PDA

View Full Version : Barra lure upgrades



darylive
26-10-2008, 09:17 PM
Many do it :D


Pay good money for a lure designed for a purpose then spend more $$$ on upgrading it to the task :(

OR


Maybe you buy the best available and leave 'em alone?

What are your preferences?

I go for Owner hooks and rings.

What sizes are you using? Rings? Hooks?
same back and front? or smaller on the rear :)

I am happy with #4 @ 50lb but I know others who use bigger. The lure ends up like a bloody chandelier with reef anchors hanging of it.

Besides the lose of flotation it looks like it would snag on water.

Dick Pasfield
26-10-2008, 09:50 PM
I'll use Owner trebles but this is my favourite beef up



http://i464.photobucket.com/albums/rr4/dickpasfield/1-5.jpg

darylive
26-10-2008, 09:57 PM
A thing of Beuty!

NAGG
27-10-2008, 06:04 AM
Hey Daryl ...... List for me the lures that are designed for the task (big barra)

I'll start it off


1) Stiffy range
2) ?
3) ?
4) ?
5) ?
etc
etc

Seriously ..... I cant think of another lure that would not require a STN66 & split face lift :-/ Some awesome lures out there - but most carry hardware that could be opened by an 80-90cm fish ( specially against a tight drag) + the jaw pressure that can be exerted by a 90cm fish ..... can definitely open standard trebles. In the end its insurance - why skimp on $100 worth of hooks (20 lures)



Sizes of upgrades (splits & hooks) just depends on the lure & the level of buoyancy required ....... I've run from #2 to 2/O & up to #7 hyperwire splits
Also ..... I've swam an upgrade which has been a replication of the same lure - only to have to change it:(

Chris

Tropicaltrout
27-10-2008, 06:27 AM
Yep up-grades are useful to most if not all lures with a barra's mouth being the design it is, it stretches even the strongest hook, I do up grade to Owner stn66 but only as I bend the standard trebble:) I wont sit and put new hooks on a lure for no reason maily as i am yet to loose a fish to a bent one but before you say it will happen I know but time will tell. I took plenty of fish up to a dollar 15 last year 9 in one session on standard every day vipers and arafuras, and bent 2 hooks total.

Its a personal thing more so insurance and peace of mind I guess.

Nath

darylive
27-10-2008, 09:05 AM
Hey Daryl ...... List for me the lures that are designed for the task (big barra)

I'll start it off


1) Stiffy range
2) ?
3) ?
4) ?
5) ?
etc
etc

Seriously ..... I cant think of another lure that would not require a STN66 & split face lift :-/ Some awesome lures out there - but most carry hardware that could be opened by an 80-90cm fish ( specially against a tight drag) + the jaw pressure that can be exerted by a 90cm fish ..... can definitely open standard trebles. In the end its insurance - why skimp on $100 worth of hooks (20 lures)



Sizes of upgrades (splits & hooks) just depends on the lure & the level of buoyancy required ....... I've run from #2 to 2/O & up to #7 hyperwire splits
Also ..... I've swam an upgrade which has been a replication of the same lure - only to have to change it:(

Chris

Chris, my point is that they are marketed as BIG BARRA lures, but may not be up to the task and I am not referring to the chaep lures.

I am inclined to agree with Tropical Nath I don't automatically up grade everything. I have landed big fish on standard Arafuras, Vipers & Scorpions from Mondy and Awoonga. Mind you those big girls did not get too deep in the forest of Doom.

I fish with mates who swear by them out of the box and won't interfere for fear of changing flotation swim etc. I certainly have upgraded and carry spare owner hooks and rings.

It seems some blokes are just short of fishing with grapples and chain.

Interesting to hear the varying opinions mate ;) especially from blokes like yourself who have a recent history of IBD therapy the envy of most ::).

It seems you are either fishing or doing 'Plastic surgery' ;D you lucky bastard.
(or maybe upgrading the trailer :P) Perhaps we should call you the Doctor :D

NAGG
27-10-2008, 10:15 AM
Chris, my point is that they are marketed as BIG BARRA lures, but may not be up to the task and I am not referring to the chaep lures.

