Tow Vehicle Help

[levinge]

I have a 5.95M Formosa Centre Cab on a Redco Sportsman twin axle trailer. Currently towed by a 3.0L Mitsubishi Challenger, weight of boat and gear on the trailer would be around the 1 tonne. On a recent trip down to Proserpine and back I noticed that the Challenger labours a little up hill and into the wind.

So its time to upgrade the truck.

Question is - What would be the best vehicle for towing

[Ally Jack]

Levinge,

I'd try and get your boat and trailer on a weighbridge, I reckon it would weigh a fair bit more than 1 tonne...

I have a 3.0ltr turbo diesel Navara single cab, and have also owned the dual cab version as well. Great vehicles all round IMO

Ally Jack

[levinge]

Boat dry weight minus motor 670kg motor comes in at 220kg add an extra 110 kg of gear and its the 1 tonne, tare weight of the trailer is 500kg sportsman RT180mo

So I guess if you count the lot its 1.5 tonne towed

Was considering the following vehicles but would like to hear from those who own them and their ease of otherwise of towing that they have experienced.

Landcruiser 4.0 ltr and above
Landcruiser Prado 4.0ltr
Nissan Navara 4.0ltr
Nissan Patrol 4.2ltr

[Scott nthQld]

Yeah brett, your Boat, gear and Trailer would be way heavier than that, I tallied mine up the other day, hull is 360, engine 115, load of fuel would be around 50kg, plus esky, ice and gear would come in at another 100kg. Then the weight of the trailer would be about 300kg, so mine comes in at just under the tonne, and you've got a whole lot more boat than me, so I would say you'd be looking at aroung 1600kg plus.

As for a tow vehicle, if you've got the dollars its simple, Cruiser or patrol, but if its a baby 4X4 you want, I'd go with a navara 3L turbo deisel.


Edit: you beat me to it, if its a new car you want, you won't get a 4ltr patrol, and the navara 4ltr is petrol, where as IMO a deisel would be the go. The navara is capable of towing around 3500kg braked I think, if i remember correctly. Plus they look the goods which is a bonus and come with the Nissan reliability and guts.

[levinge]

Yeah the more I think about it, the more I lean toward a cruiser of patrol. As for weight I dont carry near as much ice as you there Scott.

Don't mind the idea of a Navara Diesel, but just can't swallow the fuel cost on a Diesel at the moment. So I'll be leaning to petrol until something changes. Will not be upgrading until around March next year when the Redundancy cheque lands on my coffee table...

[Spaniard_King]

Go The cruiser... plenty of room towing wise if ya need to upgrade the boat later :)

[levinge]

Garry the story goes

Pre Boat

Holden Zafira - then bought a 4m tinnie
Realised Holden no good on slipper ramps - Upgrade Misto Challenger
Sold tinnie - bought 5.95m Formosa Centre Cab
Realised Challenger underpowered - Upgrade Car

See a pattern here, so does the missus and I'd be a fisho minus vital anatomy if I even consider a bigger boat YET!!!!!

But don't count me out

[Chamelion]

To go against the grain of 4wd's.. How about a falcon? :)

Matt.

[age]

Levinge

Have you considered something like a V8 petrol 100 series Landcruiser. Heaps of power at 175Kw, 5 speed auto, awesome tow vehicle (my Southwind would weigh in about the same as your boat), the GXL is well appointed, safe with constant 4WD etc. With the credit crunch we are in, it is a buyers market for these type of vehicles - people are jumping out of them everywhere and you can snap one up at a bargain. I used to use a diesel Landcruiser, but the V8 petrol kills it as a tow vehicle and it may surprise you how economical it can be compared to a hard worked diesel when towing. Just take it easy around town and the bowser wont hurt too bad - unleaded is a bit cheaper than diesel as well, so cost difference in running the petrol V8 is narrowed further - half the services on the petrol compared to diesel as well - I would never go back to a diesel or manual 4WD again after using the V8 auto Cruiser for 2 years now - absolutely love it.


