Smart Tabs

[frank100]

Hi everyone !
Thinking of intsalling trim tabs to my BC6.1 and one of the options is Smart Tabs Composite tabs). Anyone got any experience with these ? another option is Electotabs (Ally tabs- electric operation) any comments would be appreciated.

Thanks
Frank

[tin can marlin]

Go the volvo type they are very good northside marine stock them ask for glenn riley reel good bloke and knows his stuff when it comes to tabs.

[BrisBen]

I fitted the electrotabs to my sportfish very happy with them easy to install and they look to be good quality.

[tenzing]

The volvo tabs were my first choice but was advised that on the back of the seafarer they were not the easiest or most practical installation.
I ended up with Bennets as I was more comfortable with hydraulics out the back and electronics inside the boat. I've been thrilled with them. Whatever you choose make sure you get switches with a position readout so you can keep an eye on exactly what you are up to. Mine came with an auto retract which I disconnected and put on a toggle as a manual feature otherwise the things are retracting for god kows how long after you turn the motor off. not great when you are drifting'
Brendan

[frank100]

BrisBen,
Thanks for the reply. I have been looking at Electrotabs since the BarCrushers are now fitted with them ex factory. Could you tell me where you got them from & what you paid ? the local BC boat yard has been slack & not got back to me on the price.
Much appreciated.
Frank

[Noelm]

always had me puzzled why when all these Boats need Tabs, that they are not fitted when the Boat is new, sure I know about price and other things, but on most Boats they are necessary, so they should be standard equipment! not something that you discover you need 6 months later.

[scrubba01]

I have QL tabs on mine great tabs nice and compact and fast acting, paid $820 from Col at Fisher boats.

[Chimo]

Hi Frank

Have you looked at the Lenco electric tabs?

I dont have the indicator lights and as an extra they may be useful but on the 6.2 Vag the adjustments are very fine and you can feel the effect very easily especially if your doing any speed. Not convinced that you really need the lights as full up to down is only a couple of seconds so you just tap the switch to operate them anyway. Even fully up ie off, they aid the bum lift as they lengthen the boat; side to side trim happens when you operate one or the other.

Not so convinced about the QLs particularly after P Webster's comment that they cost about 1knot :( due to their drag which according to Peter Webster is similar to the effect of antifouling:'( his Quintrex tinny. All that drag is adding to the fuel bill.;)

Cheers
Chimo

PS Noelm
Your right re why are they not fitted if boats need them?

I asked this Q of Lindsay Fry while he still owned Seafarer when he fitted mine and he said it was simply that most boat buyers didn't want to spend the $s when they ordered the boat even though they were very beneficial etc etc

I guess if you were selling stuff,the customer can be led but cannot be made to drink ! even if they are clueless, its their money Ralph.::)

[siegfried]

I have electrotabs on a formula 233 and would recommend them as being as good as any

[Noelm]

I know that no one wants to spend the cash, but if they were part of the build, just like steering, windscreen and stuff, then you pay for them, because that's how the Boat is, and it performs as it should straight away, you do not get smashed down on one side for a year and then get them, well I reckon anyway!

[snelly1971]

Hi Frank

Have you looked at the Lenco electric tabs?

I dont have the indicator lights and as an extra they may be useful but on the 6.2 Vag the adjustments are very fine and you can feel the effect very easily especially if your doing any speed. Not convinced that you really need the lights as full up to down is only a couple of seconds so you just tap the switch to operate them anyway. Even fully up ie off, they aid the bum lift as they lengthen the boat; side to side trim happens when you operate one or the other.

Not so convinced about the QLs particularly after P Webster's comment that they cost about 1knot :( due to their drag which according to Peter Webster is similar to the effect of antifouling:'( his Quintrex tinny. All that drag is adding to the fuel bill.;)

Cheers
Chimo

PS Noelm
Your right re why are they not fitted if boats need them?

I asked this Q of Lindsay Fry while he still owned Seafarer when he fitted mine and he said it was simply that most boat buyers didn't want to spend the $s when they ordered the boat even though they were very beneficial etc etc

I guess if you were selling stuff,the customer can be led but cannot be made to drink ! even if they are clueless, its their money Ralph.::)

I have the same set up as your chimo, and I find the Lenco`s cost me a knot in speed if they are full down.

