FICHT outboards would you buy one

[screaming reels]

G'day fellow ausfishers, just wondering if anybody would buy a 2nd hand ficht outboard,i have been offered a 225hp 02 model at very resonable price, which i think was the 3rd version of these models and as i already know these models did have problems but where they rectified by the time the 3rd version came out,any genuine advice would be appreciated. thanks brent

[Chimo]

Should be ok but to be sure get an OMC BRP marine tech who does these to check it over.

Where are you?

If your on or close to the Gold Coast we have such people here.

Cheers
Chimo

[cormorant]

Only if it has had all updates , has run correct oil,, perfect compression,has correct plugs indexed, has no codes on computer and has been serviced by a proper experienced OMC Ficht mechanic. By 02 all problems were solved in those motors but there is a lot of mechanics who know diddly squat about them and don't have the computer software to check them. You must also like with all motors make sure they have not spent their lives overpropped as they hated lgging and it was detrimental to their health along with trolling without a good high speed run to clean em out. Check it is making the correct WOT in an on boat test.

If you get the model and serial number ( check the serial number on the block matches the plate ) month and year of manufacture ( many people quote installed date not manufacture date so check it) and give it to a trustworthy OMC mechanic or dealer he can log in and check original sale details and any warranty issues with that motor and it's update status.

Are you aware of any issues with the motor ?
They are a cheap access to a lot of HP due to the poor reputation but unless you have access to a decent mech who knows his Ficht motors I would be very cautious and I would be careful about how much you pay as the industry hates them if you want to ever trade your boat in..

[tenzing]

I know this is very subjective but I have an 04 175 hp FICHT with about 250 hrs and it has always gone fine. I get it serviced by Alan Downes and he says its in perfect nick. I did all the homework that the previous respondents have recommended and everthing checked out fine there. So I reckon if it looks ok on the checks and its a good deal then there is no reason not to be quite confident in it.
Brendan

[cormorant]

Different motor by a fair bit.


You have a good mechanic in case you didn't know as he knows them very well fromn what I hear.

Screamem - if Alan says the motor is OK it will be if you are local to there get hi to check it out thoroughly..

[Noelm]

as a general rule, they are no better or worse than any other Motor on the market, many years ago they had some drama with a couple of models, but also remember that at the time, they were way ahead of any competitors in terms of technology, if any of the older ones are still running on original power heads, then chances are they will still be running in 10 years time, limited knowledge was the killer to a lot of early models, as well as neglect by the owners, wrongly thinking that any old Oil was good (they had used it for years in their mower) that Model will be fine as long as it has had regular routine service by a good dealer, but as mentioned resale suffers because of the misinformed public that relate stories of drama and woes from someone they don't even know, but they heard about it at the pub.

[FNQCairns]

Back in around 04 they had a value equivalent to $2 per kg, they certainly had there problems but no more than opti, hdpi, fict didn't directly cause the downing of OMC as is widely believed.

It had better be cheap because they have been sold for next to nothing for lots of years, the problems where real hence the final set of updates that stabilised the engine once the company was taken over for a year or so.

As mentioned above make sure all of the updates have been done then very possibly consider yourself the last owner and purchase on the price that relates.

cheers fnq

[cormorant]

$2 a kilo was overpaying for a bad one!!!!


There was huge reputation problem with OMC itself and it even turned it's own dealers against it when they refused to continue warranty on motors after BRP took them over. This gave OMC products a crap name but all the metal mechanical bits were OK. The first and second series motors in some sizes had computers program ( fuel map relaibility) issues ( not water cooled like later series) and gave the whole range a bad name even though when updated they were good. Mechanics hated them as there was nothing they could do if they didn't have OMC software and diagnosis so they couldn't get any $ out of those clients so just told clients to keep using them and they blew up - surprise surprise. Not like mechanics to do that is it?? Many issues were undersize fuel lines , water in fuel, wrong oil, wrong plugs, wrong battery. Computer always draws a small current so long term stowage in cold winters led to battery flat and failure if using undersize battery. So many issues were set up issues where BRP mechanics didn't think things were important like checking water cooling passages on ECU for salt build up and then it got hot and did funny things. Gearcases lasted twice as long with better quality synthetic oil etc. The computer stores all codes and errors on them for the last 100hrs running so ensure that is downloaded by someone who knows as it will even show when a battery is disconnected along with correct hours and revs for those hours.

