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View Full Version : Used Hainess 445F Prices



TJ Bear
23-01-2009, 03:02 PM
Been looking around at some used Haines 445F's man nearly had a heart attack. 3o year old boats in poor condition, rotted transom, old evenrude 2-stroke 9k. Good examples with a newer Yamaha 2 stroke from 11 to 15k. All the boats I looked at where in poor condition and a minimum of 20 years old. I know there a classic little hull, I worked at Haines long enough and know there is buggar all to them. Just blew me away what they are getting for them. :o

Bruce_Bogtrotter
23-01-2009, 03:50 PM
Are they really that good? or are you just paying for the legend on a boat that was great 30 years ago But has plenty of competiton from newer boats these days..

Steeler
23-01-2009, 04:31 PM
Hi TJ Bear.Came across your thread and note you worked for Haines.Without running the risk of hijacking ya thread i am wondering if you may be able to help me.I purchased a V16R and it has at some stage had the transom replaced so i have no idea as to it's vintage.if i could arrane some pics for you would it be at all possible to shed some light on it's age ?.

Cheers Steve.

TJ Bear
23-01-2009, 05:57 PM
post some pics and I'll do my best.

Steeler
23-01-2009, 06:24 PM
Hi TJ Bear.Thank you for that,i will gather some pics 2morrow and post.When the time comes to sell it would be nice to give a potetial buyer as accurate info as possible.

Cheers Steve.

Steeler
25-01-2009, 08:53 PM
post some pics and I'll do my best.


Hi TJ Bear.Having allsorts of drama's trying to post pics:( :( ,would it be at all possible to e-mail me on smlewis1@bigpond.com.au and i will reply with pics ???.

Regards Steve.

sooty_mad
26-01-2009, 10:09 AM
TJ
You should be able to get hold of a 146 Haines cheaper. Below the join line (deck/hull) they are exactly the same boat. Any Haines that old you should anticipate redoing the floor and transom.
In my opinion they are worth it. Better than any modern hull up to 15foot.
Kind regards... David

ped cairns
26-01-2009, 09:38 PM
I found one [146] sitting under a mango tree in backyard of guys house had a very good trailer on it and paid 1200, it was perfect to do up as timber rotten and very soft made it a bit easier to strip
i put timber floor and stringers back in it and 60 4stroke which seemed to make it sit a little low in water now but ride is great for boat this size good luck

ps just remembered i put add in paper for one in any condition worked well

goodluck

Smithy
27-01-2009, 08:39 AM
Exactly what Jeffo found out when he was looking around. That is why he is doing a 445R to 445F conversion.

TJ Bear
27-01-2009, 08:52 PM
Nearly worth while flopping a hull and deck mould and selling the boats as unassembled parts for people to build there own. I could make a profit out of selling a hull with internal 100ltr tank and floor, ring deck and console as three parts for $6k you join it assemle and fittout as you wish. Nobody owns the hull rights anymore so any Joe can flop one.

dooley
27-01-2009, 09:54 PM
Are they really that good? or are you just paying for the legend on a boat that was great 30 years ago But has plenty of competiton from newer boats these days..


i don't think they're that good mate - why anyone would pay such a ridiculous amount for a 30 year old boat with a timber floor, timber stringers and timber transom is beyond me given the potential for rot and other problems for a boat of that age.

they're a very deep vee so pathetic at rest but great underway and being 14.5ft (4.45m) they're a bloody small boat!

yes they're a good, predictable hull but in all honesty i think think the fact that there was a lack of comparable hulls on the market for a long while meant that the 445F became extremely desirable in it's day and the legend has lingered - there are a number of hulls that would be just as good if not better these days

TJ Bear
27-01-2009, 10:42 PM
Dooley the 445 is amazingly stable at rest, I was the production Manager at Haines before moving to Riviera and been building boats for a while and I can't think of a better 15ft hull. I do agree with the ridiculous prices and the old school engineering but if you where building it now you could infuse the parts with a core and with the stringers and bulkheads built over foam formers. Would be lighter and stronger.

upstart
27-01-2009, 10:54 PM
Interesting what you say about flopping a mould off the hull. Are the Formula boats a copy of the Haines of old? Also, I think the Dale brand of boats from Home Hill in NQ are pretty simialr too.

Steeler
27-01-2009, 11:37 PM
Hi TJ Bear

Thanks for all your help and taking the time out to lend a hand.

Regards Steve

dooley
28-01-2009, 08:49 PM
Dooley the 445 is amazingly stable at rest, I was the production Manager at Haines before moving to Riviera and been building boats for a while and I can't think of a better 15ft hull. I do agree with the ridiculous prices and the old school engineering but if you where building it now you could infuse the parts with a core and with the stringers and bulkheads built over foam formers. Would be lighter and stronger.

appreciate your thoughts as an insider mate

maybe i had higher expectations of the hull - i had one for about 8 years and don't remember it as an exceptionally stable hull.

the hull was sensitive to weight distribution and would list significantly if two blokes were standing on the same side. i distinctly rememeber having to move to the opposite side of the boat when fighting a fish to let the gaff man in so that the boat was balanced.

overall i think it was the best hull in its class at the time but these days there are a number of comparable hulls that seem to be as good.

