upgrade which one

[outsiderskip]

im looking at upgrading my motor to a 200hp
current motor is a 150 e-tec with 640hrs on the clock
must choose in next few weeks looking at fuel economy
e-tec 2 stroke or honda 4stroke
hard choice

pete
http://www.nuggetfishing.com.au/forum/Themes/default/images/icons/modify_inline.gif

[Noelm]

I reckon that is a "flip a coin" choice, both good Motors with good reputation, I guess in some ways, the Etec is the better choice for you, because that's what you had before, so lots of bits and pieces can be compatible, and reused, and there is more chance all the gauges and stuff will be the same size and fitting!

[ThePinkPanther]

SUZUKI - now used by many of the volunteer marine resue groups owing to good deals, good running costs and top after sales service (dealer dependant!)

[Chimo]

Are you happy with your service technician?

If yes talk to him / Her if not find an alternative and buy what he / she services.

Cheers
Chimo

[Spaniard_King]

SUZUKI - now used by many of the volunteer marine resue groups owing to good deals, good running costs and top after sales service (dealer dependant!)

TPP are you aware of the Suzi Price rise, taken the shine off them apparently;)

Pete, maybe you should go for a run in my rig8-)

[Heath]

Go the Honda. Just repowered my rig with one & it's bloody fantastic.

[disorderly]

Pete, maybe you should go for a run in my rig8-)

With the current economic climate I feel for those in the marine business and we dont want to see Garry destitute,living on the streets and eating out of garbage bins,now,do we..?::);)...

So go the 'onda...;D

[Spaniard_King]

Scott, unfortunately they won't let me sell them (yet) otherwise you would be hearing more of me :) Could have sold a few V6's in the last week :P instead I just have to scrounge around for good second hand deals to help people out :(

[finding_time]

im looking at upgrading my motor to a 200hp
current motor is a 150 e-tec with 640hrs on the clock
must choose in next few weeks looking at fuel economy
e-tec 2 stroke or honda 4stroke
hard choice

pete
http://www.nuggetfishing.com.au/forum/Themes/default/images/icons/modify_inline.gif


I must say Pete i'm a little suprised that your looking at upgrading and upgrading to something other than a e-tec!:o

What has happened to the old one? i've got about 700hrs on mine and i dont think i can tell there anything but new and would not consider a repower atm!Whats the reason behind your decision to upgrade, this may well lead to the solution!;)


Now for my dig;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

Also i thought once you owned a e-tec , you would not even consider another old technology motor?:P They'll be kicking you out of the club mate!;) Ps. how many pm's have you had from disorderly and jabba trying to convince you to remove this blasphamy!:-[ ;D

[julian1]

as Noel said it will be cheaper upgrading to the 200 Etec as all the cables and fittings will be the same, unless you go the 200HO then maybe they are different ? but upgrading to the smaller block 200 Etec won't give you much performance gain as it will have the same torque as your 150. Personally i like the Suzuki V6's but its your money

[Mindi]

SUZUKI - now used by many of the volunteer marine resue groups owing to good deals, good running costs and top after sales service (dealer dependant!)

Just gone up by about $1000 (90HP) at a very strange time to introduce a price rise...

[business class]

To be Honest just go with what ever is cheaper Honda, Suzuki or Yammaha there all great Engines. Its a price Factor now!!!!.

Ps. Gary Its a pitty That Suzuki's Prices have risen now! as i think they might be dearer then there oppisions, but i am waiting to confirm this. HINT HINT

Cheers
Matty

[outsiderskip]

hi ian
there is no problems with the motor just no happy with fuel economy im running at 1klm to 1 lt
have been told my boat is too heavy and on borderline for 150hp

[Noelm]

that seems to be about what most get, not too sure you would gain anything, or at best, enough to make it all worth while!

[Vitamin Sea]

hi ian
there is no problems with the motor just no happy with fuel economy im running at 1klm to 1 lt
have been told my boat is too heavy and on borderline for 150hp


Pete

I have a 19C with a new 200 opti, provideing I keep my right hand in control I get anywhere between 1.4 ~ 1.7 km/l.

Plenty of available power, cruise 3600 - 3900 which gives good boatspeed at about 42km - 48km / hr, round about.

WOT gives 80 km/hr. ( could be improved I think )

I would expect similar numbers from the etec 200.