Cheers

A

[Scott nthQld]

To go against the grain of 4wd's.. How about a falcon? :)

Matt.

Chamelion, I have a newish falcon ute (2006) and it won't be up to the task of towing 1600kg, especially up a slippery ramp. About 1200kg would be the limit for a falcon when retrievng a boat.

As for the petrol vs diesel debate, a petrol vehicle will never match the low down grunt a diesel has....ever.

[levinge]

Hey Chamelion, last time i saw a falcon on the ramp with a boat, his wheel were spinning and going nowhere. had to be towed up by a 4wd. Up here in NQ we have some severe tides and 4wd is the safest option on any ramp for getting up and out of the way.

age - Thats pretty much what I would be going for - been doing a little looking but as I said a little earlier, March will be the time I will be going hard at getting one under my feet...Thanks for info

Scott, understand the Diesel theory but just can't justify the added expense on fuel. If the fuel wasn't an issue I would be considering one but the wallet (Missus) controls the fuel dollars for the boat so I gotta ease the pain where I can...

[Dan5]

Mate the 100 series v8 has more than enough "low down" grunt to pull your boat easily.You can pick one up for around 30k and stick it on lpg for another 2k after the rebate.

[Fatenhappy]

On a recent trip down to Proserpine and back I noticed that the Challenger labours a little up hill and into the wind.

So its time to upgrade the truck.

Question is - What would be the best vehicle for towing

Only one way to not have your vehicle "labour a little up hill and into the wind ..."

Get some thing like this .... 7.3Lt V8 turb diesel that can comfortably handle a combined GVM of 8 ton down the highway at 100K's and still give you less than 17Ltrs/110 K's ..... boat ... what boat ??? ;D ;D ;D

[scorpionNQ]

Hey Levinge,

If you really want to spend the dollars on a new vehicle, fair enough. But how many times are you going to proserpine? or any other long distance for that matter? Most vehicals (even prime movers) labors " A little up hill and into the wind". That's why most vehicles have 5 speed g/boxes. For the record I have a 4.2 Diesel maverick (patrol) and have owned this 4wd for 12 years. Has never missed a beat, and have spent bugger all on it, except the usual servicing. I have towed my 2.5T 625 cruisecraft, my current 7.3m longboat and car trailers with many diiferent cars on. My point is that even my vehicle will labor going up hills and into a reasonable head wind. Providing it handles your usual everyday chores, I would really consider spending the extra dollars at at the moment.
Most larger 4wd's are good for towing, but there is so much more in it than that. In my opinion, patrols are popular and generally cheaper than the cruisers. I doubt whether I will ever sell my Mav, as it is such a great vehicle. And I think once you have a diesel it is hard to go back to a petrol. Ok, the price is of fuel is slightly higher atm, but fuel price will change, and no one has a crystal ball here, but reliabilty and maintainance is far better on diesels. Over a longer period diesel is a proven performer. Petrol will have more grunt going up hills etc, and I will have to change back a gear or two, but that's about it. This is my experience only Lavinge, and I do not want to start a debate on diesel vs petrol. Obviously if you are expecting some money in the future and you have your heart set on a upgrade, good on you, but if your otherwise happy with the Mitz, I might keep the money in the bank.
Good luck
Cheers
Lee

[Alchemy]

Brett,

I'd go a cruiser or patrol. I don't know how the fuel consumption compares between the petrol / diesel variants of these though. I had a 6m Quintrex Offshore last which weighed in at 1800kg, towed by a commodore wagon. The commodore did it easily, but the one of the advantages of the 4wd wagon is the weight. The heavier tow vehicle allows greater control over the tow weight. Eg, the Quinny would throw the back of the commodore around a bit, but when I hooked it up to a mates patrol it was fine.