I am inclined to agree with Tropical Nath I don't automatically up grade everything. I have landed big fish on standard Arafuras, Vipers & Scorpions from Mondy and Awoonga. Mind you those big girls did not get too deep in the forest of Doom.

I fish with mates who swear by them out of the box and won't interfere for fear of changing flotation swim etc. I certainly have upgraded and carry spare owner hooks and rings.

It seems some blokes are just short of fishing with grapples and chain.

Interesting to hear the varying opinions mate ;) especially from blokes like yourself who have a recent history of IBD therapy the envy of most ::).

It seems you are either fishing or doing 'Plastic surgery' ;D you lucky bastard.
(or maybe upgrading the trailer :P) Perhaps we should call you the Doctor :D

Hi Daryl

Thats the problem ....... Those lures mentioned are reasonably expensive Aussie lures & are marketed as big barra lures - yet they still use standard hooks ( Mustads & VMCs) ........ but even 6X VMCs are easily opened if you have a top & bottom jaw hook set or gill cover / jaw.... Why risk a fish when we can upgrade:P
I totally agree about effecting the lure action ........ Its something that you need to tinker with ........ I'd rather drop down a size in STN-66s & double splits than stick with standards ......... Its just me ::)

I have a lot of spare time on my hands ...... so tinkering is fun & keeps me out of the pub
As for trailers Daryl ........ I'm sick of em!!!!! Since my last trip (Sept) I've put on 2 new mud guards , 2 bearing re builds , 2 new winch post U bolts , Replaced 1 axle U bolt , 1 winch rope , 2 new trailer lights , 1 new brake cable adjuster .......... & I'm thinking of replacing the tie down strap .............. And the trailer is not yet 2 years old:(

Chris

darylive
27-10-2008, 12:42 PM
Have you thought about a polly trailer? :oops::wiseguy::devilish::lipsrsealed:


:LMAO:

NAGG
27-10-2008, 05:09 PM
Have you thought about a polly trailer? :oops::wiseguy::devilish::lipsrsealed:


:LMAO:


actually ..... Poly mudguards & plastic lights all broke .......... i should have hit em with a hair dryer .....:oops: I mean heat gun ;D


;D ;D ;D :rifle:

nipsta
27-10-2008, 07:16 PM
i disagree about vmc hook i have used them for a while now and havent had any troulbe maybe that cause i dont tighten the drag up so tight that when you go to loosen it you need a wrench to undo i reckon thats what cause the hook to open up is winching barra in i mean if there is a weak point to be found thats the easiest way to do it not that i dont use stn 66 but vmc are just as good as them in my books easyiest way to test put a st on ya line and hook it to a wall pull and see what strain you need to bend them then do it to a vmc 6x and see under maxium condition they all will give way but under flowing drag condtions less chance
just my point of view im sure there are others that think different

nipsta
27-10-2008, 07:20 PM
Hi Daryl

Thats the problem ....... Those lures mentioned are reasonably expensive Aussie lures & are marketed as big barra lures - yet they still use standard hooks ( Mustads & VMCs) ........ but even 6X VMCs are easily opened if you have a top & bottom jaw hook set or gill cover / jaw.... Why risk a fish when we can upgrade:P
I totally agree about effecting the lure action ........ Its something that you need to tinker with ........ I'd rather drop down a size in STN-66s & double splits than stick with standards ......... Its just me ::)

I have a lot of spare time on my hands ...... so tinkering is fun & keeps me out of the pub
As for trailers Daryl ........ I'm sick of em!!!!! Since my last trip (Sept) I've put on 2 new mud guards , 2 bearing re builds , 2 new winch post U bolts , Replaced 1 axle U bolt , 1 winch rope , 2 new trailer lights , 1 new brake cable adjuster .......... & I'm thinking of replacing the tie down strap .............. And the trailer is not yet 2 years old:(

Chris
ubolts i would weld that winch on chris will limit give you a back up the the ubolts are only there if you use the trailer for multipe boats so weld that sucker . and bearings cand dye out of the packet im getting all that checked before we go
i think and the motor is gettting a service on the thursday before as well

