AFC 2008 Monduran round - Leaders

[NAGG]

Gee ..... after just watching the Monduran round .... Unbelievable !

What surprised me were the amount of fish that were lost to blown leaders :o

Was it a case of nerves , panic , pressure & impatience - ???? for all the skill of these guys - I was surprised!!!

Interested to hear your thoughts ..... on the footage , fighting tactics , drag pressure & leaders ........... no one used twisties - Why not ?

Cheers

Chris

[Steve B]

Inpatience Chris...simple as that. I cant beleive how much they were trying to turn/stop and dictate green fish! never going to happen.

Steve

[NAGG]

Inpatience Chris...simple as that. I cant beleive how much they were trying to turn/stop and dictate green fish! never going to happen.

Steve

Lots of it Steve
Impatience was evident right through the barra rounds ....... & some of the net shots were shockers

Sounds like you were surprised too

Chris

[Steve B]

Quite suprised Chris!!!(I missed Awoonga round). The most suprsising (and disappointing part, as of the culprits are quality barra anglers) was how hard they were going on them in open water!!

Notice the free spooling to position the boat by the yank...perfectly done.

Steve

[birko]

I was suprised by how high some of the rod angles were. Mind you it may well have been full of nasties just under the water that they were trying to keep the fishout off. Cameras dont show the whole view that the anglers were seeing I guess. Some nice fish though.

Birko

[Steve B]

G'Day Craig, how things up your way? Is the Pinnicle pub shut today;D

I agree, the rod angles were high, but they got lower as the comp went on!!! It made good jumping footage....when the fish stayed on!

Steve

[NAGG]

Quite suprised Chris!!!(I missed Awoonga round). The most suprsising (and disappointing part, as of the culprits are quality barra anglers) was how hard they were going on them in open water!!

Notice the free spooling to position the boat by the yank...perfectly done.

Steve

Obviously not staying in contact with ausfish ;) Its been raised on several occasions recently.......... but yeh ... it stood out !

Yeh the yank backed off while the locals went just as hard even when the felt contact with timber

This is some of the best footage of what not to do .... that I've seen::)

Chris

PS ..... Mottys blown fish ::) A running fish ( Kerrin with net in his hand) & the boat stationary ............. The fish got to the trees & bang ........ Far out :-[

[Steve B]

Obviously not staying in contact with ausfish ;) Its been raised on several occasions recently.......... but yeh ... it stood out !

Yeh the yank backed off while the locals went just as hard even when the felt contact with timber

This is some of the best footage of what not to do .... that I've seen::)

Chris

PS ..... Mottys blown fish ::) A running fish ( Kerrin with net in his hand) & the boat stationary ............. The fish got to the trees & bang ........ Far out :-[

Yeah its easy for us to sit here and pull it to bits!!....I have made all the same mistakes plenty of times!! It happens...thats fishing.

[NAGG]

Yeah its easy for us to sit here and pull it to bits!!....I have made all the same mistakes plenty of times!! It happens...thats fishing.

Yeh it is easy to be critical (arm chair expert::) ) ........ & yes its easy to make errors in judgement - - - but this was something more......... & it happened a few times ....... & that stood out ( specially on the same boat) ........... I know I'd be saying WTF!!!!

There was a lot to get out of it ....... some good rod work too8-)

[Apollo]

The 120cm was a beaut. I thought the partner would have done a bit more boat positioning to assist the guy hooked up instead of saying 'stay on fish' or just watching - lack of teamwork. I am a beginner at barra, but thought the same as you guys.

[nipsta]

hey did anyone tape it i missed it due to a bit of a issue um the chief forgot to turnthe dvd recorder off for me as i aksed her to do 3 times and so i didnt not get to see it i would really apreciate a viewing of it
cheers

[stevelcqld]

Wish i had recorded it. Was good viewing, I have not had the chance to chase barra yet... I now have the boat, so won't be long...

Steve

[TonyM]

hey did anyone tape it i missed it due to a bit of a issue um the chief forgot to turnthe dvd recorder off for me as i aksed her to do 3 times and so i didnt not get to see it i would really apreciate a viewing of it
cheers

I recorded it, PM me your details and I'll shoot you a DVD ;) Or I can give it to you at the bash if you can wait that long

Cheers
Tony

[Awoonga]

What l saw was...Smoke , mirrors... and no twisted leaders

[shane 234]

nipstar im pretty sure they will all be posted on youtube soon. last season and the one before that where.
yer i liked the tactics of the yank, notice he was a lot more calm and collected than the twins.
im looking forward to seeing the abt final.

[Hardb8]

I missed this round due to a friends 30th.

As mentioned before,There is alot the cameras don't show you.

You must also factor in :- These guys are under pressure to perform for sponsors,Cameras,And to earn competition points so that they remain for the next tour.Not to mention their personal pride is on the line.;)

I imagine it's not quite the same as a casual Sundee arvo session with one of ya mates.

This could explain the blood rush leading to extream rod angles,And the brute force tactics of trying to dictate terms to these fish.A combination of pressure and adrenalin can make you do things you normally wouldn't do.

After watching the Awoonga round last week...I was very surprised to see the decisions made,Hook setting methods :o ,Fighting styles,And the tactics used to get bit by the countys elite.

Good on Mat Mott for showing some initiative.I reckon he deserved to win.

I don't think a word was even mentioned about line or leaders during the show I watched last week.I think it would be a welcome addition for veiwers of the program to see these boys rigging up their gear before the comp from go to whoa,And explaining their choices in regards to their chosen tackle.

Cheers. B8.;)

[robo2242]

I have just finished reading harro book BARRA and there is a sectoin on how to free spool a barra,there is even a couple off pictures. Now im new to this dam fishing, I was watching last weeks round at awoonga and when they where fishing weed beds anchored...... What type off anchor do you use? or do you use just a weight and how far from fishing spot do you put anchor down? when stealth is so important. Any advice would be great...... Thanks Rob

[NAGG]

I have just finished reading harro book BARRA and there is a sectoin on how to free spool a barra,there is even a couple off pictures. Now im new to this dam fishing, I was watching last weeks round at awoonga and when they where fishing weed beds anchored...... What type off anchor do you use? or do you use just a weight and how far from fishing spot do you put anchor down? when stealth is so important. Any advice would be great...... Thanks Rob

Hi Rob

A lead weight is fine ..... if you can make 1
(nice and flat..... An old frying pan would make a good mould) ..... say 10kg ........ not sure how it goes in those screaming winds that you get at Awoonga

I use a sand anchor & 5M of chain ........ Its not the best option (chain noise:( ) I've now covered the chain in bicycle inner tube (much better).

If you do use chain & anchor ....... Make sure you drop back as far as you can on the rope 30- 50 M ..... + your casting range ......... You could lower the anchor 70 or 80M off your chosen area

I hope this helps

Chris

[robo2242]

Thanks chris will give it a go next time Thanks rob

[Barry Ehsman]

Does anybody know when this round was actually held???

Cheers baz

[NAGG]

Does anybody know when this round was actually held???

Cheers baz

Hi Baz

End of Oct !

Chris

[scrotty]

Hey Guys, I agree with most of the comments. I could not believe the rod angles these guys were using. Maybee they were trying to get some jumping footage but it certainly cost them some fish! Some of the netting techniques used were some of the worst I have everseen. For fishos that are supposed to be at that level they certainly looked lacking. I imagin the pressure and desperation of being in the comp would contribute to some degree but at that level they should be used it. I agree that more attention should go into showing their riging up etc. I to were supprised to see no twisted leaders! Is there a rule prohibiting their use?
Cheers

[robersl]

they seem to of lost a lot of fish using 80lb leader impatience and putting to much hurt on the fish to early i know there are snags and such but they were winding as hard as they could to try and turn the fish and that puts a lot more strain on the leader then letting the fish have a few runs and tire a bit before turning them my opionon only and i have only fished the dam once but have done a lot of barra fishing in the N/T in the last few years (p.s i am guilty of it there as well with 80lb leader near the sticks the fish kept running and i kept putting a lot of pressure to turn her thought she got me under a stick but the leader had frayed just above the hook)

Shane

[NAGG]

they seem to of lost a lot of fish using 80lb leader impatience and putting to much hurt on the fish to early i know there are snags and such but they were winding as hard as they could to try and turn the fish and that puts a lot more strain on the leader then letting the fish have a few runs and tire a bit before turning them my opionon only and i have only fished the dam once but have done a lot of barra fishing in the N/T in the last few years (p.s i am guilty of it there as well with 80lb leader near the sticks the fish kept running and i kept putting a lot of pressure to turn her thought she got me under a stick but the leader had frayed just above the hook)

Shane

I'm glad others are seeing the same thing as I did .......... I'm really thinking that it was the mental pressure that got them over excited ......... These guys know the waters fairly well & they fish plastics heaps ...... which mean they would be aware of the wear on leaders when using them.
I thought Hank & the Yank were good to watch 8-)

Chris

[robersl]

Hey Chris, I think it is good viewing but i think a few bad habits can be learnt i know they had the pressure on to land the fish and to stop them from jumping they were putting the rods down at an angle i just think it would be hard to keep the presure on the fish and guide the fish at some of the angles they had the rods

shane

[cy_taylor1]

Hi Chris,

There was quite a lot of fish lost during the Monduran AFC round. With the solid, fast fish & scattered timber it was always going to be a tricky-to-land type tournament.

The high rod angles & upward pressure were used to make the barramundi jump while leading them away from the standing & laydown timber which was abundant.

There were also some stumps under the surface which were found in the prefish and getting the fish in the air and keeping them from tangling & rubbing off on any timber was the idea.

This technique is usually effective at Peter Faust Dam on fish around timber although in the AFC event at Monduran the fish didn't want to jump! They did on some of the open water captures but most of them were running hard under the surface. The fish just didn't follow the plan! 8-)

It would have been a good idea to change the tactic earlier and possibly gone to free-spooling but that's fishing! It was a fun episode to watch though!

Thanks,

Cy & Kerrin Taylor
Whitsundays QLD

[Apollo]

Hi Chris,

There was quite a lot of fish lost during the Monduran AFC round. With the solid, fast fish & scattered timber it was always going to be a tricky-to-land type tournament.

The high rod angles & upward pressure were used to make the barramundi jump while leading them away from the standing & laydown timber which was abundant.

There were also some stumps under the surface which were found in the prefish and getting the fish in the air and keeping them from tangling & rubbing off on any timber was the idea.

