Who services thier inflatable PFDs every 12 mths?

[the gecko]

I got picked up by the water police at Hervey Bay a few weeks ago. He informs me that my inflatable pfd must be serviced every 12 mths to be legal, and that mine is 2 yrs old, -oops. " No worries mate, he says, I'll let you off this time. You can self service them if you want, as long as you log the date in this slip, located inside the pfd."

OK, Ive learned something, I said, thanks. Then the problems begin. Nobody can sell me a kit to self service them. BFC and the local chandlery can both sell me a 2 yr old gas cyinder, but have no idea about servicing. I ring the nice water police, and get told, "check the manufacturers instructions, and do whatever they say, and youll be legal."

Next stop is RFD the maker, and they say "we dont let you self service them. Send it back to us for a service at $44 plus parts plus $50 courier fee" But i can buy a new one for $90. I wonder what the date is on a new one?

So now I think the device is totally useless after 12 mths?

lesson learned - check the manufacturer date when you buy em.

Now the best way out seems to be to keep an old yellow pfd1 on board to comply with legislation, and wear the out of date pfd for comfort.

What do you do, service em, or replace em with new ones ?
Did you know they were only good for 12 mths?

cheers
Andrew

[peterbo3]

Gecko,
A lot of the inflatables will use a generic cartridge. The service is basically inflating the vest with old cartridge, waiting six hours to check for leaks, deflating & inserting a fresh CO2 cartridge. Replacement cartridges are around $22.

[SatNav]

"Now the best way out seems to be to keep an old yellow pfd1 on board to comply with legislation, and wear the out of date pfd for comfort."

1. Assuming you are wearing the inflatable PFD as something you intend to use rather than a fashion statement or simply for "comfort" then you would hope the thing works if you really need it? How would you know this if it wasn't serviced?

2. A device that specifically requires checking/servicing or in a known state of functionally should be considered illegal if it is out of date and is being "used" as such a device

[peterbo3]

Gecko,
There is more info here:
http://www.msq.qld.gov.au/resources/file/eb661348477d530/Pfd_mib_lifejacket_pfd_faqs.pdf
See page 7.
My Hutchwilco PFDs have the service schedule included & owner servicing is described in detail. A small part only is required & the CO2 cartridge is to be inspected annually. Water Police at White Island suggest that I keep the reciept for the replacement bobbin. The link provides the relevant authority to service the inflatables yourself.
If the RFD instruction manual states that you must return the jacket to them for service, perhaps it will be cheaper to bite the bullet & buy a PFD such as Hutchwilco which can legally be serviced by the owner.::)::)::)

[foxx510]

I just went and checked the gas cylinders in mine, one was loose and would not have worked. Maybe this thread just saved my life!!

[pegasus]

I have made a few calls on this awhile back-sorry cant recall- try MSQ and this was the advice I got- date of sale is the relevant date -regarding service- keep the docket( photo copy).

Also when purchasing check that it is to Austratian standards. Some have a two year servicing schedule and rather than 12 months. Service to be in accordance with manufacturers schedule and instructions. Also you should be able to prove the servicing rather than some scribble on the vest. Keep reciepts and enter it in a safety equipment log.

[pegasus]

http://www.msq.qld.gov.au/resources/file/eb661348477d530/Pfd_mib_lifejacket_pfd_faqs.pdf

[TheRealAndy]

Mate if my life depended on it I would not buy one of these things. I use one on when manning the rescue boat for the yacht club only because by law states that you have too, but we are only 1mile offshore in moreton bay. I guess if you regularly cross a bar then the same idea would apply. Eitherway, i would still carry a regular pfd1. Closed cell foam cant deflate.

[Moonlighter]

The above posts point you in the correct direction - check with the manufacturer because the regs say they need to be serviced according to manuf requirements - mine are every 2 years. It is very easy to do, no dramas at all in fact!