Mick

[trymyluck]

Hi Frank
I'm thinking about putting ql's on a 5.5m Savage and noticed that Leisure Marine have them advertised for $790.
Mark

[Chimo]

Hi Mick

I think Webster was suggesting that the QLs created drag all the time.

I dont doubt that all standard tabs eg lencos and similar shaped ones whether elec or hydraulic do create drag when they are fully engaged. I dont think this is the case when they are fully up and just adding to boat length.

By the way, did the CDs ever turn up? I guess you still have the address ?

Cheers
Chimo

[frank100]

Guys, Thanks to all that commented . Noelm, I agree totally with your comment re having them as standard but I gues most people (me) are a bit aprehensive at least when the boat is new to them as to wether someone is trying to sell you something you do'nt need.
Anyway the attraction for me to the Eltrotabs is that the tab is ally. As long as reliability is not an issue I'm not fussed elect vs Hydraulic the again I'e never had them so what would I know !
I have seen/heard enough to convince me that I need them. Cost is still an issue however. I am keen to see more comments on the usefullness of the indicator lights since they seem to cost a far bit extra.

Frank

[black runner]

I checked out the Barcrushers at the local boat show and had a chat to the dealer about the now std trim tabs with lights. It made sense that you can immediately get a visual on their position before getting underway, in the same way as the trim gauge on the outboard.

[frank100]

black runner,
Good point I never thought of that.

Frank

[snelly1971]

Hi Mick

I think Webster was suggesting that the QLs created drag all the time.

I dont doubt that all standard tabs eg lencos and similar shaped ones whether elec or hydraulic do create drag when they are fully engaged. I dont think this is the case when they are fully up and just adding to boat length.

By the way, did the CDs ever turn up? I guess you still have the address ?

Cheers
Chimo

Oh Yes, sorry the cd is here....Pm me your details if you want to sit back and watch a tri hull gliding down the gordon river.LOl

[tenzing]

Hi Frank

Have you looked at the Lenco electric tabs?

I dont have the indicator lights and as an extra they may be useful but on the 6.2 Vag the adjustments are very fine and you can feel the effect very easily especially if your doing any speed. Not convinced that you really need the lights as full up to down is only a couple of seconds so you just tap the switch to operate them anyway. Even fully up ie off, they aid the bum lift as they lengthen the boat; side to side trim happens when you operate one or the other.

Not so convinced about the QLs particularly after P Webster's comment that they cost about 1knot :( due to their drag which according to Peter Webster is similar to the effect of antifouling:'( his Quintrex tinny. All that drag is adding to the fuel bill.;)

Cheers
Chimo

PS Noelm
Your right re why are they not fitted if boats need them?

I asked this Q of Lindsay Fry while he still owned Seafarer when he fitted mine and he said it was simply that most boat buyers didn't want to spend the $s when they ordered the boat even though they were very beneficial etc etc

I guess if you were selling stuff,the customer can be led but cannot be made to drink ! even if they are clueless, its their money Ralph.::)
Hey Chimo,
I agree that the difference with the tabs is very noticeable and extremely useful.(some will argue if I suggest "essential", but wouldnt it be great if fully integrated OEM in the first place),and the effects on the victory are quite dramatic even in small increments too.
I guess it depends what you get used to, But I ordered mine with the indicator lights as part of the switch, not as an extra. While I would always head out from an all up position , I might find that we are heading into a swell head on or slightly to one side with two fatties parked on the right of the boat so the tabs may be say 60% down starboard and 40% down port for example (or whatever).
We stop at first mark and obviously weigh ourselves down with all the fish then pull up stumps to move on, different directions ,conditions etc. As I would not have retracted the flaps I dont have to go back to the start to make the necessary adjustment , which may be say starboard up to level with port.
I guess its not all that big a deal but I do find it useful and I guess if you've got a blank canvass then all these things can be ruled in or out.
I probably just got them because of the Pretty lights.
Cheers, Brendan

[Greg P]

Hi Mick

I think Webster was suggesting that the QLs created drag all the time.

I dont doubt that all standard tabs eg lencos and similar shaped ones whether elec or hydraulic do create drag when they are fully engaged. I dont think this is the case when they are fully up and just adding to boat length.



Webster is full of it on that issue. If they are causing drag when retracted then he hasnt set them up properly - simple as that.