This technique is usually effective at Peter Faust Dam on fish around timber although in the AFC event at Monduran the fish didn't want to jump! They did on some of the open water captures but most of them were running hard under the surface. The fish just didn't follow the plan! 8-)

It would have been a good idea to change the tactic earlier and possibly gone to free-spooling but that's fishing! It was a fun episode to watch though!

Thanks,

Cy & Kerrin Taylor
Whitsundays QLD


Thanks for the explanation of what was trying to be achieved and why. You guys certainly put them onto the right areas as was evident by the number of hook ups.

[NAGG]

Hi Chris,

There was quite a lot of fish lost during the Monduran AFC round. With the solid, fast fish & scattered timber it was always going to be a tricky-to-land type tournament.

The high rod angles & upward pressure were used to make the barramundi jump while leading them away from the standing & laydown timber which was abundant.

There were also some stumps under the surface which were found in the prefish and getting the fish in the air and keeping them from tangling & rubbing off on any timber was the idea.

This technique is usually effective at Peter Faust Dam on fish around timber although in the AFC event at Monduran the fish didn't want to jump! They did on some of the open water captures but most of them were running hard under the surface. The fish just didn't follow the plan! 8-)

It would have been a good idea to change the tactic earlier and possibly gone to free-spooling but that's fishing! It was a fun episode to watch though!

Thanks,

Cy & Kerrin Taylor
Whitsundays QLD

Thanks Cy for giving us the insight into the tactics of the day

I hope you or Kerrin didn't take this thread as a personal criticism ...... Its certainly not meant to be...... The footage makes for great discussion based on some recent threads on leaders & fighting techniques - Having video of what goes wrong or can go wrong is just gold......... It helps us learn!

its always good to hear from you guys

cheers

Chris

[Peter4]

I'd still like to know why the boys weren't using twisted leaders..........

Any comments Cy? I think there were three or four fish that rubbed through 80lb mono leaders.....:-/

Pete

[A_DIFF_PERSPECTIVE]

One point- the majority of leading barra anglers do not use twisted leaders. Single straight mono leaders or light wire for some is the first port of call.
A barra must be hooked before it can be lost. We could all use heavier, ugly twisteds and reduce chafe offs but that on its own is the major limiting factor that reduces strike rate initially. If you can't hook any fish, you certainly can't be chaffed off. The name of barra angling is to find a happy medium that allows finesse lure presentation on a leader that will allow fairly good chafe guard. In extremes, 80lb mono isn't good enough; neither is 100lb.
The Taylor guns have excelled in the lure presentation department and have accellerated in fish nous and tactical play. High rod angles are an important roll in some barra captures; much to the opposed thoughts of mainstream media. Low rod angles will not stop a barra that 'needs' to jump. They jump to rid a lure that is stuck inside the mouth or in situations where the lure impedes their mouth from closing neatly, regardless of rod angle in most cases. Also, allowing a large barra to jump tires a fish and allows an angler to keep better control of a fish much higher in the water column. A fish high in the water column is a fish that is now not thinking of cover or dirty snag tactics. Messing with their head is an art. Chafe offs are a sad fact, and learning when to soften the firm approach is also another skill that comes with a kazillion barra captures. The Taylors are highly developed anglers with plenty for us all to learn from.
Cheers
Johnny Mitchell

[Peter4]

Thanks JM.....no criticism was intended, just looking for a reason why - to which you have responded.

Chris, any comments on the effect of twisted leaders on the presentation of lures - especially soft plastics?

Personally I have been using 80lb mono leaders when throwing soft plastics at barra and have not yet lost a fish (have come close though - the 104 in my avatar!). My son, who was using 60lb mono leader, lost a good fish at Mondy at the death when it chafed through the leader.........it was a big girl hooked deep and a long fight in open water.

JM - "Chafe offs are a sad fact, and learning when to soften the firm approach is also another skill that comes with a kazillion barra captures"

Between us we have now caught 4 barra on plastics, just short of a kazillion!!;D

Regs

Pete

[Magella]

Johnny,
Can't agree more about twisted leaders you must get a fish to strike first before you can land them we proved this time and time again with mackerel and jack by using mono leaders and not wire fair enough your lose rate was 3 times higher but our strike rate was 10 times that of anglers using wire traces. Rod tips, fallen timber under the water make the buggers jump, open country keep your rod tip low. Do reckon they muscle up a bit but.

Cheers Foxie

[NAGG]

Johnny .... once again a valued & respected opinion.
But - there really is no need to defend your young proteges ........ The lads are pretty well at the top of the tree & only a brave soul would deny that.

High & low rod angles are something that can be argued ........ but the reality is that which tactic is the best is determined at that moment ( I'm learning this more & more .....still)............ Some barra will take to the air , others run ........ with those that stand and deliver something again. ....... we have all seen it - We can only play it by ear as every barra is different - I'm sure the next barra that runs from cover wont be the last!!!.

Now ....... With regard to the opinion of twisted leaders reducing strike rates .......... Personally I think the jury is still out ! Particularly when we refer to 2 strands only & in lighter gauges (30-40lb) ....... Not the Lethal Leader type.
I in my limited time on the water have not seen a diminished strike rate since I went down that path........ However the loss rate to worn leaders has been reduced significantly! ( I certainly know that twisties would be dropped like a hot cake ....... If I felt it significantly impeded my results - or I saw that my fishing buddy got all the action)
As you said ...... Attracting the strike is No 1 - but surely landing them is another.

Anyhow ........ The footage makes for a great discussion topic - good , bad whatever!

Cheers

Chris

PS ..... Love your new DVD 8-)

[NAGG]

Thanks JM.....no criticism was intended, just looking for a reason why - to which you have responded.

Chris, any comments on the effect of twisted leaders on the presentation of lures - especially soft plastics?

Personally I have been using 80lb mono leaders when throwing soft plastics at barra and have not yet lost a fish (have come close though - the 104 in my avatar!). My son, who was using 60lb mono leader, lost a good fish at Mondy at the death when it chafed through the leader.........it was a big girl hooked deep and a long fight in open water.

Between us we have now caught 4 barra on plastics, just short of a kazillion!!;D

Regs

Pete

Hi Pete

On Twisties ........ When I started barra fishing I used the Erskine type ( I thought thats what you needed to do) ......... I got rid of them when I started fishing plastics ........ However losses mounted particularly on big fish ( 60 , 80 & 80lb FC ..... didn't help) .......... So after making up some hand made twisties & fishing them side by side with 80lb mono ........ There appeared to be no appreciable difference.
Then Trev told me about his machine twisties ....... off I went:)

Now- I have no doubt that there must be some negative influence ..... to the point that when fishing was tough during the ABT - I used 25lb FC Twisties , Got bites , caught a fish & blew another ....... So it is in the back of my mind.

Lets see how things pan out through the course of this year starting March :P

Chris

[TonyM]

More often than not nowadays I use 60lb mono for plastics as the action of the lure seems much better. Fishing lighter lines and leaders makes you keep very focussed when a fish is on and for me at least forces me to think outside the box and use freespool and/or back off the drag when it's called for.

I agree with getting the fish to jump being a good idea at times, the 112 I got at the muster on 20lb braid and 60lb leader jumped quite a few times because the plastic was way down it's throat, although I believe that worked in my favour as it helped to tire the fish much quicker and at least kept it away from the timber/electric/outboard for a while

I have never been a fan of twisted leaders if for no other reason than the sound of them going through the guides drives me nuts ;D

I tried wind ons last trip and unfortunately I didn't get to land a fish on them, but boy do they cast nice!

Cheers
Tony

[Grumpah]

I have watched the last 4 (and have them safely on the foxbox) and I was amazed at this weeks round and the number of losses. It still looked to me that the pressure of the round generated some much greater anxiety to have the fish in the boat than in previous rounds. It seemed that particularly with Tim the Bream, there was less patience and cool than usual. I have never fished for Barra or Bass so i haven't a clue what it's like but that's why i study these programmes so closely. I look for tips and techniques and what works for them. If they catch fish on it - then hopefully, with practice I might one day too. First I need my boat - should only be a week or two now - and then...my fun can begin. In the meantime I just keep watching AFC, and Breamin' and AFC and soft plastic DVDs and AFC...........and reading your posts and posting a few of my own.
;D Love this forum!!

Graeme C.

[Peter4]

Hi Pete

On Twisties ........ When I started barra fishing I used the Erskine type ( I thought thats what you needed to do) ......... I got rid of them when I started fishing plastics ........ However losses mounted particularly on big fish ( 60 , 80 & 80lb FC ..... didn't help) .......... So after making up some hand made twisties & fishing them side by side with 80lb mono ........ There appeared to be no appreciable difference.
Then Trev told me about his machine twisties ....... off I went:)

Now- I have no doubt that there must be some negative influence ..... to the point that when fishing was tough during the ABT - I used 25lb FC Twisties , Got bites , caught a fish & blew another ....... So it is in the back of my mind.

Lets see how things pan out through the course of this year starting March :P

Chris

Chris,

Kyle and I are fishing Monduran in mid February. I intend to have two rods set up for casting plastics. One will have a mono leader and the other a twisted leader (your style). I will be testing both the presentation of the plastic and the strike rates. If the barra wish to play, I will try to get some stats together on the success of one against the other over four days of fishing....

Regs

Pete

[NAGG]

Chris,

Kyle and I are fishing Monduran in mid February. I intend to have two rods set up for casting plastics. One will have a mono leader and the other a twisted leader (your style). I will be testing both the presentation of the plastic and the strike rates. If the barra wish to play, I will try to get some stats together on the success of one against the other over four days of fishing....

Regs

Pete

Pete ..... Thats the smart play - Its what I did with Whitey ..... he used mono (60 & 80) & I used 40 & 50lb twisties .......... & yes there was a difference when I ran out of 40lb ,,,,,,, & had to use 50lb:(
Then ....... During the whole ABT & ABT prefish ........ I used 40lb twisties alongside Matt who used mono - I never felt that I was disadvantaged at any stage.

Lets see how you go !

Chris

PS ....... Did your twisties come out alright ?

[Peter4]

Did your twisties come out alright ?

Still waiting for a hair braider - daughter's was lent to a friend and is coming back this week! Besides, have been too busy chasing snaps in the bay!;)

Mondy is still 2.5 weeks away so plenty of time for leader construction.....

