevan

[kc]

Hi Jabba,

I'm in Cairns working and the boat is in Airlie but I'll get some numbers in 2 weeks and come back to you.

KC

[business class]

hi jabba the motor is running great and now we have right motor height and prop oil useage is heaps better at both trolling and planing speeds .

the boat performs much better now with the 150 then with the 115 yam 4 banger
much quieter at trolling and planing speeds
with a softer ride as the 150 pushes the boat into the sea better
on a good day can do 30 knots triming motor out getting 1.9k per litre at 3800 revs.
bevan

ok I have to BITE;D Unless im confused did u say the E-TEC 150 is quieter at full noise and trolling then the 115 YAMMY???? :o :o If so i think ur yammy had some issues :P

[business class]

Yes Ian, I did make a mistake 2 years ago with my milage, and that was due to my fuel meter being out off calibration.. But since my calibration has been corrected and is check every time I fill the tank, it is now spot spot on...

My Vermont is probably heavier then most, I also have anti-foul (hate the stuff).. How are your maths?,, at 3500rpm, I cruise at 35mph using 31ltr/hr. That is with a 19" Rebel WOT = 5850 at 57mph... With a 22" Raker @ 3500, I get 37-38mph using 32lt, WOT = 5600 at 60mph... Love the Raker, but it is a pig in the ocean at low revs....

Another thing, (And this is not directed at you Ian).. Most well set up DI 2st will have similar fuel economy to a 4st off the same HP.. However the the DI 2st will be lighter, in most cases better hole shot, accelerate faster across the rev range and they usually have a faster top speed... But over the period off a days fishing or just spending the day on the water with friends and family the DI 2st will probably used a little more juice then a comparative 4st...

But if owning a lighter motor that is quicker, faster and uses 10-15 bucks more in petrol for a whole day is wrong, then what is right.... A motor that weighs more and is slower to hop to a plane, slower top speed but is 10-15 bucks cheaper to fuel for a days boating????

It's the owners call...

Hello Jabba how are you? Long time no see on the water mate?

Now i have to bite here also LOL. We fish wide quite a bit now and a few guys have the 225 Opti and 200 Etec and im Sorry to inform you but our Fuel consumption differences are quite different (4stroke being the obvious winner here:P ) They have touch smaller boats, same HP and same sort of km travelled and are more like 50 Litres Minimum difference for the day. Fuel being at $1.40 for premium thats a total of $70 dollars extra per day.. OUCH.... and not to mention that gold priced oil use must use too:o :P . Yes they are quicker But not bye much;D As for hole shot it all about the prop, as we are lifting quite a heavy load out of the water and if u have a decent motor technician to set up your engine and prop it right, you will have no issues with hole shot what so ever;D .

I think we average about 1.7 KM/LTR at around the 45km/hr......

Cheers
Matty

[Skusto]

hi well you can bite all you want but im just telling facts as they are.
bevan

[champion]

hey rodneyk,you,ve purchased a great boat ,i also have a champion,but i still have a 2 stroke on the back,how does it go with the etec? where did you buy it from,as they dont often come up for sale.

[maimai]

ok I have to BITE;D Unless im confused did u say the E-TEC 150 is quieter at full noise and trolling then the 115 YAMMY???? :o :o If so i think ur yammy had some issues :P


Haha, I was thinking the same thing, maybe one was upwind...lol....

[Jabba_]

Hello Jabba how are you? Long time no see on the water mate?

Now i have to bite here also LOL. We fish wide quite a bit now and a few guys have the 225 Opti and 200 Etec and im Sorry to inform you but our Fuel consumption differences are quite different (4stroke being the obvious winner here:P ) They have touch smaller boats, same HP and same sort of km travelled and are more like 50 Litres Minimum difference for the day. Fuel being at $1.40 for premium thats a total of $70 dollars extra per day.. OUCH.... and not to mention that gold priced oil use must use too:o :P . Yes they are quicker But not bye much;D As for hole shot it all about the prop, as we are lifting quite a heavy load out of the water and if u have a decent motor technician to set up your engine and prop it right, you will have no issues with hole shot what so ever;D .

I think we average about 1.7 KM/LTR at around the 45km/hr......

Cheers
Matty

I havn't been on the water because a boat repairer in Runaway Bay f#cked my transom... I hope to have it back on the water in 3-4 weeks.... Schimdy gets my boat on friday to start the repairs....

As for Honda V6's, there proberly the most frugel on fuel then anyother V6....

I go out regulary on 680 Patriot with 250 Yammie... It is quiet a bit slower then a E-tec powered 680, and it hole shot is quiet a bit slower too... Economy is similar, but the Yammie is a bit ahead there.... As for noise, the E-tec is quiet, but the Yammie is whisper quiet... Open them up, and I cant tell the difference...

[business class]

hi well you can bite all you want but im just telling facts as they are.
bevan

I Fish with a mate with the 115Yammy and also one who has the 150 E-Tec, yes the E-tecs are a quiet 2 stroke especially compared to others but DO not come close to a 4 stroke especially at idle... Be serious here just cause u own a E-tec now and you are impressed with it, thats awesome as thats what we all pray for is a good donk on the back.... Back seriously if it was louder then ur E-tec ur Yammy had issues, Or ur Yammy was a 2 stroke in a four strokes Body:P ;D .

[business class]

I havn't been on the water because Boat Control f#cked my transom... I hope to have it back on the water in 3-4 weeks.... Schimdy gets my boat on friday to start the repairs....

As for Honda V6's, there proberly the most frugel on fuel then anyother V6....