I have a 4.2td patrol and it tows Alchemy with ease at a good 2.8t, but like you I have been wondering about the petrol option given the huge gap in fuel prices. As a matter of interest my patrol averages 14 - 14.5 l/100km on the hwy and around town. Hook up the boat for a hwy run and it jumps to 24 - 25 l/100km :-/ So, for me to be worse off with a petrol, it would have to be around 30% more inefficient than the diesel, based on petrol at 99c/l and diesel at 128c/l.

Regards,
Dave.

[PADDLES]

g'day levinge. we use an old 1988 patrol with petrol/lpg to tow a 2t boat/trailer. this thing's an awesome tow vehicle and on lpg is about 1c per km more expensive to run than the wife's corolla. anyone who tells you that the 4.2l long stroke nissan petrol motors don't have low down grunt obviously hasn't driven one, they make maximum torque at pretty low revs and there's heaps of it. bit of a performance drop using lpg over petrol but when i need the mumbo i just flick it onto petrol which it does drink frighteningly fast.

[Chamelion]

Fair enough.. I have no issues with my falcon, but then I've only got a small 4.4m fibreglass runabout.

[phewy]

Fair enough.. I have no issues with my falcon, but then I've only got a small 4.4m fibreglass runabout.


I had no issues at all either towing a heavy 533 CruiseCraft with falcons over the years. XF first, then an ED and an AU. No probs at the ramps either.
All had the right equipment for the job but.

[White Pointer]

G'day,

The Challenger will notice 1.5 tonne and it's not just weight. The frontal area wind resistance and drag along the boat sides plus the friction of an extra pair of wheels all play a role.

If there is nothing actually wrong with the Challenger and you don't intend to do long distance touring with the boat, I'd hang on to it until it's really worn out. If you are planning lots of long trips make and investment in future resale and fuel economy and buy a diesel.

Before you buy anything check your trailer downforce load on the tow ball and make sure your new vehicle can handle it.

White Pointer

[Black_Rat]

NAVARA :)
Honest, great tourque, 5 speed, go just about anywhere (unless Lucky_Phil is envolved :P ;D ) and diesel. Had mine for 3 years and am not going to a Toyota, she's been great ;D ;D ;D

Damo.

[levinge]

Thanks for all the info guys, gives me plenty of food for thought....

[FNQCairns]

Is this it?



Make
MITSUBISHI
Model
CHALLENGER
Series
PA 4x4
Series Year
1999
Price (New)
$36990
Engine Size
3.0 L
Fuel System
MULTI POINT F/INJ
Fuel Consumption (City/ Hwy)
13.5 /9.5 L/100Km
Tank Capacity
74 L
Power
136 Kw
Torque
265 Nm
Body Type
4D WAGON
Seating Capacity
5
Standard Transmission
5M4x4
Drive
4WD
Turning Circle
11 m
Kerb Weight
1835 Kg
Dimensions (L/W/H) in mm
4530 x 1775 x 1730
Wheel Base
2725 mm

IMO It's got more than enough get up and go, the best you could do is go bigger in size, the speed limit is the limit but the bigger the car the better the tow, still yours is no light weight...wish my car had that many horses.

cheers fnq

[levinge]

Same car just the 2004 model, would love it if they made a 4.0litre model in a V8.

They are a great vehicle but when driving up incline and into a wind, I am lucky to maintain 80kph. Normally I sit on arout 90-95kph in tow with the boat but she struggles into a wind and that only hurts the motor.

With the extra power of a Cruiser, Navara or Patrol, I think that would eleviate the problem.

Also you can feel movement in the rear of the car at times and I think the weight ratio between the car and the boat/trailer is close to the top of the stability limit. Only notice it around town on some streets/corners.

I would hate to get rid of the Mitso but Safety is my main concern and maintaining a steady tow speed comes up second, hate to create a vehicle prossession behind me, especially with the lack of passing lanes up here in NQ. People seem happy to wait if you are towing at 90-95kph but get frustrated with you below that...