Something to consider.

Regards

Bill

[Flyfanatic]

Pete

I would expect similar numbers from the etec 200.



Similar but not quite as good, besides the Merc Optimax gives the best warranties in the market.
5 years top to bottom and 3 years corrosion warranty. No other motor will give even 1 second corrosion warranty, ask them why not.

Go the Opti great motor.
dave

[Spaniard_King]

Similar but not quite as good, besides the Merc Optimax gives the best warranties in the market.
5 years top to bottom and 3 years corrosion warranty. No other motor will give even 1 second corrosion warranty, ask them why not.

Go the Opti great motor.
dave

Dave, Honda has a 5 year "NON DECLINING" warranty;)

[finding_time]

hi ian
there is no problems with the motor just no happy with fuel economy im running at 1klm to 1 lt
have been told my boat is too heavy and on borderline for 150hp

Ice and fuel on the way out and hopefully fish on the way back right! To me your looking for the motor with the best push ( torque) in say the 3700 to 4100 rpm range !

I guess hull shot is not that important you just want to cruise along heavily loaded with out having to touch the throttles as this is when you start chewing the juice.

Mate get the honda imho. there isn't going to be as much of that speed down the swell then having to throttle up the other side cr@P that you get from 2's when pushing a load! This is where you start chewing fuel!( And before any of you 2 stroke guys jump on me how much load have you carried in your rigs, i've had 4 divers in a victory with over 500kg of gear being pushed by a 200hpdi, i know what it's like with 2 strokes and weight)

Anyway that's my 2c worth i think it's your circumstances that dictate the 4 stroke!

ian

[dfox]

Garry as you know Pete is using these engines under a commercial licence does the warrantee stay the same?
p.s.go the 4 banger, youll be glad you did when 3000hrs clocks over...

[FNQCairns]

Yeah go a 4stroke, a big capacity for the HP one, when in the 6cyl range 4st engines are at their sweetest IMO.

cheers fnq

[Rod Fishing]

What are you doing with the old Etec and how much would you sell for with gauges ETC.

Cheers Rod....8-)

[Spaniard_King]

Garry as you know Pete is using these engines under a commercial licence does the warrantee stay the same?
p.s.go the 4 banger, youll be glad you did when 3000hrs clocks over...


Foxy, Due to the hours he uses it (only 640 in nearly 3 years) I think he would be able to obtain/argue for recreational use.

[Jabba_]

I must say Pete i'm a little suprised that your looking at upgrading and upgrading to something other than a e-tec!:o

What has happened to the old one? i've got about 700hrs on mine and i dont think i can tell there anything but new and would not consider a repower atm!Whats the reason behind your decision to upgrade, this may well lead to the solution!;)


Now for my dig;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

Also i thought once you owned a e-tec , you would not even consider another old technology motor?:P They'll be kicking you out of the club mate!;) Ps. how many pm's have you had from disorderly and jabba trying to convince you to remove this blasphemy!:-[ ;D
None from me.... Each to there own.. I just don't like negative propaganda that was thrown around months ago.. Thankfully most off that has stopped, and it seem there is a bit more respect going round for the E-tec now that there getting some bigger hours on them.....

[Jabba_]

Similar but not quite as good, besides the Merc Optimax gives the best warranties in the market.
5 years top to bottom and 3 years corrosion warranty. No other motor will give even 1 second corrosion warranty, ask them why not.

Go the Opti great motor.
dave

E-tec do;D

[Jabba_]

Ice and fuel on the way out and hopefully fish on the way back right! To me your looking for the motor with the best push ( torque) in say the 3700 to 4100 rpm range !

I guess hull shot is not that important you just want to cruise along heavily loaded with out having to touch the throttles as this is when you start chewing the juice.

Mate get the honda imho. there isn't going to be as much of that speed down the swell then having to throttle up the other side cr@P that you get from 2's when pushing a load! This is where you start chewing fuel!( And before any of you 2 stroke guys jump on me how much load have you carried in your rigs, i've had 4 divers in a victory with over 500kg of gear being pushed by a 200hpdi, i know what it's like with 2 strokes and weight)

Anyway that's my 2c worth i think it's your circumstances that dictate the 4 stroke!

ian
That 200 Yammie HPDI (2.6ltr) is only equevalant to the E-tec 200 small block (2.6ltr).... The 3.3ltr 200 Big block E-te is a totaly differant animal. It has so much more torque, and less throttle input is required...... The big block is better to drive following the swell...