I go out regulary on 680 Patriot with 250 Yammie... It is quiet a bit slower then a E-tec powered 680, and it hole shot is quiet a bit slower too... Economy is similar, but the Yammie is a bit ahead there.... As for noise, the E-tec is quiet, but the Yammie is whisper quiet... Open them up, and I cant tell the difference...

Sorry to hear about ur transome mate, hope ur back on the water soon getting in to them.
What you have said here makes sence, the 680 patriot is alot heavier then ur boat and has such a large V in the hull it will require more horsepower for a great holeshot, especially if u compare it to the holeshot on ur vessel as it would be insanely fast. And as for fuel consumption, if the 250 Yammy is better pushing a hull like that, imagine the difference on a similar hull like urs, Thats what im saying.
E-Tecs may be a quiet and have good economy (for what a 2 stroke can produce) but people saying that they are better then a 4 on fuel or quietier then a 4 are dreaming. Ive delivered the same hull and boat set up one boat haveing twin 225 Hondas and one with twin 200 E-tecs and the Hondas win hands down..... Ive also had this with 150 suzuki and e-tec on same hull and Zuke wins. Im not saying 2 strokes are rubbish or anything like that, im just saying people need to be real to them selves and not biast when comes to a 2 stroke 4 stroke arguement (like how u were not biast and new the 4's were quietier and better economy but lacked in hole shot and speed)

P.S What has to be done to ur transome and why will it take so long to fix?

Cheers
Matty

[Skusto]

since you are a know it all you must be right?????...................

[business class]

since you are a know it all you must be right?????...................

Not really, just stating Facts;D but its just funny how people think 2 strokes are quietier and have better fuel economy then a 4 stroke so i had to bite..... :P

[Skusto]

hi between 2000revs and 5000 revs the 115yam 4 banger was louder then etec
at trolling with etec only doing 1900 revs
yamaha at troll was doing 2500rev
at cruise 45kperhr etec 3300revs
yamaha at cruise 45kperhr 4500revs
at 5000 revs yamaha was humming nicely
at idle yamaha is better then etec

i have heard the 150 yamaha 4 banger is quieter then 115 yamaha 4 banger is the mid range revs.

[Jabba_]

Sorry to hear about ur transom mate, hope ur back on the water soon getting in to them.
What you have said here makes sense, the 680 patriot is alot heavier then ur boat and has such a large V in the hull it will require more horsepower for a great holeshot, especially if u compare it to the holeshot on ur vessel as it would be insanely fast. And as for fuel consumption, if the 250 Yammy is better pushing a hull like that, imagine the difference on a similar hull like urs, Thats what im saying.
E-Tecs may be a quiet and have good economy (for what a 2 stroke can produce) but people saying that they are better then a 4 on fuel or quieter then a 4 are dreaming. Ive delivered the same hull and boat set up one boat having twin 225 Hondas and one with twin 200 E-tecs and the Hondas win hands down..... Ive also had this with 150 suzuki and e-tec on same hull and Zuke wins. Im not saying 2 strokes are rubbish or anything like that, im just saying people need to be real to them selves and not biased when comes to a 2 stroke 4 stroke argument (like how u were not bias and new the 4's were quieter and better economy but lacked in hole shot and speed)

P.S What has to be done to ur transom and why will it take so long to fix?

Cheers
Matty

My previous comparison was a 250 Yammie and E-tec both on a 680 Patriot... My rig was not in the equation.....

I agree with the rest you say, the 4st is quieter at idle (were only talking a few db's between them).. The 4st in most cases are more economical... My previous statement that there is only $10 to $15 a day is for the average bloke, running a 150 or less out on the bay or broadwater.....
Blokes like you and I are a minority, we will travel 30 miles and more for a fish, or troll for 10hrs for marlin and Wahoo...

But that said, there is not one best or perfect motor... But on the 560 BC the E-tec is running rings around the same rigs using 4st... All it means that there a great match that complement each other....

I would never have a 2st Di on a Patriot, 300 4st is the only way for those machines...


I took my boat into Runaway marina in December last year to have a gel-coat crack repaired.. It was located in the splash well at the corner off the transom.. They looked at it and jumped up and down on the motor to see if the crack was moving.. It was but extremely little, had to look real close to see it move....

They said it was a non-structural gel coat crack and was a easy fix... It was ground out and patched and flow coated...

I took the boat outside 3 times, and the fracture was back but smaller,, took the family out to S-straddie for the day on Aussie and the crack did not change.. Then 2 weeks later we went to slipping sands and the fracture was now bigger then before it was supposedly fixed... Much bigger...

I have since been put onto Neptune Marine (Chris an Sib) and there going to install 2 Knee's into the transom, lock it into the splash well and the stringers off the hull.. Reinforce the splash well from behind and grind out the crack to the new glass and repair.. Using all multi directional cloth and some other stuff that sounds expensive.... Yes it is a over kill, but I want it bullet proof,,,they are also guaranteeing there work, something the other mob wouldn't...

How much.. Considering there doing 4-5 times the amount off work the other mob did and they charged me $500 for 2 small patches plus $100 to try and colour match... Neptune are charging me $1000....

The reason it has taken so long to fix is... #1 I had some huge bills to get rid off.. #2 The rain has held up a lot off Neptunes work, so it has put me back a few weeks... Thats cool tho,, as I needed the time to get the motor off and clear out the transom.....

[Skusto]

yes i agree on heavy hulls better to have a 4 stroke

[Spaniard_King]

Jabba,

Sorry to hear of your plight, I hope you get it sorted and get back on the water real soon.

Did you approach the mob when there repair failed?? Just interested in what plan of attack they would have come up with?

[Jabba_]

Pm sent..........