[PADDLES]

yeah, there's plenty of go in those v6's but the thing to look at is the torque/rpm figures. the challenger motor gets it's max torque of 265Nm at 4500rpm, the old TB42 petrol patrol motor gets it maximum torque of 325Nm at only 2800rpm. the cruiser petrol motor of that era would be similar. the nissan diesel motor of that era (the TD42) makes it's maximum torque of 265Nm at 2000rpm. these lazy old beasties are getting maximum pulling power without revving their arses off.

[Noelm]

there seems to be a bit of funny conceptions/misconceptions regarding Petrol and Diesel Engines, first off lets look at a similar Car, like the Landcruiser or Patrol Petrol and Diesel, any of the Petrol Engines for a tow car or Family car will eat either model in Diesel, but they take some feeding, and a regular visit to the Petrol Bowser, the Diesel fuel maybe much dearer, but the vehicle is so much more economical to run (not to mention Engine longevity) if this was not the case, all big trucks would be Petrol, a diesel may have very low down torque, and well suited to Tugs and workboats, but in a car, a petrol will eat them (I own a Diesel by the way) so unless you are a full on "low down torque" four wheel driver, or you do not mind high fuel costs, then a Petrol Cruiser or Patrol will be the answer.

[levinge]

Totally agree. My vehicle is excellent when she has to work hard, but not for 2.5 hours towing, somethings gunna give and I don't want to be driving when it happens. Great on the beach and when she has to pull loads around town.

[PADDLES]

that's spot on noel. if you look at the current range of turbo diesel passenger cars from europe as an example, i personally reckon you'd have to be pretty keen on buying one to bother. they are firstly a lot more expensive to purchase (so if you've borrowed the money consider the extra interest as well), they use more expensive parts and oils so cost more to maintain and by the time you pay 30c per litre more for the fuel are not that much cheaper than petrol on a dollars per km basis. if you hadn't already guessed, i'm a big fan of using a largish 6 or 8 cylinder engine and putting it on lpg (using a large engine makes the lpg power drop matter less).

sorry if i've sidetracked your thread here levinge.

[levinge]

Thanks Noelm, I agree with you. I cringe when I see someone pull up to the Diesel bowser and feel sorry for them that the price hasn't come down as much as normal unleaded.

Your right about the differences between them, if it is a workhorse vehicle then diesels the goer, if its general use then petrol. 100 percent right...

Looking around march next year and on current research on the car sites I should be able to pick up a pretty sweet deal. Although wouldn't mind if the interest rates were up a little, then I could get a really sweet deal, almost a steal....

Paddles - no just added more info, thanks, as for LPG, when we go away I like to load up, so if the lpg tank can't be mounted under the car, then its out of my line of sight as an option. Same as the poxy extra seats in the back. They will be the first thing removed when and if they are on the vehicle I buy...I do like the big engines also, makes you feel alive to hear them growl when needed...

[age]

Noelm

Spot on

Levinge -the specs of your Challenger are not too bad say compared with some of the Navara's etc being questioned here - go and drive a few vehicles for a comparo

Re torque Petrol v's Diesel etc

Toyota 1HZ - 80/100 series diesel- 96kW@3800rpm and maximum torque of 285Nm@2200rpm. The turbo model of this motor is more impressive but expensive to buy and source second hand still.

Toyota 2UZ - 100 series V8 Petrol - 179 kW at 4800 rpm with 427 Nm of torque at 3400 rpm

You are not going to notice 1200rpm for huge amounts of more torque in the V8 - actually apart from about 800rpm, the V8 torque curve kills the diesels.

I know which I prefer for towing - and as stated in my earlier post for the same economy

Cheers

A

[Pirate_Pete_Tas]

I have a 5.3m Polycraft Cuddy Cab & it weighs in around the 1500 to 1600Kgs all up.