[outsiderskip]

jabba i considered big block
but was told it is a thirsty motor

pete

[sempre]

Already spoke to you about what I think . Should have done it 4 weeks ago before they went up.

[outsiderskip]

sam new it was only a matter of time
for u to put your two bobs worth in

pete

[sempre]

Its raining , kids are in bed , no rum left - I have nothing else to do but gee you up .

[Jabba_]

jabba i considered big block
but was told it is a thirsty motor

pete
What boat do you have?
Are you located on the Gold Coast.... If so I don't mine taking you out for a long run in a 250 Big block

My mine is a 250 on a 19ft Seafarer (see avatar) On a days fishing trip out reaf hopping to the 50s, motor idling for long periods (using motor too back us into the currant to slow our drift), I used 80lt.. On a smaller pusuit 550 with a 90 Opti same trip on the same day he used 60lt..... 20ltr differance between a 90hp and a 250 hp is not bad in my books......

Ozbee has a 250 E-tec on a 680 Patriot is getting the same fuel consumption as his mate that has a 250 Yamie 4st on a 680 Patriot......

IMO the big block set up with he right combo is very well mannered on fuel

[finding_time]

Jabba you have got to be getting commisions mate!!!

[outsiderskip]

hi jabba i got a 19c
top speed 65klm

pete

[julian1]

i have a mate with 250 on a Western Aus 233 flop, he get's better than 1km to 1litre and at slow trolling (similar to mackeral trolling speed) it uses .5 litre per hour. And it has heaps of grunt at 4200rpm its cruising on 30 knots burning around 45-50lph. At 7 knot trolling it uses around 10lph
upgrading to the small bore 200 Etec will not give you any more torque, which is what you will want if its a heavy boat. Either get the big bore Etec or get a 4 banger - Zukes are very sweet and the 250 probably will be better on juice due to the VVTi or yes the Honda 225 has VVTi as well so it most likely will be better on juice than the 200 Honda.
if you go Yammie go the 250 with VVTi

cheer's

Julian

[Jabba_]

hi jabba i got a 19c
top speed 65klm

pete

I would consider the 19c to be similar to a Seafarer Vermont/Victory in weight, size and deadrise... In which case a 200 Big block would be ideal and be light on the fuel as it would not be working hard... I would think a 19" rebel @ 3000rpm would push you at 30mph, on smooth water with a top speed between 80-90kph... If your boat behaves the same as mine you should get 25mph @ 3000rpm outside when it's a bit rougher.. When the choping pounding you, it will drop to 20mph @ 2800rpm..

Fuel useage at 3000rpm is around 25-27ltr/hour.... The about 1.7km/1ltr average for bluewater and protected water usage...

[Jabba_]

Jabba you have got to be getting commisions mate!!!
Stranger things have happened;D

[finding_time]

I would consider the 19c to be similar to a Seafarer Vermont/Victory... In which case a 200 Big block would be ideal and be light on the fuel as it would not be working hard... I would think a 19" rebel @ 3000rpm would push you at 30mph, on smooth water and about 25mph outside when it is a bit rougher.. Fuel useage at 3000rpm is around 25-27ltr/hour....

Mate

Pete is a profisher! Now i dont know for sure but i'm betting his rig fully loaded is a fair bit heavier than your vermount mate. Your definately at the light end of the 6m boat range!

Ian

[dfox]

Mate

Pete is a profisher! Now i dont know for sure but i'm betting his rig fully loaded is a fair bit heavier than your vermount mate. Your definately at the light end of the 6m boat range!

Ian
Ian , if pete riped out the ice box, threw all his gear overboard (including crew) he'd still weigh more ! ;D;D ...

[Jabba_]

Mate

Pete is a profisher! Now i dont know for sure but i'm betting his rig fully loaded is a fair bit heavier than your vermount mate. Your definately at the light end of the 6m boat range!

Ian

I didn't know that... How much would pete's boat weigh fully loaded...