TJ Bear
28-01-2009, 09:08 PM
Can you give me an example of a glass 4.5m hull that is comparable? The 445F has a very wide beam to length ratio 4.5 x 2.06 and a very wide slightly returned chine. You may have seen something I have missed in the market. The Formula Hull is a 445F not sure if it's a flop or they bought the moulds as both the hull and deck are identical to the old 445F.

dooley
28-01-2009, 10:09 PM
Can you give me an example of a glass 4.5m hull that is comparable? The 445F has a very wide beam to length ratio 4.5 x 2.06 and a very wide slightly returned chine. You may have seen something I have missed in the market. The Formula Hull is a 445F not sure if it's a flop or they bought the moulds as both the hull and deck are identical to the old 445F.


i think formula bought the old haines moulds.

my point was that the 445F was a great hull in its day but there was nothing that competed with it for a long while around the 4.5-5mm length, in this day and age there are alternatives so why anyone would pay a premuim for a 30 year old hull is beyond me.

cruisecraft made a 4.7m hull with a 2.14m beam which i thought was decent little boat, the little haines traveler TD149 in a centre console is lighter but with similar dimensions to the 445F. poly boats have similar ride characteristics to glass and are another alternative. gale force, hooker etc also make small centre consoles that are worth a look - not exactly 4.5m but back when the 445F was king there was nothing really in the was of 4.5-5m glass centre consoles which is what made them highly sought after.

yes the 445F had nice wid chines and was a great, predictable hull both into the sea and in a following sea (i took mine out in some horrendous conditions and always felt relatively safe) but with a 2m beam and 20 degree vee i think the ride was great but the compromise came in stability at rest.

i'm not trying to be argumentative and appreciate that you know much more about boats than i do - i just remember my old hull and how it felt out at sea when at anchor or trying to gaff fish and think that options were extremely limited 30 years ago compared to today.

cheers,
d

sooty_mad
30-01-2009, 08:32 AM
I am quite sure that Dooley is right, Formula bought the moulds. Their boat is a clone of the old 445F.
Personally, I don't think anything compares with the 445 for seaworthyness, stability etc up to 15 feet.
The Hooker is a semi longboat and is quite narrow for its length. The Galeforce to me looks like a combination of about 80% 445 and about 20% Vsea. A very good boat but in my opinion (particularly for the type of fishing I do) it is too high sided.
Just my two bobs worth.
David

vini79
01-02-2009, 04:48 PM
Formula did buy a set of the moulds and also Flycraft 445f is also being made, This is being produced by Entaprise marine. A very basic fitout on these boats either a formula of flycraft is over 16k hull only, add trailer and a motor and a decent setup and your over 35k.
I have just tracked down one and should have it in my hands next week..
Keep you all posted

seaeagle
06-02-2009, 10:44 AM
My 445f is very stable at rest & rides very well in all seas. I think they are worth the price as if you have to buy a new galefore or similar you would be looking at double the price. There are not many of those cruise craft lure boats around either

HH565L
08-02-2009, 09:58 PM
Nobody owns the hull rights anymore so any Joe can flop one.

How can you be certain of that TJ?

Formula Power Boats in Melbourne build them and I've been told indirectly they own the rights to the moulds.

Having said that I know of at least one other crowd that are building the same boat in NSW or QLD. Will look them up and post details when I get a chance.

stevej
10-02-2009, 01:18 PM
maybe with a slowdown in the economy the focus of manufacturers will come back to affordable 14-15 footers

instead fo the 6m monsters in fashion atm

easy to tow resonably economical with a modern engine, good family or if a little hought to setup good fishing boats

Tewantin
10-02-2009, 07:48 PM
Hi TJ, I'd value any comment you might have about the following.
I too grew up with the legend of the original Haines boats and did a lot of fishing on my mates V17L. A fantastic open ocean boat. I recently bought my first boat after many years of jumping on other peoples boats and settled on a secondhand Haines Seaquell 460RF. Would I be correct in saying that this is a very similar hull to the 445? I picked this boat up for $6500 with a 1996 60hp Mercury and only 170 hours on the clock. I had a mate that knows boats come and look at it before I bought it and he said it was immaculate for its age. I love it to death but have to agree that its a bit sensitive to weight distribution. Maybe you could enlighten me with your thoughts as to whether this might be a better value alternative to the 445 from an affordability factor?

upstart
10-02-2009, 08:22 PM
Tewantin, that sounds like a great buy!! The Seaquell, I believe, used a VDH hull design and are great little boats. All samll boats are sensitive to weight distribution. You get the feel for it and move things around. No problem.