NAGG
27-10-2008, 08:04 PM
i disagree about vmc hook i have used them for a while now and havent had any troulbe maybe that cause i dont tighten the drag up so tight that when you go to loosen it you need a wrench to undo i reckon thats what cause the hook to open up is winching barra in i mean if there is a weak point to be found thats the easiest way to do it not that i dont use stn 66 but vmc are just as good as them in my books easyiest way to test put a st on ya line and hook it to a wall pull and see what strain you need to bend them then do it to a vmc 6x and see under maxium condition they all will give way but under flowing drag condtions less chance
just my point of view im sure there are others that think different

Hi Simon

I wont argue about the flowing drag etc ....... But as I found out on my very first metery (105 @ Faust) - The jaw pressure opened up 2 of the 3 trebles on a classic 120 (6X VMCs upgrades) ......... luckily I still managed the fish after a prolonged fight .........
after that ...... I was so surprised:o & I started to upgrade to STN66s & hyperwire splits.

Chris

darylive
27-10-2008, 08:34 PM
As an aside boys I just bought some imported plastic lollies from tim n

http://www.ausfish.com.au/vforum/showthread.php?t=140294

Not many left if you are interested get in quick.

Steve B I hope you picked the right colours, I am told we got the same selection

Steve B
27-10-2008, 11:59 PM
As an aside boys I just bought some imported plastic lollies from tim n

http://www.ausfish.com.au/vforum/showthread.php?t=140294

Not many left if you are interested get in quick.

Steve B I hope you picked the right colours, I am told we got the same selection

So Did I daryl!!!;D

As for trebs and splits. I use owners. not just for the strength factor, but for the penetration and 'stay sharp' factors.................given the cash we spend on everything else, the one simple point where we are connected to the fish should not be skimped on IMHO.

steve

NAGG
28-10-2008, 12:16 AM
So Did I daryl!!!;D

As for trebs and splits. I use owners. not just for the strength factor, but for the penetration and 'stay sharp' factors.................given the cash we spend on everything else, the one simple point where we are connected to the fish should not be skimped on IMHO.

steve


GOOD POINT ::) ::) ::) ;)

nipsta
28-10-2008, 06:29 AM
damm i thought i might have got more bites then what i did ill have to be a bit harser next time i use owners as well as vmc i like the stiffy range at least they come standard with owners and i have notice they have a new range of lures as well so look like they might be worth getting a few more of i say does anyone know if they have rattle or not thats the new ones

Tropicaltrout
28-10-2008, 06:31 AM
GOOD POINT ::) ::) ::) ;)


SHARP REPLY::) ::) ::) :P

DEANO68
28-10-2008, 06:36 AM
SHARP REPLY::) ::) ::) :P

thanks for pointing that out.::) ::) ::) 8-)

Tropicaltrout
28-10-2008, 06:39 AM
;D There's the trebble;D

Whitto
28-10-2008, 06:40 AM
Hook failure is far more evident in Jig heads....Slick rigs are straightned out fairly easily....I will be using up my currant stocks and will be using in the future just the plain SR Shads and attaching Owner Nitro J/heads (very strong hook).....at the moment have the Nitro heads attached to Hard nose and H/belly lures.....the jig is a 7/0 17gm and looking for the 6/0...want to get the SP a tad deeper.....just a test really:-/

NAGG
28-10-2008, 06:47 AM
SHARP REPLY::) ::) ::) :P

SHANKS ::) ::) ::) :-[

NAGG
28-10-2008, 07:05 AM
Hook failure is far more evident in Jig heads....Slick rigs are straightned out fairly easily....I will be using up my currant stocks and will be using in the future just the plain SR Shads and attaching Owner Nitro J/heads (very strong hook).....at the moment have the Nitro heads attached to Hard nose and H/belly lures.....the jig is a 7/0 17gm and looking for the 6/0...want to get the SP a tad deeper.....just a test really:-/

stock up on those nitros mate ..... They are not being made in the long shank configuration any more - going to a shorter shank thicker nickel plated hook!