BIAS have the kits and also you can get them thru BLA - I got mine from Stones Cnr Marine here in Brisvegas, about $20 recall. I marked the service tag in the jacket and also carry a service log in my boat as well.

The service log sheet helps to prove they were checked - attached is the form that I prepared which is modelled on one I saw in a marine shop one day from a PFD manufacturer - feel free to plagarise/use this form as you see fit, but no warranties are made or implied about whether it is acceptable or not to the authorities!!!

39686

[marty_z]

Andrew,

I had a Boating and Fisheries officer tell the crowd at the Flathead Classic that if you are wearing an inflatable PFD that is out of service date, as long as you are carrying enough regular PFD's for every person on board you are legally covered.

Now this 'exception' only works in areas where you do NOT legally have to "wear" a PFD - so inshore is fine. But if you were crossing a bar (where a jacket is compulsory) an out of service inflatable would be a violation.

Obviously you were pinned by Water Police, and I would double-check with them as this "loop-hole" is fairly open to interpretation. But the idea came from authorities (Boating & Fisheries) - not me!

Marty

[Charlie]

You may have to register to view the videos however this page show you exactly how to do the service if you scroll down to lession 14

http://www.########.com/Resources/view_news.aspx?NewsID=2872

[breeze53]

Gecko,

I get my Hutchwilco jackets serviced at Marinesafe at Springwood every 12 months. $33 per jacket, 24 hr service, and they provide an official certificate of service stating the serial number of the jackets and date tested, which I always keep a copy of on board for any inspection.

There can be little argument with the authorities in my opinion, when you have a recognised safety supplier such as these guys certify them, and the price is not worth taking the risk on your life, or with the authorities by trying to do it yourself.

I have been using them for several years now, and have received first class service with them everytime.

Breeze53.

[chewy01]

Hey andrew,
give mike a bell at boaties warehouse, he put me on the tright track with mine, up in maryborough.

[Dave_H]

The bizarre thing is that the inflatable jackets used in aviation only have to be serviced every two years. Go figure.::)

[foxx510]

I guess the aviation ones never get used though. Ours get exposed to salt water and hooks and sharp fins and boat hardware regularly.

[the gecko]

Gecko,
A lot of the inflatables will use a generic cartridge. The service is basically inflating the vest with old cartridge, waiting six hours to check for leaks, deflating & inserting a fresh CO2 cartridge. Replacement cartridges are around $22.

So how do they know the new cartridge is gonna work? It seems pro testing is no better than self testing then?

Anyway, thanks guys, a lot of good info there.

The hutchwilco ones seem a good long term option for next time I buy one.
Im gonna look into the BIAS kits first, cos Id like to DIY, and I'll keep a log book in the boat.
I'll try chewys mate too.

Im mainly looking at them for bay work solo at night, and Im only a few miles from shore in smooth waters. I dont cross bars, but I agree with marty, thats the time when they arent legal.

cheers
Andrew

[jeffrey_h]

I got 2 off the net with no instructions at all. Got pulled over by the police, they said these are out of date, "no they're not I just brought them weeks ago", yes they are date here says Oct '06, "but I brought them "BRAND NEW"", so he let me off.

Contacted the company who, of course, don't care, insist that they are brand new. Would you trust that those cyl. would not leak over 3 years. I could have legally written the purchase date on them, but with no instructions or trust I got them serviced by Marine Safe at Springwood Brisbane for $33.00 each, pickup. And brought the new EPIRB off them as well.

I then contacted other people who brought them and some were 3 years old, sorry NEW! Marine Safe had them on special for $90.00 I think, maybe $99.00?

They test the inflation of the jacket, then weigh the cylinder with very accurate scales to check for any loss of gas, if none they don't change the bottle.

You should keep a copy of the purchase doc. to prove your case as the fines are $150.00 each, and no, as stated, if the jacket is out of date and you are wearing it, regardless of any other jackets on board, you will be fined.