[outsiderskip]

hi jabba
i guess 2ton boat then 2 fat buggers
100kg each 230lts fuel and 100kgs of ice
i carry that most of the time

[Jabba_]

Yeah that's fair bit heavier, I recon mine is about 700kg lighter then yours when I am fully loaded.....

what have you done to your boat to get it so heavy. I did think get it surveyed wild make such a massive difference in weight

[Vitamin Sea]

I would consider the 19c to be similar to a Seafarer Vermont/Victory in weight, size and deadrise... In which case a 200 Big block would be ideal and be light on the fuel as it would not be working hard... I would think a 19" rebel @ 3000rpm would push you at 30mph, on smooth water with a top speed between 80-90kph... If your boat behaves the same as mine you should get 25mph @ 3000rpm outside when it's a bit rougher.. When the choping pounding you, it will drop to 20mph @ 2800rpm..

Fuel useage at 3000rpm is around 25-27ltr/hour.... The about 1.7km/1ltr average for bluewater and protected water usage...

19 C, 200 Opti

3000 RPM 35km/HR, 17 litres / hr
3500 RPM 46 km/hr, 23 litres / hr
4000 rpm 54 km/hr, 28 litres / hr
5700 rpm 80 km/hr, a fair bit

Would not be as loaded as Pete, 230 litres, 3 on board

Cheers

VS

[Ocean_Spirit]

Mate, I recommend the 200 E-TEC H.O. or standard 225. Having driven everything in that range, E-TEC has plenty of balls and good smooth power delivery. Going from a 2.6Ltr to a 3.3Ltr - you'll notice a big change. Honda make nice engines too, and if you were to go that way, as said above, the 225 V-TEC is the pick.

Mate putting it down the line, I would recommend the Evinrude. You can't under-rate the low maintenance aspect of the E-TEC's. It costs me more annually to maintain my 35 Johnson than a V6 200HP. With your hours, it will save you some money over the long-run. Less to go wrong too.

We had ours fitted up by one of if not the best boat builders in the business and have the best and experienced no-crap mechanics servicing it, and it has run perfectly since the first run. I think the quality of your mechanic, whatever brand you go for, can either make your ownership experience a good one or bad one.

If you've got something good now, upgrade to the bigger block in the same technology and keep all your rigging. The only way to get honest opinions is to ask people who actually own that size engine and are out in the water using them. If you get a chance, go out and run both, and go with what you like. Ultimately, your the one who has to be happy, not any of us, and buy what you like. Best thing is, the two brands you are looking at both build bloody good outboard engines and either way, you shouldn't have any dramas.

[chop duster]

I would like to see someone match Vitamen Sea's fuels figures?
Opti's (200 & 225's) apear to be the economy kings from all the figures I have gathered. But all the owners still winge about having to pay for the bloody oil (even of they aren't chewing all that much in reallity). if I was after fuel economy and thats all, then the opti would be my pick, although between the honda and the Etec, I would say the honda for it's reliability status and low fuel consumption.

[seamaid]

;D Hi Pete
knowing the weight factor on your pro fishing trips, best advice would be to contact Haines Hunter on the max kilo's transom weight, you most likely done this, however the change over $$xxx might not add up to your cost eg; 5 years of fishing
The kl's trav of xd 100 oil your using per trip, it might be worth looking at the 4 strokes make & model hyour choice.
best of luck Pete.
Seamaid

[Vitamin Sea]

;D Hi Pete
knowing the weight factor on your pro fishing trips, best advice would be to contact Haines Hunter on the max kilo's transom weight, you most likely done this, however the change over $$xxx might not add up to your cost eg; 5 years of fishing
The kl's trav of xd 100 oil your using per trip, it might be worth looking at the 4 strokes make & model hyour choice.
best of luck Pete.
Seamaid


I'll have a look at this for you Pete, I sill have the original compliance plate.

I know that they are rated to 280 HP, just not sure of weight.

Regards

VS

[outsiderskip]

thanks bill
be appreciated

pete

[Vitamin Sea]

thanks bill
be appreciated

pete


ok Pete, just had a look at my plate, unfortunately no reference to max weight, however, as previously mentioned, they are rated to max 280 HP, 8 persons on board.

So, draw from that what you may, I don't think any single motor up to 250 - 270k's would be much of a issue.

Still looking at the Honda's?

Cheers

Bill

[outsiderskip]

yes bill i think i made a deal on 200honda

thanks for all your troubles

pete