BTW when you say 40lb twisties is this using 40lb mono or 20lb mono doubled over for 40lb twistie?

[Steve B]

Johnny,Cy and Kerrin,

From my perspective there was definatley not malice intended with my repsonses, only judging by what I see. It is know that the editing process with filming can make things different and 'attractive' to TV...thats show business, and the desired effect of AFC which we enjoy.

Now, I cant deny that every sitation is different, we all do different things. I can only compare the boys in JM's DVD to the boys in AFC and there were remarkable differences in fish fighting demeanure IMO. I had the previlege (as did Chris) to fish the entire ABT along side these lads...and yes they are head and shoulders above everybody with fishfinding/landing and natural ability. I spose what I am saying is some of the mistakes were quite uncharicteristic for the lads, and Kerrin still did enough to win, Cy close up which really proves their capabilites. I am thinking certain pressures from the AFC production hindered their thinking on the day, particulary with one partner in particular who tends to have a dominating effect. Agian, its easy to sit back and pick it to bits from the armchair, cameras dont show everything....but what they did produce was not the brilliant fishing styles I have seen seen from these truely skilled lads. Again there is no malice intended, just a genuine discussion which I intend to learn something from.

At least their drags sounded smoother than Motty's!

Cheers Steve

PS: As for twisted leaders...cant comment....never used one. never needed to.

[A_DIFF_PERSPECTIVE]

If twisted leaders were a fish catching improvement there would be many more anglers using them. When we look at ABT results for hours fished for fish boated it becomes very ugly. ( Yes, I know , not everyone is/was using twisteds). In the existing lake barra fisheries that vary from around 10-25+ yrs old, there is little clue needed to be dropped that lure presentation is near the top of the list of must do's in pressured waterways. Starting with rigging, there does need to be a lot of refinement from anglers if they wish to lift their catch rates, especially in the likes of ABT events with horribly frightening figures of hours fished per barra landed. Stats show that if an angler landed less than 1 fish per round of event they would end up in the top ten overall. That is a bit scarey when it is broken down to about one barra landed roughly every 10 hours in competition time. I believe it is time anglers took another road when it comes to connecting fish to lines,,,,especially when it counts. If the fishing is easy, fencing wire on your lure will hook barra and we don't think twice about questioning our rigging, or our lure. When it is tough, or touchy, leader choice, lure balance and advanced lure presentation will help no end. If ya mate beside you is catching none also we don't automatically have to think it is a tough day.
Harro- light wire leaders.
Wilhelm- single mono or fine wire the last time I looked.
Myself- single mono.
Taylors- single mono.
3 out of these 5 anglers are guides who need to put clients onto barra in less than 5-6 hrs, amongst teaching anglers to cast and to retrieve.
The other two are ranked one and two in the country.
Other key variables are at play, but a coincidence with leader choice stands well clear. We can all take our own track, but I wouldn't bother typing this if it wasn't to paint a helpful picture. Sometimes stats and future prognosis needs to displayed. Our fisheries won't get easier, we need to adapt to what is being created.
Johnny

[NAGG]

Straight up ........ No one is saying that twisted leaders are a panecea for leader failures ....... far from it - Most who construct their own are fully aware that it is a compromised approach........ A calculated gamble that your approach will not adversely affect your strike rate!
Sure ...... you can stay with a single mono leader system based on what the legends of impoundment barra fishing use - then roll the dice & see what happens .......... Most of us have! - Then some of us have looked for something else! ........... Some just except that blown leaders are a part of barra fishing! ..... MAYBE !
I for one do not think that there is a definitive answer ........ only what compromise or gamble you are willing to except

Cheers

Chris

[wheezer]

haven't seen this episode and i'm aware that with television comes criticism but the guys fishing on the AFC are there for a reason...they've worked hard to be there and i for one am not going to slay them, especially on a public forum

regarding leader choice...well for every pro there'll be a con but i'm with johnny, twisties are old news, been down that road a few years ago buts its mono FC or nylon/copolymer for me now depending on presentation/technique. again not the be all and end all but has yet to let me down and more importantly i'm confident in the system

regarding rod angles...well that could go on for a long time...a jumping barra is a disorientated barra, and sometimes that is what is required..i have encouraged barra to jump when fishing in close proximity to structure, i would rather have some chance of landing the fish then getting bricked in a flash...there is other variables, high rod angles can also shift the load higher on the blank, further cushioning the voilent headshakes of a jumping barra reducing the chance of pulled hooks...especially with zero stretch braided lines too much pressure is just as bad as not enough...

[Awoonga]

Last year l spent close to 250 Days on Awoonga and l tested many types of Leaders .. ..Last year l caught the odd Awoonga Barra ... Some months the score was quite high....By the above comments if l used single leaders there would be no fish left...So just to help you guys out l shall continue to use Twisted leaders.......lol

[wheezer]

it seems the conclusion was drawn by the airmchair experts that the use of twisties would have changed the outcome...there's far too many variables involved to draw a conclusion like that..as is being seen in this thread there will always be a difference of opinion..

[Peter4]

I disagree wheezer....I don't think any conclusions were drawn by anyone. A few experienced barra fishos (not me!) asked some valid questions and others responded. Most were careful not to offend and and a lively discussion ensued.

I do agree that we cannot draw any conclusions from the points raised but it sure is interesting getting the pro-twisted leader views compared to the mono leader views - especially with some very experienced guys in both camps......

[NAGG]

it seems the conclusion was drawn by the airmchair experts that the use of twisties would have changed the outcome...there's far too many variables involved to draw a conclusion like that..as is being seen in this thread there will always be a difference of opinion..

Hi Andrew .... I dont think any conclusion were drawn when it came to leader types - The question was just asked! ......... but more-so - fighting techniques!
Unfortunately ....... A conclusion was drawn that twisted leaders would not have improved results! After all they have been dismissed by 3 top guides & the top 2 barra tournament ranked anglers::) .

Chris

[NAGG]

Still waiting for a hair braider - daughter's was lent to a friend and is coming back this week! Besides, have been too busy chasing snaps in the bay!;)

Mondy is still 2.5 weeks away so plenty of time for leader construction.....

BTW when you say 40lb twisties is this using 40lb mono or 20lb mono doubled over for 40lb twistie?


Hi Pete

I twist 40lb Nitline XTS - This has been the best compromise for me

Chris

[Plasticin]

Hi Andrew .... I dont think any conclusion were drawn when it came to leader types - The question was just asked! ......... but more-so - fighting techniques!
Unfortunately ....... A conclusion was drawn that twisted leaders would not have improved results! After all they have been dismissed by 3 top guides & the top 2 barra tournament ranked anglers::) .

Chris

Lucky we have you to keep us on track then Chris.

[Awoonga]

OK ...My view... l live next to Awoonga.....I fish it most days... I care for these fish... with the use of soft plastics some of the fish are deeply hooked and this is where we get the chaffed leaders from... By using Twisted leaders l lose less fish and therefore there are fewer fish that suffer having a lure stuck in its gullet...Do l think Barra are leader sensitive ? no l dont...Do l think it affects the lure action ? no l dont....Do l think colour makes a difference... yes l do... My mate who l think is one of the best barra fisherman in Australia thinks not....We all have opinions..thats fine......You have mine.....

[NAGG]

Lucky we have you to keep us on track then Chris.

No mate ..... not here to keep anyone on track - Just ask questions & promote thought / discussion .......... & more importantly- Learn !

Chris

[Apollo]

A question for Cy and Kerrin - It wasn't clear in the show where the leader had worn through. Was it abraided near the lure (ie from the Barra) or further up the leader (ie from rubbing against snags)? More to do with my own interest and trying to learn more than anything else.

Thanks

[Peter4]

Hi Pete

I twist 40lb Nitline XTS - This has been the best compromise for me

Chris

Thanks Chris.

I will try with 40lb Black Magic Supple Trace (my favourite leader!);)

[A_DIFF_PERSPECTIVE]

When we talk lure presentation most individuals think of what they normally do each trip to try to catch fish. What I mean by finesse lure presentation is what is done by the highly tuned in angler that achieves much more than anglers who adopt reasonably straight forward cast, wind, jiggle techniques, especially with soft plastics. When the 'finesse' word is examined and matched to the finely tuned lures that the Taylor's use to win these competitions there becomes a new level that seperates the simple talk on what Harry, Paul, Joe or Jim catches with what technique or rigging system. Taking into consideration that they have a very particular standard of what they call a tuned lure compared to what 99% of anglers use. It's off track to comment on the finnesse of angling until it really is understood on the grounds of higher skill level. In this situation where a 'fine delivery of a lure' is essential in creating the strike in conditions where a massive portion of the field struggle to even land one fish, one must realise that the purpose of single strand leaders is by far a superior delivery tool than a twisted leader with the lure choice for Cy and Kerrin. Subtle differences make all the difference.
It really is only in competition time or when times are tough when the subtleties stand well clear of 'normal, basic and common techniques.
In my opinion, if you are fishing with a twisted leader you are supressing your ability to produce better results on the average day on a highly pressured barra dam.
johnny

[Hardb8]

Hi Johnny,
I'm curious to know why you believe the single strand leader system is a superior setup?

Cheers. B8.:)

[Tropicaltrout]

Yeah I just spent some tome reading all these posts, Nagg mate you are a man of many words... lol

Cy and Kirren awesome boys, its a tough stage you guys are on and I for one would not like to be on it but you hold yourselves well... I struggled with Motty dont know how you can share a boat but hey each to there own...

I know you fellas are top anglers and no your stuff but why do those who partisapate insist on coaching the hooked up angler??? the T boys seemed quiet compared to Harry Who and some of the others...

Johnny I agree with the finesse side of fishing, my style has changed over the years and from putting a thousand cast into a area with a turn of the reel to now a concentrate variation in retrive and other varibles etc my catches are still turning over... I have to admit I am a twisted leader user but in saying that I am just starting to branch into the plastic style of fishing due to wanting to master all aspect of hard bodies....

I just spent some days with Lyndon and Justin, magic people and talk highly of you mate, so I look forward to meeting you some time on a dam some where..