I used to tow it with a 2000 model Challanger & it did it Ok but with 250 000Ks on the clock I was working it harder than I ever had so I moved to a Kia of all things.

I got a 2.5L Turbo Kia Sorento Automatic. It towes the boat like its not there. Put in into Drive on the flat & the car will idle away. 2000RPM is 100Ks on the highway & thats right where the 2.5 Turbo puts out the most torque.

Its a propper 4WD under neath with a full chassis. The Diesel is a German enginered beast with a garret turbo so it going to last. The car sits on the road at 2200Kgs & can tow 2800Kgs. ita shorter & squatter than the Challenger & the good lady drives it wo work with ease every day & I only get to drive it on the weekend when we take the boat out.

http://i233.photobucket.com/albums/ee312/Polyboatowner/Sideon.jpg

[PADDLES]

yeah, there's a bit of messing around with fuel tanks to be done levinge. our one has a 120l gas tank where the original petrol tank used to be under the back doors, between the chassis rails and just in front of the towbar, this gets us around 550k's of range. they then fit an auxiliary petrol tank that's about 70 or so litres under the drivers side passenger door, this gives us around 380k's or so. both gas and petrol in our big 6 run at around 5.5kms to the litre for economy. food for thought anyway mate.

[White Pointer]

Same car just the 2004 model, would love it if they made a 4.0litre model in a V8.

They are a great vehicle but when driving up incline and into a wind, I am lucky to maintain 80kph. Normally I sit on arout 90-95kph in tow with the boat but she struggles into a wind and that only hurts the motor.

With the extra power of a Cruiser, Navara or Patrol, I think that would eleviate the problem.

Also you can feel movement in the rear of the car at times and I think the weight ratio between the car and the boat/trailer is close to the top of the stability limit. Only notice it around town on some streets/corners.

I would hate to get rid of the Mitso but Safety is my main concern and maintaining a steady tow speed comes up second, hate to create a vehicle prossession behind me, especially with the lack of passing lanes up here in NQ. People seem happy to wait if you are towing at 90-95kph but get frustrated with you below that...

G'day,

I've read all the replys after this and I'm getting a feeling that the Challenger is a substitute passenger car most of the time and a boat tractor some of the time.

The "problem" with your Challenger is that it is a Triton ute with a wagon body. The independent front suspension is basically incompatible with a live axle rear end on cart springs. Later Challengers had coil rear end like the last of the independent chassis Pajero.

Now, the advocates of Navara utes and the like live with the compromise because cart springs are really good load carriers and very durable. I have a Rodeo to tow 2-tonne for that very reason and I live with the rear end compromise on off-camber corners by slowing down.

Can I suggest that you get the trailer balance and tow ball down force load checked? After that get the springs and shock absorbers checked. Don't buy an after market suspension for towing - it will just make the car more uncomfortable and unstable unladen.

White Pointer

[levinge]

Nice points there white pointer, The car handling when towing isn't really an issue, she tows well, cornering is always taken easy. Only when I have to break quicker than I normally would, thats when you feel the extra weight behind the car.

My real issue is power the 3.0 Ltr Motor/chassis is only rated to tow 2110kg masx (braked) and when she's loaded the boat and trailer come in just under th 2 tonne. So add a little incline and some wind and grandma with a walking frame could beat me hands down.