After having both Bennets and Lencos I wouldnt go near them again after having QLs.

[Noelm]

OK, I'm going right out on a limb here and leaving myself open to abuse (as usual) but I reckon if you need lights or gauges to know where your tabs are set, then you have no idea how to use them, or your Boat! the Boat trim is a feel thing, not a readout on a gauge/lights, to get the most out of your Boat, you should not be looking at "gizmos" to tell you that one Motor is higher/lower than the other, nor should you be looking over your shoulder to see if they are set level! (if you get my drift) OK guys, ready now, throw rocks now!

[Chimo]

Hi Noelm

Your missing the point totally once again:P

You forgot to mention the need to use your ears and listen to the motors (s) as well as the sound and interaction between the boat and the water.....;)

Also just as plastics and other lures catch fishermen, lights and gismos catch boaties; this is the natural order of things ............... always was always will be::)

Hell just re read what I've written and now I could be in trouble with the non bait mob:o

Oh well, such is life:-[

Cheers
Chimo:-*

[Noelm]

I can lend you a spare safety hat and boots to help with all the rocks that will be hurled at you!

[Greg P]

You forgot to mention the need to use your ears and listen to the motors (s) as well as the sound and interaction between the boat and the water.....;)



If you are talking about getting the most fuel efficient running of your boat/motor (ie Nm/litre) then I would disagree with that statement.

I used to think that way until I had an EP-20 on my Zuke. What sounds/feels right to the senses aint always the most efficient speed.

[Noelm]

tabs are not fitted for fuel economy (although I guess they could have some influence), they are fittd to make a hull perform as the maker designed it to! like smashing down on one side when running side on to the wind, or getting the Boat to run flat instead of leaning to one side, that sort of thing, and I still reckon they should be on the Boat and included in the price, not an option.

[Chimo]

Agreed Noelm but lots say they cannot afford them, and others say they don't need them, so given that "the customers always right" what would you do as a vendor ?
Would you say you cannot have the boat unless I fit x y and z or would you go with the flow and sell em what they asked for?

Chimo

[ozscott]

I have Bennetts on the Vagabond...I dont have leds and dont need them. I usually put them fully down as I come down off the plane and then trim the boat as I get going back onto the plane after fishing say and trim the motor. I know where they are when running but the attitude of the boat. You get used to them and get in tune. For the effect of wind shear on any deep v you cannot be without them I reckon.

Cheers

[Noelm]

that's why they should be ON the thing when you buy it, regardless of the extra cost (which is not all that much in the scheme of things) they should not be an extra, just like steering, bollards and anything else, standard equipment from the manufacturer, not the dealer!!! you just cannot buy it any other way once you get to 5.5m or there abouts.

[FNQCairns]

IMo if you ever find yourself trimming the engine right in or half in no matter what boat/engine when travelling on the plane you will find some benefit in tabs, fuel saving even, as the option to have the prop thrust running parallel to the water surface yet the nose tucked down the efficient way - with tabs is superior to using the engine trim to do it.

Once at a fast cruise and beyond the tabs will become or should become secondary to outboard trim or be used to level boat lean.

Smart tabs work well although they cannot be fully retracted on the fly without manually doing it so will always be effecting full force regardless of your speed over the water, to be efficient at mid cruise and higher on good water trimming the nose of the boat as high as possible without the prop blowing out too often is what's needed, the smart tabs will compromise this to a degree.

cheers fnq

[ifishcq1]

HI Gents

not trying to hijack the thread but needing the same advice

I read in 1 post could have been by Chimo that boats over 6m should have trim tabs

I am doing up a 9m longboat, it has a 400mm flat pad it the middle of the stern with about 5degree dead rise out to the chines for the rear 4m and then variable dead rise to a deep nose
none of my 6 and 7m longboats needed them but I haven't tested it yet and maybe I should give it a fair test first

any thoughts welcome

Thanks
SL

[Chimo]

Hi SL

I think I would test it first particularly given the length * width of longboats and their overall wave eating characteristics. Also how often do you have a lean to correct on them anyhow?

Cheers
Chimo

[black runner]

I agree that when you are at one with your boat/car you don't need gauges to tell you how to operate it. The main purpose of gauges are to warn/confirm or otherwise the correct operation of critical components when things don't feel, smell or sound right.