Cheers Nath

[nuggstar]

i had fun watching this ep of afc. i thort it was funny how most of the fellers targeted the stick. iv never seen high sticking like that hehehe, it was awsome. and how were them fellas the getting them monster fallows with the surface lures, that had my hart im my mouth, seeing the size of the bow waves. lurn't a bit watching too, like how the tailor boys were doing them sharp rod flicks then getting slamed on the drop, and how the yank used bream tacktics with the free spooling to gain the advantage. it was great. hehe matt could have had that fish it that were on the lecky quicker i recon. i cant wait to watch the next lot. im keen as ever to fish that place now, any one elce keen hehe

[Pridey]

Great discussion lads. I live a little too far away from your super lakes down there at the moment, and I've only done very little freshwater barra fishing, I was wondering, those of you that enjoy a bit of saltwater barra chasing. Do you feel the 'potential' loss in presentation from twisted leader would be more or less pertinant in the salt water... wild fish being more or less finnicky or whatever...anyone use it on different species ?

thoughts ??

Btw, this is the absolute first I've heard of twisted leader, I find it interesting.

[NAGG]

Great discussion lads. I live a little too far away from your super lakes down there at the moment, and I've only done very little freshwater barra fishing, I was wondering, those of you that enjoy a bit of saltwater barra chasing. Do you feel the 'potential' loss in presentation from twisted leader would be more or less pertinant in the salt water... wild fish being more or less finnicky or whatever...anyone use it on different species ?

thoughts ??

Btw, this is the absolute first I've heard of twisted leader, I find it interesting.

Mate ..... you are a stones throw from Peter Faust .... I dont know about super lake but it certainly has plenty of Super fish:P

I started my barra fishing in the salt ....... before progressing to the ponds. The tackle developed very quickly to handle big rampaging barra in the timber.
My tackle for the salt is more like Jack tackle but with a 50lb mono leader ......... the big difference is that I usually cast suspending , diving lures rather than soft plastics which I favor in the dams ............ While I'm still to land a big salty ..... i've found that they usually sprint around , jump a bit before coming to the net ....... so with lower drag pressure & usually a lip or hinge hookup ..... mouth abrasion is less of a concern.

Twisted leaders are used for mouth abrasion or gill raking rather than structure.

Cheers

Chris

[Pridey]

Yeah, I tend to go for between 40 - 60 lb mono leader in the salt too. Sometimes smaller for jack. Why the hardbodies in salt and plastics in fresh ? longer casts in the dams ? more time and ability to mess with the retreve ?

[NAGG]

Yeah, I tend to go for between 40 - 60 lb mono leader in the salt too. Sometimes smaller for jack. Why the hardbodies in salt and plastics in fresh ? longer casts in the dams ? more time and ability to mess with the retreve ?

For me ...... I use hardbodies in the mangroves as a more of a in your face presentation ....... chuck it in & pull it down - pause twitch ( you do use the same technique in dams too ) ......... Plastics offer a good way to cover more water in the dams ....... & the plastic can be fished in a multitude of ways...... without a change. Having said that ...... I usually have a rod rigged with a HB close by - situation dependant.

Chris

Ps ........ a slow sinking plastic rigged weedless & thrown into the mangroves would be deadly too IMO

[A_DIFF_PERSPECTIVE]

Hardb8 (http://www.ausfish.com.au/vforum/member.php?u=36434),
Drop me a PM if ya would like to know more on my posts. You seem keen to investigate further. It would take pages to fully explain the answer, but you'll get the drift.
Cheers,
Johnny

[brisboys]

Inpatience Chris...simple as that. I cant beleive how much they were trying to turn/stop and dictate green fish! never going to happen.

Steve

I must agree, once they were on they simply didn't take the time to get it in nice and easy. As many chances as there were that they did bring in were very nice!

Patience is a Virtue

Sam

[NAGG]

I must agree, once they were on they simply didn't take the time to get it in nice and easy. As many chances as there were that they did bring in were very nice!

Patience is a Virtue

Sam


Sam ..... There is a fine line with these beasts - & sometimes it's "Go hard or Go home!" ......... What most fishoes consider as take it easy just doesn't apply to impoundment barra ............ usually!

Chris

[chewy01]

Just as a note,with one fish in particular with one of the taylor boys,at the point i think there were pelicans in the shot im not surprised they were tryin to get them to jump.Outside where they were fishing is 4 or 5 big lay down trees.I liked the tactic,but unfortunately the barra decided to come clear of the water as opposed to just lunging,which in my humble opinion makes it near on impossibe to maintain contact with the fish.It seems this season in particular the fish have a predisposition to jumping clear of the water.On the weekend i ended up retrieving with the tip a few inches in the water but still they became airborne at the slightest contact with the hook point.Dont know if its coz im fishing the hotter weather,not sure if i care,but it makes for some awesome hookups(or lack thereof).But there is a lot of spots in that dam where if you make use of making them jump tactic whereas if they stay in the water you will get just about 0 fish to the boat.I guess its just a matter of using the right technique,to suit the country you are fishing,no use freespooling if the fish is just going to bust you off in 5 seconds 50 metres away.Freespooling is a gret tool,so, long as you have a lot of vertical trees not so much laydowns,thats what iv found anyhow.

[wheezer]

Mate ..... you are a stones throw from Peter Faust .... I dont know about super lake but it certainly has plenty of Super fish:P

I started my barra fishing in the salt ....... before progressing to the ponds. The tackle developed very quickly to handle big rampaging barra in the timber.
My tackle for the salt is more like Jack tackle but with a 50lb mono leader ......... the big difference is that I usually cast suspending , diving lures rather than soft plastics which I favor in the dams ............ While I'm still to land a big salty ..... i've found that they usually sprint around , jump a bit before coming to the net ....... so with lower drag pressure & usually a lip or hinge hookup ..... mouth abrasion is less of a concern.

Twisted leaders are used for mouth abrasion or gill raking rather than structure.

Cheers

Chris


why is mouth abrasion less of a concern on wild barra? they are extremely fit and can wreak havoc on gear. i've yet to have impoundment barra destroy lures the way wild ones do...in the attached pic you can see an x-rap SXR-12 way down the big gob of a wild barra...if you look close enough you'll the front owner has been mangled and has pulled out...that lure got off lightly compared to some of the others!

[NAGG]

Good point Chew

Just a question ......... Freespool Vs Reduced drag -------- Whats best ?

Chris

[PaulMark]

Good point Chew

Just a question ......... Freespool Vs Reduced drag -------- Whats best ?

Chris

Freespooling is a worry if you are a novice,as you have no real influence on where the fish is heading,just hang on and hope they head for open water.Reduced drag gives you at least a bit of contact with the fish and maybe a bit of influence on where you want it to go.Not that the big buggers take a blind bit of notice:o;D
Paulo.

[NAGG]

why is mouth abrasion less of a concern on wild barra? they are extremely fit and can wreak havoc on gear. i've yet to have impoundment barra destroy lures the way wild ones do...in the attached pic you can see an x-rap SXR-12 way down the big gob of a wild barra...if you look close enough you'll the front owner has been mangled and has pulled out...that lure got off lightly compared to some of the others!


Hi Andrew

As I mentioned ...... I fish hard bodies in the mangroves ..... The majority of hook ups are jaw ( not deep) so the leader is not normally in the mouth ........ Plastics are more of a chance of deep hooked ...... with the leader worn by the jaw.
I also fish no where near the drag pressure on estuary fish ........ so leader wear is again reduced.
As I mentioned ... I'm yet to catch a big salty - - -
I also feel ( & its only my opinion) that Impoundment barra are more aware of their environment & know where sanctuary is to be found ...........

Chris

[chewy01]

Nagg i like freespool iin standup timber as if a fish doubles back towards you round a tree i like to be able to nearly let go and use the trees as resistance till i get back direct to the fish,its just a feel thing.i only do this in the impoundments as lure losses are terrible in the salt.At mackay two years ago i ended up trolling to try and get fish away from the landslide they were holding behind but stilll ended up losing 9 lures for the sesh.They woouldnt hit trolling with the tide but against would just arc in and cut me off on the oysters.I tried the freespool method that day and donated two richos extractors to the river. I think there is a time and place for all the methods but i think its important to have a game plan should you hook up,for the given place/situation,be it getting it to jump,not jump freespool or lock up.In the heat of battle isnt the time to be deciding,sure you can modify ur plan but at least have an idea of which way to drive the boat to cut the fish off from structure etc.

[2manylures]

Hi Andrew
I also feel ( & its only my opinion) that Impoundment barra are more aware of their environment & know where sanctuary is to be found ...........

Chris

Chris,
You may want to re-think this opinion.

Apart from human predators impoundment barra are at the top of the food chain whereas wild/river/salties have much more to fear. I would have been of the opinion the latter would be better aware of "sanctuaries" ;D;D;D

[Colo77]

Great thread, a very interesting read & learnin heaps. Thanks to all who have contributed.

Cheers,

[NAGG]

Chris,
You may want to re-think this opinion.

Apart from human predators impoundment barra are at the top of the food chain whereas wild/river/salties have much more to fear. I would have been of the opinion the latter would be better aware of "sanctuaries" ;D;D;D


Why ? I know what I've seen ;)

[Pridey]

I tend to find wild barra far more cunning and not as lazy. A little harder to coax.. but I dont really have enough experience with either so....meh

[Steve B]

Good point Chew

Just a question ......... Freespool Vs Reduced drag -------- Whats best ?

Chris

Chewy pretty much summed it up in his reply. I work similar to that too.
Free spooling is NOT a primary fighting method for me. Its a LAST RESORT after backing drag off and trying other things !!! I have only used it (homer was 1 example) when I am in vertical timber and I have been stitched up after a few solid runs, not snagged but woven thru trees.

Reason 1: the trees provide natural drag...so I back the drag right off. less resistance/pressure on trees and gear=less chance of bust off......downside.....they can stitch you up even more, but from my experience after the first few big runs...the runs get shorter. I found out the hard way, if you try and pull a fish back whilst around trees...you inevitably have the fish lodge its head and trebbles into the tree.....that is the ultimate baddness!!! Not to many fish are landed from that.

Reason 2: gives you time to manouver boat thru trees and follow fish.. often after you have got them away from most of the trees they head for open country.....on purpose or not, its in the fishes head what happens!!

I also use freespooling when a fish has bricked me in deeper trees. Sometimes they come out....sometimes not...50/50 call.

So what I am trying to say is I fight fish first and foremost to the level of intensity required for each situation. circumstances (and there are millions) dictate what to do from there....freespooling AT THE RIGHT TIME time is just another method, and honestly I have only done it in situations as described above on rare occasions. Phil Strader (the yank) did it perfectly at the nessessary time.