Beware if it is a recently rebuilt motor as if they had a lean or failed injector for example people rebuilt them and fixed up the dead pot , put an injector from a wrecker but not the new injector or computer and it just happens again. You must diagnose the cause with these motors not just try and fix the symptoms like so many backyard boys tried.

As a side note they are not as good as the etec on oil use nor on ecconomy so factor that into your running costs and use XD50 or 100 oil as there is no oil setting switch that allows them to use half the good oil. Because of that you will still get a taint of oil smell and a taint of smoke if trolling until you give it a good run. Using the quality oil makes it pretty much smokeless. 30% better fuel usage at cruise over 2 stroke carby I would think and so much torque so prop it right.

tell us what you find out

[Coontakinta]

Noelm, FNQ, & Cormarant.

Thanks to you all for your informative and detailed comments. Not in the market for one of these, probably never will be, but still nice to be educated in these things and to have misconceptions cleared up.

Cheers boys

[Noelm]

It also should be noted that not all Ficht models were duds, all the V4's are fine from new, about 1997 or thereabouts, some V6's had some drama and they are the ones that killed off the brand name and it continues today, even though they have changed the name a bit over time, also a new problem has arisen recently and it involves a fuel line getting old (and this is sped up by E10) the big problem is that it is in the high pressure side, so any leak is a good one, anyone who has one, keep an eye on the fuel line near where the car valve gizmo joins in, that's where it fails, and a high pressure fuel leak under the cowling is the result, not generaly a good thing I reckon.

[Noelm]

OH, Yeah, as mentioned, if it is rebuilt, be cautious, if it is still the original Motor, then it should be good to go.

[screaming reels]

Thank you guys for the information, you guys have given me a great insight into these models which has given me a bit to think about basically resale and maybe future problems that might arise,i am redlands based and is there anyone that you can recommend to inspect the engine who has a detailed knowledge in the areas you guys have outlined,engine is still on boat and runs and sounds good but i do belive in buyer beware. thanks Brent

[Chimo]

Hi Brent

You wont do better than Ian Purdon at Ski and Race Marine (Master Technician)
0410 546 557 and hes not too far down the road from you.

Cheers
Chimo

[monkey76]

I wuld never buy one due to the bad press they recieved, it may make your boat hard to sell down the track.

[Jabba_]

Hi Brent

You wont do better than Ian Purdon at Ski and Race Marine (Master Technician)
0410 546 557 and hes not too far down the road from you.

Cheers
Chimo

I will second that.....

[suzygs1000]

What Noelm is saying is pretty well correct.

The V-four engine did not really have that many problems, but it was estimated that some 15-18,000 v-6's had powerhead problems of some sort.

FNQ, I don't know what you consider the real reason that OMC went belly up if you don't believe it was Ficht that caused it. I would be interested to know why you feel they failed.

Extraordinarily high warranty costs on their Ficht engines and disastrous sales figures as a result certainly played the major role.

They originally were the holders of the licence for the brilliant Orbital Technology from Perth, but, when Mercury joined with Orbital as another stakeholder, OMC got cold feet, and decided to go with their own technology - this being another high pressure direction injection system developed in Germany, and subsequently marketed as Ficht.

As everyone knows, the Orbital techology is the basis of Mercury's Optimax system, which is recognised at the clear leader in the low emission 2 stroke field.

Having said all that, I would certainly purchase a 5 to 7 year old Ficht engine, the resale value may be low, but this is reflected in the purchase price! So go for it!

Dave.