For example most of us know what 10, 15, 20 knots feel like, but when the speedo shows 7knots and I know I am going faster from rpm/gps/speed sensation then I know I've picked up weed or similar on the leg, so I stop and get rid of the material (which could also have been interfering with the water intake) and off I go.

Whats the first thing you do in a car when you motor starts to lose power or changes note etc? - check the temp/oil gauge/lights. Its true your senses are often the first to pick up on developing problems but your gauges then provide feedback for troubleshooting.

I see that trim tab and motor trim gauges are in the same boat ( pardon the pun) - used as a base line to confirm normal operation and alert to other possible problems, not used to unquestioningly set the running attitude of your boat by.

Cheers FM

[chop duster]

ifishcq1,
I think long boats are the excluded here for sure. The delta pad at the stern provides enough lift as it is.
How many knots do you do at cruise in those banana's?

[MyWay]

frank100
i had on my 1st BC560 m120 sport Bennetts which i did fit on and thay much better than what i got on this BC560 they only m80
if you going to fit Bennetts which i can recommend IMO (not hard to do it self)
go for m120

Ql are good very good what i heard and read so far abot it .
I never bin on any boat whit ones on so I can not tall you how good they are
LED indicator on tabs are very good thing to have . I did not have on my 1st bot but it cam on 2nd BC it is good when you get close to rump to lift them up .Trimming wise you just trim to best what is good for boat not the by LED indicator

cheers my way

[gofishin]

....Anyway the attraction for me to the Eltrotabs is that the tab is ally...Frank

Frank, if you are worried about galvanic corrosion from ss plates on an ally hull, and ss bolts penetrating the hull below the WL there is an option - refer attached pic. On my tin boat i got channel ~65 x 30 channel welded to the transom (with drain holes ;) ). Obviously fitting nuts behind was going to be difficult so I drilled an appropriate sized ss plate (over sized holes) and to this welded some nuts (you will need to run a tap thru each). The thin piece of plastic protruding below the hinge is important - it stops a lot of spray thru the hinges at lower speeds (with these tabs anyway). Get some 1mm plastic from bunnings etc, cut to shape, and bend into an angle using a heat gun. PS. The tabs are Lectrotabs
http://www.lectrotab.com/default.htm


...as the option to have the prop thrust running parallel to the water surface yet the nose tucked down the efficient way - with tabs is superior to using the engine trim to do it...cheers fnq This is a very good statement. There is a saying used that's very important concerning boat trim - "motor trim is for trimming the prop, trim tabs are for trimming the boat", which obviously refers to longitudinal trim issues.
cheers

PS. I didn't have indicator switches, didn't think they were worth it, as I always know/knew where my tabs are/were. Trouble is when anyone else drives, & adjusts tabs (required quite frequently with a large bowrider & constantly moving passengers), I would find my self 'finding' where the tabs were when i got the helm back.

I have also used Lenco's with the indicator switches in a mates boat & they are very handy when you have stopped for a fish & moving to a different location with a driver swap - you know where the tabs are at a glance before you even take off. I now have bought indicator switches with the tabs for my new boat - 'I have seen the light' ;) & think they are worth it.

[ifishcq1]

Chimo and Chop Duster

Cruise is about 25+kn and the old one never lent at all so I would have thought this will be the same but I read about the tabs with info from you guys and FNQ and not knowing I thought I would pop the question and see what came up
I appreciate the comments

Cheers

SL

[chop duster]

so how far away are you fro getting the new one on the water? i remember your posts a few months ago.

[frank100]

gofishin,
Thanks mate, good info. BC's have the tabs mounting plate already on the boat which do the same job as the channel you put on. I am now looking at 'electro tabs' which come in ally or S/S. The BC I was looking at today comes with the electrotabs fitted ex factory, the mounting is with ally rivets so the corrosion issue is not an ssue. Very tempting so far as prices quoted are similar to other brands. They come with position indicator switches (would you believe microprocessor control !). I think as a newbie to using tabs they may be of benifit.
Also thanks to all who have commented on this thread, as usual you guys have been most informative and it is very appreciated.
I will post again when / if I get them. One step at a time .
step one - ministerial approval for the disbursement of funds
step two - fit them without f%$@@up
step three- Try them
Current status is one more step B4 I get to step one.

Frank