I just wanted to clear up my verion of 'free spooling'. I would hate to see someone hook a horse in open water, set the hooks then crack the freespool.....WOW that would be a spectacular mess!...might try it one day for an experiment.....see what would really happen!!!

cheers Steve

[Big_Ren]

I would hate to see someone hook a horse in open water, set the hooks then crack the freespool.....WOW that would be a spectacular mess!...might try it one day for an experiment.....see what would really happen!!!

cheers Steve

Giddy up:o If your backing knots were arsey enough to hold you'd get a free tour of places you've never been Stevo:D

[TonyM]

The first time I tried freespooling (line around electric motor shaft) I was amazed that the fish actually stopped dead in it's tracks once the pressure was off.

I'm sure this isn't always the case although was amazing to see the fish stop next to a tree only 3 metres from the boat almost immediately after I took the pressure off.

It's not like the fish was worn out yet, although it had allready used a lot of energy up doing a few tail walks and short runs. As soon as I re-applied pressure after the line was unwrapped (only a few seconds) it took off like a madman again and had enough energy in it yet for several tail-walks. My take on this was that with the pressure off the fish must have thought it was out of imminent danger.

When you do make the call to hit freespool it's heart stopping stuff as it goes again all your (at least all my) instincts!

Steve - can I please watch when you try the open water scenario ;D Make sure you take a spare spool of line to put on after you have to cut all the birds nests out (or tape your thumb up so you don't lose all the skin) :)

Cheers
Tony

[NAGG]

I've never freespooled a fish ........ just back the drag off ! As I learn more & hook more fish it becomes easier to judge when & how much........ In some ways this goes hand in hand with the choice of leaders & the line class used ......... Along with the terrain / environment fished .......... It just comes with experience I guess.
At least one thing that I've learnt ....... It usually ends up in tears when you clampdown to avoid a fish stitching you up

Chris

[Roo]

The first time I tried freespooling....... I was amazed that the fish actually stopped dead in it's tracks once the pressure was off....

Cheers
Tony

I had the same experience as Tony. after a fish wrapped around our anchor rope I hit freespool, fish stopped dead. we motored over to the rope, unwound the 2 wraps the fish had but in it, then re-engaged the spool and gave it a few winds to put the hurt back on, the fish immediately headed straight for the rope again so I hit the freespool again and it just stopped (we had been vertically over the fish), I moved the boat so as to get a bit more angle on the fish to "try" to encourage it towards more open water (without a floating anchor rope in it;) ) and then resumed the fight again where it (again) went on its mental way except this time not towards our rope.;D . freespooling twice on the one fish and having the same result each time may not mean that is what they will all do. but then again maybe they do.???? I asked the fish just before release... it just stared at me blankly....maybe I wasn't asking the right question:P I'm no whisperer it turns out.

Cheers Roo.

[SeekingBarradise]

We watched the program at the Monduran caravan park on the weekend with a few barra fisho's. There was a drag that sounded like my boat trailer winch. But there were also drags that sounded sweetly tuned like like a formula 1 machine.

How many missed this?
How many spotted this?
I've only watched this once and i'm sure after the 40th time there will be a good list up and running.

Leader: I used a twisted leader and had a nice fish fight on the weekend, but found the sensations coming back through the rod off-putting. There were distracting vibrations compared to the single strand and good feel of straight 80lb leader. I also had wind on leaders which were ok if they were not too long. I went back to single strand after fighting this barra because the sensation (lack of feel) coming back up the rod felt like shit.

I'll give them another go during a hot bite to see if this was a one off.

Positives: A major fault of many members on the net is that so much good info is just skipped over, time and time again. (Not by everyone) I've been guilty myself, that's for sure.

Another fault is that 2000 (january) people have read this thread but only a few interacted.
It's like watching reality tv. Not good if we want to learn.

With a combined 5000 plus days spent on freshwater the guys being filmed have thousands of tips for all of us to use and improve our own fishing. If we have the radar on to spot the tips?

Ask yourself honestly.
How many tips did i spot the first time i watched the show?
Was i going to make the effort to watch it again?
If not why?
Is my goal to improve my barra fishing?

A few smart blokes i know have a list of tips from last years series and have been working on improving their game with those valuable tips in the last 12 months. They also took notes on non competition dvd's to improve their barra fishing.
How many of us on here did that? Mark honestly.
If not why?

Another smart bloke on the weekend noticed a lost fish from too much pressure, & it even looked like thumb pressure. The dvd will have to be watched again as it all happened quickly.

Last years series: Another bloke noticed a fishing partner change his position of tools/body to that of a barra angler for better triggering, striking and fish fighting outcomes. He is a smart guy and had an open mind. Hats of to him for not having an ego and adapting and learning from anyone and everyone.

It's probably only fair that if we make comment about these guys on this thread that we post up a couple of positives as well, because there is so much good info just skipped over for the next best thing.

To think or not to think? The next best thing is easy to predict. Think about what will be released this year around mid year. It's easy as they prey on dumb people skipping over good info. They will be lures and plastics that we can touch and feel and buy. Not a lot of thinking info is released. And the stuff that is gets skipped over a lot.

Info like that AFC show on the weekend which was packed with tips & a few other non competition dvd's and presentations getting around that are not used enough in my opinion.

Lets see. Did you take detailed notes of the areas that were fished?
What stood out as a fishy area and why?
What areas looked less than fishy and why?

Wind direction at the time of fishing or lack of?

Features of the area or lack of?

Sun, Cloud, Current, Layout and temps?

Water quality or lack of?

Weed, Bait, Birdlife, animal life or lack of?

Positioning of the boats? Casting angles?

Position: Body position, rod angles, hand position, strike position, rod techniques, plastics and lures used (that were shown).? Keep a lateral mind for what wasn't shown as they had limited time to make the show and sponsored products would have to get the first run on tv as they spent a lot of coin to get there. Without the sponsors the show wouldn't be on.

Did you notice some teams work better than others? Ask yourself why, then apply it to your own fishing?

Who had a outstanding fish finding & triggering ability? Why? Add up all the points you think had a bearing on fish triggering ability?

We can even learn from guys that did it hard or didn't catch fish.
What were the differences in approaches?

Did they attract fish but not hook them?
It might have been a hard day and attracting fish might have been very hard. Maybe there were tips there for us to use as well, not from those that just caught fish. Often trips where we don't catch fish force us to think a lot more.

What tips did you get from those that did it hard or caught no fish?
Did you get these tips the first time you watched it?
Did you know the tips were there before i put the questions/observations up on the net? If not why?

Food For Thought: When thinking about all this consider this. Every few hours the Taylors trigger and usually catch barra on lakes. So do guides, they train clients to catch fish in 1-2-3-4-5-6 hours in daylight hours. Some of these clients have never fished or fished for barra before. Tallies have been more than 20 fish in daytime hours, and double figure metre barra in winter.

Do you do this on your trips at percentages above 80-90%?
In less than 5-6 hour sessions?

In all weather all year round?

Mark yourself harshly and honestly. I am the first to put my hand up and say " I don't do that well enough". I need to improve and have sited the skipping of good info as a major weekness. There are many more.

Now look at a few of these guys on tv, knowing that a few definately consistantly catch fish. Do most of us do that? (I'm not even close).

How many people have fish per hour ratio's of good guides and good barra fisho's? For me this is the exciting part, we can all learn more if we have the radar on and mark ourself honestly. We can learn from each other.

I fear all these guys hard work is being overlooked by the majority. When i say guys i mean people on and off TV. Even quiet achievers.

Helping each other to get better: Let's also use this thread to learn a few things. If we didn't have anything to learn that means we would have better fish finding, triggering and catching ability that Mitchell/Harro & the Taylors to name a few. I don't think this is the case for many of us.

The learning list is much bigger but i tried to keep this thread short and let others do some thinking & observing.

People can still post stuff they didn't like etc, but lets also take the time to slow down and do a bit of learning. Sound like a good idea?

I hope to see you on a barra dam one day for a bit of chilled out fishing, camping & learning.

Cheers Lyndon.:)

[NAGG]

Thanks for that Lyndon ...... Thoughtful as Always

Here is one glaringly obvious observation from the AFC both this year & last!

Cy & Kerrin need each other !! ...... They are a team!


Chris

[eotbmg]

Another observation was that the guy fishing with Jas had no input at all. Royter and Carl didnt even mention his name, poor bugger.
Ben

[Plasticin]

Thanks for that Lyndon ...... Thoughtful as Always

Here is one glaringly obvious observation from the AFC both this year & last!

Cy & Kerrin need each other !! ...... They are a team!


Chris

Doesn't look very obvious to me....

Series 5

Round 5 (Awoonga)
1. Cy Taylor
2. Kerrin Taylor

Round 6 (Teemburra)
2. Cy Taylor
3. Kerrin Taylor

Series 6

Can't remember the exact results and they seemed to trigger a lot of fish in a tough bite.

Guess my radar might be slightly out...

[NAGG]

Doesn't look very obvious to me....

Series 5

Round 5 (Awoonga)
1. Cy Taylor
2. Kerrin Taylor

Round 6 (Teemburra)
2. Cy Taylor
3. Kerrin Taylor

Series 6

Can't remember the exact results and they seemed to trigger a lot of fish in a tough bite.

Guess my radar might be slightly out...

Get them together & they would probably go close to 5/5 each day ........ Results came a lot tougher with their respective partners -
I'm not being nasty ....... but they feed off each other & seem to be in sync when you watch them on the water together ............. That didn't come through on the AFC

Chris

[Plasticin]

Just a guess but I'm sure fishing with #1 on the water baby and Cy maybe a little different....

[NAGG]

Just a guess but I'm sure fishing with #1 on the water baby and Cy maybe a little different....

That would be tough for anyone ...... baby::)

[SeekingBarradise]

In Sync - no shit - they are part of triplets u clown.

As Harro says " The barra are lucky their sister doesn't fish". LOL just having a laugh here chris ok i couldn't resist that line to lighten things up ok.

Cheers Lyndon..

[Tropicaltrout]

Its funny stuff Lyndon I think we made a healthy observation at the kitchen as we watched, picking the water, and the variables that go with it... and I am sure those in the "smashed em boats" did a lot more seaching aswell... Its a good thing as I watch these shows to try and watch em with a few fishos who share the same passion you will pick up alot more....