Chris

Whitto
28-10-2008, 07:06 AM
SHANKS ::) ::) ::) :-[ They look the Goods for sure

Whitto
28-10-2008, 07:11 AM
stock up on those nitros mate ..... They are not being made in the long shank configuration any more - going to a shorter shank thicker nickel plated hook!

Chris Going to a shorter shank won't hurt....but a thicker nickel plated hook (priceless)...got to be a big +.....will be keeping an eye out for them8-)

darylive
28-10-2008, 09:45 AM
I should have also asked What size hooks do you use for the up grade?

NAGG
28-10-2008, 10:10 AM
Going to a shorter shank won't hurt....but a thicker nickel plated hook (priceless)...got to be a big +.....will be keeping an eye out for them8-)

Hmmm not so good for Hollow bellies or 130 slick rigs:'(

Chris

Whitto
28-10-2008, 10:15 AM
I should have also asked What size hooks do you use for the up grade?These Nitro's Im useing ATM are 5/8 oz 17.5g 7/0 3 per pack..... They have a drop rate depending on the SP used of 2'4"/sec......Whitto

NAGG
28-10-2008, 10:17 AM
I should have also asked What size hooks do you use for the up grade?

Depending on the lure & what you want it to do ....... anything from #2 - 2/O ...... I just did a jointed X Rap .... & hung a 2/O off the belly.

Some lures require smallish hooks .... in a 3 hook configeration SO > some I've removed the belly hook ..... double ringed it & went 1 size up ..... Ended up with similar characteristics.

There is so much you can do

Chris

NAGG
28-10-2008, 10:21 AM
These Nitro's Im useing ATM are 5/8 oz 17.5g 7/0 3 per pack..... They have a drop rate depending on the SP used of 2'4"/sec......Whitto

With the black hook8-) ..... the new ones look like a STN-66 (Silver) ........ They are out in the smaller sizes ( Saltwater pros)

Chris

PS ...... I've started to grind off some lead to reduce the sink rate ...... but maintain a big hook (7/O)

Whitto
28-10-2008, 10:36 AM
With the black hook8-) ..... the new ones look like a STN-66 (Silver) ........ They are out in the smaller sizes ( Saltwater pros)

Chris

PS ...... I've started to grind off some lead to reduce the sink rate ...... but maintain a big hook (7/O) I have to say the sink rate concerns me.....for me it's the hook that impresses (very strong).....I may have to fire up the emery wheel;D

Tropicaltrout
28-10-2008, 06:01 PM
Do you fellas put a up grade on the splitty that's on the front or bib?

Whitto
28-10-2008, 06:06 PM
In a word Nath.......No...I've never had a failure at this point:P

BR65
28-10-2008, 06:26 PM
Many do it :D


Pay good money for a lure designed for a purpose then spend more $$$ on upgrading it to the task :(


OR


Maybe you buy the best available and leave 'em alone?

What are your preferences?

I go for Owner hooks and rings.

What sizes are you using? Rings? Hooks?
same back and front? or smaller on the rear :)

I am happy with #4 @ 50lb but I know others who use bigger. The lure ends up like a bloody chandelier with reef anchors hanging of it.

Besides the lose of flotation it looks like it would snag on water.

Owners mate, ST66 #2 to 2/0 depending on the lure, I use a mix of hyper wire #6 and Halco 4xx splits, though I prefer the Halcos. Some of my deep divers (trollers) still have VMC 6X from the original up-grades, but they are being progresively changed. I figure the VMC on a troll lure wont be copping as much stress as a owner used in the sticks, but better safe than sorry.
Most of my lures these days are running double splits and 2 oversize hooks, rather than the three hook set up. I reckon the double splits gives me a bit more play when a fish is twisting and thrashing its head, and the oversize hooks help with a larger exposed hook gape, hopefully meaning better hook up ratio, plus as an added bonus, they contribute to buoyancy conrol.
I remove the front tow split if I can get away with it, other wise its up-graded as well.

cheers
brian

NAGG
28-10-2008, 06:40 PM
I'm in 2 minds whether to remove them all together after loosing a fish when the sharp edge cut through the loop in a leader

Chris

BR65
28-10-2008, 07:15 PM
I'm in 2 minds whether to remove them all together after loosing a fish when the sharp edge cut through the loop in a leader

Chris

Thats happened to me before mate, unfortunately some HB's (no names Mr Gadden) have a very leader un-friendly tow point.