How many people are now going to check the service date on theirs after reading these posts, everybody I hope.

Jeffrey MERRY XMAS

[foxx510]

The bottles on my Burke pfds are stamped 06, the jackets are less than 12months old.

[Spaniard_King]

So how do they know the new cartridge is gonna work? It seems pro testing is no better than self testing then?

cheers
Andrew


A good cartridge will sink in a bucket of water a bad one wil float

[Moonlighter]

Comment posted above by Peterbo3 is not quite correct - to test the inflation an pressure holding of the jacket you don't need to set off the existing cylinder (thereby incurring a replacement cost), you can simply use the manual tube to inflate it and leave overnight to verify that it holds pressure. Then fill in the log (see my previous post for an example form) and that's one part of the testing procedure completed. The others are listed on the form.

By the way, the gas cylinders are completely sealed, so its a bit hard to imagine them "losing pressure"?

When activated they are pierced by a spike, so there's no way I can see that they can be partially discharged. The only thing I can think of that would make them lose pressure is if they were corroded pretty severely. Or is the alloy they are made of somehow permeable???

[the gecko]

if the jacket is out of date and you are wearing it, regardless of any other jackets on board, you will be fined.

Jeffrey MERRY XMAS

This is wrong. Water Police have informed me that the law states 'there must be one legal pfd on the boat for every person on the boat.' he went on to inform me that there is no law against having an out of date pfd, as long as it is surplus to the number of people on board. He said he definitley will NOT fine me for having it, as long as I have a standard, legal, pfd on board for each person.

the exception to this is when crossing a bar, you must have the legal pfd on.

They will also accept purchase receipts as proof of purchase date, as long as you have them with you, so a log book with recepits permanantly on the boat, will be my next step.

Andrew

[Didley]

Andrew, I've been following this post with interest, I didn't know about all this, but I'm glad you've informed us. I can understand the regulations, but it's just one more thing to pay every year, I'll be staying with the old type jacket 4 a while.


Dids

[jeffrey_h]

Andrew,

"the exception to this is when crossing a bar, you must have the legal pfd on."

That is the times when I'm talking about, over a bar or outside x 2nm.
Not too many people will wait for the day they want to go outside before they get them serviced.

These jackets are so much more comfortable to wear than the bricks.

Jeffrey

[tenzing]

This is wrong. Water Police have informed me that the law states 'there must be one legal pfd on the boat for every person on the boat.' he went on to inform me that there is no law against having an out of date pfd, as long as it is surplus to the number of people on board. He said he definitley will NOT fine me for having it, as long as I have a standard, legal, pfd on board for each person.

the exception to this is when crossing a bar, you must have the legal pfd on.

They will also accept purchase receipts as proof of purchase date, as long as you have them with you, so a log book with recepits permanantly on the boat, will be my next step.

Andrew
I,m with Andrew,
The water police stopped me 2 weeks ago just off combuyuro, My boys both had current inflatables on but I had taken mine off and it was expired . I got an explanation (rather than a caution?) but when I explained that I had more foam pfd 1's on board I was told that I could wear what I liked as long as I had the right number of current jackets on board.(this obviously includes the fact that we were not crossing a bar)
While they were at it they commented on my undersize rego, and I've since noticed that every victory for sale has undersize numbers/letters . Whats with that?
Brendan
Ps they told me that there are some inflatables for sale with a 3 yr service date. Anyone know where?

[the gecko]

I saw chewys mate at Boaties Warehouse, but since my pfd is RFD brand, they cant sell me a kit. Kits are brand specific, they said. The cost of servicing the pfd thru RFD is about the same as the cost of a new pfd, once you add in couriers fees. So dont buy an RFD from Anaconda, unless you live near Logan RFD factory.

Technically, I could still buy a gas cylinder, make up a log book, and paste in a receipt, to pass muster with the water police. They dont seem to mind me self servicing them. However, I want the peace of mind of knowing thats it gonna work properly, if Im gonna wear it when Im fishing solo at night on the bay.