Anyhow I enjoys seeing fishing on the TV it just baits me up to go fishing and there's no harm in that!

Cheers Nath

[Dick Pasfield]

Just got around to reading this. Assume the show you’re talking about was on Fox or local TV?

Some thoughts of my own based on what has been posted prior.

Twisted leaders? Never used them, never even seen one but I know some like them others don’t and others are nonplussed by them. Whatever works best for the individual I guess.

Cy’s mention of trying to keep the fish in the air is a good tactic, it buggers them quicker and when what’s below the water is not that flash you want them away from it. I’ve lost heaps more fish to timber than fish to abraded line. Having said that, I’ve not had many lures end up far enough down the gob to worry about abrasion. On jumping I like to encourage my fish to jump if the connection seems secure, just to watch, no other reason:).

Interesting about wire coming back as an alternative leader material.

On free spooling - a good tactic as mentioned but don’t think that it’s not possible to predetermine what the fish will do. We free spool once a fish hits the timber as a matter of course in the estuary where the snags that slump into the water are mainly horizontal. You can pick your way though the mess to chase the fish. At least in these situations the fish hit the snags at top speed and goes right through and out the other side. I believe the tactic is to put as much interference between them and the threat as possible and maintain the advantage of clean water to run again if necessary. A barra is well designed in shape and protection to do this. Once we’re through the snag it’s just a matter of coming tight on the fish again and renewing acquaintances. BTW we don’t do that in the rivers where snags are mostly large upper storey trees that lay vertical, when a fish gets into one of those it’s usually bye bye.

River fish less aware of their environment? Maybe but it’d take a lot of convincing me of that with barra big and small being considered tucker for sharks ‘n’ crocs ‘n’ cod ‘n’ birds ‘n’ people ‘n’ other barra etc. The only fish I find unaware of their environment are the ‘easy to catch’ small ones that haven’t learnt. Their future is a dim one, nature is a much harsher teacher than me.

Putting the brakes on a fish is a good tactic, it’s just when to do it. A fish full of momentum is always going to be hard to pull up, clamping down then wont amount to too much, except perhaps a lost fish. Upping the ante once the fish starts to lose momentum will gain you a few metres of grace. Doing it before a fish gains that momentum will save you even more metres. Get it in the air as well and you can just about hold a fish on a tether while it gives you a shower.

[NAGG]

In Sync - no shit - they are part of triplets u clown.

As Harro says " The barra are lucky their sister doesn't fish". LOL just having a laugh here chris ok i couldn't resist that line to lighten things up ok.

Cheers Lyndon..

I'll need to find a good makeup artist when I get to Brisbane :clown: ...... ya know of any;)

[SeekingBarradise]

I'll need to find a good makeup artist when I get to Brisbane :clown: ...... ya know of any;)

No but i reckon you could find one or 2 at the Mardi Gra down your way:)

[NAGG]

No but i reckon you could find one or 2 at the Mardi Gra down your way:)

Did they fly down ?::)

[SeekingBarradise]

Did they fly down ?::)

Yes, they had return flights from Sydney:)

Did anyone notice what depth in the water column had the most success (strikes)in the AFC Monduran round that was on TV on the weekend? Maybe you guys that have watched it a few times can help out.

Cheers Lyndon.

[TonyM]

LMAO you guys are a worry!

Lyndon - (or is it Link?) :D at least you know how to play poker ;D

Re your question re the water column I think it was mostly high up in the first few feet, although I only watched it once so reserve the right to change my mind!

One thing I remember is that when they showed the "Number one in your hearts team" (guess who) :D the lures I could see were shallow runners

I hope to watch it plus Johnnys DVD a few more times this weekend whilst supping on a cold beer (can't go fishing so might as well watch someone else do it!)

Cheers
Tony

[nipsta]

that sounds like me too tony i got no chchocie but to rest as i had my wisdom teeth removed on tuesday and lets just say i look like a chipmunk at the moment face is all swollen so i cant do anything to irrate it i cant even work on my boat to finish it off the way its going im may be ready just in time for borumba bash
Sounds like i really need to see the mondy round once it turns up(thanks to tony m) sounds like a lot of errors made on the part of good anglers

[DEANO68]

that sounds like me too tony i got no chchocie but to rest as i had my wisdom teeth removed on tuesday and lets just say i look like a chipmunk at the moment face is all swollen so i cant do anything to irrate it i cant even work on my boat to finish it off the way its going im may be ready just in time for borumba bash
Sounds like i really need to see the mondy round once it turns up(thanks to tony m) sounds like a lot of errors made on the part of good anglers

boat looks tops simon :thumbup: , reckon you will be ok come march.;) ..what do you mean you look like a chipmonk now ,you did before the op.;) ;) ;) ..ha ha ...
get well mate , that new boat needs some fishy love....8-) 8-)

talk soon deano....8-)

[chewy01]

Not so sure bout errrors nipsta,just a lotta the fish were better on the day.you could have filmed a movie to rival "australia" last weekend on my jumpoffs and maybe i did something wrong,maybe not.To me its just fishing,some days/nights yoou just cant stay connected to fish no matter what beer ur drinking.For some reason the last couple months the fish just seem to jump. i love it,but i guess if u were chasin your first,it may suck. Interestingly the saltys seem to be acrobic too at the moment

[BR65]

Feelin your pain Chewy, Ive found the jump off thing has been a real stuggle to contend with lately, and Im scratching my head as to why. Got a few theories, but only time spent fishing will prove or disprove them!

[nipsta]

boat looks tops simon :thumbup: , reckon you will be ok come march.;) ..what do you mean you look like a chipmonk now ,you did before the op.;) ;) ;) ..ha ha ...
get well mate , that new boat needs some fishy love....8-) 8-)

talk soon deano....8-)

cheers deano yeah i like it i was too abit before but 5 times worse now oh well the pian wil be worth it
And yeah cant wait till i get her back on the water good to see if i got things setup right this time i still got the life jacket issue deciding where to fit them i though in the floor comaprtment but they will get wet there i just gunner have to use the front compartment and yeah hope that works
ok catch ya soon

[chewy01]

Brian, i just drink beer and attack em in the morning..tomorrow is always a different day..:)

[BR65]

Brian, i just drink beer and attack em in the morning..tomorrow is always a different day..:)

attack what in the mornin, the barra, or the beers mate????;)

I didnt see the show, was out fishin, so will wait for it to hit the DVD stand, or pop up on youtube before I can form an opinion, but in saying that, some good stuff has been kicked around here.

[STIFFWORM]

Hi guys n gals. While were kickin things around .What about using longer softer rods when using plastics? Would that help lessen the abrasive effects on the leader wether single strand or twisted ? I know u wont have the same control over the fish but with all the talk of free spooling etc maybe its an option?Over 2 u guys cheers les:-/

[TonyM]

Hi guys n gals. While were kickin things around .What about using longer softer rods when using plastics? Would that help lessen the abrasive effects on the leader wether single strand or twisted ? I know u wont have the same control over the fish but with all the talk of free spooling etc maybe its an option?Over 2 u guys cheers les:-/

Hi Les

Most of my baitcaster outfits for Barra are 5'6 but fishing plastics I use either a 6'6 Loomis MBR783 or a Nitro Magbut 7'6 to provide a bit more give (plus you get longer casts) however there are still times when I feel freespool is the way to go.

e.g. the whippier rod will not lessen the effect of the line/leader being wrapped around a tree while a barra is headed off against the force of any great amount of drag

Cheers
Tony

[NAGG]

Hi guys n gals. While were kickin things around .What about using longer softer rods when using plastics? Would that help lessen the abrasive effects on the leader wether single strand or twisted ? I know u wont have the same control over the fish but with all the talk of free spooling etc maybe its an option?Over 2 u guys cheers les:-/

Hi Les

I'm a huge fan of the longer rod for barra ........ & particularly find the glass blends with a slightly slower action .. great. Most of my rods are in that 6'10" area.
Originally I went down that path for fishing plastics / point casting ........ but you get some other advantages too .......... like working a fish around obstructions ( motor legs , leccys ::) & timber)

Chris

[Dick Pasfield]

My smallest rod is 1.7m and the longest is 2.2, a big difference between the two but that difference is more pronounced by the type of reels mounted. The little rod has a ABU 6500 on it and the larger a big old Penn 650 (yes I know I'm a caveman;D). My point being is the line retrieved in one handle turn is as significant as the size of the rods (40cm to the abu and 90cm to the Penn, current line capacity). Longer rod plus more line on quicker = good control

Once again with respect to abrasion, as I mainly use hard bodied lures it's not much of an issue. However as for control the longer rod is a huge bonus fishing from the shore (river) when there's a strong current and rocky outcrops to deal with (see attached pic as an example). Even holding a fish laterally off a weed bed I'm anchored to is best done with the long rod. The short rod I tend to use more in the esturary, whilst it hasn't the reach of the long one for geting down to unhook the line off lateral branches it makes up for it by being a lot stiffer. Combined with no stretch braid when violence is called for those small mangrove branches usually end up snapping.

http://i464.photobucket.com/albums/rr4/dickpasfield/Fish/1-1.jpg

[BR65]

Dick, I look at your pics and can only shake my head in amazement, the enviroment you fish for barra in is so far removed from where I fish, its hard to believe we both are chasing the same fish.

[Dick Pasfield]

Dick, I look at your pics and can only shake my head in amazement, the enviroment you fish for barra in is so far removed from where I fish, its hard to believe we both are chasing the same fish.

If you compare two extremes such as the scene in the pic I posted and the one in your avatar you'd be right but I'd suggest there's environments local to us both that when compared would look very similar. The Ord below the dam for example has I believe taken on some aspects of an impoundment as it's flooded to above the old channel line and the water level for the most doesn't vary. Your rivers in QLD would be much the same as ours as well:).

[Archer]

This may seem really out of the square but here goes....

Seems to me that SP's by there very nature get hooked deeper as they feel more "realistic" and stay in that bucket mouth longer. Hence the need for stronger leader types.
HB's on the other hand well lets face it thats not going to feel like a baitfish anytime soon....and as such are "spat" before/during the hook set and normally end up pinned in the corner of the mouth.

Now im not talking with ANY experience on Barra at all yet to land one infact but i have caught more than my fair share of sothern fish and you can take alot in simply by reading the forums and talking to other anglers about diffrent speices.