The car is mainly my work vehicle, 10% the kids/missus and majority of the time towing the boat or going fishing. Great vehicle, just lacks the extra grunt and Horsepower for the long hauls. We fish from Kurrimine Beach north of Townsville to Airlie Beach South regularly. So Klms under the wheels is a real factor. Fishing wise I have done over 90 hours now and had the rig since July. Yep love my fishing. The extra power from a bigger truck will make travel alot easier and less stress on the tow vehicle over the life of both the boat/trailer and car

[ozbee]

do you feel comfortable handing out $300 dollars for a diesel fill with the price it is now . ive had two diesel 100 series cruisers and 1 100 series petrol v 8. towing the weight of your boat behind the petrol cruiser would be like towing a matchstick its not heavy in fact less than half the actual carrying capacity so go the v 8 auto cruiser if its a cruiser you want. i sold mine and bought a navara and it tows twice the weight you are so really i think you want a cruiser go for it you deserve it . the boat is irrelevant really

[wrxhoon]

I would go anything turbo diesel over any petrol 4wd for towing work.
TD's are made to pull heavy loads and still be fairly economical.
There is a reaon you don't see any petrol trucks these days, they are all TD's.
I have a 200 series TTD landcruiser and I tow a 21' Trophy all up 2.5T + and the truck is almost 3 T with fuel and gear . I don't strugle anywhere and can maintain 100 kmh + up any hill yet still manage 16-17 lt/100k.

[walruss]

Well in the last 25 years i have had a 40, 60,80 and 2, 100 series landcruisers. the first was a toy. the 60 I had for 16 years and it did a bucket load of work. I had it on petrol and gas. it was the the most viable combination then. As it aged i bought an 80 series. It went on gas almost immediately. Absolutely no regrets whatsoever. Then bought my first ever new car. A petrol 100 series. went onto gas after 2,000k. 120,000 k later it got sold. Not one regret about putting on gas.
Had a 5.45 streaker then a 650 patriot which weighed 2.5 tonne on the weighbridge, all loaded up. Must have towed it over 50,000k. The average was around the 20-22k p/100l mark overall on gas. Only marginally better on petrol. Was a great car.

I now have a t/d l/c. yes fuel is more expensive. that shits me. Currently 145 cpl here. Would I swap back to the petrol/gas. Not on your life. From a towing perspective it simply does it that much easier. The diesel motor/gearing combination just does it with no fuss and is in fact a much more relaxing drive.

I would normally tow about 10K a year, if not more, and it is the only way to go. So far with the boat on the back I average about 17/18 p/100k, maybe a little better.

I don't slug it along and push when I have to. Point to point times aren't bad. Its just the diesel is that much easier to drive.

If the money is available go the t/d. If not, the petrol and then on gas still is a great option.

Russ

[White Pointer]

Nice points there white pointer, The car handling when towing isn't really an issue, she tows well, cornering is always taken easy. Only when I have to break quicker than I normally would, thats when you feel the extra weight behind the car.

My real issue is power the 3.0 Ltr Motor/chassis is only rated to tow 2110kg masx (braked) and when she's loaded the boat and trailer come in just under th 2 tonne. So add a little incline and some wind and grandma with a walking frame could beat me hands down.

The car is mainly my work vehicle, 10% the kids/missus and majority of the time towing the boat or going fishing. Great vehicle, just lacks the extra grunt and Horsepower for the long hauls. We fish from Kurrimine Beach north of Townsville to Airlie Beach South regularly. So Klms under the wheels is a real factor. Fishing wise I have done over 90 hours now and had the rig since July. Yep love my fishing. The extra power from a bigger truck will make travel alot easier and less stress on the tow vehicle over the life of both the boat/trailer and car


G'day again,

I'm not having a go this this started as a 1-tonne load, progressed to a 1.5-tonne load and now seems to be just under 2-tonne. At around 2-tonne for the applied use, for 90% of the vehicle's use you are pretty close to its maximum capacity.

Here are a couple of simple rules:

1. For every 1kg you put in the car take 0.5kg off towing capacity.

2. Allow 30% spare capacity within the vehicle's towing capacity for long haul or off road work.

Now, I'm not going to make any recommendations on what you replace the Challenger with until I know weight of BMT with all the junk you (we) carry in the boat when towing, including full fuel. I also want to know the loaded weight of the car with people on board and junk you carry in it.