Now Ive decided to buy a new one, so Im gonna look for a pfd that needs servicing every 2 years. Anybody know which brand I should go for?

cheers
Andrew

[the gecko]

I ended up with a Platinum self service kit for $30 from a mate at tackleworld. He said theres no such thing as 2 yr service vests. And just because a manufacturer doesnt want to sell you a kit, that doesnt mean you cant service them yourself.

If the vest has the yellow slip inside for writing service dates on, then you can self service them. Ive written the new date on that slip, and I have to keep a legible copy of the service kit receipt with me at all times. That means photocopying it, and putting it in a snap lock bag, or even laminating it, and keeping it in the boat or wallet.

Of course getting it serviced by a manufacturuer is still a good idea for those who dont want do DYI.

Andrew

[Zodiac fisho]

This is wrong. Water Police have informed me that the law states 'there must be one legal pfd on the boat for every person on the boat.' he went on to inform me that there is no law against having an out of date pfd, as long as it is surplus to the number of people on board. He said he definitley will NOT fine me for having it, as long as I have a standard, legal, pfd on board for each person.

the exception to this is when crossing a bar, you must have the legal pfd on.

They will also accept purchase receipts as proof of purchase date, as long as you have them with you, so a log book with recepits permanantly on the boat, will be my next step.

Andrew


You see the Water Police and Parks and Wildlife wear inflatable jackets but by law they have to have coastal foam jackets on board because they are operating under survey and inflatable jackets do not comply for this.

You will find that most new inflatables only have a 1 year service now. Some of the older Hutchwilco jackets were 2 years and some older European jackets were 3 years.

The Co2 cylinder has an indefinite life as long as there is no corrosion. One thing to check with cylinders if servicing yourself is that they have not been partially struck. The jackets with a pull tag out the side can be caught on something and the wearer does not realise they have almost fired the cylinder The firing pin touches the end of the cylinder leaving a slight indentation which could fire at anytime or allow the cylinder to slowly discharge. You would notice the discharge when the jacket slowly inflates over time. When you check the cylinder make sure there is no half circle indentation from the firing pin.

[Zodiac fisho]

The bizarre thing is that the inflatable jackets used in aviation only have to be serviced every two years. Go figure.::)

I think the new vacuum sealed aviation jackets are ten years. If the vacuum is gone the jacket needs a service. For the price they would probably throw them out after that and buy new ones.

[oldboot]

I think the critical difference with the avation jackets is an asumption that they will be stowed and not worn.
The asumption is that marine jacket will be worn and subject to wear and tear.

cheers

[Lovey80]

Zodiac I find it highly unlikely that a firing pin held back under spring tension could almost fire or partially fire. It will either realease completely or not at all IMHO. The required pressure for that firing pin to pierce the cylinder is quite significant and as such that spring tension is quite high. Once released its all over!

As for the corrosion thing, has anyone thought of coating the cylinder with Vas or similar and covering with a placcy bag sealed with a rubber band?

Cheers

Chris

[oldboot]

It will probly be found that the manufacturers specify both of those observations.

I do not have first hand exposure to the mechanism but if the cylinder was partialy pearced or near I would also be inspecting the mechanism for a possible fault.

As for precention of corrosion....I am sure the cylinders would be andoised or coated in some way anyway.

Application of any form of grease is very likly to compromise the rubber and synthetic material of the jacket.......I would expect traces of grease on the fabric to be a possible reason for condemming a jacket.

Putting a plastic bag over the cylinder is unlikly to help probaly make matters worse.

the best prevention for the corrosion is probably rinsing the jacket with clean fresh water and leaving it open to dry if it gets wet......If there is corrosion on the cylinder there is likly to be mould on the fabric....another reason to reject the jacket.

cheers

[the gecko]

Well Ive done the self service now, so I can answer those last few queries.