Now When you consider the size that the Barra in the lakes are the SP's being used are tiny in comparison. A 1m Barra would have no worries chewing down on a 40cm+ sized baitfish.
Perhaps rather than increasing our leaders strengths making up twisted leader, using wire etc maybe we need to be looking at larger SP's???

I know there are some Off-shore trolling placcies in the 200-250mm size range. Maybe this could be somehow adapted to suit casting for Barra?

Maybe this is something some of the locals could play with and see where the hooks start sticking?

Anyway enough rambling food for thought anyway...


Joe

[Plasticin]

Interesting Joe,

6 inch plastics are really common on barra dams, numerous people throw 7 inch flick baits as well. In my experience, fish will commit to the larger plastics when they are active however in a tough bite they don't fully commit to the bait and are difficult to hook. Whilst I am only a novice in sp fishing for barra I can see the merits for smaller plastics, just for the better hook coverage and overall bait profile.

However that does raise the question, a larger plastic will throw out more vibration and profile a larger shape therefore would it not be a better searching tool??? I am currently playing around with some of the smaller plastics to try to increase the amount of action and, in my thoughts/hopes/wishes, given the better hook coverage, increase the amount of hookups. However just with simple maths it is impossible for a smaller plastic to push the same amount of water as a larger bait due to surface area. It will be interesting to see what some of the others have to say.

What I would be really keen to hear is whether people have been using a smaller bait and switched to a larger profile for no change in result.

Scott

[eotbmg]

Interesting Joe,

6 inch plastics are really common on barra dams, numerous people throw 7 inch flick baits as well. In my experience, fish will commit to the larger plastics when they are active however in a tough bite they don't fully commit to the bait and are difficult to hook. Whilst I am only a novice in sp fishing for barra I can see the merits for smaller plastics, just for the better hook coverage and overall bait profile.

However that does raise the question, a larger plastic will throw out more vibration and profile a larger shape therefore would it not be a better searching tool??? I am currently playing around with some of the smaller plastics to try to increase the amount of action and, in my thoughts/hopes/wishes, given the better hook coverage, increase the amount of hookups. However just with simple maths it is impossible for a smaller plastic to push the same amount of water as a larger bait due to surface area. It will be interesting to see what some of the others have to say.

What I would be really keen to hear is whether people have been using a smaller bait and switched to a larger profile for no change in result.

Scott


Scott,
Last weekend we threw 4 inch hollow bellies in conjuntion with 110mm squidgies.[ No larger ones were on board] We did not register a hit on the hollow bodies, yet caught several on the 110mm squidgies-consequently the hollow bellies werent used! My theory was that larger bonies were in the area, and hitting the larger offerings!
Ben

[BR65]

I mixed and matched between 110 and 130, not a touch on the 130's

[Plasticin]

Scott,
Last weekend we threw 4 inch hollow bellies in conjuntion with 110mm squidgies.[ No larger ones were on board] We did not register a hit on the hollow bodies, yet caught several on the 110mm squidgies-consequently the hollow bellies werent used! My theory was that larger bonies were in the area, and hitting the larger offerings!
Ben

Or is that because the fish weren't that active and needed more vibration to trigger a strike...

Had you modified the squidgies at all Ben?

Lyndon threw a 6' shadalicious and had quite a few hits, but no positive hook ups, I'm blaming angling ability;D ;D ;D

I threw a 4' hb as well for no interest but a 4' suspending storm drew some attention. We were theorising that because the shad "sat in their face for longer" then maybe that could trigger interest.

You also threw B52's as well did you not Ben? Did you throw the "big" version?

Interesting what you said Brian, but you hooked fish on a 6' hollowbelly???

There isn't really a right answer is there, I suppose but it is interesting to talk about it. And just on a side note, Lyndon's 4' plastic was what drew the majority of our hook ups.

Overall perhaps the most pleasing thing is that we were in areas where there were fish, whether active or not. This means that you have the confidence to experiment which is what it is all about.

[BR65]

Scotty, the hollows worked for me, and I would have stuck with them, but I only had 3 on board, and they arent the most durable of SP's!
Ive taken to the squidgies with the scissors, as Im know most do, the other thing I tried was removing the slick rig jig head, and replacing it with a 1/4 oz 5/0 nitro, but threaded thru the nose like a conventional set up, rather than buried in the body like the store brought version, if that makes sense? I dunno, it seems to shift the weight out of the head and forward a little more, maybe taking away some of the "stiffness" associated with haveing a piece of lead inside the SP?
Like you say, very interesting stuff!

[BR65]

[quote=Plasticin;963997]

Interesting what you said Brian, but you hooked fish on a 6' hollowbelly???

quote]


Sorry mate, should have been clearer, the 110 and 130's were squidgies, the bigger hollows worked, but I put that down to a good action at a slower retrieve, hence in the fish's face longer.

[darylive]

IMHO There is a lot to be said for smacking the lure in the fishes face. :o

I think regardless of what it is, sometimes they bite everything other times nothing but I think if it is in their face they will have a go and there is not alot we can do about that :-/ other than find the right spot and give 'em heaps.;D

But it is all good fun theorising and tinkering, we love it almost as much as fishing (ALMOST) and we can talk for hours on it. 8-)

[Plasticin]

Sounds good mate, noticed that the taylor's do that as well, jighead rigging a slick rig. Haven't tried it yet, but I can understand what you are saying. Whilst the slick rigs aren't the greatest plastic out there, they are quite easy to modify.

Don't worry I was following you re squidgies just interesting they were hitting 6' hb's as well as the smaller squidgy.

[Awoonga]

This sure makes interesting reading ... so l just thought that l would add a comment or two ! Monduran one Million Barra....Large waterway...Uneducated Fish...These fish have a Abundant food source...At least five different types of food that are not found in Awoonga ....A smorgasboard of delights so lets compare this to us ....The human....Whats on the menu today ? pie same as yesterday.... Pie....same as tomorrow... if its the only food that you can get fine you wont starve....But if l said today you have a choice ? would you have that pie ? One day this lure works... Tomorrow... same lure ...nothing....Try something bigger/Smaller.. and you get results.....The best thing that l ever did was get a tank barra...Everyday you learn...Now l can hear you saying these are only fish ! They eat what swims past... wrong...The food swims around with my barra...untill the dinner bell rings then you best lookout...And because there are different types of food that live in the tank he has a selection to choose from... Does he chase everything and eat the lot ? nope...Just what he requires....But there is a slant to this... if you offer him a treat that just sits in his space or in his face its goooonnee ...just like a Suspending lure... So there are ways and means to getting a reaction...... In a couple of years monduran barra will wise up they will become harder to catch ...you the angler will have to do the same or go home with that donut...

[eotbmg]

Or is that because the fish weren't that active and needed more vibration to trigger a strike...

Had you modified the squidgies at all Ben?

Lyndon threw a 6' shadalicious and had quite a few hits, but no positive hook ups, I'm blaming angling ability;D ;D ;D

I threw a 4' hb as well for no interest but a 4' suspending storm drew some attention. We were theorising that because the shad "sat in their face for longer" then maybe that could trigger interest.

You also threw B52's as well did you not Ben? Did you throw the "big" version?

Interesting what you said Brian, but you hooked fish on a 6' hollowbelly???

There isn't really a right answer is there, I suppose but it is interesting to talk about it. And just on a side note, Lyndon's 4' plastic was what drew the majority of our hook ups.

Overall perhaps the most pleasing thing is that we were in areas where there were fish, whether active or not. This means that you have the confidence to experiment which is what it is all about.


Yes Scotty I modify my Squidgies. Boiled and have the tail wrist cut. Nav got a fish on a 4inch suspending storm, first or second cast after flogging a squidgy and B52[ which also suspends with terminal adjustments]. What i also noticed was it was a longer cast than all his others. Interesting!!!!!
Lee scored a fish on a big B 52 also with changed trebles to make it suspend.
Ben

[BR65]

This sure makes interesting reading ... so l just thought that l would add a comment or two ! Monduran one Million Barra....Large waterway...Uneducated Fish...These fish have a Abundant food source...At least five different types of food that are not found in Awoonga ....A smorgasboard of delights so lets compare this to us ....The human....Whats on the menu today ? pie same as yesterday.... Pie....same as tomorrow... if its the only food that you can get fine you wont starve....But if l said today you have a choice ? would you have that pie ? One day this lure works... Tomorrow... same lure ...nothing....Try something bigger/Smaller.. and you get results.....The best thing that l ever did was get a tank barra...Everyday you learn...Now l can hear you saying these are only fish ! They eat what swims past... wrong...The food swims around with my barra...untill the dinner bell rings then you best lookout...And because there are different types of food that live in the tank he has a selection to choose from... Does he chase everything and eat the lot ? nope...Just what he requires....But there is a slant to this... if you offer him a treat that just sits in his space or in his face its goooonnee ...just like a Suspending lure... So there are ways and means to getting a reaction...... In a couple of years monduran barra will wise up they will become harder to catch ...you the angler will have to do the same or go home with that donut...


Like being offered a jelly bean after youve eaten a roast dinner mate?

[chewy01]

Just to throw another variation into the mix(and it was left behind this trip,bloody andy) I got a nice fish on spin gear last yearon a 150 squidgy fish rigged on a 6/0 resin head. Sinks nice n slow and the hook seems quite strong,not sure what hook they use in these as they are not the same as the slick rig hooks but it drifts down quite well.Just something else to try.Works for me..when they are in the boat :(

[rc@hinze]

Just an observation I have made on Leader material from my limited experience.

My first 3 barra trips I have always used a single strand of Black Magic 80lb. I had never noticed scuffed leader with fish landed from first two trips to Awoonga and then hooked but missed fish at Monduran.

Last trip to Monduran I changed to Penn 10x 80lb and I started noticing scuffed leaders.

I thought I would do an experiment and but just needed to find something rough to simulate the barra. So I started with cutting thru my leaders against the edge of house bricks. I did 6 goes each on the Penn and Black Magic and against different house bricks. In all cases the Black Magic needed at least twice as many rubs against the house brick to cut through it.

I also just rubbed the leader against the edge of a house brick and each time the Penn seemed to scuff worse than the Black Magic.