Go to a weigh bridge fully loaded. Drop the BMT and get split axle weights for the car (2 axles). Add the trailer and repeat the exercise (now 4 axles). Send me the results. I can easily calculate the imposed tow ball load from the two weigh bridge certificates.

PS If your get this done at a Queensland Transport inspection registry and you're overloaded they won't let you leave!

PPS if you haven't had your transmission serviced in the last 12-months get it done and ask what was in the oil and filter/strainer. Transmissions bear the brunt of overloading.

White Pointer

[levinge]

Thanks for that White Pointer, The 2 tonne would be BMT loaded and ready for a long haul. I tow with the boat almost empty of fuel on a long road trip. Don't mind giving local business a fair go when I get where I am going.

as for the car, generally when we are doing a trip, aside from me the missus and 1 or 2 kids the only extras are couple of duffle bags and the engel. So weight on the car is not a big issue.

With the trips we do and aside from finances (which are no prob) I am aiming at the big patrol or the big landcruiser. Will not be considering anything below the 4 ltr and won't be looking at deisel (fuel price has not come down and isn't likely too) plus I just don't like deisels. Ideally I am looking for comment from those who own Patrol's and Cruisers to see how they fair with their boats and vehicles.

I have looked at weights, tow capacities etc and to have a sturdy tow vehicle which allows safe travel and a better weight ratio than the challenger, navara, rodeo's etc, the patrol and cruiser are the only 2 that really fit the bill.

As for the weigh bridge, here is Townsville I'd be lucky to get to the weigh bridge at the Transport Dept, its a bitch to get in there at the best of times. the only other one is out at the dump and I can't see them letting me tie up the entrance to the dump for business other than what it is for...loaded up the car and boat still feel comfortable, its just a issue of power and overall safety (both are near the max, so its time)

[White Pointer]

G'day,

It's your money and your call and the Patrol and 'Cruiser will eat the towing on road. An advantage of the 'cruiser is that it doesn't have a wheel on the back door and that makes it much easier transferring gear from car to trailer at a ramp. The cruiser is also marginally more economical even in V8 compared to the 4.8 Lt six in Patrol.

You are biased in favour of petrol and I am biased in favour of diesel, and have been for many years. IMO if you have around 4-tonne all up a petrol makes no sense at all. Power is useless and lugging torque is king, especially up hills. You can expect fuel consumption to be around half or better with an efficient diesel and that more than offsets the price difference.

A final word of warning. With crash structures and just getting fat the Patrol and Cruiser only allow about 650kg of passengers and cargo before they overload the axles. That's where utes win out - but a ute isn't a solution if you need the car to double as family transport. So go to Queensland Transport unladen and get it weighed so you have the numbers. The numbers will provide the solution.

I'll shut up now and let the 'Cruiser and Patrol fans have a go.

White Pointer

[Reel Blue]

I have a 2003 TD 100 Series Cruiser and it tows my HH 650 Classic very easily on the highway. It is a heavy boat and I wouldn't want to tow it with a lighter vehicle. I'm unhappy that diesel is 30 cents a litre dearer, but I'm still in front of a petrol cruiser. It costs me more for 100 litres but I know that I'll travel about 200 km further than a petrol cruiser on a tank of fuel. I regularly travel over 700 km on 80 litres. You won't do that in a petrol cruiser.

I towed a trailer (very high, lots of wind resistance and about a tonne) from Toowoomba to Gympie and back in convoy with two other vehicles which were not towing. The 100 series petrol cruiser that I travelled with used more fuel than I did and I didn't use fifth gear.

I paid more for the TD cruiser. I'll also get a lot more for it if I ever sell it. Compare resale.

[levinge]

Thanks for that RB, is fuel for thought, but deisel up here hasn't budged in price that much to make it heavy on the thoughts. Most of my towing is local and the max distance I travel is 3 big trips away (at this stage) per year, so the deisel isn't too much of a factor.

Glad your getting really good economy with your rig..

Thanks again