The cylinders are anodised and rust resistant. There was no sign of any rust after 18 mths, and this jacket had been stowed near the anchor well, and was often wet from me hosing down the boat, even tho it was kept in a plastic bag.

Yes, the pull tag could be moved, and the firing pin could touch the cylinder. There is a small green circlip, covering the pullrope mechanism, and if this circlip is damaged, then the whole pfd is compromised. It either goes off, or its safe, there isnt much halfway. The main danger is more that the pullrope is pushed up inside the jacket, and you cant find it when you need it.

The act of servicing, means that you have to fire the cylinder, and leave the pfd inflated for at least 6 hrs to check for leaks. I left mine up for 24hrs, and had no loss of pressure. There is a mouthpiece to add pressure if you needed it at sea.

So you dont use the same cylinder when you service your pfd. The old one is used up and gone. The kit contains a new gas cylinder, and a new green or orange circlip, because your old circlip is also damaged in the act of firing for servicing.

The Platinum kits were available at Tackleworld. Other chandleries tried to sell me a new cylinder without the circlip. Watch out for that trick.

Im now very confident that my pfd will be 100% in any given situation.

cheers
Andrew

[Marky Mark]

After reading this I also looked at my el cheapo manual inflatable and the cylinder read "2006" and had a reasonable layer of corrosion on it! Back to BCF and get a "new" cylinder (no kit or circlips etc with this jacket) and I trundle home to do my own service. Pulled the cord and was suitably impressed when it went pop and blew up beautifully, left it overnight and it was still firm in the morning (know the feeling! :-* ) so I deflated and refolded it, wrote on in with a formal black texta, installed my new cylinder and felt very pleased with myself. I am still wondering what will happen if I get checked but it's certainly looking more convincing than it was, only cost $20 for the cylinder so nice and cheap too!

Thanks for the heads up! :D

[Feral]

Mate reckons you can get the same cylinders from bigger push bike shops for about half the price. The spandex heroes use them in some sort of tyre inflator device when on the road. Have not checked it out though.

[oldboot]

I doubt very much that a gas cylinder from a bycycle shop will pass compliance.

each inflatable jacket requires a specific gas cylinder. To pas inspection the gas cylinder must weigh the correct amount.
The specific gass cylinder also contains the correct amount of gas to inflate that PFD.

Using a bycycle shop cylinder cerrainly would not comply with the manufacturers service instructions and therefore would not be compliant.

I recently purchase an inflatable from MarineSafe Australia and they told me they can service almost any brand and model of jacket for under $40. that includes a notice of inspection and a date tag on the jacket

A cylinder will cost extra, but unless the jacket has been used or the cylinder does not pass inspection, that is not nessisary.

cheer

[Mindi]

Comment posted above by Peterbo3 is not quite correct - to test the inflation an pressure holding of the jacket you don't need to set off the existing cylinder (thereby incurring a replacement cost), you can simply use the manual tube to inflate it and leave overnight to verify that it holds pressure. Then fill in the log (see my previous post for an example form) and that's one part of the testing procedure completed. The others are listed on the form.

By the way, the gas cylinders are completely sealed, so its a bit hard to imagine them "losing pressure"?

When activated they are pierced by a spike, so there's no way I can see that they can be partially discharged. The only thing I can think of that would make them lose pressure is if they were corroded pretty severely. Or is the alloy they are made of somehow permeable???

Yes..and I asked about this in Whitworths today and you can "test" them yourself....it is just inspecting as listed. You dont have to replace the gas. You dont have to pay anyone $33 to do nothing to them but to write on a piece of paper. Keep your own written log. This is just another rip off.

[oldboot]

Yeh they could be telling you anything.

If you are not provided with manufacturers servicing and inspection instructions you are sunk.

Untill you see the paperwork from the manufacturer that specificlay states that the item can be user serviced and the details of the testing procedures and set down by the manufacturer... don't count on it.

cheers