I like the look, feel and packaging of the Penn better but I think I may be sticking to the Black Magic on my next barra trip. Maybe I subconsciously used more pressure on one than other. Please feel free to try this yourselves and come up with your own conclusions. - cheers Richard

[Awoonga]

Yes l too have found the Penn to be a bit softer... There is two types of magic now l have used both... They are better than the penn in my humble opion... For twisteds l use Nitline...But l have been trying another by Platypus....Platinum...Early days yet...Stay tuned

[NAGG]

I just noticed that the 5" Hollow bellies are now available .......... I reckon this size will be awesome ( the 4" looses a bit of that wonderful roll ....... when rigged traditionally) ......... The 5" looks perfect
Anyhow ...... I'm going to fish these bad boys on 7,8/O ? ( weighted worm hooks first chance I get ......... (lighter more buoyant presentation) ...... Toss it into those point weed edges & jiggle /roll them out -- - - :P now that will be a jellybean!

Bring on March :)

Chris

[STIFFWORM]

hi Chris got some of the 6 inch holow bellies .gunna rig them with 8/0 weighted hooks. All going well i should b at mondy this comming weekend . Plan 2 tie up and work some suitable points. Let all know how i go. cheers les
;)

[chewy01]

Bring some strong rope,if this cyclone comes down :):) Oh n i wouldnt tie up to the termite tree..

[Steve B]

Just an observation I have made on Leader material from my limited experience.

My first 3 barra trips I have always used a single strand of Black Magic 80lb. I had never noticed scuffed leader with fish landed from first two trips to Awoonga and then hooked but missed fish at Monduran.

Last trip to Monduran I changed to Penn 10x 80lb and I started noticing scuffed leaders.

I thought I would do an experiment and but just needed to find something rough to simulate the barra. So I started with cutting thru my leaders against the edge of house bricks. I did 6 goes each on the Penn and Black Magic and against different house bricks. In all cases the Black Magic needed at least twice as many rubs against the house brick to cut through it.

I also just rubbed the leader against the edge of a house brick and each time the Penn seemed to scuff worse than the Black Magic.

I like the look, feel and packaging of the Penn better but I think I may be sticking to the Black Magic on my next barra trip. Maybe I subconsciously used more pressure on one than other. Please feel free to try this yourselves and come up with your own conclusions. - cheers Richard

Richard,

couldnt agree more. I have changed a lot of things over the years barra fishing for various reasons to find the optimum gear for the job. My leader has never changed. always been Black magic...has never failed. I was given some penn 10x and had 2 bustoffs in 3 fish....back to 60lb black magic and all good again. Might have been a fluke....but I lost confidence instantly. Only thing I have changed is upgraded to 80lb black magic supple for plastics. and 60lb tough for HB's

cheers Steve

[BR65]

Chewy, if the termite tree goes, imagine what will happen to average catch rates?
Never seen a spot host so many big fish consistantly.

[chewy01]

Thats only because of the foamy water there from all the lures landing :)

[BR65]

Touche!
With persistance comes results

[chewy01]

Actually havent seen the bundy tackleworld boat there for a bit.Maybe they know something every1 else doesnt,that or they have released a particularly voracious breed of termite onto the tree. Need to put a few permanent moorings up there. Steve maybe you could get onto that for the visitors..

[BR65]

Old mate in his skeeter, stratos whatever tied up to it on Monday, no leccy to glide in on, so the young fella driving was crunching, and I mean crunching, the gears on the big yam to get in on the tree. He still lost a big fish, and boated a tugger, amazing stuff considering the noise he made in tieing off.

[Colo77]

Richard,

couldnt agree more. I have changed a lot of things over the years barra fishing for various reasons to find the optimum gear for the job. My leader has never changed. always been Black magic...has never failed. I was given some penn 10x and had 2 bustoffs in 3 fish....back to 60lb black magic and all good again. Might have been a fluke....but I lost confidence instantly. Only thing I have changed is upgraded to 80lb black magic supple for plastics. and 60lb tough for HB's

cheers Steve

Steve, I have been using Penn 10x for a while but am yet to tangle with any big girls. For some reason I only seem to attract the rats:-/ (12 or 13 years chasin barra in the fresh & my pb is still only 64cm:( ). The Penn seems fine with them so far but it's inevitible I will run into a big girl sooner or later (pref sooner:) ).I have noticed a bit of scuffing of late since I am getting more consistent with my catches, touch wood. Possibly due to use of SP's in lieu of HB's. Most fish are around 60cm with some hits from larger models using 30lb twisted leaders (to create 60lb) or 60lb straight.

I am a former user of Black Magic, never had any issues with it (I thought it was great), just wanted to try sumthin else. You & Richard have some compelling reasons to go back.

Thanks.

[Steve B]

Actually havent seen the bundy tackleworld boat there for a bit.Maybe they know something every1 else doesnt,that or they have released a particularly voracious breed of termite onto the tree. Need to put a few permanent moorings up there. Steve maybe you could get onto that for the visitors..

I dont even know what tree yous are talking about. seriously....I think I have an idea where it is. I know the tackleworld boat looks like the guidelines boat from the dam...sure your not mixing them up....Rob and Adrian reckon there were stacks of boats near/on one of their spots.?

[Steve B]

Old mate in his skeeter, stratos whatever tied up to it on Monday, no leccy to glide in on, so the young fella driving was crunching, and I mean crunching, the gears on the big yam to get in on the tree. He still lost a big fish, and boated a tugger, amazing stuff considering the noise he made in tieing off.

Ha ha ha, I know who that is. Our local publican. His electric motor shaft was smashed in a 'malfunction' of some kind.....now I know where you tree is. He flogs that spot too.

[Steve B]

Steve, I have been using Penn 10x for a while but am yet to tangle with any big girls. For some reason I only seem to attract the rats:-/ (12 or 13 years chasin barra in the fresh & my pb is still only 64cm:( ). The Penn seems fine with them so far but it's inevitible I will run into a big girl sooner or later (pref sooner:) ).I am a former user of Black Magic, never had any issues with it but I thought it was great. You & Richard push some compelling reasons to go back.

Thanks.

Colo,

thanks mate. I reckon its a confidence thing for me. There a lots of fans for the 10x. I think its too stiff, and goes that milky colour after a while.

Thats just me. Steve

[chewy01]

Naa Steve it was the tackle world blokes,i met em last year.Pepper point or pepper tree?? ring any bells??

[Steve B]

where roo and Nagg were at muster?? I do think its the same spot Woodsy from the pub has been flogging.....and everyone for the last 6 months. Good if it keeps producing...reminds me of Erics tree in Gay bay about 18 months ago.!! mmm the similarities!!;)

[Colo77]

The 10x i'm using at present appears fairly milky as new! As I recall, the Black Magic is fairly translucent in comparison.

[BR65]

Reckon thats the spot mate

[Steve B]

The 10x i'm using at present appears fairly milky as new! As I recall, the Black Magic is fairly translucent in comparison.

Yeah thought it was, couldnt remember if it got that way or came that way:D

[chewy01]

yea thats it steve,same 1 my apprentice jagged a good fish to put him in the places in some comp a while ago.we need a bit more rain so we can go fish the treeline up the back,plenty of places for all to tie up now ben has removed all the wire :):)
oh oops did i say that out aloud ??

[NAGG]

where roo and Nagg were at muster?? I do think its the same spot Woodsy from the pub has been flogging.....and everyone for the last 6 months. Good if it keeps producing...reminds me of Erics tree in Gay bay about 18 months ago.!! mmm the similarities!!;)

I'm surprised there is no parking meter on that tree::) ........... Everytime you go past it ...... there is a boat there! .......

good spot though:P

[Whitto]

Old mate in his skeeter, stratos whatever tied up to it on Monday, no leccy to glide in on, so the young fella driving was crunching, and I mean crunching, the gears on the big yam to get in on the tree. He still lost a big fish, and boated a tugger, amazing stuff considering the noise he made in tieing off.Friggin Tractor gearboxes ya just can't get enough clutch on em Brian;D

[Roo]

Colo,

thanks mate. I reckon its a confidence thing for me. There a lots of fans for the 10x. I think its too stiff, and goes that milky colour after a while.

Thats just me. Steve

Kim and I have only used 60lb Penn 10x so far and only had one bust off in a dozen fish.....lots of scuffing but 2 fish with deep hooked plastics made it to the boat that would have come close to 25kg (115 & 117) and after a reasonably longish fight from each of them. the one that did get away was gone after only 20 seconds.

That said, The Black magic does look good. what is the difference between supple and hard....is it a coating or completely different formula. Anyone used the Black Magic Fluorocarbon?

Cheers Roo.

[NAGG]

Kim and I have only used 60lb Penn 10x so far and only had one bust off in a dozen fish.....lots of scuffing but 2 fish with deep hooked plastics made it to the boat that would have come close to 25kg (115 & 117) and after a reasonably longish fight from each of them. the one that did get away was gone after only 20 seconds.

That said, The Black magic does look good. what is the difference between supple and hard....is it a coating or completely different formula. Anyone used the Black Magic Fluorocarbon?

Cheers Roo.

Hi Roo
The FC is really stiff ...... good abrasion resistance - but it still wears through :( MW lost a couple of good fish at Awoonga last Sept & I know that his gear only puts out a fairly low drag pressure (3kg)
I didn't like it ....... but MW was happy to use it ( he never paid for it;D )

Chris

Chris

[Peter4]

That said, The Black magic does look good. what is the difference between supple and hard....is it a coating or completely different formula. Anyone used the Black Magic Fluorocarbon?

G'day Roo,

Kyle and I always use Black Magic Supple Trace. We started with 60lb originally but I moved up to 80lb when we started throwing big plastics at barra in 2008.

So far we have only lost one fish to a 60lb leader and it was a monster (estimate 120cm+!) that fought long and hard in open water....

The tough trace is more abrasion resistant but stiffer and harder to get the knots right. The fluorocarbon is also stiffer and heavier and we found that it affected the rise rate of tuned lures, so we ditched it and went back to supple.....

I love the stuff!!;D

Regs

Pete

[Colo77]

All these metre+ fish you guys talk about :huh:, I still havn't joined the metre club::) ! I feel likev there's been a bad omen placed on me or sumthin!

Been fishin freshwater for em for years, 11-12 years in Emerald, Nogoa River (stocked weirs) & been in Mackay now 2.5 years. Havn't been able to get away too often (3 kids under 4) I fish Teemburra mostly but Kinchant has some monsters & faust is only 1.5hrs up the road. I've only fished the latter 2 once each. I guess persistence pays, i'll have to keep pluggin away. You guys get me all fired up every time I come on here.;) :D :D

Cheers,