[stevej]

I wuld never buy one due to the bad press they recieved, it may make your boat hard to sell down the track.

work out the hull trailer price and only offer a few k for the outboard

if it goes pop no biggy you havnt done your cash

[Ally Jack]

Yes I would, well I am. Very close to doing a deal that will see me with 2 115V4's if it all goes well next Friday.:D

Do your reasearch on that size motor and year model, and steer clear of the general "i heard a mate's mate who had one and it was s**t."
I spent a bit of time on the hull truth searching and reading and a couple of PM's here that really helped out....thanks noelm.

But it's your money in the end and you have to make the decision, but the more information you have makes that decision easier.

Ally Jack

[Spaniard_King]

It also should be noted that not all Ficht models were duds, all the V4's are fine from new, about 1997 or thereabouts, some V6's had some drama and they are the ones that killed off the brand name and it continues today, even though they have changed the name a bit over time, also a new problem has arisen recently and it involves a fuel line getting old (and this is sped up by E10) the big problem is that it is in the high pressure side, so any leak is a good one, anyone who has one, keep an eye on the fuel line near where the car valve gizmo joins in, that's where it fails, and a high pressure fuel leak under the cowling is the result, not generaly a good thing I reckon.


Noel, I am not sure how much you know about these engines but the only high pressure section of the Ficht fuel system is from the atual injector to the combustion chaimber:-/ which develops around 500psi

This is why OMC went for this type of injection system as it does not have high pressure fuel being passed around the engine in fuel lines. Supply to the fuel injector is approimately 35psi which is around the pressure most common rail systems use.

[solaris]

I had a 2004 200HP that had done around 480 hours with the only issue being that the plugs required replacement every 70 to 80 hours. I repowered with a 250 suk 12 months ago. The 200 FICT used less fuel. It was at least .2 to .3 Km per litre better than the 4 stroke on the same boat.

If the motor is the right price with a genuine history, I would have no problems.

A freind of mine upgraded at the same time from a 250 FICT to a 250E-Tec. No better fuel economy but much less oil consumption.

[GBC]

What an eye opener - here I was thinking that being caught with a ficht was only a little worse than a dose of clap:-/
Very informative.

[Jabba_]

They originally were the holders of the licence for the brilliant Orbital Technology from Perth, but, when Mercury joined with Orbital as another stakeholder, OMC got cold feet, and decided to go with their own technology - this being another high pressure direction injection system developed in Germany, and subsequently marketed as Ficht.

As everyone knows, the Orbital techology is the basis of Mercury's Optimax system, which is recognised as the clear leader in the low emission 2 stroke field.



Dave.
If the Merc Orbital is such a brilliant piece of 2st Tech, then why is it Merc racing USA has been shut down due to Emission laws it can not meet with its currant line off Optimax XS race engines.... Yet BRP's HO engines are kicking butt in Australian ski racing scene and they are also doing very well in the US comps too...

Merc has another bigger problem in the US... With the new Californian Emisson laws due to be enforced in 2010/11, Merc at this point can not get the Opti to meet the new 2010/2011 emission requirments without loseing a heap off horse-power and reducing the fuel economy.... But once again the E-tec already meets the 2010/11 emission laws...

Yep that Orbital Tech is brilliant. Noisy too



On the subject.. I had a 250 Ficth which die a quick death due to water ingestion.. I only put 35hrs on it before it died..... During that time it was a very good reliable and economical motor...... The Ficth was 2mph faster then my current E-tec (the E-tec gear casing is huge), but the E-tec is miles ahead in terms of refinement and emission smell...

[suzygs1000]

Yeh, sorry Jabba, you're right on all of that, my phraseology was from the turn of the century, pre E'tec days.

I would have to agree that the pinnacle of two stroke low emissions at the moment is the Etec system, and if you happen to prefer two strokes over four strokes (the old argument).

I don't own an Optimax, those were objective opinions based on technology 6 years old. I own a 4 stroke.

Dave.