NAGG
28-10-2008, 07:39 PM
Thats happened to me before mate, unfortunately some HB's (no names Mr Gadden) have a very leader un-friendly tow point.

Mine happened on an X RAP ....... & I know what you mean about classics

Chris

Blinky
29-10-2008, 12:46 PM
Here's a few of my upgrades, also put the singles on Poltergeists, they work a treat, outstanding hook-up rate!

http://www.fishingterritory.com/download.php?id=6201
http://www.fishingterritory.com/download.php?id=2741
http://www.fishingterritory.com/download.php?id=4092

Whitto
29-10-2008, 02:09 PM
Here's a few of my upgrades, also put the singles on Poltergeists, they work a treat, outstanding hook-up rate!

http://www.fishingterritory.com/download.php?id=6201
http://www.fishingterritory.com/download.php?id=2741
http://www.fishingterritory.com/download.php?id=4092 G'Day Blinky......can't open the attachments....was told I was not authorised to do so....would love to see your upgrades....Whitto

darylive
29-10-2008, 04:34 PM
your right, not authorised

Blinky
30-10-2008, 03:36 PM
Sorry lads, try these.
I'll add one of the Polties later.

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d44/Doctorblinky/Img2007-07-05_0001.jpg?t=1225344759

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d44/Doctorblinky/Photo0004.jpg

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d44/Doctorblinky/LURE_kevlar_trebles.jpg

Whitto
30-10-2008, 03:59 PM
Thanks Blinky......Love the Barra Classics.....I will definatedly give that a shot

NAGG
30-10-2008, 05:36 PM
Good onya Blinky ....... you certainly wont be straightening those bad boys

What is the hook up rate like ?

Chris

Blinky
30-10-2008, 06:10 PM
Good onya Blinky ....... you certainly wont be straightening those bad boys

What is the hook up rate like ?

Chris

Hook up rate is surprisingly good, you aren't going to nab the face slappers that you would using trebs, 90% of them are rats anyways! The good thing about the singles is once they get a hold they don't let go, especially when used in conjunction with the kevlar cord, you can get up to 1080° of hook rotation. Unlike split rings, even when used doubled up, there is no mechanical advantage gained by the fish when using kevlar.

NAGG
30-10-2008, 06:27 PM
Hook up rate is surprisingly good, you aren't going to nab the face slappers that you would using trebs, 90% of them are rats anyways! The good thing about the singles is once they get a hold they don't let go, especially when used in conjunction with the kevlar cord, you can get up to 1080° of hook rotation. Unlike split rings, even when used doubled up, there is no mechanical advantage gained by the fish when using kevlar.

I've got some of those bad boys ...... but use them for jigging with knife jigs

I've thought about using them .... but I dont really have a major issue with hard body lures atm .......... but yes .... duly noted & easily converted

Thanks

Chris

BLOOEY
31-10-2008, 06:41 AM
Blinky do you have dramas with the hooks catching on eachother with that setup. Looks as though there is a fair bit of overlap going on. They do look pretty mean though. Ben

Blinky
31-10-2008, 08:17 AM
Blinky do you have dramas with the hooks catching on eachother with that setup. Looks as though there is a fair bit of overlap going on. They do look pretty mean though. Ben


No, not much tangling, you just gotta be careful when tossing them out.
Fishing only on braid helps, if there does happen to be a tangle you know about it immediately.

poddy mullet
31-10-2008, 12:16 PM
Too bloody right! Pay good money and what do you get??????? Cr@p! Shouldn't need to touch them!

Blinky
01-11-2008, 03:51 PM
Modified poltie.

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d44/Doctorblinky/DSCN3973.jpg